The situation with the two remaining survivors.

Over the years of the game's existence, many annoying moments have been solved and fixed. The most boring part of the game is now when the killer leaves one survivor on the ground to find another and make four kills thereby and this situation can drag on for a long time. I don't have a specific solution, just do something towards the killer or survivor if you don't have some kind of your ideal solution. The most important thing here is that there will no longer be this dull waste of time.

Comments

  • GayDwight
    GayDwight Member Posts: 83

    It means to do something else, even in favor of the killer, if these achievements are so important. It's their job to come up with something else. But don't just leave it as it is. I expressed my opinion, at the moment this is the most negative part of the game.

  • Anti051
    Anti051 Member Posts: 505

    If the killer has not found a survivor for 4 minutes, the entity grants 'whispers' until the next chase starts.

  • Skillfulstone
    Skillfulstone Member Posts: 162
    edited September 12

    Honestly, as disgusting as the "basekit Unbreakable" idea was. The concept has some use.

    Simply make it so that if only 2 Survivors remain in a trial then they can get up by themselves.

    There, problem solved.

    Basekit Unbreakable can't exist the whole trial. But slugging for the 4k (which more often than not results in the slug bleeding out after 4 minutes) is beyond boring for everyone involved.

    Alternatively, if only 2 Survivors are left, give an "instant bleedout" option to a downed Survivor.

  • Archol123
    Archol123 Member Posts: 2,154

    Agreed, the problem is that when you already "won", because the survivors are unable to finish the gens but you have to get all 4 and don't want to rely on hatch. Either make it so hatch escape does not count toward adept or just rework hatch into something that rewards skill and not some rng thing that might spawn right next to you or on the edges of Narnia (like in the swamp maps).

  • zarr
    zarr Member Posts: 724

    Allow survivors to kill themselves in the dying state ("call upon the Entity to take their dying soul" because killing oneself doesn't fly these days I suppose). This would solve all of those issues. If not being able to always guarantee a 4k from a 3k is an issue for achievements or challenges, change the latter.

  • AbsolutGrndZer0
    AbsolutGrndZer0 Member Posts: 944

    While I agree, this game isn't and has never been really about skill.

  • Archol123
    Archol123 Member Posts: 2,154

    Why not? I think it is about skill in chase or hiding, while I would say the hiding playstyle is more luck based. Of course with map rng and so on it is largely impacted by how good your map generation has been... Otzdarva once did a video about the worst map rng and I think it was 5 pallets on groaning storehouse.

  • AbsolutGrndZer0
    AbsolutGrndZer0 Member Posts: 944

    Because of all the luck and RNG involved, it's still way more luck than skill overall. More so for survivor than killer, I think. If there are no more pallets on the map cause Meg pre-threw them all at 5 gens, then no amount of skill is going to save you. If the killer is a tunneler, no amount of skill is going to save you. If the other survivors are standing behind you waving you and another survivor to get off the generator blocking you from seeing the ghost face standing just outside range, no skill is going to save you when that Ghost Face pops exposed on all 3 of you. You might be the most skilled gamer ever, but there are 3 other survivors that probably aren't.


    After all, how many content creators have done 1000 Escape Streaks?

  • Archol123
    Archol123 Member Posts: 2,154

    No offense dude, but you just described a skill issue with the teammates xD As for tunneling, you can tunnel all you want, if the survivor is good enough he will loop you all game long.

    I mean there was 200+ escape streak done by hens, only lost against a comp Nurse... Such streaks basically only ever end against comp players.

  • AbsolutGrndZer0
    AbsolutGrndZer0 Member Posts: 944

    Yes, but YOUR skill doesn't matter when the other players skill can be so varied. As you said, generally unless you are a SWF of 4 COMP survivors vs. a COMP killer, then and only then does a player's individual skill matter. Plus as you said, COMP players aside, most players aren't comp. They are here to have fun and that's it... When I play, survivor or killer, I play for fun, I follow the Golden Rule (Do Unto Others as You Would Have Them Do Unto You) as best as I can.

  • Archael
    Archael Member Posts: 609

    I too, hate such scenarios. Tho its important for certain objectives, challanges and achivments.

    Tho i think i have a solution.

    If killer hook, and/or kill 3rd survivor, while one is laying on the ground, said surv recovered immidately. In this case, hatch escape should count as a sacrifice for killer in terms of achivments and challanges.

  • Foempticol
    Foempticol Member Posts: 139

    Hatch should be removed, it only encourages toxic and selfish behavior

  • Felgoose
    Felgoose Member Posts: 114

    It's a consolation prize. If a killer gets 3 kills, they won. The hatch is just a bonus to keep the last survivor from hiding forever. I would like to see challenges adjusted so that no one NEEDS to get a 4k.

    For this situation as well as 3 gen clusters I'd like to see an early collapse timer. We see it as part of the normal interface. When only 3 gens are left, we get the progress of a slow collapse. If there is only 1 survivor left standing regardless of gen progress, the slow collapse progresses and a hatch appears. Speed of this collapse would increase with hooks and generator completions. If everyone is slugged, last survivor has to choose between hatch or rescue attempt. If killer closes hatch, it spawns somewhere else and collapse gets a chunk of progress. End game collapse triggered by exit gate opening or final hatch closing on last survivor starts from where this slow collapse left off.

    It would be an extreme change but would eliminate stale gameplay moments and add pressure to both killer and survivors to keep the game progressing.

  • Archol123
    Archol123 Member Posts: 2,154

    If hatch just respawns after it gets closed isn't that just way too survivor sided than?

  • Felgoose
    Felgoose Member Posts: 114

    Only really for solo que. SWFs are gonna try to save each other.

    The last survivor standing hatch would be more of a way to concede defeat. It would have to instantly sacrifice the remaining survivors when someone jumps into it, and preferably they'd modify challenges that require you to get a 4k to only require 3k. I think there's too much value put into getting 4k as the game stands, both from challenges and what the community sees as 'winning'. The hatch isn't a way for one survivor to win the game. It's a post-game freethrow, a chance for a consolation prize for the team that lost.

  • Archol123
    Archol123 Member Posts: 2,154

    I don't agree at all. Didn't you say it would only respawn when there is one person left anyway? So at the point when the hatch reopens/respawns what does it matter if it is swf or solo? Since there is only 1 person left? So at this point they cannot really help at all. But the killer cannot just close the hatch and patrol gates but has to find hatch again? And probably just camp it because closing only opens it somewhere, I don't like the idea at all, I think it is terrible. It's is basically a free escape for the fourth guy, because there is no way people would actually just search for hatch that many times in one match, just so it respawns anyway.

    I don't necessarily think there is too much of a focus on 4ks, I just don't think you should get a consolation prize, because why would you, you didn't earn it in any way. The survivors are supposed to work in a team to fullfill their goal and if they cannot they loose.

  • Farya
    Farya Member Posts: 94
    edited September 20

    Sometimes I have big issues finding the last remaining two Survs, if there are still 2-3 gens need to be done. Might be because I am not that good at this game, but oh boy I had games going on 5-10 minutes with two remaining Survivors, because both just hide and never come out. This is the case often.

    Whenever I play Surv I just stick to doing objectives and if the Killer get's me and my hiding team mate get's hatch.. I don't care much. At least this is more fun than waiting unneccesary long time for the game to end and hope he find my team mate first.

    I can't think of a good solution on this for both sides. Maybe change Hatch somehow, yes... or make gens pop faster, if there are only two Surv left, dunno. It just annoys me, that Survs (being it mates in a surv game or opponents in a killer game) act this way, making the game more boring and lenghten it for everyone.

  • Felgoose
    Felgoose Member Posts: 114

    Only the pre EGC hatch would respawn. Once a survivor is the last one alive and the hatch is closed, that would trigger the EGC like normal and another hatch would not spawn.

  • Felgoose
    Felgoose Member Posts: 114

    There ought to be a point when you start gaining idle crows if you just crouch-walk around the map and don't do any objectives.

  • Felgoose
    Felgoose Member Posts: 114

    I think another simple solution would be to give the killer basekit Whispers when exactly 2 survivors are remaining.

  • Farya
    Farya Member Posts: 94
    edited September 20

    How about spawning hatch if there are 2surv left and more than two gens are still to be done? That would make the two remaining survivors at least search for hatch and not make them hiding and lenghten the game anymore.

    Last Survivor would have to open one of the exit gates after hatch was used, without having to complete the remaining gens.

    The basekit Whispers when 2 survivors are remaining (maybe after a certain ammount of time has passed) sounds good as well.

  • Archol123
    Archol123 Member Posts: 2,154

    Why should hatch spawn earlier? It used to do that and got removed because it was stupid to be openend with keys when not all gens where done because the killer could do nothing about it.

  • Farya
    Farya Member Posts: 94

    Maybe I didn't play that time or forgot about it, sorry then. Just came back after a long break. My thoughts on this were, that maybe it kept the last 2 Surv from hiding and hoping the other one gets killed first, which I see very often these days. Was just a brainstorm. (or brain fart maybe 🤭).

  • Archol123
    Archol123 Member Posts: 2,154

    I don't know how long ago it was, maybe 2 years or something like that? Until then hatch spawned closed before and people would just escape despite gens still being there to be done... It was really annoying because you would basically loose a won game just because of a key, so glad they changed it. I think it was the same patch where moris got changed as well.

  • Skitten56
    Skitten56 Member Posts: 83

    The simple solution is to just have a button survivors can press to automatically bleed out under specific conditions. I think the following conditions would be reasonable:

    1: If there are only 2 survivors left in the trial and 1 or more are slugged on the ground

    2: If all remaining survivors are slugged on the ground or hooked (maybe not allow it if one of them has Unbreakable, Plot Twist, or Deliverance active as they may be able to turn things around still)

  • not_requested49
    not_requested49 Member Posts: 1,970
  • Archol123
    Archol123 Member Posts: 2,154

    I mean with 4ks required for some things you would just need to slug 3 people then because otherwise you as the killer still have the issue of someone needing to get the 4k for example for an achievement.

    I would either change hatch/ last man standing into something else or just completely remove hatch, basically forcing survivors to still try to win through finishing gens and opening the gates. Survivors won't have to hide for hatch anymore, killer does not have to slug anymore, since he can just patrol gens, and if you want to give up you can just run towards him and he has no reason not to hook you because the last guy cannot just escape through hatch.

  • I_CAME
    I_CAME Member Posts: 824
    edited September 20

    So make it take 30 seconds to one minute before the bleed out finishes. The killer still has a chance to find the hatch if it spawns. A survivor can already realistically hide for the entire bleedout anyway. Making it slightly faster isn't going to change much. Worst case scenario you're in a 50/50 at the end where you're both looking for the hatch. Doesn't mean killers won't be able to get a 4K.

  • AbsolutGrndZer0
    AbsolutGrndZer0 Member Posts: 944

    I mean, if you are being serious about liking being slugged, then sure. Go for it. Slug to your heart's content with my blessing.


  • not_requested49
    not_requested49 Member Posts: 1,970

    I am

    Genuinely prefer it to getting hooked but people will hate me cuz I'm not killing them immediately I guess 🤷‍♂️