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Simple improvements to Clown: Make both bottles strong, but separate the bottle counts

MrMori
MrMori Member Posts: 1,917
in Feedback and Suggestions

Before this update, Clown was very reliant on purple bottles because they were the strongest, and yellow bottles were a little underwhelming. BHVR saw the stats that few players were using yellow bottles and wanted to even their usage out a bit, so they nerfed purple bottles heavily while buffing yellows significantly.

But now, purple bottles aren't really worth using anymore, while yellows are too strong and too easy, leaving Clown in a strange spot where he's maybe stronger than before, maybe not, but very obviously less skill expressive, and not particularly fun to play as or against, simply running around spamming haste the whole game.

I have a pretty straightforward idea which would both improve the ratio of yellow/purple bottle usage, but also make Clown more interesting to play as and against, and reward players for using both bottle types and heavily disincentivize using only one type. Here they are:

New changes:

  • Purple and yellow bottle counts are now separate, with 3 purples and 3 yellows being basekit
    • Reloading reloads all bottles at the same time
  • Increased the time it takes for Afterpiece Antidote gas clouds to activate to 1.5 second (was 1).
  • Increased the Hindered effect linger time from Afterpiece Tonic gas clouds to 1.5 second (was 1).
  • Cigar Box: Now reveals auras within 12 meters (was 6).

Full reverts:

  • Increased the Hindered effect of Afterpiece Tonic to 15% (was 14%).
  • Flask of Bleach: Now increases the Hindered penalty from Intoxication by 4% (was 2%).
  • Ether 15 Vol%: Now increases the duration of Intoxication by 1 seconds (was 0.5).

In short, I would revert almost every nerf to purple bottles and their addons, partially revert the hinder linger duration, keep most buffs to the invigoration, but increase the invigoration activation time a little bit, and finally, separate the bottle counts.

With these changes, Clown would have access to two bottle types where both types are strong, but they would be limited. By separating the bottle counts, this would naturally incentivize Clown players to learn to use both bottle types, which would now be worth it since you get the best of both worlds with both strong yellows and purples, at the cost of having only 3 of each.

On a side note, I think the hinder duration is kind of awkward to balance right now because Vigil not only reduces the hinder duration, but also stacks with itself. This may be something to look into. Without Vigil in a match, 1.5s hinder duration is fair. But with Vigil, it's too low. It makes it awkward to balance the purples.

Either way, while the separate bottle count may be seen as limiting, sometimes limitations actually encourage creativity as players find solutions to work around the limitations. And let's be honest, if 3 bottle count of each is too low, then making it 4 would undeniably be a buff if Clown gets to keep both his strong yellows and his strong purples. So it's not like this separate bottle count idea is doomed, we would just need to find the right balance between the bottle counts and the strength of each bottle type.

What do you guys think?

Comments

  • Jargonator
    Jargonator Member Posts: 64

    Yeah… I haven't heard a single good thing about the Clown changes, this is probably for the best

  • mooasis
    mooasis Member Posts: 119

    good idea, but he'll still need further buffs to not be a terrible bottom tier killer

  • Elan
    Elan Member Posts: 1,419
    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/453090/simple-improvements-to-clown-make-both-bottles-strong-but-separate-the-bottle-counts

    It's reasonable there is only a cigar box, that was good change. Same with Chucky, there shouldn't be such a braindead add on that gives you wallhacks, on top of moving way faster. It completely any point of trying to play stealthily or hide near valuable spot.

  • Evan_
    Evan_ Member Posts: 562

    Not a half bad idea..

    If we accept the notion that killers should use their entire kit equally. But why? Will they also rework Dredge if they find that people teleport to lockers more than to the Remnant? What will happen to Dracula if they find that players aren't spending ~33% time in each form?

    As a Clown main who doesn't enjoy playing Blight Mk 2 at all, I still only wish for a full revert. Why break things that aren't broken?

  • Ohyakno
    Ohyakno Member Posts: 1,499

    This is a more elegant solution to encourage people to use both bottles. 3 is far too restrictive though.