http://dbd.game/killswitch
Buffs to alternative gen regression
So, gen regression perks are the most picked perks in the game. But only a select few, the rest has really small pick rates. And for a good reason, most of them suck.
In this post, I'll go over those that I feel should get buffs or changes to increase their popularity and, in doing so, also variety.
Call of Brine:
• Increase the regression speed to 200%.
• The regression speed is also capped at 200%.
To avoid the second coming of Overbrine, the hard cap should be lowered to 200% regression speed. With that, both perks can be strong without being annoying.
Dying Light (Rework):
You start the trial with 3 tokens.
Whenever you hook a survivor that's not the Obsession, all survivors repair and healing speed decreases by 3/4/5% for each token you have. This debuff will remain while the survivor is hooked and 30 seconds after.
Whenever you hook the Obsession, you lose a token.
Current Dying Light is a failure as a concept. It's a win-more perk. So, why not invert it?
Eruption:
• Only the inital kick is counted as a regression event, the subsequent explosion that happens when you down someone doesn't.
Hex: Ruin:
• Increase the regression speed to 100/125/150%.
Hex: Pentimento (8.7.0 version)
• Remove the totem auras, or (if they have to be there) make them work in a similar way to Plaything (the aura is revealed after some time)
Oppression:
• Decrease the cooldown to 50/40/30 seconds.
• Now, failing an Oppression Skill Check causes the gen to lose extra 4% of progress, just like Overcharge. (Idea by @MechWarrior3 )
Overcharge:
• The regression speed now rises from 120% to 160%.
• The regression speed is capped at 200%.
Same story as Call of Brine, but unlike it, I feel like that it's secondary effect makes it so it doesn't need to be all the way to 200%.
Pop Goes the Weasel:
• Increase the time it stays active for to 30/45/60 seconds.
Yes, I know this isn't an unpopular perk by any means, but this change is only aimed to make it more accesible to lower mobility killers.
Thanatophobia:
• Decreases survivors repair speed by 1,5/2,5/3,5% for each survivor that's not healthy.
Thrilling Tremors:
• Remove the cooldown.
• Now, it blocks generators for 16/18/20 seconds.
Fun fact! This perk stayed the same since it's release. That's over 5 years...
Undone:
• Good skill checks now give you 1 token.
• Remove the cooldown.
Comments
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Lots of great ideas!
Personally since the gen kick limits exists I don’t think limiting CoB or Overcharge is even necessary but I’d be fine with your changes nonetheless.
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The Dying Light idea is well thought out.
IMO, Eruption should have its Incapacitated effect again, but its original version. I enjoyed running it when it was only 16 seconds of incapacitation, and since damaging gens now has a cap, I don't see any harm in buffing the perks that once reigned supreme.
Edit: typo
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Good suggestions.
I would suggest two more changes for COB with them it should probably stay at 150%.
- Generators on which Call of Brine is active, start regressing again when survivors leave them.
- Can be active on multiple generators (was one).
Instead of increasing Thrilling tremors duration I would let it activates for as long as you carry a survivor and make it linger for 16 seconds after you hook a survivor.
Thana could be 4%, that was the version before it got buffed to 20% and then nerfed to what we have now.Additionally to your suggestion Undone grants two tokens for great skill checks. That way it does something against better players as well.
Post edited by Langweilig on-1 -
These are actually neat.
I really like the change to Undone, since right now it's a meme perk and I say that as a Doctor main (the killer that can probably get the most value out of it, but even as Doctor it's a joke of a perk).
Your suggestions for Dying Light and the new Penti are also pretty solid. I think showing Pent's aura after some time is needed because of solo Q, but it would be nice if the aura wasn't shown immediately :)
Hex: Ruin can be buffed a bit now that the old Ruindying is gone. It's been gone for so long that it makes me wonder why Ruin is still unchanged.
Your suggestion for Pop is on point because it would only be an improvement for slow killers, who definitely need a little help these days.
And I'd argue that Thana could get even a bit more love than you suggested without it becoming too crazy.
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I'm down for all of these. Especially the 200% cap on regression so we don't get toxic playstyles.
I would prefer it if gens were more balanced at a baseline level so that we wouldn't need regression in the first place, but even with this type of balance design Call of Brine is just too weak. Regression should be strong enough that you'd use it opportunistically, without gen speeds being balanced around them. But right now, the issue I'm sensing is that gen regression perks are balanced around gen speeds being more fair, when that isn't the current reality.
With all that said, Call of Brine is honestly a joke. They overnerfed it certainly. Even if gen speeds were more balanced, the perk is still too weak in its current state.
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ruin should go back to 400%
your dying light idea is terrible and all dying light needs to do is work in reverse and the obsession should be affected by it too
pop should just be reverted to 25% of total gen progress instead of current
pentimento shouldn't be changed
thanataphobia should be at 4 or 5
thrilling should have no cooldown and block gena for 30 seconds so m1 killers can also get value
also the 8 kick limit should be removed
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So, I will assume you are not trolling and actually mean these.
First, Ruin was never 400%. And even the old 200% Ruin was a hard meta perk by itself, so there is 0 reason to exceed that line. I also don't want the perks to become targets of survivor complaints immediately after a buff.
I don't know if you ran the numbers through your head, but reverting Thana and inverting Dying Light would create the second coming of Forever Freddy (or Forever anyone, really). And, I don't know about you, but I would despise going against that. We're talking about 50% slower repair speed almost for free.
I would like Pentimento to stay the same, but we all know that is not happening.
The 8 kick gen limit exists for a reason, to avoid things like old chess merchant (now more like chess knights and singularities, but the point stands)
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Thanks for commenting!
Interesting take on CoB. That version could be good, but it would need testing to see how well it goes.
The other changes you mentioned also seem good.
I would not, however, make Undone punish great skill checks, as that would make it a lose-lose a bit-lose a lot perk.
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Some of these are good changes for sure, but I would be wary about just buffing Thanataphobia, Call of Brine, and Overcharge.
Tackling the last two first since they're similar to each other, hard capping the regression speed to 200% with these perks is a good instinct, that'd prevent the most obscene imbalance that could come from them, but it doesn't change that these perks having actually good regression in their current state is unhealthy because they're unearned. It's just always going to be cheap and unfair, the killer doesn't have to do anything to get it.
Rather, I'd suggest buffing CoB's information instead so it can fill that niche better, and just reworking Overcharge entirely. A rework I pitched in another thread myself was something like the following:
- When a survivor is hooked, Overcharge activates for [X] seconds. While Overcharge is active, all regression speeds are increased to 200%, and survivors interacting with a generator for the first time during the activation are faced with a difficult skill check. Overcharge then goes on cooldown for [X] seconds.
That'd rework it to be far more useful, but also much healthier because it requires hooks. It'd also open up fun synergies with perks like Ruin (in its current state at least) and Oppression.
For Thanataphobia, stacking and also killers like Legion and Plague are the big concerns here. I would also suggest a rework for this perk, to hopefully make it a bit more stable. I'm much less sure on this one, but the same post I suggested Overcharge getting changed also had this rework for Thana:
- When a survivor is injured by a basic attack, their action speeds (same list as current) are decreased by 10% for 120 seconds or until they're fully healed.
Like I said, less sure about that one, but I think it's a healthier direction than the global effect it currently has.
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True.
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I discussed Undone with @UndeddJester and there his argument was, that the perk should be aimed at being more effective against better players than being more punishing for soloq and bad players. This change also has the benefit of not being completely nullified by good players and countering extrem gen rush builds.
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I don't think incapacitated should ever return on a perk. Being unable to progress the game at all is way too strong of an effect for a perk that every killer can use. It should be reserved for killer powers only.
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I see you thought a lot about those.
The Overcharge rework could work, I'd maybe rather make it so the skill check pops up like it does in the live game.
Call of Brine is a tough one, since I'm not sure how could the aura even be buffed. But, if Overcharge ended up getting reworked as you suggested, I feel like CoB by itslef would be fine.
And, at last, Thana. I feel like Legion and Plague would benefit from it the most regardless of numbers, so... Your change could solve that, but I'm not really sure about it.
Anyway, thanks for feedback.
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It'd be buffing the loud noise notifications you get from CoB, I'd imagine, not the aura itself. Make it last for longer + make it able to be applied to multiple gens, you've already got a pretty okay gen-monitoring perk that could be a reasonable sidegrade to something like Surveillance.
If you want to be really crazy, have it apply any time a gen starts to regress, and remove the extra speed entirely.
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so 400 must've been on ptb and the reason i wanted 400 is because it's normal survivor repair speed rather than 200 being half of a survivor's repair speed
they could just make those 2 perks (thana and dying) not stack but even slow i want killers to have early game slowdown
8 kick merchant is an auto win for survivors if they just keep gen tapping and running to the other side of the map and also makes eruption and sometimes surge unusable
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Hmm… Could be a nice perk, really. This is a kind of an idea I'd like to see PTBs explore.
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Another one rarely mentioned is Merciless Storm. Having this based around skill checks makes it bad against good players and really good against bad player. This is the opposite of the kind of design we want. I propose removing the skill checks entirely and just make it block a gen for 25 seconds upon reaching 90% progress.
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The skill check requirement is the identity of the perk. Removing that would be really sad to see and is not necessary in my opinion.
I would suggest that it can reactivate after a cooldown of 50 seconds again on the same generator. (This should also apply for tinkerer). For perk synergy I would suggest that it gets an effect that extends all generator blocks by 3-5 seconds. That way it buffs itself by 3-5 seconds and other perks.
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While I agree that it is part of its identity, skill checks determining balance isn't good for the game. As I mentioned before, it only punishes bad players and is useless against good ones. The ideal design we want is weaker against bad players and better against good ones. As long as it's based on skill checks it will rarely ever be used. The retrigger being added isn't really relevant to make it any better as it's flawed in design. I do like your extension of block effects giving it more synergy though.
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What do you think of giving it a secondary effect of blocking a generator for 0,5 seconds (which gets extended by 3-5s) when survivors hit a great skill check? It’s a goofy idea I had.
Even tho the normal skill check part is more effective against bad players, I wouldn‘t remove that part. Otherwise there is no real difference to pinheads gen block perk. In the end they only get combined together and both get nerfed. The skill check requirement keeps it kinda safe from getting nerfed or being too strong.
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I think that does sound like a better idea. What would happen is after 1 great skill check they'd just only do goods for the rest the match so it would never proc again, but I suppose that's at least a little extra less gen progress if they only can do goods for the rest the match. A small, but nice buff.
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Imagine the faces of hyperfocus players after playing against that😂😅
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Yeah and guaranteed Gearhead value lol
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just make kicking gens actually do something...
I was playing yesterday against an oni. A Nea and I were doing a gen early in the game, and we were around 90% done when the Oni got to us. So the nea ran away, i tried to complete it but say I got up to maybe 92% at most before getting hit. So i ran away as well. The oni kicked the gen and remained nearby, so i went to shack, near the gen, but not near enough to be in danger. I was playing with a friend btw. The thing is, the oni managed to down another survivor and hook them, I decided to do the gen next to shack, and my friend rescued and healed the hooked survivor while nea looped the killer away from me or the kicked gen from the beginning. Then I was about 80-90% of the new gen when my friend went to the still regressing gen to continue repairing it... After all that time, the gen was still above 75%. He had a toolkit so he finished it faster than it took me to finish mine... Basically the kick on that gen did nothing...
At the end of the day, not even NOED gave the poor oni a single kill, he left with 3 hooks...
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I am down for these changes 100%. Great ideas!
The only thing I would like to add is to Oppression. If you miss the difficult skill check, you lose 4% more progress for the missed skill check. (Just like with Doctors Perk)
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Nice changes, I would like to see those.
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Great idea!
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Thank you! I don't think personally it would be too "Overpowered" in my humble opinion.
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Edit:
Added an extra effect to Oppression.
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It's def a hard concept to balance, but I genuinely thought OG eruption was fine. It was just severely underrated from both sides.
The killer has to actually work for the perk to kick in, and most survivors found the effect lackluster when they got caught by it. Since gens can only be damaged up to 8 times, this doesn't mean survivors would have to deal with the OG gen kicking meta where it was nearly infinite.
I can see them bringing back the incapacitated effect, but perhaps 10 seconds instead of the og 16 or notorious 25 so the killer still gets the aura reading + 10 sec of no gen progress.
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<3
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incapacitated is a really fickle effect, as seen by the 3-gen meta.
While adding it with limited numbers could work, I don't imagine many people will be happy with it even being there.
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