http://dbd.game/killswitch
People still get upset because of lightborn?
Comments
-
I think that if I bring a perk or item to the trial, I should be able to use it. Its effectiveness should range from 100% but never 0%.
19 -
my medkit and full heal build v plague would also like to have a chat. If she puts on lightborn we’re double cooked. No, but what you said made me laugh fr and they should block totems from being broken for at least some x amount of time.
7 -
If the console can't handle the game, it probably shouldn't have been ported to that console in my opinion.
Absolutely. BHVR should not have ported the game to Switch. A lot of us would love to get our money back. The game cost at least as much as it did on other platforms but doesn't function half as well.
someone else's choice buying a switch
It's not just Switch. It's a console problem. Even with the newest consoles: I've been told the input lag that exists on the PS4 is still there on the PS5 (I think it has to do with the way PSN handles the input rather than the hardware). I focus on Switch because the issues are egregiously bad there. While the issues aren't as bad on PS4, they still affect gameplay enough that I always equip Lightborn on PS4.
BHVR likes to use band-aids to solve gameplay problems. It's no surprise console players feel forced to use perk band-aids to deal with optimization issues. I see a lot of console killers run Iron Grasp because the wiggle (even without Boil Over) can be really bad. The vast majority of Switch killers I face run Unrelenting. And if I see a killer running Lightborn, it's almost always a console killer.
the survivor gaming experience is tied to
The survivor gaming experience is tied to everything a killer does and brings. And everything their teammates do and bring. Lightborn and the Switch aren't special in that regard. If the only thing that matters to the survivor player is blinds, if that's what they base their entire DbD experience on… I hope they make that evident in their player name, because I don't want them as a teammate.
In terms of my personal survivor experience, I'd rather go against a killer who runs Lightborn and plays the match than a killer who either 1. AFKs and leaves us to play a boring gen repair sim, or 2. slugs us all. I appreciate a killer who'd rather waste a perk slot and play chill than slug everyone. Also, if a killer is running Lightborn, my teammates are less likely to follow me around during a chase and might actually do gens, so I kinda wish more killers would run it. I only just had a match where two teammates brought flashlights and failed over and over and over again against a killer without Lightborn… I'm tired of dying to people who sandbag so they can attempt their flashlight saves. Please, killers, bring Lightborn and stare into their flashlights until the batteries run dead.
9 -
I personally don't care what perks a person brings, as long as they are having fun.
4 -
No, you were just making up arguments about why killers shouldn't use Lightborn, blabbering about what's "optimal" or "competitive" in some elaborate attempt to convince killers to stop using the perk you don't like. And when called out that these arguments mean nothing because killers use Lightborn for personal convenience and not for any hardcore competitive advantage, you shifted the goalposts yourself to Distortion and aura-reading when it was originally about Lightborn and flashlights (i.e. whataboutism), and making false equivalences and hyperbolic suggestions that mean nothing.
If anything isn't good for discussions, it's derailing them with irrelevant nonsense that has nothing to do with the original point.
13 -
This is backed up by anecdotal evidence. My sample size is 3 matches. 2 players hard flashlights. 1 DCed.
Not so bad, good return on investment, for a trolling perk.
We need a master list of the best perk/killer combo for DC effect.
-1 -
skull merchant 4 slowdowns
4 -
I'm talking about balance and fairness. Just because you think killers only run lightborn for "convenience" doesn't make it true for everyone. Lightborn is an amazing perk for what it does, and can win you games when you know the opposing team is running flashlights. To claim otherwise is simply just wrong.
Considering you didn't understand my original points and have no intention to, I'm not going to engage in this one sided conversation. Feel free to move the goalposts elsewhere.
-10 -
If this is supposed to be a gotcha towards me, I've never said anything about totems. I'd personally want the killers to be able to light totems at the beginning of the match so they can choose how to defend them or have better spawn logic so it's more fair for killers.
-12 -
It's not OP or even strong at all, its exactly like you said and I agree.
The rare time someone decides to troll around and finally bring a flashlight instead of only toolboxes/medkits and the killer has Lightborn it just leads to never wanting to bring one again which is pretty crappy.
The takeaway isn't that Lightborn should be nerfed however, its that survivor items shouldn't be so worthless.
6 -
my friend does get mad and thinks the killer is sweaty when the killer has it...
-2 -
I remember one survey asked which survivor items needed improvements and I chose maps and keys without hesitation. Medkits also need to be reworked so that their rarities actually matter instead of insignificant tiny improvements to heal speed. While I agree with the medkit nerf a while back, they've been meaninglessly homogenized for too long now.
6 -
Okay so I'll just leave my two sense here.
- So if it's a bad thing I have to rely on a perk that prevents me from being blinded since fun fact back then your screen would turn completely white and that hurt the eyes. But if I'm being called a baby or having to rely on a "crutch" perk then why isn't it seen as a crutch to use a flashlight to save a teammate. You can tell me that I just need to look around before picking up, look at a wall or bring perks that tell you if someone is nearby. Well then here's the counter to it instead of bringing a flashlight why not do this. Take protection hits unless your already injured, while boring do gens your teammate is keep the killer away so doing the objective is a good idea, be resourceful if the killer has lightborn then best bet is just grab a new item toolboxes and medkits are good even at brown rarity while weak they still give you a little boost plus now the killer as a wasted perk slot just because you brought a purple flashlight and two add-ons it doesn't change much your add-ons are gone regardless but if you really want to keep your flashlight then hold onto it or put it somewhere you can remember.
2. I'll repeat lightborn is a waste of a perk slot once you remove flashlights. Overall it's not a powerful perk it removes a mechanic but just remove the mechanic yourself and done the killer only has three perks to work with. You have pallets and windows to your advantage and looping is a big thing constantly clicking your flashlight is just telling the killer to pay attention to you but they'll ignore it since they know your going to loop being unpredictable helps looping other tiles helps or even faking pallet drops. Once you remove the flashlight from the picture you have other resources to use. I'll say this to those who hate lightborn it's like NOED to me. Yes I still dislike NOED but I'm not pulling out my hair and getting fussy since I know it's a perk and all perks have a counter. NOED is doing totems either during or at the end and well lightborn just don't bring a flashlight.
3 -
1 perk slot wasted means 1 less slowdown perk. <3
I like facing Lightborn unironically. Flashlights are already gimmicky and can even throw matches sometimes, Lightborn just gives my teammates more motivation to actually do their objective instead of running around the map like a headless chicken all while doing nothing in the process.
Also some people use it for accessibility, which Im all for.
2 -
yes and most of those are unfounded. Saying “the other side complains about things that don’t matter so I should be able too as well” is defending your own poor behavior. How many people complain about pallets unless they are god pallets or broken like the floating ghost pallet. Using people who will complain about anything makes your point almost invalid.
and I have a rather poor memory I included other tools cause I might have forgotten something.-1 -
I think it's just because it encourages less interaction an a interaction starved game rn. Though the other day I was laughing coz the hag I was facing deliberatly picked up in front of me and I was like "haha you're so silly" then I screamed when I realised she had lightborn and couldn't stop laughing, coz she was so aggressive.
I personally think it could just go back to slowing down blinds instead of denying them, especially with flashbangs fixed.-5 -
so you want the killer to lobby dodge every match with a flashlight now? Of course the killer is going to pick up a match with a flashlight when they had to wait forever to get into a match. I’m not going to wait another couple minutes cause I don’t want to deal with a flashlight. If I’m that worried I’ll use Lightborn. That’s why it exists.
of course the killer perks are 4x stronger they have 4x less perks. One perk is equivalent to an entire survivor. I’m not saying “make lightborn a 5th perk slot” I’m perfectly happy with it taking 1/4 of my build so I don’t have to worry about chainblinds or the wanna be streamer.
the longest a safe will take is like 20 seconds. That not even close to 7.5 minutes. And if one survivor is the only one doing gens that isn’t lightborns fault it’s the other survivors. Why are you complaining that your teammates are going to work on gens? id rather play the game then have “flashy_G0d_TTV” trying to follow me all game to get their 2 saves so they can post their “killer rages after my insane play”. If the survivors play the game and do gens then I’m happy cause we are playing the game I payed $35 for along with the Nintendo Online pass. Them doing the objective isn’t a problem.
They aren’t a big deal so it doesn’t matter that a 1/4 of a killers build is stopping them. Keeping 1 or 2 hook states is worth that one perk. The way it is rn is fair cause the survivors loose an item and the killer loses a perk
7 -
I don't want anyone to lobby dodge, so please stop putting words in my mouth. I was pointing out that it is unfair for a killer to be able to tailor their build depending on what items survivors are brining, but the survivors do not have that luxury. If you can't handle flashlights, that's a you problem. Could you imagine if there was a survivor perk that ignored all totem effects? How about a perk that prevented you from taking damage? How about a perk that ignored all debuffs, including exposed? All because a survivor "didn't like" those mechanics?
I will reiterate: just because you dislike the mechanic doesn't mean you should have the ability to outright ignore it. If a killer cannot handle flashlights, that is honestly just a skill issue, I'm sorry. You can flat out stare at a wall and be protected from a flashlight, and now that they've fixed the flashbang bug, there is nothing you can do as a survivor if the killer can face a wall during a pick up. Flashlights already require the killer to be in a location where they can't shove their camera into the wall, which is honestly very rare nowadays. The stars essentially have to align to even have a chance to get a flashlight blind, and part of that is the killer making a major mistake by not checking 360 degrees for 2 seconds to see if anyone is around.
of course the killer perks are 4x stronger they have 4x less perks
Yes… that's why I said that… My point was that because killer perks are 4x stronger, they have 4x the impact when they go into effect. One proc of pain res or corrupt or grim embrace or pop can completely counter a survivor's gen rush build with 4 perks. So what if ONE of your slots goes to lightborn if you have 3 other slots that can most definitely carry you to victory? A lot of people run lethal pursuer with no other aura read. They only have 3 perks after the match starts and guess what? They can win games. Most maps are small enough that a killer can find a survivor easily without lethal if they know the spawn logic, so running lethal really is only saving them 5 seconds of time max. The fact that you have to "waste" a perk slot on lightborn when you get value out of it and most likely don't need a 4th slowdown perk because your other perks are good enough was the point I made.
the longest a safe will take is like 20 seconds.
… Okay let's do the math together. 1 survivor being chased (not doing gens), 2 survivors hovering for save (they are not doing gens), 1 person doing gens. Gens take 90 seconds. There are 5 gens. 5 gens times 90 seconds for one person is……….. 450 seconds. Divide that by 60 seconds to get minutes….. 7.5 minutes! And that's not including the time it takes for that one survivor to make it between gens, so it is actually more like 8.5 to 9 minutes total. Point being: if the survivors are doing ANYTHING but generators, that is more slowdown than you could ever get through perks. I was not complaining that my other survivors were going to do gens, I was saying that if you have 2 people going for flashlight saves and they see lightborn, they will pivot and do gens instead, and the killer loses their inherent slowdown because the survivors went from flashlight saves back to gens…
They aren’t a big deal so it doesn’t matter that a 1/4 of a killers build is stopping them. Keeping 1 or 2 hook states is worth that one perk. The way it is rn is fair cause the survivors loose an item and the killer loses a perk
I don't have any idea what you were trying to say here, I'm not able to follow these sentences.
-5 -
Lol if you think killers do not complain body blocking and pallets then i have nothing to say to you, deny it all you want because you have no proper answer to facts. Killers whine just as survivors do end of story.
Also you still have yet to talk about these other tools survivor have other than pallets/body blocking/ second chances.
-5 -
Well you know they big boohoo when like when they want to have 5+ aura reading(huntress in general) complain how its unfair distortion is and killers their entire fun build, same crap when it comes to crutch born. Same thing when it comes to a plague which makes all heal perks + med kits =a waste and also freely now robs you of any points in the altristic category.
Then when they get so called gen rushed they say survivors are boring and never want to do anything else, you cant win with these killers, everything survivors do will always be an issue. They may as well have us start the trial 2 hook and injured by the hook. Like you said imagine if we had a perk that disable their powers or add on, how mad will they be and am not talking ######### like xenomorph with turrents.
0 -
I think lightborn is fine, it’s one of the least of survivor worries, and no where close to op. Just annoying if a survivor wanted to flashlight/flashbang saves. They won’t always get matched with someone running lightborn.
4 -
People still get upset because of lightborn?
No-4 -
Honestly, Lightborn is a crutch. I've only used it a very small number of times, and usually it just ends up occupying a perk slot better spent on something else. If I know a flashlight is in play, I'll be checking nearby corners, and I always angle myself for pickups in ways to avoid blinds if possible, or even try to fake pickups to coax people out. When several flashbang or flashlight saves happen, I get more paranoid about it.
But I don't remember the last time I got less than a 3k against a bully squad. I have to admit that I have put Lightborn on and pretended to not have it for a lot of the match before. That can be hilarious :D
But Lightborn is definitely not necessary for a 3k or 4k. Just slug squads that try to bully you and make sure they don't have expo somewhere. Although, I also will admit that matches with Lightborn against four flashlights are less annoying than they might otherwise be. So maybe it's not solely a crutch, it can also be a QoL choice.
Edit: Oh, I forgot to mention… infinite distortion would be insane. It can be buffed a little and I wouldn’t care, but infinite distortion would get played on every survivor all the time. If someone said infinite distortion should be a thing, I disagree.
4 -
As always, no one thinks about the future. After all, killers have Franklin's Demise. Let's say Lightborn disappears one day. You do understand what will take its place, right? In this case, it will be bad for all survivors, not the warriors of light.
In general, just think for a second that killers in most cases will prefer Lightborn instead of Franklin's Demise. For the most part, in this situation, killers care about comfort and peace of mind than fighting with all the items of survivors. Do you really want to change this?
As for survivors. Please make generators. Lanterns are not the type of interaction that is needed in the game. Lanterns have a very bad historical reputation, dating back to 2016, when one streamer, like Prometheus, taught survivors toxicity with this weapon. This deep bleeding wound is still bleeding because many survivors want to repeat that path of glory.
If you as survivors want interaction, take Chemical Trap, Blast Mine or Flashbang. At least you will be busy with generators, which will benefit your solo friends.
13 -
Not to mention, Lightborn can be a waste of a perk slot. I've equipped LB so many times against what I thought would be a flashlight sabbo squad, only to find that none of them attempted blinds, outside of maybe one or two poorly aimed blinds during pick-up. So I don't understand why some survivor players are so up in arms over the perk, unless they're just tthe type to complain any time killer gets to have some semblance of power over survivors.
4 -
I think it’s at best like Smurf said a “QoL perk”, and at worst a waste of a perk slot. Lightborn is not a hill I care to die on as a survivor. It’s the least of my soloQ worries, and it would just buff swf to touch it in a negative way.
11 -
Lightborn honestly saves games for me pretty regularly when I run it. It's hard sometimes to know when a perk is being useful, but this is definitely not one of those cases. I usually only throw it on if it there are 3 or more flashlights in the lobby, or 2 if I just don't wanna deal with it. A lot of people will call it a crutch perk that makes you sloppy, which is fair, but I don't think there's anyone out there good enough to avoid a blind 100% of the time, which is why Lightborn will always have good value.
3 -
I agree, LB is just such a nothing burger of a perk, that it ends up being like Windows of Opportunity (which is another perk I've seen people ask to be nerfed or have a timer). It can sometimes be more of a hindrance than a help. I think at the end of the day, much like the visual heartbeat indicator and Spies from the Shadows/Whispers, Lightborn exists purely as a QoL perk for people with light sensitivity or mild epilepsy and should be left alone. Especially gven how powerful certain flashlight + add-on combos can be and how some survivors do and will use blinds to bully the killer.
6 -
if you don’t want lobby dodging then please rephrase what you said. I took you saying killers choose to go into a match with flashlights. I took that as meaning instead of lightborn we should just dodge the flashys. And you're using False equivalence. Flashlights not blinding are no where near not taking damage or Hex totems not working at all. And you want to hear a fun fact that is Basekit: cleansing the totem. You can just cleanse the totem. You can remove totems without any perks. Also in what world is removing damage a logical an equivalent for your flashlight not working.
If one survivor is doing gens like you claim then Lightborn has NOTHING to do with that. That is the fault of the Survivors for not doing the Objective they need to do. Why should it be the killers fault that the people that randomly got assigned to your team don’t want to do gens? Survivors should chill out on gens instead of having half the team trail a chase. A survivors play style isn’t the fault of the killer so should not be used in terms of balence. Most survivors don’t linger for the save unless they are a SWF who built their team Around one person doing gens and the rest do saves or are trying to Clip farm.
your response was filled with Fallacy's and false equivalences.2 -
People get mad about Lightborne because it removes blinds from play, which removes an optional thing Survivors can choose to do. Generally Survivors in my experience are only mad about it if they a) built around blinds, b) are doing a blind challenge, c) are there to try to get clips for a compilation for Youtube or something.
There is nothing truly equivalent on Killer side except maybe Pentimento at 5 stacks, which removes totems from the equation, for the record.The problem is nobody makes you take blinding perks and blinds are not needed to win the game. There are actually several options like pallet saves, body blocks, and Breakout for example besides flashlights.
I am a casual player. I play both sides, though exclusively Killer right now because I just got really bored of Survivor. I am not looking to winstreak, I am not looking to pip, I am not looking for "a challenge" nor do I want "baby Survivors", I just want to have fun playing the game. But I am photosensitive, and the effect hurts my eyes when done repeatedly. Being blinded over and over isn't fun for me, at all, it hurts me. So therefore, I bring Lightborne sometimes, especially if I feel unconfident on a Killer - just like a Survivor may choose to bring WoO because it helps them learn loops or loop better. No different.
That, and I and many others who play Killer just find repeated blinds frustrating and unfun, the way a repeated slug is unfun and frustrating. Again, remember, like many other players, I'M CASUAL. I don't sweat, I don't run nasty builds, I still give hatch and door, I'm downright nice. But I do not like having Survivors swarm me with flashlights when I just want to do a hook challenge. I do not enjoy three people running Blast Mine when I just have a generator kick challenge. I hate being discouraged from even doing my goal because at that point, why am I playing? It's not fun if I can't achieve any amount of my goal, let alone a few hooks.
I main several M1 Killers especially (Dredge mostly, but I have dabbled in others), and I don't really like being say, Ghostface or Trapper and seeing people immediately try to take advantage of my M1 nature by coming running in for blinds while I play normally and destroy the team because they're too busy going for blinds. I actually just had this today in a Ghostface round, three people ALL so desperate for blinds and to do the Nostromo Main gen, they did nothing else - did not play well, did not spread out, and gave me a 3k for it. On one of Ghostface's WORST maps due to its size.It's a good thing blinds were fixed recently and a good thing Lightborne exists, because being gang-flashed by three people over one measly save doesn't feel good. It locks the screen. It ends the Killer's interaction. For some Killers if the Survs are good enough, it can prevent any hooks at all so the Killer never actually gets to have their goal, thus locking them out of their goal and possibly forcing bad behavior like slugging. It craps on baby players for no reason except to give some people an ego stroke.
It needs counters just like anything else in the game. Lightborne is healthy for this game, because it is an optional anti bullying and anti frustration perk, no different than something like Off the Record or Decisive Strike. Simple as. Don't tunnel, and Survs will not bring DS or OTR. Don't flashlight bullysquad, and Killers won't bring Lightborne.
It's simple manners.6 -
Hopefully people wake up like my swf and I just bring tool boxes with fast gen repair and finish all the gen off in 3 mins or less then you hear all survivors do is gen rush and dont want to do anything else lmao. Come on solo q do it.
-2 -
The game is not balanced around survivors preventing hook states. Flash saves, sabo and body blocks are high rish high reward, and rare.
4 -
My words are what they were: killers have the ability to change their loadout in the pregame lobby. If they are insecure about their skills, they can adjust their loadout if they see flashlights. That is unfair. One side shouldn't be able to lobby shop if the other side can't. Nobody should be able to adjust their builds based on what they see before the match starts if the other side can't. It is just outright unfair by definition.
Your second paragraph is a strawman and inconsistent to your previous claims. You claim that most people that bring flashlights are "bully squads" aka SWFs, yet here you claim these are people who are solo queueing (which was not an assertion of my previous comment). So which is it? I never said survivors not doing objectives is the killer's fault. However, there is a reason that flashlight saves have value, they are a lateral move to prolong the game so other survivors can do generators. That means flashlights have value to the state of the match. To claim that lightborn "has no value" and "is only for bully squads" is just simply not true by the examples you keep providing. Either it has no value or it does, so please pick one for the sake of your argument being consistent.
1 -
Likewise for hex perks. They are perks that have overpowered abilities countered by the fact that the survivors can break them. They are high risk high reward, yet just earlier in this thread people were claiming the opposite sentiment, that they are a core part of the game and how much of a tragedy it is if the risk doesn't pay off.
-1 -
flashlights/flashbang are one of the last fun things in the game for survs bar being chased, you take away the opportunity for flashlight saves and it means people will just have to stick gens which is boring
people could bring sabo builds, but that always leads to slugging because no one likes sabo…
i like to enjoy my games and not take them too seriously and try to evade flashlights rather than just denying the possibility completely. its part of the fun for me playing killer, i love when there's cheeky survs who like to go for saves and i try to pick or mind game the pick and chase them away.
flashlights are a core part of the game for many people and light born takes away what many people find fun about their matches, trying to save their teammates (even if they fail lmao)
youre allowed to run it though, everyone plays this game differently…but personally I think there's no need to be so against the idea of a flashlight save that you need to run a perk that 1. removes a fun aspect of the game for survivors (and kilers) 2. ends in the user getting gen rushed because no one is hovering for saves anymore
do you .. but you cant act oblivious as to why people find it annoying
-2 -
Well we're in agreement then
0 -
bait question lmao? It completely disables a play style, if the survivors wanted to do that play style, they can't. It's that simple
-3 -
The thing is, you really do not all need to bring flashlights in. There's never any reason for any team to bring four flashlights in unless they actually are memeing or trying to make someone's game a hard time and hoping they're baby or rusty enough to fall for it.
As someone else put it: The game is not about Survivors preventing hooks any more than it's about Killers preventing Survivors from getting even one generator done by 3-genning for 45 minutes with Skull Merchant. Your goal isn't to prevent the other side from scoring, this is not soccer and you are not a goalie. Your goal is kills/hooks, or doing gens and leaving. In no way is the game balanced around preventing gens or hooks, and playing the game that way is super, super obnoxious and unfun.
It has nothing to do with skill or ruining YOUR game, because it's simply not about you but about the other players' comfort. It's really no different than WoO, and frankly the only time most Killers even use this perk is when a) they feel unconfident, b) they have some sensitivity to certain patterns/lights, c) they suspect the Survivors JUST want to make their round as unfun as possible.
In all cases, putting on Lightborne is absolutely the right counter. When there are cases where a player can be vulnerable to a certain mechanic 100% of the time, such as breaking a pallet or picking up allowing for a chance to blind, it's reasonable to have a counter. When a side can be prevented from simply doing their damn goal, as the game intends, by a mechanic used in sufficient amount, it needs to have a counter. For 3genning, we have generator progression perks, toolboxes, spreading out tactically, and a kick limit. For repeated and excessive (and yeah four flashlight swarming is EXCESSIVE) blinds, we have Lightborne. Because yes. Repeated blinds can be that annoying. Just ask MCote about why flashlights were changed sometime.
As per lobbies and "why does the Killer get to see who we are rabble rabble rabble!!!!" well friend, that's because there are four Survivors who can coordinate with each other but only one Killer who has to make all the choices for themselves. The game is actually somewhat balanced around secrecy for some Killers, and removing it would remove part of the fun and the challenge. It'd be pretty unfair if Survivors got to coordinate before the round starts, but Killers couldn't do any sort of planning ahead, right? It'd also be really unfair if Survivors could see who the Killer is and purposefully do things like… oh, I dunno, plan for Dredge and prelock lockers, or plan for Ghostface and put on more looping perks plus be more alert knowing he's a stealth Killer, or plan for Oni by throwing on healing perks and medkits, or plan for Huntress or Dracula with perks that hide your aura, and so on and so on. Lobbies have to stay for this reason alone.Post edited by LockerLurk on2 -
Holy 40+ vote down, Batman.
1 -
I was agreeing with you but then that last paragraph. Trying to compare Lightborn to OtR and DS is absolutely insane to me because one perk completely negates an entire play style while style also acting as a QoL perk for the person using it, while the other two are at best a mere hinderance to the Killer.
If a killer runs Lightborn then they can't be blinded. Period. But if a survivor runs DS and/or OtR, they can still get tunneled out of the match. The extra endurance hit and 5-second stun does absolutely nothing especially since killers that like to hard tunnel are extremely stubborn anyway.
im not even pro or anti Lightborn, but to casually act like it's at all comparable is pretty insulting to me. Killers can play around DS/OtR. Survivors can't play around Lightborn. Big difference.
-4 -
Lightborne is fair and balanced.
It's fair because it only counters a niche style of stun that isn't that common but IS often used to be a nuisance to others… kinda like being tunnelled is so you throw on Off The Record to help with it or even stop it entirely.
It's balanced because the only thing it halts is a niche interaction that the Survivor never HAS to do to win the game, sorta like how hex perks and boons can be powerful but are still niche as they require investment and time (Boons) or can be forever lost (Hexes).If the problem you have with Lightborne is that it counters you wanting to blind the Killer with your friends all round so they can't do much, good. That's the point, it stops an obnoxious playstyle. If the problem you have with Lightborne is that it counters your preferred playstyle, sorry, but maybe if BHVR did something else to counter excessive uses of this niche mechanic, then your whole build wouldn't be countered. If the problem you have with Lightborne is that it's a "weak pick" and "a crutch" then why complain? It takes up 1/4 of a Killer's build and that's one less gen hold perk or meta pick while also helping new people get into the game - and we do want new people to stick around and play the game, right?
Post edited by LockerLurk on-2 -
Blinding is a nuisance and Survivors never need to go for blinds. Lightborne prevents the cases where Survivors go for blinds on purpose to annoy Killers; the Killer does not know your intentions when you and a friend take in like three flashlights, but they might assume you came to be annoying and throw this perk on. Because oftentimes when there are many flashlights that is what happens if they don't bring it - Survivors harass them all round with flashlights and it is not fun. It's also not even fun for other Survivors not in your SWF in this case, because you and your friend are off chasing me for blinds while they try to do five gens by themselves; how are they gonna feel in this situation? I do not go into my rounds to be forced to slug flashlight users or be blinded to the point I can't pick anyone up and even get one measly hook for my efforts, something every Killer plyer has dealt with or will sooner or later.
Hard Tunnelling a single person is very similar - it's a nuisance, it's annoying, and Killers never actually usually need to hyperfocus one person all round until that person dies. DS and OTR both help with tunnelling in case it does happen so another Survivor can possibly take aggro when a Killer purposefully tunnels a Survivor just to annoy them; I don't know as Survivor if the Killer will tunnel me but I know it's possible, so I bring OTR very often. There are Killers that hard tunnel people out, and if I don't bring OTR then it's me they could target - then I get harassed for a 2 minute round and barely get to play, that isn't fun.
And flashlight blind mobs are very, very similar. I just don't want to be annoyed.
It really isn't that hard to see how these are similar - both handle tactics that are really, really unfun to face when done in sufficient quantity of the actions.Post edited by LockerLurk on-2 -
Friend, I get what you're saying here… but did you consider that maybe being blinded a whole bunch of the round isn't a fun interaction for the Killer?
1 -
Wrong, it's not niche.
-3 -
I still want the effect of Lightborn to be immune to the blind effects instead of being immune to blinds.
Would mean the survivors beam narrows, they still get their score event (and challenges) and the game considers them blind for other effects, but you don't get the blind splash, stunned while carrying, or the lunge being disabled.
It would mean Killer would want some degree of acting blind to not give the game away and keep getting value which would be fun.
It would also have synergy for Shadownborn and Hex: Two Can Play, while also being somewhat countered by Champion of Light and Residual Manifest.
More interactions, much more interesting as a perk, and a much healthier design for future perks and mechanics
2 -
That's what happens when someone makes a bad and really biased, extremely competitive take here. The game is not a hardcore comp e-sport.
-2 -
How about you read when I say I was laughing at her having Lightborn coz she was so confident and I think it could be back to being slowed down, not it SHOULD be.
If anything what killer needs is a dark mode for being blinded so you aren't straining your eyes at it, I play killer and this is what I'd prefer personally.
How about you consider people don't like having the item they earned nullified, it's the same as having your killer power made useless by a flashlight… I wonder when we removed that hmmm, maybe stopping a player from enjoying their gameplan is lame hmmmm.
But no flashlights are intended for blinding, as are flashbangs. There is a way to please both sides in this interaction, I feel a dark mode would go a long way, or even let lightborn still get blinded but they see the blinders aura during it (so it can still be used to save others).
Killer mains not read what they want to read and percieve only challenge impossible.-1 -
I'm sorry but where in the game does it say your goal is to go for blinds, not do gens, not escape, not try to outrun the Killer? Nobody owes you letting you play your specific way, especially if it's a way that is really annoying and has no way to avoid it in certain situations. This is true of tunnelling, true of aura read, true of all stuns… and true of blinds. Heck, it's true of basically all game mechanics!
Saying "wrong, it's not niche" when I just pointed out several times how it is, in fact, niche, does not make a point. It just makes you look like you want to argue. It's also incorrect and demonstrably so as I and everyone else here have pointed out since you don't NEED to blind the Killer to win. It is absolutely super niche to build around going for blinds, I don't know anyone including myself who uses perks like Champion of Light or Blast Mine if I'm not going for a blind challenge or achievement. None of those perks are meta, why use them at all? Blinding itself is just a form of stunning (which is an actual mechanic), and not a particularly subtle or useful one (high risk mid reward), and not one that really is required. Blinding is therefore optional, you opt into doing them, they are a thing you can do in the game. You can always stun a Killer, but you need to bring a blind perk or flashlight or firecracker or something to blind the Killer. You are never forced to do them, it's optional, it's an optional form of the stun mechanic and an optional way to play the game that like hex builds, really is not that effective. That makes it niche by definition, so saying it's not because YOU like doing them and playing that way is quite simply incorrect.There are, speaking as someone who JUST spent a year and a half playing almost exclusively Survivor recently, often in SWF, far far far more fun and interesting and useful ways to stun the Killer and prevent hooks than a flashlight, flashbang, or Blast Mine. In fact it's way more tactical and fun and skilled, IMHO, to do something like set up a pallet stun, or find a way to trap the God Pallet with Chemical Trap, or somehow manage a Breakout-Boil Over-Sabo play, than it is to run in with a flashlight or Flashbang especially when the blind hitboxes recently got fixed from being glitched.
Learn new ways to play. I had to do it when Distortion was changed. I had to do it when Circle of Healing and medkits were changed. I had to do it when MFT+Hope were changed and FTP+Buckle Up were changed. You can also do it too, friend, I believe you are skilled enough. :) You can even do it mid round because Lightborne is that much of a non-issue! If flashlights don't work, simply go for pallet stuns or play for chases or generators. If points are what you want, go cleanse bones, you don't need a hex or boon in play to cleanse bones. If you are that bored of these things, maybe it's time to consider switching roles to Killer or playing something else. If your whole build keeps being negated by Lightborne, maybe it's tme for a new build. Improvise, adapt, do new things when old things don't work, that keeps the game fresh. How many times do you really need to win or play one style to have fun in the game anymore after thousands of hours? I mean really? It's the whole reason I and many others don't even try for winstreaks anymore, we just play the game and see how we do.
You and all of the others here angry that a niche mechanic can be countered may downvote all you like, but it doesn't make me or anyone else saying what I am saying any less correct. It doesn't make it any less niche and BHVR is not going to adjust one perk just to cater to you. Just like I as Killer should not expect my hexes to not get cleansed should I build around them, I as Survivor never expect the Killer to not bring Lightborne if I and my SWF bring and build around many flashlights. Yes sometimes those strategies yield big rewards, but both are too inconsistent enough to be used constantly. So it's really better to just build around something else. Something less annoying.-1 -
I think this could be a very healthy way to keep the perk's effect but give Survivors something for it, but it wouldn't make much sense would it? Shouldn't they only get the points if they do blind?
I agree with all of these but I'm confused why you're being so aggressive here. I didn't come at you aggressively, and I did read your whole post. It wasn't that long. I only said that maybe it's a good idea to consider that the blind mechanic as a whole, when done repeatedly and excessively, isn't fun for the Killer no matter how fun it is for Survivors. A Killer may similarly find tunnelling quite fun, but Survivors obviously don't. That was it, that's my whole point.
I am not a Killer Main, I play both sides. I currently do play exclusively Killer because I am bored of Survivor, but I played almost only Survivor for a whole year and a half before this because I got bored of Killer. I have thousands of hours in the game. I have played for several years. I am not "a Killer Main", I am a "DBD Main".
Since you seemingly just are looking for things to argue over, and so are others, it's probably time I either block you both or bow out of this thread. I have more than made my point, and more rehashing the same stuff here is useless and stupid.
Assuming not making an ass out of U and Me challenge: Impossible.-6 -
First of all, you edited your previous post, so I don't know how much of your original argument you changed.
Nowhere does it say in the killer's win condition does it say that their goal is don't hook survivors, slug them on the ground, hold 3 gens; yet this is what killers do. Why? Because it helps the killers achieve their goal. At the end of the day, a survivor's goal is to escape with as many of their team as possible. Flashlight saving a teammate is literally saving a teammate from a potential elimination. I really hope we are on the same page as something as basic as that.
Lightborne is fair and balanced.
It's fair because it only counters a niche style of stun that isn't that common but IS often used to be a nuisance to others… kinda like being tunnelled is so you throw on Off The Record to help with it or even stop it entirely.
It's balanced because the only thing it halts is a niche interaction that the Survivor never HAS to do to win the game, sorta like how hex perks and boons can be powerful but are still niche as they require investment and time (Boons) or can be forever lost (Hexes).
^ This was your "several times" explaining how it's niche in your response to my comment. I don't see you explain how it's niche here, other than you addressing an ambiguous situation that you deem niche from your own personal experience. Your point about "no of the perks being meta" is such an odd point to make, and your erroneous point about flashlight blinds just "being another stun" is wrong, because you are lacking the context around them. Pallet stunning the killer in chase versus saving a hook state on a teammate are two VASTLY different things. Also, if you love playing the most up-to-date meta, good for you, but just because something isn't meta, doesn't mean it's "niche."
You are never forced to do them, it's optional, it's an optional form of the stun mechanic and an optional way to play the game that like hex builds, really is not that effective. That makes it niche by definition, so saying it's not because YOU like doing them and playing that way is quite simply incorrect.
Your definition of niche is just wrong. The word you are looking for is playstyle. Niche implies a small number of people in relation to the total playerbase. I see at least 1 flashlight per lobby. 25% minimum of the playerbase is hardly "niche."
Learn new ways to play. I had to do it when Distortion was changed. I had to do it when Circle of Healing and medkits were changed. I had to do it when MFT+Hope were changed and FTP+Buckle Up were changed. You can also do it too, friend, I believe you are skilled enough. :) You can even do it mid round because Lightborne is that much of a non-issue! If flashlights don't work, simply go for pallet stuns or play for chases or generators. If points are what you want, go cleanse bones, you don't need a hex or boon in play to cleanse bones. If you are that bored of these things, maybe it's time to consider switching roles to Killer or playing something else. If your whole build keeps being negated by Lightborne, maybe it's tme for a new build. Improvise, adapt, do new things when old things don't work, that keeps the game fresh. How many times do you really need to win or play one style to have fun in the game anymore after thousands of hours? I mean really? It's the whole reason I and many others don't even try for winstreaks anymore, we just play the game and see how we do.
This is a non-point and also completely dismissive. You are talking about the most meta builds of meta builds that have ever had the chance of existing in this game. Of course they are going to get nerfed. I'm talking about the ability to use one of the 6 SURVIVOR ITEMS (3 if you aren't counting firecrackers, maps (useless), keys (useless)). Most survivors only bring a medkit, a toolbox, or a flashlight. You are talking about perk combinations. I'm talking about core basic item usage. "Learn new ways to play" is completely besides the point of the discussion. At a certain point you have to ask "are these perks/changes healthy and fair to both sides?" That's the point of my comment, not some commentary on "well I guess I'm just not adapting enough 🙄"
You and all of the others here angry that a niche mechanic can be countered may downvote all you like, but it doesn't make me or anyone else saying what I am saying any less correct.
Opinions can never be correct or incorrect, they are simply just opinions. If you ignore everything else from this post, at least remember that…
3
