The anticamp mechanic is ineffective
If the killer is standing on the edge of the radius the bar goes up so slowly that even if the survivors proc reassurance then bolt away from the hook the survivor barely manages to unhook themselves with a few seconds spare before staging. Thats if the bar is never slowed by a nearby survivor and the killer stares at the hook the entire time AND reassurance is used. This is far too slow, the speed decays too quickly with distance. Either the distance needs to be larger or the speed needs to decay less with distance. This is not a significant distance either, standing at this distance an m1 killer can easily react to a survivor approaching the hook before action can be taken. Huntress or trickster are pretty much completely unphased as hitting survivors at this distance before they can unhook is trivial.
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Every killer I have played against since the update has been camping, just from super far away. I seriously don't understand why they don't just play the game normally.
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Killers are supposed to be able to react to a hook save. There is an entire score point about safe unhooks vs unsafe unhooks. The whole point of AFC was to try to prevent trades from being impossible. Let's face it, 90% of the patch was to address bubba.
AFC was never meant to stop hook trades or otherwise be completely safe for free rescues.
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Staring at a hook for 89 seconds from 15 meters away is not "reacting to a save" its literally just camping. The mechanic totally fails to prevent this kind of camping as even reassurance is ineffective as realistically the killer can just step an additional meter away for 2 or 3 seconds before stepping back and a hook stage will happen while camping the entire time.
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You may have misunderstood the patch. It's not an anti camping mechanic. It's an anti face camping mechanic. They outlined this and clarified quite a few times. It's mostly to stop bubbas, imho. Stopping proxy camping would gut most killer gameplay...at least for weaker killers. They need to be able to defend hooks. If that's taken away, they need some buffs to add pressure in other ways.
That being said, it doesn't affect me much since I usually leave hooks clear open for saves, but there are definitely situations where defending a hook is necessary. Survivors have a LOT of power right now, so sometimes trades are needed.
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Fail to hide, fail to avoid injury, fail to escape chase, and the survivor only succeeds at becoming bait for the killer to draw in teammates.
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I can confirm the mechanic is flawed. I had a camping Myers yesterday who put me on a hook close the a hill, he camped on top of it and although he was inside of the 16m radius (thank you Kindred) the bar did not go up. The Game literally thought he needed to leave the hill the way he got onto it... But in reality he was maybe 10m away max.
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Have you considered taking reassurance and/or deliverance to punish this?
The 16m radius affords you the ability to use them quite easily now. You can even take decisive strike and dead hard too to waste loads of the killers time.
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AFC was never meant to prevent any camping. It's there just to remove the most uninteractive part where there's nothing u can do but watch person on hook die. That's no longer the case. You can now unhook or at least trade. Even against killers that are camping from distance.
The only issue mentioned is what @LapisInfernalis mentioned (but it's to be expected that there would be some problems with early implementation). Everything else is fair game.
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I don't know why everyone is dissatisfied. Then try using the anti-camping perk! The development team basically gave survivors one perk that would allow them to free themselves from the hook. The killer will feel like he has 5 perks per survivor.
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its anti facecamp not proxy camp
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If the Killer isn't just standing right in front of the hook to deny any trade opportunity then you shouldn't be getting yourself off hook for free.
Too many people are falling to understand what this mechanic was meant to address.
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The devs made changes because of maps with second stories. Looks like Myers found a nice loophole.
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Laughs in tombstone. No but seriously I love the afc but I also play slinger and when I need to stay in an area because there's and almost complete gen and a hooked survivor it agitates me.
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its anti face camp. is your face 16m long?
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Nothing that can't be fixed i guess.
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I have seen a video with this Tombstone tactic. it's evil.
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You didnt even read the post. This was tested in a custom game. Put someone in a hook, proc reassurance before the 7 second grade period is up and the run away from the hook so you dont slow it down. The killer can simply stand on the edge of the radius and the unhook bar goes up so slowly despite camping the entire hook stage THROUGH REASSURANCE that they will not unhook themselves before stage 2. Nor can you safely unhook because the radius is small enough that the killer is able to react to a survivor approaching the hook and begin face camping now that the meter is slowed by an approaching survivor.
When camping at 16 meters the bar should go up fast enough that the survivor can unhook after 50 seconds of camping if no other survivors are nearby. There is no excuse to camp someone for that long if survivors are not at the hook That's still enough time that it's easy to camp someone to second stage unless a reassurance is used, and makes reassurance an effective anti camping perk
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I did read your post, sorry I didn't make my point clear at all. I'll try again.
The point of deliverance/reassurance in my post isn't that it allows the survivor to unhook themselves... its the fact that you can get both of these perks working for you easily, whereas before, trying to use them against a face camper was a gamble in of itself, you were just as likely to get down before you even got the unhook or the reassurance off.
If you apply reassurance to a survivor being proxy camped, that hook stage is now 90 seconds instead of 60 seconds. If you then pull them off with deliverance, you get hooked, and thats another 60 seconds the killer wastes. You then unhook yourself with Deliverance and run for anywhere between 10 and 50 seconds. Get downed and hit decisive or eat a hit with off the record. Then loop as long as you can, before using a dead hard.
All going well, you just cost the killer anywhere between 150 and 250+ seconds, while your teammates have been pumping out generators. Even if you don't have these perks, it is far easier to rotate exchanges, especially with kindred, and by doing that it's buying you an absurd amount of time.
The main benefit of the AFC is not that you get to unhook yourself against proxy campers, it's the fact that you as a survivor are safer to go for unhooks or use anti-camping perks that you were before.
Post edited by UndeddJester on2 -
"Standing on the edge of the radius"
"has been camping FROM SUPER FAR AWAY"
I love survivors, really i do love survivors 😂😂
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Unhooks are not safer to go for though. Killer lunges are roughly 6 meters and moving 10 meters takes a 115 killer about 2.2 seconds. This means if a killer is camping at 16 meters you have about 3 seconds to reach the hook and unhook safely before the killer can successfully intercept you, it's simply not plausible. If the killer knows what they are doing it is effectively no different to face camping.
The distinction between face camping and "proxy camping" are practically irrelevant as face camping really provides 0 benefit compared to camping from a slight distance. The only difference might come on a map like lerys where there are walls everywhere so you don't have clear lines of sight on the approaches to the hook. Hell for huntress and trickster it is completely irrelevent
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Something else I noticed is that a survivor can bait-juke the killer in the hooks radius, giving the hooked survivor free escape without even saving and taking a hit.
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Survivors when the killer is in the same zip code as them when they're hooked:
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Even if you go down, if you can rescue an onhook survivor and escape, the rescue is a success.
AFC is not meant to guarantee an unscathed rescue. If that were the case, there would be no strategy for rescue operations at all.
Please pay the same price. If not, try to be better than your opponent.
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Well BHVR never said they intended to stop camping, they've always said its part of the game. For years, they've shrugged off face camping as 'deal with it'. However they've relented and admitted there isn't really any counterplay to this, so the AFC was introduced to combat the most agregious cases of face camp...
Now I know its not as strong as you would like, but thats not its purpose to stop camping... its purpose is to open up counterplay... and it IS undeniable that its easier to unhook against a camping killer with the AFC than it is without. You can approach from a different angle out of sight of the killer, and the killer has to move in/get an angle on you to stop you. Without AFC they're able to sit right under the hook and you basically can't do anything.
The fact is that BHVR never wanted to end camping, and merely wanted to stop face camping... so I dunno what to tell you, the feature seems to be working exactly as intended.
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The funniest thing is, I think this makes Survivors play worse now than before. They feel invincible, so their team waits far too long to realize 'oh snap, I need to actually rescue them from the hook'. I had a full team stare me down on Borgo, with the 4th hooked in the jungle gym behind me in the corner, while I stood next to a 90% gen in the middle of the side. The Nea kept pretending like she was going to take aggro, but we both knew she had Balanced, so she stayed close to main building to fall off at all times. As a result, the team showed me that me standing right there kept everyone off of gens, the nearly complete gen kept regressing, and none of them were willing to take a hit or go for a hook trade until the person died on hook. They never tried to go around from the opposite side/corner, they never tried anything that showed an inkling of thought, and as a result their teammate died on hook behind me when I was nowhere near her.
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