https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/472588/future-of-dead-by-daylight-forums
That's it, from now on I refuse to play against the Onryo
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Others lose their target but she doesn’t? What? Lol. She doesn’t have a homing beacon on their location, they are able to crawl. You say other killers can’t find new targets but she just can? She has to search for other survivors just like everyone else.
In what way is telling people to just get a tape and that it’s an m1 killer you can loop contradictory? That isn’t what the word contradictory means. Both those statements are simultaneously true.
She doesn’t just zone you and get free kills unless the survivor doesn’t understand how to loop, much less loop a basic m1 killer. If that’s our criteria for crazy strong and uncounterable then all killers with anti loop must be wayyy OP.
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It's not relevant if I have a full team slugged and I'm the only one that can loop. Doesn't matter much anyway if she teleports to every new loop I go to to mori me. The mori is mindlessly easy in solo queue, let's not lie.
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No, it is not objectively sweaty or boring. Please tell me how being slugged is more boring than being on a hook? On the hook you can literally do nothing while on the ground you can crawl, recovery, run multiple anti slug perks and have a second chance at life. Being slugged is actually objectively less boring. The literal only reason someone can prefer being hooked is because they want to remove themselves from the game early, that’s it.
Ignoring/denying an entire aspect of the game? By choosing to hook you we are also ignoring an entire aspect of the game, slugging. Also an aspect of the game is pressuring gens, of which you do more efficiently by slugging.
I don’t care about getting smoke from survivors, I wish we didn’t even have a chat filter as far as that’s concerned so they can say anything they want to me. I’m simply arguing that you haven’t given any rational argument as to why slugging is toxic or boring for that matter.
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I would say nearly 10,000 hours in the game and being in the .0001% of play time is a pretty big sample size.
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you can't say being slugged is objectively less boring as it's a subjective opinion :)
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What you just described was losing because of bad teammates, not killer design. If that scenario is happening y’all either played very badly or the killer was just way higher skilled. Either way they should be winning. Those scenarios don’t happen with even remotely evenly skilled teams.
Instead of arguing against Onryo you’re argument should be about bad matchmaking.
Also, she should not be cutting off every loop to a tv. Why is every tv on first of all. Second her teleport literally tells you she’s using it, you should absolutely never be getting cut off by an Onryo teleport or you’re making mistakes.
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Its not subjective, it’s objective. I gave facts why as well.
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I had to do this to get rid of Condemned because it was almost full and i couldn't find an active TV. I think I ran around one TV for a good 30s waiting for it to switch back on. If everyone is doing this frequently then it adds up to one massive waste of time in a game where seconds count. You're literally playing to beat Sadako or your team mates to a TV. Maybe they could add some sort of recharge indicator after x amount of seconds. I don't know. But TVs should be the side objective, but at times they feel like the main objective.
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The "facts" you listed were "while on the ground you can crawl, recovery, run multiple anti slug perks and have a second chance at life"
While on hook, you can run perks like Deliverance / Slippery Meat and Up the Ante to get yourself off the hook, whilst also having a second chance at life, and you can do a funny hook dance while on first stage. How is this objectively worse than being slugged? It just .... isn't. Hate to break it to you, but don't decide what other people find fun in this game, no matter how many hours you put into it. I personally find being on hook a lot more fun than being on the ground because that's just my personal opinion, my opinion isn't objective. It's subjective. Just like your opinion isn't objective. Please stop this line of argument. It's embarrassing.
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Bad matchmaking is why solo queue is bad. It literally defines solo queue. We are arguing about Onryo being overpowered in solo queue. Also I don't get cut off from a teleport, I get condemned because I end up being injured when I get taken by surprise so the tape goes with it. That's the problem.
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In reality it really isn't. If you learnt probability properly in maths, you would know.
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I will agree there is a subjective marker IF they are running those perks. However, an exception doesn't disprove the general rule. In 99% of cases it is objective.
What people find fun is subjective. However that is not what you're describing. The option on hook is, "do nothing". Anything, is objectively more fun than nothing. If there was any "realistic" play making to do on the hook "generally speaking" then I would agree with you.
Just because you don't agree doesn't mean you need to resort to insulting. I focus on the subject matter of the conversation and provide counter arguments, not insulting the other person.
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Then you agree with me. Onryo isn't the issue, bad matchmaking is. If you consistently got good teammates you'd have no issue with her as the scenarios you described would not be happening.
"Taken by surprise" So Onryo wasn't the issue, you said you messed up and got surprised. So this scenario again wasn't Onryo, you said it was you making a mistake.
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I have and your statement is inaccurate. No need for subtle insults towards me, we're just having a conversation.
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i mean if you run 4 up the ante+slippery meat with 4 luck offering, you can make a play on hook by jumping off the hook but otherwise there is less gameplay on hooks then on slug's. I am not entirely sure why slugging is disliked. It is probably same reason that sadako condemn is disliked. it is just different gameplay. It is like survivor just want every killer to play same way. it should be opposite, every killer should feel different to play against. that makes it more interesting.
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I never insulted you, either. Way to play the victim because I told you your line of argument (which is saying subjective opinions = objective facts because *you* said so) was embarrassing. It's clear to me you have to use outside means of speaking (which is funny and hypocritical) to make me look worse in order to win a forums argument, so you can have your forums win since you want it so bad that you resulted in making things up, I'll just be playing survivor and enjoying being hooked over being slugged in peace and quiet, you genuinely aren't worth my time or effort.
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Take it however you like. If you see me saying probability isn't as simple as 'I play fifty matches a day so I should technically encounter a slugging Onryo every so often' as an insult then you do you.
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And bad matchmaking isn't going to be solved anytime soon. Hence why Onryo is an issue.
Yeah, I sometimes do get surprised in dead zones and get hit by a stealth killer. We all do.
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Just gotten out of a match and she hit me while I was running and it gave me stacks and then she teleported to hurry and mori me; this doesn't make any sense... yeah this NEEED to be changed.
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"fifty matches" is not at all what I said in any way. I would say that was a terrible sample size, that's strawmanning my argument.
You were attempting to be subtly insulting implying my failure to learn probability.
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Well, if you heard here terror radius from that direction, and the TV is off, there is a good chance she is in the area and it was recently turned off. When she pops out of a TV she is automatically manifested and has a terror radius.
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Survivors not having basic communication is part of the game. No pinging, no voice chat, no text chat. Its not toxic at all to use perks or add ons that block information, its part of the game.
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I won't either by not turning on the game until this is fixed. I stopped logging in when I stopped having fun.
First SM now this. I don't mind losing or whatever, but this toxic game play is too much for me. My mental health is more important than a game , I'll just not log in I guess. 🤷 Once this stuff is fixed I'll consider coming back. Zero drive to play against this type of encouraged gameplay.
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It is really hard to tell on those though. That's like, pinhead knowing where the box is because he knows where everyone spawned level of skill.
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I usually hook with sadako cause I get bored of looking for slugs.
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Saying that someone is "embarrassing themselves" is attempting to insult them. It isn't playing the victim. "you genuinely aren't worth my time or effort." Yes, calling someone low value and not worth your time is insulting someone.
"Way to play the victim because I told you your line of argument was embarrassing"
We can all go back and read it. You did not say my line of argument was embarrassing, you stated I was embarrassing myself. Quite different.
"which is saying subjective opinions = objective facts because *you* said so"
That is in fact not what I said at all. You are strawmanning what I actually said.
"t's clear to me you have to use outside means of speaking (which is funny and hypocritical) to make me look worse in order to win a forums argument"
I didn't use outside speaking. I'm simply pointing out the flaws in your argument and allowing you to come to the conclusion on your own. You're getting very defensive in our disagreements. We're just having a calm conversation with differing thoughts, which is great. There's really no need to make this personal with subtle jabs at me through condescending tone. I'm not being sarcastic when I say I enjoy conversations like this where people disagree, it's why I like the forums, these are great discussions to have with differing ideas.
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That is the point, her power does nothing in a chase, the point is that she is a macro killer, she can't chase because she is literally just a t2 myers basically with 0 power, a little stealth (but you'll see the heartbeat when shes nearby anyway because she has a lullaby).
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Bruh how is Sadako new SM? You are not forced into an eternal 3-gen and have various counterplay options.
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I’m always solo and I’ve only played three games against her so far. I usually look for two TVs close together and just keep the tape. I haven’t been condemned yet but like I said it’s only been three games so far.
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legit old sadako, you needed to do this to be successful at her. you needed to slug with her and tv TP, then once you build enough stacks on the survivor team from slugging then you need look at the map constantly to see when the player grabs the tape and if you understood how old mechanic works. if you grab a tape, the tape would passively build condemn so they would get the heartbeat.
the problem of course was... that your an m1 killer who has to down people to slug them and that if you ran ring drawing, people would heal once. see that you have add-on then never heal. The only time they would heal is to 99% their heal then use a med-kit to ignore add-on or use very popular circle of healing perk which unlocked the ability to self-care. so chasing was not viable for her, you had to like camp slug and use tv teleports to be tactical with her but survivor said that slugging sadako was unfun, so they changed her. the tape mechanic has been revised and her entire gameplay loop has radically changed.
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except you're not doing more when slugged compared to being on the hook. Holding down a button to slowly recover is the same as hitting skillchecks while in Struggle phase. You're only other argument for why slugging is somehow less boring than being hooked essentially boils down to "dedicate you're build to situational niche perks" just to avoid/counter an annoying and unnecessary but fairly uncommon playstyle. This is like telling the average killers that going against Boil Over sabo squads isn't frustrating because " you can just run Agitation, Iron Grasp, old Hangmans Trick etc and keep slugging everyone at the cost of not getting as much Sacrifice points etc"
Well at least you admit you don't know what grass is.
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Id rather be in the hook and take my chances then bleed out on the ground
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for real, that's what i'm sayin'
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We're back to those forever Freddy times where a killer takes 0 effort for maximum value, which is not good design
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That's what happens when the devs listen to a community where the mayority are absolutely clueless about the game they play.
Hard buffing a killer that never was bad to begin with cause everybody shouted how weak and the worst killer in the game she was despite being in the top half in terms of kill count.
They should go back to making changes based on stats. This community their feedback obviously isn't worth a lot
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Survivors are so lazy they wont even take tapes. Theyd rather die than work for their escape. If you cant teabag a killer they dont want to face them. Its so sad.
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No, you’re strawmanning again. That isn’t what I said or what my argument actually was. I listed other things than what you quoted. You’re giving counter arguments for points that aren’t my points.
As I mentioned with the others there’s no need to insult me when we’re simply having a conversation on topics we disagree. If you have counter arguments that type of thing shouldn’t be necessary.
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All killers are annoying or OP right? I mean Sadako has been trash since day 1 let her be A-tier now come one she deserves it.
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She is a stealthy killer, her lullaby is to give some kind of counter. Every stealthy killer has something that gives away their position to survivors.
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It's not toxic until you make it toxic. I can easily use Knock Out, down you in a weird place and keep an eye out on how long you're slugged for as I keep pressuring your team. By the time you're found, at least half of your bleeding out progress will be done and I can just bleed you out for the second time. Isn't that a little toxic? Not even giving you a chance to play properly?
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It's hardly toxic when this is the legit way she should be played.
With her chase potential, she can barely afford time hooking people so slugging allows her to apply the pressure properly. Whenever survivors like to be slugged or not, killers will do whatever they want and feel like they should. It just happened that Sadako both needs and benefits from such playstyle.
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Well is it not the truth? Probability isn't as simple as what you stated. When I listed reasons on the influences of probability, you didn't even bother thinking about what I said.
Am I wrong for suggesting you play fifty matches a day after you told me how addicted you are to the game? Did I go too high or too low? How am I strawmanning, I am simply assuming from what you told me about how addicted you are. If you're going to complain about my assumption, at least correct me. See this is yet another factor influencing probability. The list goes on.
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That playstyle should never be encouraged on any killer. I don't mind if they buff her chase potential, I really want them to instead of what they did to my solo queue games.
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That's because BHVR changed things between the PTB and the Live, she was real bad in PTB.
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SWF and the HUD icons existing completely nullifies this argument.
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god you could not be anymore wrong could you? every stealth killer doesn’t have a lullaby to give away their position. ghostface, wraith, pig, and other stealth killers don’t have lullabies because they are STEALTH KILLERS. sure you can say “oh but pig has that roar!!” “oh wraith has his breathing!!” okay? well sadako has the screeching whenever she’s phasing, sadako is able to be seen within 24 meters too.
she does not need and should not have a lullaby, it ruins her aspect of a stealth killer.
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Huntress has a lullaby specifically so she's not a stealth killer. Otherwise she could see you across the map and hatchet you without you having any idea she's there. The lullaby just let's you know she's in a range so you have a heads up.
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somehow, the survivor mental gymnastic that they should not need to learn how to loop an m1 killer or play well with survivor and then you get these type of entitled posts of "I want to d/c" vs x killer. makes little sense. I agree with your post. the mori is as easy as survivors play around it. don't play around the mori, easy mori. play around with mori and loop well. harder mori.
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For real that’s what it feels like. People act like she gets free hits without chasing as if she’s a wraith or something. She’s barely passable as a stealth killer with a lullaby and has to chase for her hits as an m1 with no power lol
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