General Discussions
General Discussions
If you complain about Eruption but use DH
You are part of the problem. Both are incredibly problematic. Complaining that the killer is using Eruption when you're running full meta perks with DH as your selected exhaustion perk is incredibly hypocritical.
Comments
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You're not wrong. People act like 25 seconds is too long to delay a Survivor but are perfectly okay with Dead Hard buying 25 seconds to delay a Killer.
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Post edited by Pulsar on40 -
Yeah, 25 seconds of being able to do LITERALLY nothing. Imagine if as killer Dead Hard stunned you for like 10 seconds with literally no warning and nothing you could do about it.
At least with Dead Hard you can bait it out, possibly let go of the Survivor afterwards which will make them have to mend which wastes time, and once you get hit by it you know its not going to happen again if you decide to keep going for them.
With Eruption you have 0 indication (unless its a killer like Oni, and even then its only when he's in Blood Fury) that its coming. I'd be fine with it even blocking the gen for 25 seconds but no, it gives Incapacitated which lets you do literally nothing other than run. They also shadow buffed it recently, so that while you're working on it and Eruption goes off it will now actually regress the gen further.
So you're not dealing with just a 10% regression and 25 seconds of wasted time, but also an additional 6.25% because of the added regression (this doesn't even take into account if the killer has Call of Brine, and in that cases its an additional 12.50%). In total thats 41.25% (or 47.50%) of a generator that could of been completed, but the killer simply kicked the gen and got a single down. And they can do this all over since the perk has a measly 30 second cooldown
But yeah, Eruption and Dead Hard. TOTALLY similar
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Difference is though that I’m sure Eruption’s gonna get nuked into oblivion while DH will remain. After all, there’s just no way to make a “dodging a hit” fair for both sides. The only way to nerf it would be to delete it.
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ok? I use dead hard and want it nerfed not part of the problem simple as
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They are. You said "all you can do is run".
What do you think a Killer is doing chasing Mr. Dead Hard? Making a pot roast?
Yeah. He's running.
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I've never used DH or a meta build in my life. So I guess I'm okay to hate on Eruption?
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Again, you have several options with Dead Hard
Please tell me the options with Eruption, other than "play in a SWF"
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Eruption and DH are both problematic for the same reason: they act as deterrent from both sides to use their basic abilities to win. Killers are deterred from using power/lunges, survivors are deterred from working on gens.
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DH is also currently the single most used perk in the game according to nightlight. If BHVR wants to keep their promise of keeping a fresh meta, it's gonna need some tweaking real soon.
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The funny thing is that both perks have the same effect, wasting the opposing side’s time.
i highly doubt BHVR would nerf Dead Hard because survivors would just complain instead of trying to work with other perks.
Dead Hard nullifies mistakes at the lower levels of play (Losing a mindgame at a tile) and becomes a free health state at the higher level (Bodyblocking, Pallet Baits, Generator rushing in front of the killer).
But of course “Just bait it out” is the only answer people will say to DH. If BHVR added a Killer perk that applied Deep Wounds on an m1 hit, the amount of complaints would probably rival that of current Eruption
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Lol DH is so easy to bait
Eruption is impossible to counter
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Tell me you play in baby MMR without telling me.
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Or....I just don't think DH is all that difficult to play around and it's a completely different thing than Eruption. I seriously don't understand the difficulty players are having with it. I chalk it up to lack of experience I guess. You can tell a player has it or wait it out 90% of the time.
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You are thinking of a scenario whereby the Killer is chasing the Survivor in an open area with no pallets or windows. Only then does “wait it out” make sense. Experienced survivors will try to bait the DH at pallets. If the Killer swings at the DH, the Survivor uses the speed boost to make distance, saving the pallet for later chases, If the Killer “waits out” the DH, the Survivor drops the pallet and leaves the tile with DH still intact. It’s a lose lose situation unless the player messes up their DH or fails to drop the pallet in time.
Not to mention that it’s not one player whom you have to wait out DH, it’s not uncommon to see 3-4 DH users in a lobby.
All that “waiting out” leads to a longer chases overall and lesser time to pressure other survivors.
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While thats true one of them at least has trade offs
With Dead Hard, you can't run any other Exhaustion perks with it, and it doesn't even have a guaranteed to work. You also can't use anything else that gives Endurance, such as Off the Record or BT disables it making you better off running something else. In a situation where the killer lets you go you also have to Mend afterwards, which wastes time.
Eruption on the other hand synergizes VERY well with other regression perks. 41.25% of regression off one pop of Eruption alone, and it only has a 30 second cooldown. Which when combined with something like CoB (which was already mentioned) or Pain Res you're amping up that regression even more.
In terms of balance, Dead Hard is more than fine. In terms of how it feels how ever is a different story. I want to see all meta perks nerfed in some way, and underused perks buffed. Something like every midchapter the 5 most used perks nerfed, and the 5 most underused perks buffed. Just so we can see some variety
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One of them is fair and takes skill now while the other is braindead ,not even close to gettin compared
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Let go of a gen when you see an injured person in chase.
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Weird I remember when only "dead hard for distance was the problem". Squinting hard watching those goal posts moving off into the horizon.
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This tells me everything I needed to know
Thank you
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You can wait for an injured to survivor to go down in chase and then do the gen. Does that make Eruption fair too?
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If a killer drops chase on someone who used their DH and the DH player is mending, the player isn't "wasting time" by any means. In fact, he's just managed to escape a chase without giving the killer a hook state, and the killer had to waste as much time as they did chasing then hitting through DH. In what scenario is going doing and getting hooked superior to having to mend because killer drops chase?
Eruption does NOT give 41.25% of regression, you got those numbers wilding out there. You're confounding slowdown with regression (which Eruption provides both). DH also synchronizes well with Off the Record+DS, and is one of 16 perks, as opposed to one of 4.
Both DH and Eruption are incredibly problematic in the current meta. Trying to make a special exception for one but not the other is hypocrisy.
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About as satisfying an answer as "Just wait it out", huh?
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It takes skill to press E right before a pallet?
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Its better than dropping chase and them not using their DH, because then they still potentially have it and can immediately hop on a gen
No, it doesn't give 41.25% of regression, it gives 16.25%. That part of the post I worded wrong. What it does do how ever is get rid of 41.25% of potential generator progress.
Also how does OtR work well with DH? Decisive Strike I can see, but OtR?
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As satisfying as updog
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I mean if people believe there's an OP perk that's commonly used and they hate it, they're gonna use strong stuff to try and deal with it. Wouldn't say they're part of the problem.
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yeah, it's strange actually, dead hard giving a speed boost was the problem then, and it still is now despite the rework
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Great idea! The counter to avoid getting hit by incapacitated and forced to do nothing for 25 seconds is...to do nothing for possibly an even longer time.
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i propose a fair trade: you get eruption nuked (or reworked) and 2 the general buffs that killer got gone for good (basekit BS and the 2 free stacks of STBFL), but in exchange you get dead hard and off the record completely reworked (not nerfed, REWORKED) and basekit BT gone (as far as i know, that was an extremely stupid change because now people are doing saves with the killer still near... they should be punished for the unsafe unhook, not rewarded for a bad play)
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"dead hard still op!! NO! eruption is"
im just enjoying the show
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there is not a single good suggestion in here
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Yeah. That's the game. Not all answers to things need to be perfect ironclad "counters" that work 100% of the time.
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personally i don't have problems with eruption since it can be countered in more ways somehow if you are experienced enough (fogwise, emphaty, aftercare, kindred, etc etc), but dead hard it's another thing, especially when there are so many auto dead hard users around... as far as i know the only killers that can counter dead hard are deathslinger and legion (not completely in the 2nd case, but at least you can deny it's use in a normal chase where the survivor is still healthy thanks to FF)
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then you are fine with eruption and dead hard working in that way despite you complain about eruption (you cannot complain about a perk that waste a lot of time for only one side: if both have those options, both needed to be looked at, otherwise you'll end being biased toward a specific side)...
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i don't use either. so... ######### dh and eruption
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Or, someone can just accept that Incapacitated is a really bad status effect and should not exist like this on a Perk like Eruption.
One hit of Eruption is basically half a Gen added. Considering how often it can activate, it is quite easy to see that it is completely overtuned.
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LOL ok :) keep thinking they are equally braindead :) guess which one is gettin nerfed down the line :)
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I use neither and for the same reason - both are broken and unfair and I wont use something I dislike going against
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DH causes a unique animation to play for an Injured Survivor. (Likely an animation used for a Survivor with Deep Wounds if that ever gets its own animation) it plays regardless of Exhaustion.
This allows the Killer to note if a Survivor is running Dead Hard prior to total chase buy-in.
Then turn Lunge Attacks into two stages:
Stage 1: The Killer holds the Basic Attack button, gaining momentum for a duration, and then loses all momentum, stopping in place for a moment.
Stage 2: Upon releasing the Attack Button (during momentum increase, or after the Killer has stopped, Lunge Attack still raised in the air) the Killer performs a Basic Attack.
This allows the Killer to feint an attack by decoupling when the Lunge Attack actually hits (but doesn’t allow the Killer to just walk around with the attack raised, but that could be a thing)
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It would be hypocritical if DH was actually as unbalanced as Eruption is.
Just because a perk is meta, doesn’t mean it’s unbalanced.
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DH is the only thing keeping the killer from killing you at 5 gens lol. Once the killer notices you don’t have DH, they will see you as the weak link and tunnel you out.
There’s also the problem of very interactive antiloop killers like artist and nemesis that out you in lose-lose situations without DH, what are you supposed to do against them without it?
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If you would have stated that 1 year ago, i wouldn´t have known which one is which.
What a time to be Alive!
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What makes it bad? Just because you can't take actions? Why is it okay for there to be tons of ways to stun killers but with Survivors, of which there are four of, you have now committed a sin?
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Eruption is horribly overrated since it requires for the killer to get downs to get the effect to even proc which is incredibly hard on most maps (at least the modern/reworked ones) due to featuring so many goddamn pallets that you'll lose 3 gens before the first survivor actually goes down. At the level I'm playing survivors do not make mistakes anymore, they will flawlessly chain loops and tiles and always get to the next pallet to waste as much of your time as possible. It's absolute hell.
Dead Hard meanwhile is among the main contributors to why it's so damn hard to get downs/hooks as a killer.
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No matter how much you complain, eruption is next and there is nothing u can do about it. While dh will remain as it already got its rework then nerf and now its more healthy than old dh.
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No, having a reliable "get out of jail"-card that activates in situations in which you most need it, ie wounded and cornered, is the problem. All other exhaustion perks can be annoying in the right situation, but only DH can be used in any situation, be it in the open, or in a strong loop, greeding a palette to the max. The short time after 6.1 was such a giant bolder taken of my broad killer shoulders, when I had a survivor cornered, outplayed and closed up to them after a tough chase, I could just swing without second guessing, no strings attached, no "fufufu if you outplay them, but they DH, did you really outplay them?". It was such a novel concept and exhilarating ... but sadly it didn't last and now we are basically in the same situation as before.
The perk is nominally more fair then before and its grosses and most agrevating uses have been cut out, but now that survivors learned how to use it, its again the most used survivor perk and you have to take it into account in each and every chase, "baiting it out" instead of swinging. And its so tiering.
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Also don't forget subtle cheaters/hackers who use Auto DH scripts to always use it perfectly, they basically gain a guaranteed third health state. It's downright despicable and makes you question every single survivor who runs the perk.
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Regardless of how the survivor winds up at the pallet, with deadhard, they can extend the chase adding time to an activity that although enjoyable causes the killer to lose the game. So it is like Eruption.
But, who cares. Just leave them both as is and play on with the challenges.
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Low key, honestly my thoughts too, which is partially why I prefer Call of Brine Overcharge over Call of Brine Eruption.
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