comms and ranked system for balancing
if the game had inbulit comms instead of SWFs useing discord like we all do, the game can actually be blanced not for solo q, that is just trash and into SWFs which is co-oridnated and can destroy killers easily. if the game was balanced against SWFs instead of solo q by adding comms the game will be much easier of balance
a ranked system will further help seperating casual players from players that wanna win while also adding a relaxed casual mode for everyone else. this way people actually have a reason to win apart form just winning and the game can be balanced even more effectivly and give a reaosn for people to que apart from "just having fun"
I just think both survivors and killers will benifit with these changes as the game can actually me balanced a
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I would play ranked because having competent teammates is fun, not dudes who cleanse dull totems affected by thrill of the hunt, (just had a teammate doing that today, super frustrating and a massive waste of potential gen pressure) some who don't know how to play safe and counter garbage killer kits, and people who dc the second one little thing doesn't go their way
Comms should be forced and encouraged on ranked, and optional in casual/quick match.
Post edited by CompetitifDBD on-3 -
As this isn't new, I'd start by asking why adding comms to the game changes the mindset killers have about… using comms at all?
If its just apart of the game, its magically accepted and alright? I wouldn't think so, as that would mean all of this crap about discord and comms is merely something to complain about. Not real substance, just complain to complain.
So, I'm not sure how adding comms to the game changes anything. If this discord age thing falls flat, I'd wager people will still use discord. If comms are apart of the game, will discord users still be flamed for using it?
Genuinely curious. No one answers these things and I'm hoping you'd be the one that stands apart! Thank you :)
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SWFs which is co-oridnated and can destroy killers easily
My 41% ER playing mostly SWF says otherwise.
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Most swfs end up with a lower escape rate than they realistically should because they tend to be super altruistic.
@topic That assumes people would use the in game comms. Which the majority wouldn't.
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Again, comms in game or comms on discord, whats the difference?
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In game comms won't be used. Balancing around comms that won't be used is a bad idea imo.
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Bro… Can you stop replying with random statements when quoting a question from me? It sort of implies you're trying to answer the question. But in case you missed the question:
If comms exist in game and also discord, would you or others be upset if players continued to use Discord instead of in game? Does the mindset change whether its in game comms or discord comms? Hell, add other comm sources if it helps work it out. I need to understand this lol
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The point still stands. I'm not doing much destroying. The comms have yet to de-potato me.
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I cant lie the question you gave me confused me so much LMAO. I come from csgo when I solo que I used to comms in game when im wit the boys we use discord but thats only cause like we know each other and we have each other added. Same thing for dbd id think? its just having comms in the game atleast builds ligitmency for balancing the game around it and also makes solo q eaiser. If people are getting mad at a "stack" comp so a team of survivors that qued together and useing discord they would be more mad at the skill and chemistry of the players they might blame discord but its kinda baseless. when comms becomes universal it allows you to make plays with the team easier, so at that point this is when skill and game sense matter more than the comms itself. people will still be mad maybe? but honestly it would be baseless
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When you create your own win condition being that you consider it a win when you die and 3 others escape it sort of adds up why your escape rate would be lower. Pretty much implies that you can have low escape rate and still "win" if your team escapes meaning your likely to throw your own escape down the pan under the belief that you actually won. With this in mind I don't think quoting a low escape rate proves anything.
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Thank you! This makes so much sense lol. Very much appreciated <3
Are you really saying the win condition in a players head means more to you than the game's win condition? The thing you leave your team behind for? Just wanting clarity.
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By that logic, we should be taking turns dying and all have higher ERs. We generally lose as a team, and not because of altruistic throwing, it's because the game is killler-sided, comms don't make you good, and varying MMRs in a party make for bad matchmaking.
Pretty much implies that you can have low escape rate and still "win" if your team escapes meaning your likely to throw your own escape down the pan under the belief that you actually won.
Starting to feel like a broken record here, but I don't think about winning that much. If I trade or die for friends it's because they're friends, not because I care about the idea of it being a perceived win.
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My point still stands, you saying your escape rate being low as evidence of SWF having comms makes no difference is debunked due to you possibly sacrificing yourself for your team. In doing this, your escape rate would drop but it's possible that your 3 other team mates could be escaping therefore the killer losing.
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And I'm telling you that's not the case. I'm not the team punching bag. We are just losing, plain and simple. Will I trade? Yeah. But so will they, so the ERs will be similar if we all play similar.
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Your point never had legs. You're just good with mental gymnastics. But its entertaining. So continue.
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How could they possibly "force" comms? How would they even know who's using them, especially on the consoles?
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So we are to take your word on that? You might trade and so might your team but you also might not. It's possible your telling the truth, it's possible your lying or even mistaken just how much you actually throw yourself under the bus for the sake of the team. I'm simply saying you giving a low escape rate doesn't prove your point any more than me showing an escape rate of over 70% and me saying "I never abandon, I always escape via the gate".
It's good that you offer some sort of "evidence" to back your claim but without solid proof there is always room for error and I have merely pointed out a flaw in your argument while pointing out a flaw in your evidence.
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Good argument, I will make sure to make note of that. Can't dispute it so come up with a random comment... Or downvote as many do lol. Never had legs yet can't argue against it? Come on now 😂
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I'm not going to do any of that at all, so you are correct. Now, please continue.
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BHVR could and should never add voice comms to DBD: the mechanical and moderating issues it would create would dwarf any minor potential benefits from letting solo Survivors directly speak to one another. A ping/comms wheel like in Overwatch would be easier to implement and use
A ranked system is tempting, but you know that the true sweatlords would use the casual queue to guarantee that their opponents are not going to be equipped to compete.
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Continue what exactly? I have already said what I wanted to say, unless you have something to discuss or add, which you have said you don't....so I'm not sure what you expect lol.
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I would play ranked because having competent teammates is fun
Unfortunately ranked doesnt mean you'll get competent teammates. Looks at every ranked game ever.
You'll only get that if you choose them or get lucky in matchmaking.
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It works if everyone speaks the same language, but on servers with multiple languages, it’s hard to communicate over voice chat.
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Voice chat doesn't automatically make people better at the game. Many people who group up are playing for fun with friends and not sweating, and people who play solo can be competitive without it.
Not to mention that the stats already show that being in a group isn't some ticket to instant win any more. If anything, there's a weak correlation between grouping up and dying more often by being altruistic.
Dbd doesn't need voice and probably couldn't handle it anyway. A simple ping or pre-set call-out wheel with a cooldown to prevent spamming would be nice, but would simply be a qol change at this point.
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Welcome to Dead by Daylight! This topic comes up about once a month, and… the reasons why it is just not feasible are legion (not the killer.)
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SWF with comms don't make people better at the game but they can aid in escapes, that's the point. With Comms you don't need to be good at the game.
Perfect example is when I played in a duo with a brand new player, they had like 10 hours of gameplay and they were able to escape more teamed with me than with solo due to my call outs. They didn't have to know how to loop because they could pre run or walk away before the killer even go to them so they didn't have to loop. Was this new player good? Not at all. Did comms help them escape? Absolutely.
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a voice channel is always open when in a lobby on this game mode. The only way to not be heard is to use an official muting method from lets say your controller mic on a ps5, or a mute button on your external mic or headset.
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the point of a mode like this is for people who want teammates adamant about winning, having communication as a trade off for balancing in the form of banned perks/items/add ons. I'd take a balanced DBD with somewhat more competent and communicated players over the one we have now
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In-built comms and DC comms are a totally different thing. Not every SWF is on voicecomms, and if they are not everyone is making call-outs like comp. If you dont think so youre most likely american, where everybody speaks the same language. The rest of the world doesnt, just fyi. And most people arent that good in speaking english too, to even communicate properly. Forcing voice comms and thinking that everyone is now a topnotched-swf doesnt make any sense.
The same goes for split modes. Most people do not just want to win. They want to have easy games. So why should they want to play in a ranked mode with not so easy games? They just play casual and do the same thing as now. The only ones that would play a ranked mode are people who are totaly competitive oriented, so maybe 1% at all. A mode for 1% makes no sense, especially cause dbd isnt a comp game at all.
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That won't work for the consoles, as their comms are built directly into the machines, and are entirely separate from which game might be being played. DBD wouldn't be able to even know who's on comms there.
Plus for a game to be accepted by Microsoft or Sony they cannot interfere with comms in any way.
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Though I'm quite sure many people lie about their matches, or at least exaggerate, if we go down that road then there's zero point in any conversations that happens here. I could post the details of my most recent 4mans that show most matches having one or zero escapes but that would make this thread very long. If I'd clipped it, I could post the recent match where I had to use a key that we've been bringing in and hiding, along with a hatch offering, so one of us can get out because that's how bad the situation is for the dreaded 4man.
It's wild to say that I'm just dying on purpose every match and for...reasons? I like dying? I'm a masochist? I want to throw off my stats even though I intentionally don't abandon so they're accurate? Idk.
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i already explained why you might be inclined to die…to take one for the team so you get your "win" if your under the impression that 1 man dying and 3 out is a win. Makes perfect sense and a logical thing to do. If you thought dying was a loss then it make no sense to die for your team but you clearly view it as a win.
Im just saying a counter point to your argument and suggesting a possible explanation for the low escape rate which you cant deny is a possibility. Theoretically a weaker player can be in an SWF team and die alot, they might not be bothered by dying because they see it as a win when 3 others escape….but escape rates dont take into account "team escapes" they take into account the individual so claiming you have a low escape rate to suggest SWF teams dont win often can be disputed. Unless your saying dying is a loss for you even if your team escapes? then it makes no sense to sacrifice yourself for the good of the team. But while you view it as win to die while others escape you have given valid reason to not only die for the team (reducing your escape rate) but also to be perfectly happy with doing so (because you feel you won).
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You keep talking about me being the only one who is dying and I'm telling you that's not what's happening. No one is talking about win conditions or anything. So since you're accusing me of lying, here are the 6 deaths of my lasy 9 4man sessions:
Four people on comms and pretty much all full team wipes accept one draw.
I love how it's the people who soloq who are experts on what happens in every and all SWFs. The boogeyman isnt real but it hurts the narrative, so it must continue.
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the evidence shown only shows results. it does not show if they are even SWF. Could be soloq for all i know. duo? 4 man? who knows.
The evidence shown also does not show if comms were used which is what this thread is about…SWF that use comms. Showing matches where comms are not used doesnt prove that comms are not effective when they are used.
The evidence also does not show if these matches were played normally or specifically working towards a challenge such as hatch escape (which is a possibility as you have said about bringing a key and hiding it.) ofcourse if your doing challenges then your not going to be concentrating on wins.
I have played SWF as a duo with a new player and they escaped a lot more due to comms. "killer heading your way" that simple quick comment said between having a laugh and joking around still enabled them to pre run avoiding the need to loop (which they couldnt do).
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Yeah the repeat characters in the same spots during the same time frame are just coincidences. Logical.
I post a lot of screenshots. I provide the evidence I have. You do nothing but tell anecdotal tales, often about things other people did or said or might be doing. It's cute that you're trying to discard all my evidence while providing none of your own in a discussion about something you mostly know about in theory and I know in practice.
Idk who these baby players you're playing with who are still doing these tome challenges and also have no idea how to play at the same time but that's not happening in my matches. 4mans don't throw so someone can cleanse totems. Were bringing the key and a hatch offering solely in hopes that one person can get out of the match because the matches are awful. Even then, we often get no one out because the killer slugs for the 4k. We used the key once in these matches. And it was me, and I wasn't doing any stupid challenge.
Yeah I've heard you're story of playing in low MMR with one guy once. Amazing. I've played with dozens of people over thousands of matches. The results remain about the same as soloing, the company of friends just makes the endless loses more bearable. But you're the expert on this thing you've basically never done.
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i posted stats, my escape rate and it was quickly cast aside due to inaccuracy. swings both ways, if personal stats are not accurate and open to scrutiny then so are screen shots that prove nothing.
there are players with thousands of hours in the game and have no done tome challengers. i have over 3k hours and i havnt done them all. 4mans do throw to help people with challenges, its the often the best and easiest way to get them done when everyone helps eachother to get them done. 4 man team where multiple people needs hatch escape….the team will help them get it. soloq where someone needs hatch escape, ye they wont give it to you because you need to get it done.
while my anecdotal evidence isnt good enough for you, your hypocrisy just doesnt wash. constantly saying one thing then contradicting yourself a second later. your arguments are very wishy washy at best and it seems like you change your stance depending on what your argument is at the time. there is no consistency. The most you offer is your own experience with vague evidence which can be interpreted in many ways. I offer my own experience AND the experience of others. Even on these forums there have been people that have said exactly the same as me, SWF with comms can be game breaking or can offer advantages that soloq doesnt get. But you dismiss this every time because i dont screenshot every comment or record every discusion then you say "no evidence, anecdotal". Sorry but if you want hard evidence given then you have to provide it too. By hard evidence i dont mean things that can be interpreted in different ways, i mean solid evidence that cant be disputed. until that happens then your evidence is just valid or invalid as anecdotal evidence.
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The advantage of SWF is overstated.
We know the stats, iirc.
Top row is Japan, bottom row is the world.
1st column is Solo, then Duo, then Trio, then 4-man.
Inside those boxes, the top number is percentage of players playing that way. Bottom number is the escape rate.
2% difference.
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i posted stats, my escape rate and it was quickly cast aside due to inaccuracy
The survivor stats are known to be inaccurate. That's why I almost never post mine, even if mine are accurate. And you yourself use the abandon function and still use your stats as an example, which is disingenuous. I suppose that's why you think I'm being disingenuous, because you can't understand that some people are capable of honesty without ulterior motives.
4mans do throw to help people with challenges, its the often the best and easiest way to get them done when everyone helps eachother to get them done
I've never once been in a party that threw for someone to do a challenge. But tell me more about all these 4mans you've never played in that have done this.
Even on these forums there have been people that have said exactly the same as me, SWF with comms can be game breaking or can offer advantages that soloq doesnt get.
I'm here too. I don't need your screenshots, I see the comments, and they're the same as yours. "I played a few games with my friends and we won all of them so ez killer got no hooks I have no evidence and MMR and skill level is an unknown but trust me bro SWF is OP"
I offer my own experience AND the experience of others
other people can speak for themselves. I talk about my own matches and what happens in them. I don't care what's happening in others cause I wasn't there. "Someone said something once on the internet" is not evidence, it's just hollow echoes.
Sorry but if you want hard evidence given then you have to provide it too.
I did, and you really tried to say all these repeat characters aren't a party lol. I could post the match with the comm recordings and you'll say "well I can only see your view, what are your friends doing? Maybe they're just tbaggjng the killer to die."
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- these are from 2024…not up to date stats, there has been many changes since then.
- These stats only show SWF escape rates. They do not show how effective comms are when used. As we know not all SWF use comms. SWF is not the issue. The comms are.
- These stats also do not show what killers are being used…..im willing to bet S tier killers being used more commonly is the reason why escape rates are not higher. remove the S tier killers, show the rest of the roster v SWF with comms…i would like to see those escape rates.
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you almost never post your stats….yet you were using your 41% escape rate as evidence to prove SWF with comms does not offer advantages? That was my point.
other people can speak for themselves. I talk about my own matches and what happens in them. I don't care what's happening in others cause I wasn't there. "Someone said something once on the internet" is not evidence, it's just hollow echoes.
You realise you are someone on the internet…. so just hollow echoes because i wasnt there.
Your screen shots might show an SWF, but does it show comms? you said it yourself you dont always use comms when in SWF and not all SWF use comms.
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1) 2024-2025.
2) You cannot make that distinction. You are trying to prove a negative, stop using fallacies.
3) Look at the stats at high MMR then. You have internet access, and while I have quite the catalogue of screenshots, it might behoove you to do the research for yourself.
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exactly my point, you cant prove that comms were used or not so providing screenshots that show escape rates covering everything including where comms are not used is not reliable or accurate when the discussion is not about SWF as a whole. its about comms. its like someone complaining that kill rates are too high on S tier killers then someone else showing a screen shot that says all killers average out ok. filter out the the parts that skew the results and you have your evidence, until then your offering stats that have nothing to do with topic of comms. When the discussion is regarding SWF as a whole then you can provide these stats that reflect SWF as a whole.
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So you have no point at all, understood.
You have no data, no evidence, all you are doing is ragebaiting.
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so your so called evidence was debunked and you have no actual relevant data that shows the effects of comms….not SWF as a whole but comms? understood.
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You are asking people to prove a negative.
Either actually argue a REAL point, or stop derailing conversations.
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Because it's an averge, reasonable number. And if that 41% were an inflated number, what would that say about SWF?
You're talking about something you saw someone else say that you have no experience in and calling it evidence. I'm talking about my own matches and you're calling it lies.
I haven't been off-comms in some time.
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im not asking anyone to prove anything, your the one trying to prove it. The OP posts a thread about how comms can destroy killers, i agree it can destroy certain killers….not all but stealth killers in particular. Your the one trying to disprove it with flimsy evidence to suggest this is not the case….when i debunk your evidence as it hold no baring on comms at all you claim im asking people to prove something lol.
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However from my point of view im seeing someone online say about their experience…so its valid for you use your experience but it cant be used further than that? i cant use your experience and say "well this is what someone else experiences". makes your experience pretty invalid when you look at the big picture as it cant be used to back up anything other than what you personally say. You cant say about what anyone else has said to back up your own arguments then which you have done many times.
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No, I don't reuse what random strangers I don't know or trust type in a box. I'm not using that as evidence in an argument about a game I play and I have experiences in. This is exactly the problem with this game's echo chamber, it's no different than parroting a streamers opinon or using their match as an example, especially when people cherry pick what matches they talk about to make their points. If someone cries about SWF beating them while concealing they'd won 30 games before that one and have an 80% KR, the information is incompete. If it's not happening to you, I don't know why you're talking about it, because you don't have all the info. And if you haven't experienced it and you're just guessing, you're opinon is useless. You can't never play in a SWF of average players and think you know everything about it while disregarding either real personal experience or official data.
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you reuse what others have said on these forums many times claiming that when enough people say the same thing it adds validity to the argument. (the numbers of people that find tunneling an issue for example). But by your standards if you dont experience it then it never happens? you play in your own little SWF bubble and might not play like most SWF teams do. i have been in a duo, i have seen how others people play and they dont play like you. But lets disregard this because you were not there. Facts remain, people clearly have an issue with comms as they are voicing loud and clear in the forums, you can disagree based on your own experience but you cant disprove other peoples experience by throwing stats that are known to be wrong not worth anything. Then after your stats were logically debunked as they offer no evidence regarding comms you change to screenshots to try to prove your right and other people are wrong which also shows no relation to the use of comms.
This seems to be your go-to response to many issues people raise when it doesnt suit you….you try to disprove what people say or ask them to prove what they say when quite often proof cannot be provided which is exactly what im pointing out now. Every proof you have given has had holes and can be disputed, this is why almost every topic gets taken off course and the current thread is a perfect example of how it becomes a debate about stats, legitimacy, validity, proof instead of actually discussing what the OP has an issue with. If you dont agree, fair enough, but trying to disprove it with meaningless stats just isnt going to happen.
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