We need to talk about the number of pallets on The Game

DocOctober

I counted each Pallet I broke on that map: 15 pallets and there were still a couple left.

I'm sorry, but that's just too many. The Survivors didn't even have to think where they were running to, there was always a pallet in reach.

I would prefer it if the number gets lowered and the map gets made darker, more akin to something you'd actually see in a SAW movie, to make stealth and LOS jukes a more viable option. I'm tired of the braindead running from pallet to pallet. That doesn't take any skill whatsoever, not even map memorisation.

tt_ivi_99

Pallet looping takes skill, as killer you should try and improve your mindgames. The only problem is the infinite loops. Those are the ones which dont take skill at all and should be removed from the game.

DocOctober

@tt_ivi_99 said:
Pallet looping takes skill, as killer you should try and improve your mindgames. The only problem is the infinite loops. Those are the ones which dont take skill at all and should be removed from the game.

I'm not talking about looping here. Every Survivor just chained pallets as they were so abundant that they didn't even have to think were they were running to. They just run around and each time I caught up, there was a pallet to throw in my way.

And most loops are not mindgame-able. There are next to no unsafe pallets left.

Another thing too: looping is braindead-easy and requires no skill other than being able to run around stuff while looking backwards. Most Survivors are horribly bad at this game, so they resort to the easiest, cheapest "strategy" they can find in order to actually get good at the game. This becomes even more evident in late game when they run out of pallets. The actually good Survivors that don't rely on loops are still able to get away from/lose the Killer, while the "pro"-loopers that can't do anything else suddenly get their ######### handed to them.

tt_ivi_99

The only not mindgame-able loops (which I assume you think about the "line of sight loops") are found on Autohaven and they can be mindgamed by ussing the killer's power.

Yh some pallets can spawn pretty near to each other and I think they should get the same treatment as hooks on the 2.5.0 update but other than that I wouldnt reduce the number.

Edit:
About that "braindead-easy and requires no skill" comment... Try hidding your light by moonwalking, stand still facing the pallet when line of sight is broken or be decisive when ussing your killer power.
Seriously, It aint that hard to end chases sooner if you're facing a looper.

Vietfox

Some of those pallets are really unsafe, so i guess it's fine.

Ihatelife

@Vietfox said:
Some of those pallets are really unsafe, so i guess it's fine.

And some of them are perfectly safe, so i also guess that is fine.

Vietfox

@Ihatelife said:

@Vietfox said:
Some of those pallets are really unsafe, so i guess it's fine.

And some of them are perfectly safe, so i also guess that is fine.

Yup, what would be the purpose of them if all of them weren't?

Freudentrauma

The only problem I see with the Game's pallet distribution, is the room above the bathroom. I think only one pallet there would be enough considering that these are two strong loops. Besides that I don't mind the amount of pallets considering tha Game's layout and the lack of vaults.

NoShinyPony

The Game has a super low amount of windows, therefore there need to be pallets, otherwise the areas on the map would be a dead zone from the beginning and the survivors would have no chance.

A lot of those pallets are safe and the killer needs to destroy them. If the survivor knows how to run, the killer will often only catch up to him after 4/5 gens are done.

Conclusion: Map design should be reworked by either swapping pallets for windows or by creating more mindgame opportunites around pallets.

mcNuggets

@tt_ivi_99 said:
The only not mindgame-able loops (which I assume you think about the "line of sight loops") are found on Autohaven and they can be mindgamed by ussing the killer's power.

Yh some pallets can spawn pretty near to each other and I think they should get the same treatment as hooks on the 2.5.0 update but other than that I wouldnt reduce the number.

Edit:
About that "braindead-easy and requires no skill" comment... Try hidding your light by moonwalking, stand still facing the pallet when line of sight is broken or be decisive when ussing your killer power.
Seriously, It aint that hard to end chases sooner if you're facing a looper.

The 2 basement pallets are definetely mindgame able.
Thanks Mr. Smartypants for giving us insights.

DocOctober

@tt_ivi_99 said:
The only not mindgame-able loops (which I assume you think about the "line of sight loops") are found on Autohaven and they can be mindgamed by ussing the killer's power.

Yh some pallets can spawn pretty near to each other and I think they should get the same treatment as hooks on the 2.5.0 update but other than that I wouldnt reduce the number.

Edit:
About that "braindead-easy and requires no skill" comment... Try hidding your light by moonwalking, stand still facing the pallet when line of sight is broken or be decisive when ussing your killer power.
Seriously, It aint that hard to end chases sooner if you're facing a looper.

Don't waste your breath. Safe pallets are not mindgame-able, but fool-proof, that's the premise of them being safe ones, which is already ridiculous that it exists, considering the devs never intended for Survivors to have safe spots.

And many loops do not have line of sight blockers, those too are not mindgame-able unless perhaps against the noob Survivors you seem to face, considering the ludicrous strategies you try to suggest to me.

DocOctober

@NoShinyPony said:
The Game has a super low amount of windows, therefore there need to be pallets, otherwise the areas on the map would be a dead zone from the beginning and the survivors would have no chance.

A lot of those pallets are safe and the killer needs to destroy them. If the survivor knows how to run, the killer will often only catch up to him after 4/5 gens are done.

Conclusion: Map design should be reworked by either swapping pallets for windows or by creating more mindgame opportunites around pallets.

Or improve stealth. The map is too bright and staying hidden or losing line of sight is quite difficult.

DocOctober

@Vietfox said:
Some of those pallets are really unsafe, so i guess it's fine.

The pallets in the basement corridor? Safe.
The pallets in the room atop the bathroom? Safe.
The pallets in the jungle gym? Safe.
The pallets in-between the store racks? Safe.
The pallets in-between the shipping containers? Safe.
The pallets right atop the staircase with a railing? Safe.
The pallets surrounded by barrels? Safe.
The pallets in-between junk in the small rooms with 4 pillars? Safe.

There are next to no unsafe pallets on The Game other than the one in-between the wall and the forklift. That's the only one I can think of right now at which the distance the Killer needs to walk to reach either side is short enough for the back-and-forth vaulting Survivor to eventually screw up and get hit.

And you seriously dare ask why I call you biased? It's this very thing.

The Map is full of safe pallets, they vastly outnumber the unsafe one(s), yet because at least one unsafe one exists, you deem it balanced and fair. That's bias in its purest form.

Vietfox

DocOctober said:

@Vietfox said:
Some of those pallets are really unsafe, so i guess it's fine.

The pallets in the basement corridor? Safe.
The pallets in the room atop the bathroom? Safe.
The pallets in the jungle gym? Safe.
The pallets in-between the store racks? Safe.
The pallets in-between the shipping containers? Safe.
The pallets right atop the staircase with a railing? Safe.
The pallets surrounded by barrels? Safe.
The pallets in-between junk in the small rooms with 4 pillars? Safe.

There are next to no unsafe pallets on The Game other than the one in-between the wall and the forklift. That's the only one I can think of right now at which the distance the Killer needs to walk to reach either side is short enough for the back-and-forth vaulting Survivor to eventually screw up and get hit.

And you seriously dare ask why I call you biased? It's this very thing.

The Map is full of safe pallets, they vastly outnumber the unsafe one(s), yet because at least one unsafe one exists, you deem it balanced and fair. That's bias in its purest form.

I don't recall asking you why you call me biased 😕
There's more than one, like the one between a column and something else (i've never been good with details) or the one in the room which looks like a jungle gym but it really isn't, those are quite easy to mind game.
Also don't forget that The Game map is the one with the lowest survival rate iirc so it can't be that bad.

The_Trapper

There are fewer pallets where you can mindgame, and even fewer when you are playing as a tall killer. No matter the skill, any survivor can loop and buy their team time to do generators, and on the majority of the maps there is always another pallet close by, sometimes insanely close.

ShyN3ko

First: I dont care about safe and unsafe pallets.
Second: Pallets are a resource.
And yes survivor have to many pallets(on some maps).
And they dont get a hard punishement for wasting this resource.
Because the killer doesnt have enough time to destroy all pallets.

PigNRun

I feel The Game got darker with the engine update, too dark. I was playing Clown, and the room below the pig vac felt so dark seeing a Claudette was difficult. And it was mid-chase, she wasnt hiding in one dark corner.

Master

@DocOctober said:
I counted each Pallet I broke on that map: 15 pallets and there were still a couple left.

I'm sorry, but that's just too many. The Survivors didn't even have to think where they were running to, there was always a pallet in reach.

I would prefer it if the number gets lowered and the map gets made darker, more akin to something you'd actually see in a SAW movie, to make stealth and LOS jukes a more viable option. I'm tired of the braindead running from pallet to pallet. That doesn't take any skill whatsoever, not even map memorisation.

I believe that the number of pallets if fine at the moment. What needs to change is the number/location of windows. Reduce jungle gyms etc.

White_Owl

That is true, but at the same time that map has very few windows (I can think not more than 4), the second floor has little to no cover and overall the paths are very predictable: this, together with the fact that the floor is smooth and clean makes loosing a killer is very hard. I don't like all those pallets, but currently if it wasn't for them the map would be a death trap for survivors.
In conclusion, The Game needs a complete rework if we want a decrease in pallet numbers.

DocOctober

@White_Owl said:
That is true, but at the same time that map has very few windows (I can think not more than 4), the second floor has little to no cover and overall the paths are very predictable: this, together with the fact that the floor is smooth and clean makes loosing a killer is very hard. I don't like all those pallets, but currently if it wasn't for them the map would be a death trap for survivors.
In conclusion, The Game needs a complete rework if we want a decrease in pallet numbers.

That is what I proposed, yet people seem to not read that part.

Lateral

For every 1 pallet there are 10 hooks.

That's a bigger problem.

Frugl1

@Lateral said:
For every 1 pallet there are 10 hooks.

That's a bigger problem.

Except it's not.
First of all. That is a gross exaggeration. Second, the killer spends way too much time in a single chase for it to be wasted because of hook RNG. There not being a hook should very much be the exception, and not to rule, because the game pace simply does not allow otherwise.

powerbats

@DocOctober said:

@NoShinyPony said:
The Game has a super low amount of windows, therefore there need to be pallets, otherwise the areas on the map would be a dead zone from the beginning and the survivors would have no chance.

A lot of those pallets are safe and the killer needs to destroy them. If the survivor knows how to run, the killer will often only catch up to him after 4/5 gens are done.

Conclusion: Map design should be reworked by either swapping pallets for windows or by creating more mindgame opportunites around pallets.

Or improve stealth. The map is too bright and staying hidden or losing line of sight is quite difficult.

I've suggested darker maps and more stealth options but then the P3 Claudette and not wanting to have to play a stealth game complaints come up. I suck at looping and try not to do it often unless it's a Billy trying to hold his chainsaw up charged behind me. Those I'll loop into oblivion because i'm not going to give them an easy cheesy down like that.

For me I love a good stealth and evade game where the killer has to actually outthink me and figure out where I've skulked off to. I've had lots of killers compliment me on my evasion skills since they'd know i was there on that gen but couldn't ever find me.

But for all the killers that like a good hunt there's plenty more that just want survivors to run around in the open even if they complain about the end result being looping.

I'd be all for removing some more pallets if there was more ways to actually stealth off and Ormond is a prime example of not happening. I'm not advocating Red Forest type maps across the board but even swamp has gotten so much harder to stealth on.

Justicar

@tt_ivi_99 said:
Pallet looping takes skill, as killer you should try and improve your mindgames.

This is exactly the problem with so much of this game. A killer is supposed to be power role, and shouldn't be reliant on mindgames. They should be an extra tool, but not necessary.

powerbats

@Justicar said:

@tt_ivi_99 said:
Pallet looping takes skill, as killer you should try and improve your mindgames.

This is exactly the problem with so much of this game. A killer is supposed to be power role, and shouldn't be reliant on mindgames. They should be an extra tool, but not necessary.

Yet killers like Myers are all about mind games and I mean look at Friday the 13th how he mind gamed so well.

Raizinz

@tt_ivi_99 said:
Pallet looping takes skill, as killer you should try and improve your mindgames. The only problem is the infinite loops. Those are the ones which dont take skill at all and should be removed from the game.

You're ignoring the disparity here and christ stop using "skill" and "map knowledge" as interchangeable terms, there is nothing skillful in running towards a pallet that you know is there. The fact that you're suggesting that the killer must incorporate extra effort on top of already being disadvantaged in mobility is mind-numbing.
That said, procedural generation of pallets would resolve this overnight, as survivors won't be able to reliably run to the nearest loop while still keeping the same amount of pallets on the map

powerbats

@Raizinz said:

You're ignoring the disparity here and christ stop using "skill" and "map knowledge" as interchangeable terms, there is nothing skillful in running towards a pallet that you know is there. The fact that you're suggesting that the killer must incorporate extra effort on top of already being disadvantaged in mobility is mind-numbing.
That said, procedural generation of pallets would resolve this overnight, as survivors won't be able to reliably run to the nearest loop while still keeping the same amount of pallets on the map

Actually there is something skillful in running to a pallet you know is there since you have to make sure you're pathing is good to be able to reach it safely. If you make a mistake and get stuck on something, barrel, wall, tree stump etc you're screwed.

While procedural would help you'd have to do what @DocOctober said and add more stealth options since otherwise the survivors screwed. Also you've got more base movement speed, you can get bloodlusted, you can break said pallets.

You can hit the survivors and injure them and not the other way around, once destroyed those pallets are gone for good. You have perks that help, killers that deal with it quite easily and you can easily mind game some of them.

Lateral

@Frugl1 said:

@Lateral said:
For every 1 pallet there are 10 hooks.

That's a bigger problem.

Except it's not.
First of all. That is a gross exaggeration. Second, the killer spends way too much time in a single chase for it to be wasted because of hook RNG. There not being a hook should very much be the exception, and not to rule, because the game pace simply does not allow otherwise.

Doesn't change the fact that there's simply just a buttload of hooks, way more than is reasonable pretty much making Decisive Strike a must have pay 2 win feature.

NoShinyPony

@powerbats said:

@DocOctober said:

@NoShinyPony said:
The Game has a super low amount of windows, therefore there need to be pallets, otherwise the areas on the map would be a dead zone from the beginning and the survivors would have no chance.

A lot of those pallets are safe and the killer needs to destroy them. If the survivor knows how to run, the killer will often only catch up to him after 4/5 gens are done.

Conclusion: Map design should be reworked by either swapping pallets for windows or by creating more mindgame opportunites around pallets.

Or improve stealth. The map is too bright and staying hidden or losing line of sight is quite difficult.

I've suggested darker maps and more stealth options but then the P3 Claudette and not wanting to have to play a stealth game complaints come up.

Looping is a core mechanic of DbD and one main aspect what makes this game unique and why so many people love this game.

Not for everyone, but for the majority of people the chase is the fun part.

If the devs would put more focus on stealth, this game wouldn't be DbD anymore and a lot of people would quit playing it.

White_Owl

@DocOctober said:

@White_Owl said:
That is true, but at the same time that map has very few windows (I can think not more than 4), the second floor has little to no cover and overall the paths are very predictable: this, together with the fact that the floor is smooth and clean makes loosing a killer is very hard. I don't like all those pallets, but currently if it wasn't for them the map would be a death trap for survivors.
In conclusion, The Game needs a complete rework if we want a decrease in pallet numbers.

That is what I proposed, yet people seem to not read that part.

Yeah I just wanted to mention windows and pathing ^_^

powerbats

@NoShinyPony said:

Looping is a core mechanic of DbD and one main aspect what makes this game unique and why so many people love this game.

Not for everyone, but for the majority of people the chase is the fun part.

If the devs would put more focus on stealth, this game wouldn't be DbD anymore and a lot of people would quit playing it.

Well for some looping is the greatest but for others it's not and they could give stealth much more support so both types of players on both sides could enjoy it. I mean some killers complain about looping now but if stealthy play keeps getting whacked/not supported loopers are going to be 100% more common.

Tru3Lemon

@powerbats said:

@DocOctober said:

@NoShinyPony said:
The Game has a super low amount of windows, therefore there need to be pallets, otherwise the areas on the map would be a dead zone from the beginning and the survivors would have no chance.

A lot of those pallets are safe and the killer needs to destroy them. If the survivor knows how to run, the killer will often only catch up to him after 4/5 gens are done.

Conclusion: Map design should be reworked by either swapping pallets for windows or by creating more mindgame opportunites around pallets.

Or improve stealth. The map is too bright and staying hidden or losing line of sight is quite difficult.

I've suggested darker maps and more stealth options but then the P3 Claudette and not wanting to have to play a stealth game complaints come up. I suck at looping and try not to do it often unless it's a Billy trying to hold his chainsaw up charged behind me. Those I'll loop into oblivion because i'm not going to give them an easy cheesy down like that.

For me I love a good stealth and evade game where the killer has to actually outthink me and figure out where I've skulked off to. I've had lots of killers compliment me on my evasion skills since they'd know i was there on that gen but couldn't ever find me.

But for all the killers that like a good hunt there's plenty more that just want survivors to run around in the open even if they complain about the end result being looping.

I'd be all for removing some more pallets if there was more ways to actually stealth off and Ormond is a prime example of not happening. I'm not advocating Red Forest type maps across the board but even swamp has gotten so much harder to stealth on.

well they could make her clothes lighter make it so that her clothes can be seen since ppl use p3 its because a reason that shes very easy on stealth with her and its just for noobs. now i know alot ppl like claudette but for me shes just a character that make her invisible in dark maps

NoShinyPony

@powerbats said:

@NoShinyPony said:

Looping is a core mechanic of DbD and one main aspect what makes this game unique and why so many people love this game.

Not for everyone, but for the majority of people the chase is the fun part.

If the devs would put more focus on stealth, this game wouldn't be DbD anymore and a lot of people would quit playing it.

Well for some looping is the greatest but for others it's not and they could give stealth much more support so both types of players on both sides could enjoy it. I mean some killers complain about looping now but if stealthy play keeps getting whacked/not supported loopers are going to be 100% more common.

There are Hide & Seek video games without the looping mechanic but these games are nowhere as popular as DbD. Of course, there are people that like stealth play, but it's not the majority.

If the devs were to put focus on stealth, they would lose more players than gain new ones.

DocOctober

@NoShinyPony said:

@powerbats said:

@NoShinyPony said:

Looping is a core mechanic of DbD and one main aspect what makes this game unique and why so many people love this game.

Not for everyone, but for the majority of people the chase is the fun part.

If the devs would put more focus on stealth, this game wouldn't be DbD anymore and a lot of people would quit playing it.

Well for some looping is the greatest but for others it's not and they could give stealth much more support so both types of players on both sides could enjoy it. I mean some killers complain about looping now but if stealthy play keeps getting whacked/not supported loopers are going to be 100% more common.

There are Hide & Seek video games without the looping mechanic but these games are nowhere as popular as DbD. Of course, there are people that like stealth play, but it's not the majority.

If the devs were to put focus on stealth, they would lose more players than gain new ones.

I'd prefer that.

Looping was not part of Dead by Daylight for well over half a year after release. To claim that looping is a core mechanic is false. Even the devs call it an unintended way to play the game.

NoShinyPony

@DocOctober said:

@NoShinyPony said:

@powerbats said:

@NoShinyPony said:

Looping is a core mechanic of DbD and one main aspect what makes this game unique and why so many people love this game.

Not for everyone, but for the majority of people the chase is the fun part.

If the devs would put more focus on stealth, this game wouldn't be DbD anymore and a lot of people would quit playing it.

Well for some looping is the greatest but for others it's not and they could give stealth much more support so both types of players on both sides could enjoy it. I mean some killers complain about looping now but if stealthy play keeps getting whacked/not supported loopers are going to be 100% more common.

There are Hide & Seek video games without the looping mechanic but these games are nowhere as popular as DbD. Of course, there are people that like stealth play, but it's not the majority.

If the devs were to put focus on stealth, they would lose more players than gain new ones.

I'd prefer that.

Looping was not part of Dead by Daylight for well over half a year after release. To claim that looping is a core mechanic is false. Even the devs call it an unintended way to play the game.

Looping was not intended when the game was developed but you can't deny that looping became a core mechanic of the game. Nowadays, the devs would not say that survivors are not supposed to loop. When it comes to map changes like pallets and windows, it's about looping since it became an essential part of the game.

You don't have to believe it but if DbD had stayed a stealth game it wouldn't have become that successful.

shyguyy

Didn't this map have like a 34% survival rate when they showed stats a few months back? Don't we have other things we could complain about?

Raizinz

@NoShinyPony said:

@DocOctober said:

@NoShinyPony said:

@powerbats said:

@NoShinyPony said:

Looping is a core mechanic of DbD and one main aspect what makes this game unique and why so many people love this game.

Not for everyone, but for the majority of people the chase is the fun part.

If the devs would put more focus on stealth, this game wouldn't be DbD anymore and a lot of people would quit playing it.

Well for some looping is the greatest but for others it's not and they could give stealth much more support so both types of players on both sides could enjoy it. I mean some killers complain about looping now but if stealthy play keeps getting whacked/not supported loopers are going to be 100% more common.

There are Hide & Seek video games without the looping mechanic but these games are nowhere as popular as DbD. Of course, there are people that like stealth play, but it's not the majority.

If the devs were to put focus on stealth, they would lose more players than gain new ones.

I'd prefer that.

Looping was not part of Dead by Daylight for well over half a year after release. To claim that looping is a core mechanic is false. Even the devs call it an unintended way to play the game.

Looping was not intended when the game was developed but you can't deny that looping became a core mechanic of the game. Nowadays, the devs would not say that survivors are not supposed to loop. When it comes to map changes like pallets and windows, it's about looping since it became an essential part of the game.

You don't have to believe it but if DbD had stayed a stealth game it wouldn't have become that successful.

You're absolutely right in saying that looping was not core for a while and not intended. Devs spent a fair amount of time boarding up windows and doors due to infinity loops or loops that took way too long to complete if they couldn't shake the killer. I miss moonlight offerings, it was one of the killer's ways to counter survivors thickening up the fog +/- claudette for making it unbelievably difficult to locate survivors.

DocOctober

@shyguyy said:
Didn't this map have like a 34% survival rate when they showed stats a few months back? Don't we have other things we could complain about?

This discussion has nothing to do with survival rates.

@NoShinyPony said:

@DocOctober said:

@NoShinyPony said:

@powerbats said:

@NoShinyPony said:

Looping is a core mechanic of DbD and one main aspect what makes this game unique and why so many people love this game.

Not for everyone, but for the majority of people the chase is the fun part.

If the devs would put more focus on stealth, this game wouldn't be DbD anymore and a lot of people would quit playing it.

Well for some looping is the greatest but for others it's not and they could give stealth much more support so both types of players on both sides could enjoy it. I mean some killers complain about looping now but if stealthy play keeps getting whacked/not supported loopers are going to be 100% more common.

There are Hide & Seek video games without the looping mechanic but these games are nowhere as popular as DbD. Of course, there are people that like stealth play, but it's not the majority.

If the devs were to put focus on stealth, they would lose more players than gain new ones.

I'd prefer that.

Looping was not part of Dead by Daylight for well over half a year after release. To claim that looping is a core mechanic is false. Even the devs call it an unintended way to play the game.

Looping was not intended when the game was developed but you can't deny that looping became a core mechanic of the game. Nowadays, the devs would not say that survivors are not supposed to loop. When it comes to map changes like pallets and windows, it's about looping since it became an essential part of the game.

You don't have to believe it but if DbD had stayed a stealth game it wouldn't have become that successful.

I disagree completely. It would have attracted a different audience and I'm sure that even if the number was lower, it would be a less toxic one.

And the devs made that statement about looping very recently.

Mister_xD

@tt_ivi_99 said:
The only not mindgame-able loops (which I assume you think about the "line of sight loops") are found on Autohaven and they can be mindgamed by ussing the killer's power.

Yh some pallets can spawn pretty near to each other and I think they should get the same treatment as hooks on the 2.5.0 update but other than that I wouldnt reduce the number.

Edit:
About that "braindead-easy and requires no skill" comment... Try hidding your light by moonwalking, stand still facing the pallet when line of sight is broken or be decisive when ussing your killer power.
Seriously, It aint that hard to end chases sooner if you're facing a looper.

not mindgamable pallets, also called "god pallets" are a thing. these are pallets where the killer can not catch up to the survivor, unless he breaks the pallet.
here some examples:
the shack pallet
the cowtree pallet
the pallets in the elementary schools basement
the pallets next to the bathroom at the meatplant
the pallets behind the staircases at the meatplant
the pallets in the basements in haddonfield and springwood

these are the ones i could think of asap. im sure there are more though.

JJRULEZ159

@Mister_xD said:

@tt_ivi_99 said:
The only not mindgame-able loops (which I assume you think about the "line of sight loops") are found on Autohaven and they can be mindgamed by ussing the killer's power.

Yh some pallets can spawn pretty near to each other and I think they should get the same treatment as hooks on the 2.5.0 update but other than that I wouldnt reduce the number.

Edit:
About that "braindead-easy and requires no skill" comment... Try hidding your light by moonwalking, stand still facing the pallet when line of sight is broken or be decisive when ussing your killer power.
Seriously, It aint that hard to end chases sooner if you're facing a looper.

not mindgamable pallets, also called "god pallets" are a thing. these are pallets where the killer can not catch up to the survivor, unless he breaks the pallet.
here some examples:
the shack pallet
the cowtree pallet
the pallets in the elementary schools basement
the pallets next to the bathroom at the meatplant
the pallets behind the staircases at the meatplant
the pallets in the basements in haddonfield and springwood

these are the ones i could think of asap. im sure there are more though.

you forgot the one in the long hallway on lery's. I'd have shack over that one in terms of safeness any day.

powerbats

@JJRULEZ159 said:

you forgot the one in the long hallway on lery's. I'd have shack over that one in terms of safeness any day.

You're referring to the one that's really narrow and you've got to break the pallet if not Nurse/Legion in Frenzy to get past right?

JJRULEZ159

@powerbats said:

@JJRULEZ159 said:

you forgot the one in the long hallway on lery's. I'd have shack over that one in terms of safeness any day.

You're referring to the one that's really narrow and you've got to break the pallet if not Nurse/Legion in Frenzy to get past right?

correct.

powerbats

@JJRULEZ159 said:

@powerbats said:

@JJRULEZ159 said:

you forgot the one in the long hallway on lery's. I'd have shack over that one in terms of safeness any day.

You're referring to the one that's really narrow and you've got to break the pallet if not Nurse/Legion in Frenzy to get past right?

correct.

Yeah that one I'd like to see get tweaked some so there's a shortcut but not too short of a cut that allows killers access but they've still got to work for it. Since even the shack still has a window there and the others do have other ways of getting around them.

NoShinyPony

@DocOctober said:

@shyguyy said:
Didn't this map have like a 34% survival rate when they showed stats a few months back? Don't we have other things we could complain about?

This discussion has nothing to do with survival rates.

@NoShinyPony said:

@DocOctober said:

@NoShinyPony said:

@powerbats said:

@NoShinyPony said:

Looping is a core mechanic of DbD and one main aspect what makes this game unique and why so many people love this game.

Not for everyone, but for the majority of people the chase is the fun part.

If the devs would put more focus on stealth, this game wouldn't be DbD anymore and a lot of people would quit playing it.

Well for some looping is the greatest but for others it's not and they could give stealth much more support so both types of players on both sides could enjoy it. I mean some killers complain about looping now but if stealthy play keeps getting whacked/not supported loopers are going to be 100% more common.

There are Hide & Seek video games without the looping mechanic but these games are nowhere as popular as DbD. Of course, there are people that like stealth play, but it's not the majority.

If the devs were to put focus on stealth, they would lose more players than gain new ones.

I'd prefer that.

Looping was not part of Dead by Daylight for well over half a year after release. To claim that looping is a core mechanic is false. Even the devs call it an unintended way to play the game.

Looping was not intended when the game was developed but you can't deny that looping became a core mechanic of the game. Nowadays, the devs would not say that survivors are not supposed to loop. When it comes to map changes like pallets and windows, it's about looping since it became an essential part of the game.

You don't have to believe it but if DbD had stayed a stealth game it wouldn't have become that successful.

I disagree completely. It would have attracted a different audience and I'm sure that even if the number was lower, it would be a less toxic one.

Nah, you don't disagree completely, we agree on a couple of points: Looping wasn't intended when DbD was developed. If it had stayed a stealth game, it would have a attracted other players and a lesser number of players in total.

What we don't agree on is the question what is more fun: stealth or looping. And to that question, there is no objective answer, of course. You prefer stealth, I prefer looping, that's just how it is. No hard feelings.

JJRULEZ159

@powerbats said:

@JJRULEZ159 said:

@powerbats said:

@JJRULEZ159 said:

you forgot the one in the long hallway on lery's. I'd have shack over that one in terms of safeness any day.

You're referring to the one that's really narrow and you've got to break the pallet if not Nurse/Legion in Frenzy to get past right?

correct.

Yeah that one I'd like to see get tweaked some so there's a shortcut but not too short of a cut that allows killers access but they've still got to work for it. Since even the shack still has a window there and the others do have other ways of getting around them.

maybe just like another room that makes it so that you can mind game it as killer, like its still a safe pallet, but if the survivor misplays then they get hit.