MfT was problem and it's gonna be nerfed.
But now we are getting complaints for SB too...
What perks we should use
Threadly reminder that the majority of the player base (on both sides) has no problems with SB or lithe.
SB and Lithe are not meta for long time. We had Dead Hard meta for long time. After DH gutted, we got MfT. So SB and Lithe did not stay as meta perks for long enough.
We will see real reactions pretty soon but i am hoping you are right. I don't wanna get all fun perks nerfed just because people don't enjoy against them.
Survivors shouldn’t use any perks or items. They should go into matches naked so that all killers can 4K with ease and zero challenge. 🤣
Personally speaking, I don't like either of the implications this post makes.
I don't like the implication that complaints necessarily lead to nerfs, and I don't like the implication that survivors only have a handful of perks worth using. Neither of those things are true and I don't think we achieve anything by acting like they are.
Some people are just gonna complain about whatever perks annoy them the most, it doesn't really mean anything's going to be done about it.
Given enough time you can find complaints about almost any perk in the game, especially strong ones. Most players have no issue with SB and Lithe. They are both balanced.
On the other hand MFT was complained about frequently and got nerfed because it was legitimately problematic.
SB and Lithe were always meta. Not top of the top meta but still.
Not everyone was able to hit „E“ during DH‘s prime time and not everyone was comfortable staying injured for MfT. So people used SB or Lithe instead.
And just because there was one guy was complaining doesn’t mean anything. People are still complaining about dead man‘s or NOED but nobody takes them seriously.
Those killers should equip Mindbreaker and block exhaustion reset if they really hate it.
Anyway I don't think there are any problematic perks besides current MFT and BuckleUp (with FTP in SWF).
I think it’s a bit disingenuous to suggest that complaining about perks does not lead to nerfs. People have been complaining about MFT on this forum for months, the same way they did about DH, COH, medkits and after months of complaints they all got or are getting nerfs. Same as what happened with eruption.
Obviously one persons complaints about a perk that they want nerfed because they got outplayed by it isn’t going to get much. But it’s obvious that the community feedback, especially here on the official forum, is going to be seen and considered to make changes. Especially when the feedback/complaints are constant and consistent. Otherwise why ask us for our feedback when they drop PTBs and stuff?
Constant complaints do have power here whether we want to admit it or not.
The crucial thing missing from this rundown though, is that those things warranted nerfs. The complaints those received were not the primary reason that they got addressed- the reason for the complaints was also the primary reason they got nerfed; they were too strong.
That's why it's wrong to imply that a couple people complaining about Sprint Burst means that Sprint Burst will be nerfed. In the past however many patches, I can only think of a single perk that was complained about and subsequently nerfed that didn't warrant it, and that's not exactly a convincing precedent on its own.
Wasn't the death of Deadhard suppose to make people complain about SB or Lilith. Also the moment MFT was created, SB and Lilth usage went down.
I don't think Survivors think theses perks are as good as they want to admit. Who knows, maybe with MFT changes they'll go up again.
Fair point and I think the idea of nerfs being warranted depends on who you ask, but again nerfs don’t usually happen until the complaints come in. Medkits were the way they were for years until a sudden influx of complaints about them came through then that’s when they got looked at. Were they too strong? Possibly depending on who you ask but nothing was done UNTIL they became widely complained about. DH got its first nerf and killers were happy with it until survivors learned to adapt and use it in a different way. As soon as they learned to use it suddenly it became an issue again, the complaints went back up and it got its second nerf.
I get what you’re saying and yes you can say “well those nerfs are warranted because they were too strong” but the fact remain that until people complain that it’s too strong, the nerfs don’t happen. Because why would they? If no one is complaining then the devs have no reason to look at them outside of their initial release really. They’re focused on pumping out new chapters every 3 months.
And now who’s to say that sprint burst isn’t too strong? I think you’re correct that 1-2 people complaining isn’t gonna do much but I’ve seen plenty of people complaining about sprint burst on here before MFT hit and after DH got it’s second nerf. Now with MFT about to be gone, if sprint burst increases in usage I think it’s very possible that it will start to be the new complaint perk and headed for a nerf.
We’re already seeing that with complaints about windows because it’s the number one used survivor perk, it’s “too strong” despite the fact that there are counters to it (blindness perks) and there’s a killer version of it available in zanshin tactics.
Please don't try to create drama about something that most players don't find problematic. Just because of someone says Inner Healing is too strong in your game, you don't have to go your way and make drama out of it.
The majority of players probably has no problem with sb. Of course there are those die hard killer only players that will complain about everything that isn't no mither + self care, but you should just ignore those people.
Play what you wanna play bro.
"Imagine complaining about sprint burst or lithe... In 2023..."
There are dozens of viable survivor perks. Don't be a meta slave.
If that ever happens, I'll be the first to defend them both. Even before DHs pick rate skyrocketed, Lithe and SB were popular but I do not remember many complaints about them. They were mostly regarded as fine. Strong and not great for the killer (as with any survivor perk other than maybe No Mither) but definitely fair.
I'll fly to the BHVR head quarters myself and have a little chat with the devs before that happens. Preferably over some Feng skins. Love you, devs!
I have no problem with sprint burst or lithe or overcome or whatever you want to bring.
I take you all day. The problem for me was not the exhaustion perk that extends chases. It's the exhaustion perk that extends chases in an unfair way.
Dh: at the end of chase, uncounterable at pallets
Mft: during the entire seconds part of the chase and uncounterable in general.
All the other ones are either a one and gone or are hard to use twice. I can live with survivors using skill in a match. I hope survivors use skill in matches. I want survivors to use skill in matches.
I don't want survivors to run from pallet to pallet with a 3% speed boost just because their windows told them to pre drop it in my face.
Killer propaganda is so crazy cause I'm not sure how you can say MFT and DH take no skill and then in the same post praise Lithe for being skillful.
I truly wish you guys would use these perks against killers who know how to play against them.
And let's be real. The only reason you like SB and Lithe has nothing to do with them being skillful and more that both are so easy to ignore because they suck outside of niche cases.
Back when MFT was in PTB, people said that it was a weak perk and Lithe/SB would be better.
Fast forward a few months later, people are saying Lithe/SB will be better after MFT nerf
Alternate facts are my favorite facts.
One person complaining because they lost doesn’t mean everyone wants it nerfed.
If I posted every complaint I got in end game chat then Ghostface and Spies from the Shadows would have been deleted by this point.
There’s still a lot of good survivor perks you can use so don’t worry about one person complaining because you outplayed him.
Also nice to see more people running Vigil. Your build looks fun.
@Venusa People are busying about FTP + BU; WoO ; Sprint burst, Lithe nerf. I think using Calm Spirit will be fine.
He didn't have a good game and is lashing out. I wouldn't have even bothered to reply. Just go next.
I really think it so. If a Blight without perk and able to down everyone with no chance, its not a good game on survivors.
Some still find a reason to complain. Just move on.
you are trying so hard to build the narrative that killer mains will look for the next survivor perk to complain about but no, noone, including this huntress in the ss isn't complaining that sb (or lithe, considering your older bait post) is *unfair or broken*. little spoilers if you are this curious as to what survivor perk these whiny crybaby killer mains will complain about: it's ftp buckle up. unless a strong boon perk comes out or already decent perks get buffed (like buckle up), there will be no other survivor perk people will be complaining "next".
DH is not really gutted. It just has it owns drawbacks. the drawbacks being that it does not work on 1st chase and that you cannot use it more then two times per game. Previously, DH had 0 drawbacks and only contained positives. SB has drawback where you cannot control when you use it. you can only use it at the start of a chase. the only time you have control if killer volunteer chases you with 99% SB. Lithe has drawback where you cannot loop strong tile-sets. You have to vault a window and run forward before you can loop anything. Only thing high skill play you can do with Lithe is loop weak pallets then try to time a slide that connect a weaker pallet to strong pallet to disable bloodlust.
Killer are not complaining about these perks because the survivor has no control on how to use said perks. There is lack of heighten skill expression with SB and Lithe. DH has skill expression but it is limited because of # uses. MFT had infinity skill expression because killer was not in control of how to use the perk. Survivor had full control over how to use 3% haste. Now they're erasing MFT from exhaustion category. They're trying place it in anti-tunnel category. I don't know how many survivor will try to use it. You have to use stypic agent from med-kit to trigger endurance effect on first chase and you need use OTR+MFT as 2 perk anti-tunnel combination. The logic is that if a killer is tunneling you off-hook, they'll hit 90 second OTR to proc MFT. that is just a lot of perk commitment just to use the perk. Anything else and the perk will not be consistent in average match. In my opinion, your better off using Decisive strike as 1 perk slot for anti-tunnel. My guess is that people try to use stypic needle with OTR+MFT, realize it is not worth it and just use decisive strike.
Probably should have asked the person making the claim in the endgame chat instead of making an Us vs Them topic on the forums.
Who’s complaining about SB?
Didn't you already make this thread last week?
I dont think anyone said they thought MFT was gonna be a bad perk or is a bad perk. If they did they just dont have much knowledge about the game.
Now that's a hot take.
When did I say that dh takes no skill? When did I say that lithe takes skill?
Also regarding your "killer propaganda". Can you explain what this is? Antagonizing players in an us VS them - format is not tolerated by me and many others on this forum. We try to be open minded and considerate for both roles in this game. Everything else invites a very unhealthy mindset.
" Wish you guys would see players that know how to play against them."
I happen to play 80% - 20% killer - survivor and am known as an obsessive Boop-enthusiast (pig main). What counter does the 3% haste have? I hit a survivor and they are faster. Done.
DH at pallet has counterplay, true. A fraction of a second. That's good counterplay right? Skull merchants drones also have good counterplay right?
Last but not least: sprint burst is an extremely good perk. I think most can agree on that. When using the Perk, you will almost never start a chase outpositioned. That saves you an entire health state. If the killer baits it and runs away, you downright won the chase because they found you to be too much of a haste to deal with. That's also extremely good. In regards to skill: 99% sprint burst mod chase is probably the strongest haste effect a survivor can pull off. Getting two sprint bursts in one chase is skill expression in my book and it's totally fine for me.
Lithe is not as skillfull. Especially not with windows of opportunity. But I'm also fine with that because it's a one and gone.
I feel like there is a good chance that a lot of players will complain about sb/lithe in 2024 (unless the next survivor comes with mft 2.0)
Phew! We survived another season. Don't let them know how broken and problematic CS is.😍
I think we need to differentiate between complains about a perk being strong and complains about a perk being unhealthy.
Sprint burst and lithe are sting but fair.
Old DH and MFT are strong, unfun and unfair.
However, there will always be people that complain about losing.
Lithe and Sprint Burst are annoying to face (all the exhaustion perks are), but I dont think they need nerfs. When MFT gets its nerf I'll be happy enough.
MfT was problematic and deserved a huge nerf; that is something I can 100% get behind.
However, some killers complaining about exhaustion perks is just silly at this point. Do they just want easy, guaranteed win chases at this point? Honestly, all of the most problematic survivor perks have received huge nerfs (DH, MfT, DS, and CoH). It’s like some players aren’t happy once their most hated perks are nerfed and simply say “next” and complain about something else.
Exhaustion is arguably one of the fairest mechanics in the game. Not only does it have a hefty cool down, but many perks and killer add-ons are direct counters to the likes of SB and Lithe.
SB, Lithe and most of the other exhaustion perks are fine. MFT was a problem for many reasons like: it could stay active almost the whole match, it had a very strong effect, specially against the weaker killers; it could be combined with other strong perks without a problem.
I hope we don't get more annoying busted perks for any side any time soon. Its bad to the game health.
We already have one: Ultimate Weapon
Was he even complaining about your sprintburst here? It says SH... Maybe he thought there was a hacker in the lobby and SH meant speed hacks.
as a killer i hope neither perk gets nerfed bc you get exhausted so you cant just tap the sprint button five times and walk 300 meters in 2 seconds so its fine by me
I mean we saw complaints about these perks after DH‘s second nerf. And they weren’t rare or incidental. I’m not the least bit surprised those complaints are returning now that MFT has been weakened. 🤷🏽♀️
Ironically, not even the guy in the original picture was complaining about SB, lol
As somebody who plays a lot of survivor? Bring Borrow Time.
Bring more Borrowed Time. Do it now.
You WILL save lives with with it, I almost never take it off.
Stop thinking about yourself and start thinking about others. Bring borrowed time.
Calm Spirit and Distortion needs to be deleted, reworked, or heavily nerfed. Excessively hiding survivors are a major game problem.
He was? I don't know where did you get that lol.
He dc'ed when chasing me and then we argued why SB is busted and boring.
he said SH not SB. Either it was a typo and he meant SB, or he was referring to speed hacks and thought you were cheating.
The majority of players also didn’t have a problem with DH or MFT. Because the majority of players aren’t on DBD forums. 💅🏾
Always room for Us vs Them!
It's like cookies for dessert :D