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Can we finally get Basekit Unbreakable which unlocks after being slugged for 60 seconds?
Answers
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Oh yes, if only the team mates of downed survivor would not interfere at all.
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I mean, slugging isn't interactive.
Imagine if you as the killer had chemical trap applied to you permanently. You can still chase right? You can still attack and move. Is that fun? Are you realistically going to be able to do anything to meaningfully interact with the other side or progress your wincon? No.
Slugging for the players being slugged is boring if you don't have power struggle or a way to pick yourself up. You crawl and/or hold left click while moving, and the only time any of this is exciting is when you're inching toward an exit gate or hatch and the killer is coming. It is very boring. Same with incapacitated status effect where survivors do almost nothing, which is why it was removed from Eruption (and why Eruption was the most hated perk at the gen kick meta time) and is now applied very sparingly.
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Slugging is easier win than hooking
They will never change that
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Your solution would make ds always active. So a killer can not wait out ds without giving survivors another free perk. Survivors on the ground are not incapacitated. They don't get base kit endurance when picked up. The problem is survivors will not run anti slug perks because if they complain enough in forums and review bomb they will get it for free. Use the tools given to you and stop asking for free perks. The game has two sides and unfortunately for devs survivors will talk smack for months if they don't get their way. There are two types of people that play dbd. People who play and use the perks to counter the killer or survivor are one. The other type of people that play dbd are they ones who want the game to play itself and they always win. The second type of people are not based in reality.
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then they should change that goal to hooking
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Talk to BHVR about hook-activated god mode perks if you don't like it tbh.
As hard as endurance will carry survivors, did you really think people wouldn't adapt and start cooking pressure through knockdowns instead?
You can't funnel all the killer kits into this insane endurance factory as if every kit has the same capability as the blight or nurse. Hard reality-check, dude.
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If you're on the ground for more than 60 seconds either, there's a knockout in play which sucks. You're the one of two final survivors or your teammates are very, VERY bad. Not great situations to be in but I wouldn't say they warrant having unbreakable basekit. Honestly I'd be more okay with just allowing a boost in movement speed while you're slugged. Nothing too crazy but making yourself slightly faster would definitely help in repositioning yourself to make plays from it.
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Being slugged is a way to incapacitate a survivor, sure... but aren't survivors ALSO incapacitated when on hooks? You're in a state where you have to wait for your teammates to put you in a non-incapacitated state either way. It could actually be argued that you're better off slugged since you can do more while slugged (crawl).
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I don't know about other times, but if such a measure put an end to survs being left on the ground doe 2-3 minutes at the end of the game while the 4K obsessed killer scours the entire map for a surv whose location they have no earthly notion of, I'd be all for it.
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Did you take into the account the Sabo squads that exists in this game?
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Yep and they buffed Sabo Squads btw
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They also made hooks respawn and have shrunken maps so hooks appear much closer together than they had previously. Make sure you tell the full story when you’re weaving tales.
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it’s not worth taking because you get up just to be slugged again.
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Most maps are now so small, with more reworks in the same vein incoming, hooks spawn so close together and now respawn indefinitely. Boil over and Saboteur are some of the most pointless perks in the game.
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Just my two cents, but it really depends on the team im playing against. Read the room scenario. If I see that at least two survs have beamers, imma slug more that game. If survs are downed by pallets imma slug til I know I'm safe before picking up. It really depends on the match and how those survs play.
If unbreakable becomes base kit, I do believe survs who play obnoxiously would just take advantage of it at that point. All it would take is to have duos run beamers and power struggle perk to actively harass the killer, so they don't pick up, effectively stalling the game. It would be hell for any killer going up against survs who would exploit this feature imo.
If they add base kit unbreakable, bhvr needs to add more time to the gens to compensate for players who would stall the game cause they want to use their base kit unbreakable every game. Mind you, each survivor would have one chance to do that, effectively prolonging matches too. So imo, no we don't need it. Yeah it sucks to be slugged, but base kit unbreakable would be exploited too much. Just something to think about. Have a good day.
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I need people that think stuff like "Nooo, but killers' job is to incapacitate you, your job is to avoid it" to actually ruin their 100% Killer play ratio and play at least one game where they're slugged for several minutes so they finally understand that speedrunning their objective by just refusing to hook is an incredibly unhealthy gameplay pattern and should not exist in the game.
Keep in mind survivors had the ability to instantly repair generators and no killer liked it. Slugging survivors to skip 8 entire hook states is about the same as that was back then.
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There are too many people on this forum who routinely ignore the concerns of one side and can't even talk about an issue without bickering.
Here are the points:
- Slugging is not fun for survivors.
- There are perks that counter slugging, but whether or not you brought one is luck based. So, the more important question is whether slugging in its current state needs changes regardless of perks.
- Killers could feel trapped into having to pick up in a bad situation if there were base kit Unbreakable. Flashlights are not going to be enough to prevent a pick-up for 60 seconds, but there are definitely situations where slugging just makes sense.
- Survivors do already have the ability to pick up slugged teammates.
The discussion should be around whether survivors need ways to prevent themselves for being slugged for long periods of time. If your teammates are dead, or hiding in a locker, or getting chased by the killer while you lie there on the floor, should you have some way to end the tedium without disconnecting. Base kit Unbreakable after 60 seconds was mentioned in the post, but alternatives would also make sense to consider. These "it's the killer's job to kill/incapacitate" arguments are not relevant and they are consuming a lot of the oxygen in the thread.
I don't think there's a need for base kit Unbreakable personally, even after 60 seconds, but I do like the idea of letting survivors kill themselves on the ground after they've fully recovered.
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I have had it happen to me before, because I play both roles in roughly equal measure. No, it wasn't fun, but losing is never fun, and I didn't immediately leap onto the forums to make a sob story post about it and demand completely unreasonable changes that would wreck the balance of the game. It also happens so rarely that I can't treat it as anything other than fringe cases.
Sorry to burst your strawman bubble.
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Please do elaborate how that is a strawman. Under what premise was BNP nerfed, and under what premise is people requesting to remove full slugs and 4k slugs through the addition of self pick ups.
And also, "wreck the balance of the game" is your assumption, not a reality. And even if you were right, a change like that would have follow up patches to rebalance the game around it were it to actually mess up with kill rates.
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Please do elaborate how that is a strawman.
"The only reason you disagree with this is because you're a selfish and ignorant killer main who doesn't know how hard it is to be survivor!"
That's a strawman. You just making up nonsense assumptions about people and painting them unflattering colors so you can dismiss them or distract from the actual discussion. I could just as easily call you an entitled survivor main who hates losing so you want any and all advantages a killer has stripped out of the game, but that would be rude and dishonest.
Also comparing BNP stacking to killers downing survivors and survivors just wanting to undo the killer's advantage for free is the most hilarious and absurd thing you could have possibly come up with. One of the most potent item add-ons in the game versus a basic and core aspect of gameplay. It's also very charitable to assume BHVR would balance the game in a way that works after adding Unlimited Unbreakables, and I'm sure there'd be very many complaints about any compensation offered to killers in the wake of that.
How's this for balance: if the survivors complete all 5 gens and the killer has less than 4 hooks, 3 of the generators just break themselves and reset back to 0 and the survivors have to fix them again. That's fair, right? Since we can just take one side's success away whenever we feel like it, regardless of context or causes.
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No, you think being stuck on the ground with nothing to do for such a long period of time is good game design and gameplay, and it IS NOT. It's absolutely SHOCKING that I even have to explain this, maybe it's stockholm syndrome.
'Entitled' is such a buzzword, we are ALL entitled to a good game, and I think the devs want to have a good game that is enjoyable to play.
It's simple bad gameplay to be stuck with no option but to stare at your screen while a slow timer runs out. IT'S BAD. Maybe you are just a troll who enjoys slugging people until they bleed out because you have nothing better to do with your time, idk. There are a lot of changes they could make to fix the issue, the easiest being basekit unbreakable of some kind but honestly ANYTHING would be better.
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I don’t personally slug, Except maybe at endgame to prevent hatch I slug one person to go find the other. However, you think that you are entitled to be actually doing something the entire game, and think that the killers objectives should be circumvented so that you can do what you want to do the key word is that it’s wants. That is the definition of entitlement you want to do something and you think the game should be changed so that you can do what you want to do.
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… didn't you just literally use a strawman on me? Because I did not say such a thing. That quote of yours is heavily altered to the point of ridicule, and adds aspects to my statement that were not there to begin with.
I can admit you can read "ignorant" from what I said, but it wasn't meant at all in that derogatory "I am better than you" way like you're trying to imply, but rather that the unhealthy nature of the gameplay pattern can only be felt once you're on the recieving end of it. I didn't say anything about selfish killers, I didn't say anything about how hard it is to be a survivor… I said "play at least one game where you're slugged for several minutes so you finally understand that speedrunning the objective by just refusing to hook is an incredibly unhealthy gameplay pattern and should not exist in the game."
You even agreed with me, after kindly letting me know you do, in fact, play both sides. "I have had it happen to me before, because I play both roles in roughly equal measure. No, it wasn't fun" - although from then on you went on about losing which is not at all what the basekit unbreakable change is about at all, but rather how unhealthy and unfun it is that a "strategy" that a game allows makes one side of the board lick floor for minutes on end.
There's also one thing I don't understand and it's that part you said "wanting to undo the killer advantage for free". The thing is, it's not "for free", just like the EGC change was not introduced to prevent survivor wins "for free" - it is pressure on the survivors to prevent killers having to stay on a lose-lose scenario and reduce hostage situations.
Leaving someone on the floor should be a risky decision for the killer, not mostly benefits. The hook should always have more benefits than just leaving someone on the floor because that should be the natural conclusion of the killer gameplay. Skipping that part to "win big" should apply pressure on the killer, not on the survivors. And we're not talking about 20 seconds "Oops, I have to prevent a save" slugs, we're talking full 4 man slugs and the third player slug for the 4k scenarios.
Again, it's unhealthy that the killer can get an advantage by skipping 8 hook states. The BNP change was made under the same grounds: Survivors can speed up their progress, but should not be able to skip it, otherwise unhealthy and unfun gameplay patterns occur. The self pick up change is being requested on the same grounds, and if it truly raises survival rates so dramatically, it is only fair that balance changes are applied to eliminate any undesired gameplay patterns that may have arised due to the change being made.
This is not at all about winning or losing, this is entirely about gameplay health.
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What tale? The devs buffing Sabo squads is an objective fact.
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So is what I’ve said.
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No we cant. Basekit UB was rejected back in 2022 for a bunch of obvious reasons which have all been alredy stated here.
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"you think you are entitled to do something" imagine wanting to be able to DO SOMETHING IN A GAME. How DARE you want good gameplay! that's entitlement! You vll play zee bad gamez, You vil eat zee bugz, and You vil LIKE IT!
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True. Honestly tho like what is it with killers feeling the need to win? It literally gives you nothing? You don't climb a ladder, you don't get cash you gain absolutely nothing. This is supposed to be a casual game. They should really focus on chasing and hooking so the devs need to incentivice these actions more. Make it that when one person is one the ground for a minute or when one is dead the actions get an action buff making gens faster etc. And whena survivor picks himself up he gets an action debuff of like 20 % or sth like that for the rest of the game. There are so many possibilities. These devs are just absolutely terrible focusing on the next clown cosmetic or some ######### like that.
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Absolutely valid point :) why not try it out. The problem is they don't even try tackling these problems as they simply could not care less. Solo Q is in the gutters right now and there really is zero incentive to keep playing this absolute miserable abomination of a game…It could be sooo good for both sides but I guess that is too much to ask. Add action debuffs for swf lobbies and make solo queue experience better by improving it.
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