How to stop tactical camping

Orion

(This thread was copied over from another category due to having been misplaced)

For the purposes of this thread, "tactical camping" is intended to mean "camping intended as a strategy", which does not encompass griefing.

Tactical camping, at its core, stems from one core issue: unhooking a Survivor is extremely punishing for Killers and extremely rewarding for Survivors.

Here's a typical scenario:

• Assume a Killer takes 15 seconds to find a Survivor. During this time, four generators have been repaired to 15%, taking into account skill checks, base generator repair time, and the time it takes to find a generator.
• Assume a Survivor can keep a Killer busy for 30 seconds before getting hit for the first time. During this time, three generators were repaired to 55%, while one generator remains at 15%.
• Assume another 30 seconds until the second hit. Three generators have been repaired to 95%, and one remains at 15%.
• Assume 5 seconds to reach the hook. Three generators were fully repaired, meaning that the Survivors are 60% of the way to being able to open the gates. Given the time it takes to open the gates, I'd hazard a guess they're 50% of the way to winning, while the Killer has yet to kill a single Survivor.
• The other Survivors immediately stop generator progression and approach the hook while trying to remain unseen by the Killer.

At this point, the Killer has two options:
1. Camp the Survivor he already has, knowing full well that the rest will come for the rescue.
2. Leave the hook, knowing full well he will lose his prey.

Let's follow both paths, one at a time.

First path:

• The other Survivors crouch around the hook, trying to find an opening they know won't come, until the hooked Survivor dies. Three Survivors remain.
• The Killer had already spotted the three Survivors around the hook and finds a new target.
• Assume 20 seconds until the first hit, due to the Survivor not realizing the Killer had seen him long ago. During this time, the other Survivors are scrambling to find new generators. One of them finds the generator that was left at 15%, while the other finds a generator at 0%.
• Assume 30 seconds until the second hit. First generator is at 55%, the other is at 40%.
• Assume 5 seconds to reach the hook. First generator is at 60%, the other is at 45%.
• The Killer still camps, but the Survivors have now decided to focus on generators.
• It takes 60 seconds for the second Survivor to be sacrificed, because they give up mashing the space bar after a while due to being camped. First generator is fully repaired, while the second sits at 85%.
• The Killer finds the Survivor that was repairing the first generator. The last one keeps working on the second generator.
• After 10 seconds, the second generator is repaired. The last Survivor moves toward the nearest gate, to open it.
• Assume 20 seconds from the time the second generator was repaired until the third Survivor is hit. One of the gates is now open, but the third Survivor doesn't know which one.
• After 30 seconds, the third Survivor has led the Killer toward the wrong gate, thinking it was the one their teammate had opened. The third Survivor is hit again and taken to a hook in 5 seconds.
• The last Survivor escapes through the gate.

Result: Killer has 3 kills.

Second path:

• The Killer finds one of the three Survivors approaching the hook and initiates a chase.
• The hooked Survivor is rescued and healed in 10 seconds. All three Survivors disperse and resume generator repair after 5 seconds.
• The second Survivor the Killer is chasing is hit 20 seconds after the hooked Survivor is healed. During this time, three generators were repaired to 30%.
• Another 30 seconds until the second hit. During this time, three generators were repaired to 70%.
• 5 seconds until the second Survivor is hooked. The other three are already approaching the hook's area.
• The Killer manages to find the first hooked Survivor and decides to chase them. The second hooked Survivor is rescued by the time the Killer initiates the chase.
• 30 seconds until the first hit. The second hooked Survivor was fully healed after 10 and all three Survivors resumed generator repair 5 seconds after that. Three generators are now at 90%.
• 30 seconds until the second hit. All generators were repaired after 5, and both gates were opened at the same time as the second hit.
• The Killer finds the second hooked Survivor and initiates a chase. The first hooked Survivor is rescued by the time the chase is initiated.
• The second hooked Survivor makes a beeline for one of the open gates, getting hit once along the way and escaping in the nick of time.
• The Killer checks the area around the gate and decides to go toward the other gate. There, the Killer finds three Survivors spamming Ctrl, who run before the Killer has the chance to approach.

Result: Killer has 0 kills.

TL;DR: Survivors have the ability to essentially reset the Killer's progress in 10 seconds, while keeping their own intact. Killers know that if they attempt to stop the Survivors' progress, they have to sacrifice their own as well. Often, this results in "one step forward, two steps back" for the Killer.

With all that in mind, a combination of these changes to the game could help reduce tactical camping. I want to emphasize that these changes are not perfect and have room for improvement, as well as the fact that I'm not suggesting they should all be implemented:

• Base Killer movement speed adjusted so it matches tier 1 of Bloodlust. This will make chases slightly shorter.
• Hooked Survivors are capped at the "injured" state. This will make hooking more relevant.
• Survivors no longer get a Sprint Burst upon being hit. This will make chases slightly shorter.
• Walking speed of injured Survivors is reduced to between crouch-walking and regular walking, with the appropriate change to sprinting speed. This will make injuries relevant in the short term and shorten chases.
• Unhooking a Survivor requires two Survivors to be near-instant (the speed it is now), but will not trigger Borrowed Time or other unhooking-related perks. With only one Survivor, it takes 15 seconds to unhook. This will make hook saves actually dangerous.
• The further away the Killer is from the hook, the faster the hooked Survivor is sacrificed, with the speed increasing 5%/m after a radius of 4m, without limit. Within the 4m radius, the sacrifice speed is normal. If the Killer is engaged in a chase, the sacrifice speed is immediately doubled, as is the bonus 5%/m. This will make Killers want to leave the hook and chase other survivors.
• Borrowed Time injures the rescuer if the unhooked Survivor is hit while it's in effect. This will make hook saves with Borrowed Time actually dangerous.
• Survivors only take 60 seconds to be sacrificed. This will put less pressure on Killers to defend the Survivor they caught and more pressure on Survivors to rescue their teammate.
• Survivors who are rehooked are immediately sacrificed. This will make Killers want to allow a rescue, since it will greatly benefit them if they can catch the same Survivor again.
• Killers are no longer slowed after attacking, no matter if they hit a Survivor or terrain, or if they miss altogether. They will still get the usual animations. This will make chases slightly shorter.

only1biggs

My god, so many bad ideas smh ...I don't even know where to begin

Capped at injured? Tier 1 bloodlust all around!? No speed boost after a hit? Survivors that are re-hooked a re dead? So no 3 lives concept, just... 2 hooks and you're out and it's now easier to catch them and hook them?

You just killed the game.

Here's an idea.. when the game starts, all survivors spawn in the basement and the killer spawns at the top of the stairs. As soon as the first survivor is hit, they are teleported to the hook and the rest of the survivors are downed. It's then a race for the killer to hook everyone as fast as he can.

jiyeonlee

@only1biggs said:
My god, so many bad ideas smh ...I don't even know where to begin

Capped at injured? Tier 1 bloodlust all around!? No speed boost after a hit? Survivors that are re-hooked a re dead? So no 3 lives concept, just... 2 hooks and you're out and it's now easier to catch them and hook them?

You just killed the game.

Here's an idea.. when the game starts, all survivors spawn in the basement and the killer spawns at the top of the stairs. As soon as the first survivor is hit, they are teleported to the hook and the rest of the survivors are downed. It's then a race for the killer to hook everyone as fast as he can.

actually i saw that hacks before from some chinese player

Orion

@only1biggs said:
My god, so many bad ideas smh ...I don't even know where to begin

Capped at injured? Tier 1 bloodlust all around!? No speed boost after a hit? Survivors that are re-hooked a re dead? So no 3 lives concept, just... 2 hooks and you're out and it's now easier to catch them and hook them?

You just killed the game.

Here's an idea.. when the game starts, all survivors spawn in the basement and the killer spawns at the top of the stairs. As soon as the first survivor is hit, they are teleported to the hook and the rest of the survivors are downed. It's then a race for the killer to hook everyone as fast as he can.

If you actually read the comment, you'd see I'm not suggesting every single thing on that list should be implemented. Let me know when you actually read it so we can have a proper discussion.

jiyeonlee

scenario is too weebo (stupid and unrealistic)

and your suggests are beyond of idiotic

you re the another one who using the "no one stupid enough to think like this way" perk

oh man... if you re more than 12years old play more games and come back here

its soo soooo terrible ideas im sure youre not downloaded game and watching twitch streamers

jiyeonlee

make sure my words

wrong<stupid<moron<idiotic<beyond of idiotic(same level as random baby's wrable)

by the way you decorated your ######### well but still looks maximum autistic

only1biggs

@Orion said:

@only1biggs said:
My god, so many bad ideas smh ...I don't even know where to begin

Capped at injured? Tier 1 bloodlust all around!? No speed boost after a hit? Survivors that are re-hooked a re dead? So no 3 lives concept, just... 2 hooks and you're out and it's now easier to catch them and hook them?

You just killed the game.

Here's an idea.. when the game starts, all survivors spawn in the basement and the killer spawns at the top of the stairs. As soon as the first survivor is hit, they are teleported to the hook and the rest of the survivors are downed. It's then a race for the killer to hook everyone as fast as he can.

If you actually read the comment, you'd see I'm not suggesting every single thing on that list should be implemented. Let me know when you actually read it so we can have a proper discussion.

I did read your post and understood everything, hence my opening gambit of, "My god, so many bad ideas".

I await our discussion.

No_Cluie_Louis

@Orion said:

@only1biggs said:
My god, so many bad ideas smh ...I don't even know where to begin

Capped at injured? Tier 1 bloodlust all around!? No speed boost after a hit? Survivors that are re-hooked a re dead? So no 3 lives concept, just... 2 hooks and you're out and it's now easier to catch them and hook them?

You just killed the game.

Here's an idea.. when the game starts, all survivors spawn in the basement and the killer spawns at the top of the stairs. As soon as the first survivor is hit, they are teleported to the hook and the rest of the survivors are downed. It's then a race for the killer to hook everyone as fast as he can.

If you actually read the comment, you'd see I'm not suggesting every single thing on that list should be implemented. Let me know when you actually read it so we can have a proper discussion.

The irony i said the exact same thing on my thread, but you continued to tell me what a bad idea i had rather than trying to help me change my ideas, don't be such a hypocrite man. The difference is, my idea would barely change the difficulty for either roles, with it being a bit easier for killer after the change, you're essentially suggesting to make survivors never leave and make the killer have in game hacks. I had no problem with what you said on my thread untill i saw this, you insult my idea but yours is completely ridiculous.

Orion

@No_Cluie_Louis said:

@Orion said:

@only1biggs said:
My god, so many bad ideas smh ...I don't even know where to begin

Capped at injured? Tier 1 bloodlust all around!? No speed boost after a hit? Survivors that are re-hooked a re dead? So no 3 lives concept, just... 2 hooks and you're out and it's now easier to catch them and hook them?

You just killed the game.

Here's an idea.. when the game starts, all survivors spawn in the basement and the killer spawns at the top of the stairs. As soon as the first survivor is hit, they are teleported to the hook and the rest of the survivors are downed. It's then a race for the killer to hook everyone as fast as he can.

If you actually read the comment, you'd see I'm not suggesting every single thing on that list should be implemented. Let me know when you actually read it so we can have a proper discussion.

The irony i said the exact same thing on my thread, but you continued to tell me what a bad idea i had rather than trying to help me change my ideas, don't be such a hypocrite man. The difference is, my idea would barely change the difficulty for either roles, with it being a bit easier for killer after the change, you're essentially suggesting to make survivors never leave and make the killer have in game hacks. I had no problem with what you said on my thread untill i saw this, you insult my idea but yours is completely ridiculous.

I said your idea is bad because it would tilt the balance of the game in the Survivors' favor (something that shouldn't happen in an asymmetrical game) and create a situation where the Killer is punished for trying to complete his objective (kill/prevent rescues). Your idea cannot be fixed because it is fundamentally flawed.

Don't accuse me of hypocrisy when you clearly haven't been paying attention to anything anyone's said unless it's to agree with you.

Orion

@only1biggs said:

@Orion said:

@only1biggs said:
My god, so many bad ideas smh ...I don't even know where to begin

Capped at injured? Tier 1 bloodlust all around!? No speed boost after a hit? Survivors that are re-hooked a re dead? So no 3 lives concept, just... 2 hooks and you're out and it's now easier to catch them and hook them?

You just killed the game.

Here's an idea.. when the game starts, all survivors spawn in the basement and the killer spawns at the top of the stairs. As soon as the first survivor is hit, they are teleported to the hook and the rest of the survivors are downed. It's then a race for the killer to hook everyone as fast as he can.

If you actually read the comment, you'd see I'm not suggesting every single thing on that list should be implemented. Let me know when you actually read it so we can have a proper discussion.

I did read your post and understood everything, hence my opening gambit of, "My god, so many bad ideas".

I await our discussion.

I await you to give me something to discuss other than a strawman.

only1biggs

@Orion said:

@only1biggs said:

@Orion said:

@only1biggs said:
My god, so many bad ideas smh ...I don't even know where to begin

Capped at injured? Tier 1 bloodlust all around!? No speed boost after a hit? Survivors that are re-hooked a re dead? So no 3 lives concept, just... 2 hooks and you're out and it's now easier to catch them and hook them?

You just killed the game.

Here's an idea.. when the game starts, all survivors spawn in the basement and the killer spawns at the top of the stairs. As soon as the first survivor is hit, they are teleported to the hook and the rest of the survivors are downed. It's then a race for the killer to hook everyone as fast as he can.

If you actually read the comment, you'd see I'm not suggesting every single thing on that list should be implemented. Let me know when you actually read it so we can have a proper discussion.

I did read your post and understood everything, hence my opening gambit of, "My god, so many bad ideas".

I await our discussion.

I await you to give me something to discuss other than a strawman.

LOL