Tunneling
Before you slap a downvote on this post and start yelling at me, I have just seen so many mixed signals about tunneling. I, for one, do it out of pure efficiency of killing a survivor before I get genrushed. I wanted to find a consensus about this topic. Please, people please, do this rationally.
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In case this matters, I do play killer, specifically spirit, the most.
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There's always a reason to tunnel.
Getting t-bagged ----> Tunnel.
Flashlight clicked ----->tunnel.
But tunneling out of sheer desperation, as a survivor I hate it, I absolutely hate it.
To completely eradicate someone from the game in the first stages of the game is just messed up and there's no consideration for the other side.
And before people say iTs the kIlLers jOb, well, it's not the killers job to be a dick.
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While tunneling and killing a survivor will slow the game down once they are dead. It is still not the best way to play. Here is an example:
Tunneling - You hook a survivor and proxy camp and wait for unhook. While survivor is hooked you have potentially 3 survivors working on gens while you are waiting for an unhook. 1 survivor comes to unhook (2 survivors still on gens).
Not tunneling - You hook survivor and start chasing another survivor. Now only 2 survivors are working on gens, and one has to stop to get the unhook. leaving 1 survivor on a gen.
If you want to tunnel, you will most likely lose 2-3 gens for doing so. The game will slow down considerably once you kill the person and it will make it easier to defend the remaining gens, but overall it is not the most reliable and efficient way to play.
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I have a personal rule: Don't go back to the hook if you're not prepared to hit the first person you see. The goal isn't necessarily to tunnel, it's to ensure that I don't throw the game because I'm playing too nice.
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I mean, if I see a 4-man SWF, I'm going to tunnel bc it will most likely result in all of their friends taking hits, taking them off gens and forcing pressure through hitting them. And with Spiri's amazing chasing power, I can get a snowball going real quick.
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I don't see tunneling as a bad thing, necessarily, I will down a Survivor, cause I'm not just gonna let the hooked Survivor go heal and do gens, but I will give them another chance while I hunt the others and make others waste their time trying to pick up their friend rather than doing an object, one less person doing anything and I'm hunting others while they try to get someone who's on the ground, who can't do anything, it's a smart tactic.
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It's a logic decision. Will I:
-Go after the healthy survivor who will probably run me around for a bit, or
-Put the now-injured survivor on death hook.
Simple.
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Because you don't consider the other side.
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I don't do it specifically unless I feel I'm starting to get behind or the survivors are being really flipping stupid with unsafe rescues as I hate unsafe rescues when I'm a survivor. Remember, safe rescue is only when the person hooked is off the hook 10 seconds. When you get an unsafe rescue, the rescuer is denied 500 points and they LOSE benevolance overall for the careless unhoook. So you bet your ass I'm going to take every opportunity to discourage that behavior.
I don't typically tunnel though. At the most I'll down the rescued person to deny the points but start chasing the idiot who did the bad rescue as that will buy me some time.
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I mean its the way the core of the game works man i think you are trying a little hard to say tunneling isn't fair if we wanna get into that conversation theres a lot of things in the game that are not "fair" but its just how the game is designed its not fair that 3 gens go in the span of a minute most killers dont enjoy tunneling but sometimes you got to.
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The enjoyment of my opponant's game is the last thing on my mind. I'm not one to mentally shackle myself with social pressure and made up rules. I realize that many view me as a dick for this. But ultimately in the grand scheme of the universe - how anybody views me is meaningless.
Because victory is all that matters. Just be happy that I'm one of the better killers that understands how spreading the pain slows the game down.
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First paragraph is exactly my point.
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Tunneling is a sheer act of desperation and selfishness by the killer who have no consideration for the health of the game.
I'm honestly not surprised by the amount of positivity when it comes to tunneling and the amount of people who want the DS Perk nerfed. There is no middle ground when it comes to these subjects because you all start throwing the "Well, if survivors can, killer should" argument and no one wants to be the bigger person and start giving everyone a fair chance and give this game a healthy feel to it.
Sad.
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I think it's even more pathetic that the playerbase has been filled to the brim with weak and spineless sheep that that shackle themselves with such meaningless rules and convention.
Here's the thing - like it or not, every game we're ranked and judged. You might call it it meaningless and that's your choice. But how you feel about it has no bearing on the fact we're still judged by the system.
Some people play to that system and will do what it takes to rank. Deal with it.
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And people like you is why I thank the Devs they haven't introduced Rank Rewards. Desperation in killers like yourself will add to that toxicity that's already plaguing this game because you obviously do not care for the health state of the game in regards to viewing it from both sides.
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And I'm glad you're not in charge or we'll all be getting participation ribbons like you did in kiddie soccer!
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I wonder how many gallons of sweat you produce after a match. Holy Jeez, the amount of sweat reeking from your statement.
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You know me bro. I agree with you 100%
You can't fix tunneling without changing the entire core game mechanic. Chastising other players for tunneling is about as meaningful as complaining about campers in CoD.
You can either whine, or you can get better and stop getting killed.
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Im flattered to be considered a professional.
In my case, I intentionally go my way out to avoid tunnelling people off the hook, even though it costs me the match sometimes. At most, I will simply leave them on the ground. But thats just because of my really empathetic nature (as arrogant as that sounds). However, I can perfectly and fully understand others doing it, whether its a match Im not in, a Survivor on my team or myself.
Tunnelling is with no doubt the most effective way to ensure a victory sometimes. Being down to 3 Survivors really helps. Way easier to keep people away from objectives and apply pressure. It is in no way "sweaty", "tryhard", "desparate" or "a baby Killer tactic". It is simply playing optimally. When people call people tunnelling this, it is usually just out of frustration.
I have said this before, but, if Survivors dont care about the Killer's fun (nor they should), likewise Killers should not either. (Toxicity is something else entirely, doesnt apply to this rule, just to clarify.)
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Except you respawn if you get killed by a camper in COD and you don't get executed from the game. I mean, you do in Search and Destroy but not in TDM.
In COD you have more chances to better your gameplay within a span of 10 minutes. There are no similarities.
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So you just want to know if other people tunnel and why?
I generally don't tunnel. However, there are a lot of times survivors will call tunneling when it's really not tunneling.
Ignoring all other survivors and waiting at the hook to go right back into the same guy is tunneling.
Completely leaving a hook but you just happen to run into the same survivor again isn't tunneling. Killers work on pressure and tempo, they can't afford to just ignore a guy they run into because it just happen to be the same guy.
Also, a lot of weaker killers are forced to tunnel if they actually want to win. If you're playing an M1 killer and the survivors are actually good red ranks you can't afford to play the "fun" way.
While it's not fun when I get tunneled off the hook, if it's say something like a trapper or wraith, I really can't blame them. If the devs made the weaker killers stronger they wouldn't have to play that way.
This is why I say if the devs actually properly balanced the game tunneling and camping would go way down. Some people do it to be toxic, but the majority of killers do it because they feel like they're backed into a corner and have no other options left.
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Did you want a cookie for being nice in a video game? You're an asset to us all in DbD cause you don't tunnel. Just kidding, teasing you.
For the record, I enjoy being tunneled. It's called a challenge. Nice killers that give chances are lame af honestly imo, I don't like a boring game where the killer intentionally leaves me. A killer should be opportunistic at all times.
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The sheer saltiness of your comments outweighs whatever sweat you perceive Monsieur @FrenziedRoach to have. I've seen your comments and you are no better then what you are trying to accuse him of.
@CallMeSpidey Why am I not surprised that you are here saying the things you say, shesh, I try not to bother writing a post to you but I am bored so here I am. Calling players who tunnel 'Desperate' is the worst (and most pathetic) kind of argument that makes you look desperate for any foothold in a argument. The way you write things makes you seem so one dimensional and extremely biased. I probably shouldn't bother trying to write to you, you'd just miss my points anyways.
As for you @Masantonio, Tunneling is just another term for a killer doing their job. I encourage 'tunneling' when it is done to finish the game as fast as possible. I DO NOT encourage tunneling out of malicious intent or for petty reasons.
For example of (my opinion) a valid 'tunnel': You return to the hook after someone is saved, and you only see the unhooked person. So might as well take em' out.
For a example of a unreasonable tunnel: You chase the person who was unhooked and completely ignore someone who is trying to offer themselves up to be hooked in place of the unhooke.
I hope this helps you understand my stance on this subject, Masantonio.
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Ah yes, "Sweaty" is the new term you kids are using for "Try Hard" I guess?
Let me clue you in on a very old proverb
"If you aren't playing to win, why keep score?"
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I was gonna make a Long Thread about this but there are already so many . So Here ..
Not every Killer Camps / tunnels for a Reason Because I've seen many Who camped the very first Survivor with Ruin . Plenty of killers do it .. Why ?
Simple because they suck and that's the only way they could secure a few kills or win . And Sadly the Devs are encouraging this even more intentionally or not .. By Removing the viability of Hook Sabo , and Keep making it Harder for Survivors time after another like they discussed in the stream about loops and map Re-work . I do agree with that . But they look at one side and ignore the other . Just sad
Then when Survivors Complain . They bring Game Breaking Perks like DS / MoM .. never used them never will .
But with all this Camping / Tunneling I get game after game i find myself forced in that Direction so I might just go with them even i dislike these perks
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Why is it desperation to choose the path of least resistance to win in a pvp game? That's what this game is. I think it's toxic to look at the mechanics of a game, say "nah, here's how it should actually go", and then shame people in a postgame chat for not conforming to made up rules. I can't think of another game that I've played where instead of playing a different game, people just expect players to play under an alternate set of rules as if that's the gold standard and playing within the devs framework is seen as toxic.
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Because they're taking you seriously as an opponent. Players who don't go all out aren't taking you seriously as an opponent; it's like fighting a guy with two hands behind your back because you know he's #########.
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I'm not going to say you're wrong, because you aren't.
It's disrespectful imo to blatantly go for the easiest tactic in which the Survivor can be helpless in. Immediately downing them after an unhook and ignoring other Survivors for one Survivor is just a dick move, it's not against any rules, it's not about the health of the game, but it's more just of how disrespectful it is. It's scummy to ignore other people for one survivor, or to keep hooking them immediately after unhooks until their dead because let's be honest,
it takes no skill.I know everyone's going to downvote this post and degrade it, but It just shows to me you aren't willing to get good via less easier tactics and if you continue doing so, what Survivor is going to play this game anymore if that's all that happens to them?
With that being said, go tunnel and camp your way to victory if you so please. There's no rules against it, nor should there be. You'll just be an ass hole nobody likes to play with. Facts.
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This is like someone who whines about someone playing a top tier character to win in a fighting game tournament. Is it disrespectful to use Marth while your opponent uses Bowser Jr?.
No, you're playing to win. Players getting salty and feeling "disrespected" over a player simply trying to win are the real toxic ones. I don't care what my opponents think of me. It's the ######### internet. You passing judgment over how someone plays a game is toxic af.
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Holy dude take a chill pill. I never said it wasn't allowed or that you shouldn't do it.
You're so opinionated but you disregard so much. It IS disrespectful, and that's something that's subjective not objective. You clearly don't know the difference.
I'm not even going to argue my case with you. You're incapable of real discussions.
Also, your analogy makes no sense.
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Great proverb. People who don't play to win shouldn't complain about losing.
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Let me be clear on something - tunneling is not something I seek out and do. I prefer to leave the hook and find somebody else to chase.
BUT - if another survivor has so little respect for his teammate as to do an unsafe hook, you bet I'm going to punish his behavior with the tunnel because it destroys the rescuers score, puts me in a better position, and teaches the team I'm not going to tolerate it.
I would like nothing more than to walk away from a hook and chase somebody else. But if you don't let me walk more than 10 steps away, that ######### tunnel is going to happen - don't be a braindead idiot who rescues in such a stupid manner!
it takes 2 minutes for somebody to fully die on a hook, that's 1 minute per stage. You have PLENTY OF TIME TO MAKE SURE THE COAST IS CLEAR.
This is why I referred to somebody above as sheep - because only a sheep mindlessly walks to the slaughter and takes his teammate with him with such stupid and brain-dead moves.
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So in a nutshell... you don't want a tunnel? TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR YOUR RESCUES
That means
- The rescuer should be ready to throw themselves in the killer's way if they miscalculate and the killer is nearby.
- The victim needs to be ready to make themselves scarce and disappear. Because if bleeding prey runs out in front of a hungry wolf, it's going to be the wolves nature to bite you.
Anotherwords, GET GOOD
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Um, I am chill? What lol I just disagreed with you mate. Is it cause I said #########? You said ######### to bro. I'm just saying, it's the internet lol.
How is my analogy bad? Tunneling is exactly like doing something like picking a top tier, or making a counter pick in a fighting game tournament. You're doing something that is going to win you the match.
It's hilarious how unhumble you are in gaming. You'd get tunneled and say the guy is disrespectful and never play with him again. While in SF4, Infiltration threw PR Balrog 5 times in a row, and teabagged all apart of a plan to tilt PR and throw his gameplan off. What'd they do afterwards?
They shook hands and smiled, because they know, at the end of the day, it's a game and they aren't going to pass judgment on one another for simply going for victory. Good ad hominem btw. It's much easier to just say I lack the intelligence to argue, than to just come up with a reasonable rebuttal.
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B-But killers shouldn't t-tunnel. It's against t-the rules :<
I don't like getting tunneled either, half the reasons why I just knock down the person who just got unhooked if I can't find the rescuer. But there is no sense in complaining about it, people get unlucky.
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Thats actually a very important point. Its rare to see someone actually protecting the unhookee unless the gates are open.
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Nah bro it's disrespectful. You're not a good person unless you let them heal man.
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Agreed and get ready for the downvotes from Rank 20 killers who also want DS removed.
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@ReneAensland Wow, unless you are trolling, you are desperately reaching for straws there mate. Pls say sike
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So is it ok if I destroy your stupid logic by saying I'm a Rank 1 Survivor that invites any killer that wants to tunnel me to do just that?
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Again, saying tunneling is or isn't disrespect is a subjective topic. You are showing you don't know what that means.
It means, it comes down to an opinion. And you are just blatantly disregarding mine because of your own. So yes, you are incapable of a real discussion.
I think tunneling is disrespectful because it's usually in situations where the Survivor is completely helpless and immobile. I.e immediately after an unhook, from the basement, etc. There are other players in the game, and people seem to forget that. So do I think it's disrespectful to take advantage of a player that by no means has the ability to counter play in certain situations? A teammate farms me, I play solo, and the Killer instead of going for the unhooker who could've been easily more punished, decides to go for the easier path and immediately downs me once the unhook animation is done. Yes. Are we all going to agree upon that opinion? No, because it's an opinion. A subjective one.
Do I think it's a dick move to follow a Survivor around for 5 generators, never give up, ignore other Survivors mid chase just because they want that Survivor dead? Of course, there are other players in the game, again. Is that another subjective opinion? Of course.
Do I want to play with someone who's a complete dick in the game? No, why would I? It's unfun. Not that it'll stop me from playing, but when it happens a few times in a row I'm obviously going to take a break from the game and play something else more enjoyable. It's like talking to someone who is just calling you rude names during a conversation. Why would I continue to talk to you if you're rude? It's unenjoyable.
Your assumptions of how I act ingame without any evidence showing of how I do is irritating and your lack of real discussions is more evident than you'd like to see.
You seem to disregard the part where I said, go ahead and tunnel and camp your way to victory. My subjective opinion is not supposed to change how anyone plays. And I will not continue any further discussion until you understand that.
As for the Smash Bros analogy, it really isn't the same. I don't understand how picking a top tier character against a bottom tier is equivalent to tunneling and camping because Smash Bros requires skill at any level of play regardless of Top Tiers or Bottom Tiers. We all know watching your first hook die or just farming someone off of their hooks isn't skill. It's just an easy way to secure kills, which I'll say one more ######### time, is allowed and I have no problem with them doing so. I'm allowed to think it's disrespectful to do so, and the OP asked for opinions.
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lol yeah right, to appeal to the low end of the totem pole killers?
Hell no, you tunnel you're trash.
You camp? You're trash. It's why it's such a controversial topic.
The crap killers do it, and you can all make excuses on "iTs a coMpeTitIvE gAme aNd wE hAve tO eLimiNate thE opPonEnt."
At the expense of everyone's experience.
You can be GOOD and not tunnel, or be complete trash/desperate and tunnel.
Learn some skill, it's not hard. It's easy taking the easy route and go for the person who just got unhooked, give them a crap experience, but there's a challenge when you go for the person who unhooked. Why are you afraid of another chase? "iM oN a TiMe cruNch bEcauSe Im geTtinG geN ruSheD" well that's your fault. Don't take it out on the person who just got unhooked, that's just sad.
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I just chase/hit whoever I see first crossing my path.
Then I hook and leave.
And I continue chasing/hitting whoever I see first crossing my path, be it the gen jockey, the runner, the unhooker or the unhooked.
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That's a lot more respectable than "I go for the unhooked."
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I'm sorry, and you are?
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It sounds like a poorly programmed bot.
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lolwut
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I completely understand what subjective means homie. The reason I say it isn't disrespectful is because it's a video game, it's art. There isn't a way to be truly disrespectful outside of the end game chat.
However, YOU taking these things as disrespectful is something you choose to do. You getting offended by saying you were "disrespected" is fine, feel however you want to feel. But taking something in a video game at a personal level, honestly, is quite pointless. It isn't going to change how the game is played, and the entire argument is made null when you tell people they can play how they want. So, you'll still be disrespected, even though they aren't meaning to be disrespectful, just playing to win?
The main point I'm arguing is that this whole argument is really pointless and dumb in the first place. Call that disregarding your opinion if you want. I hear what you're saying. But it's actually pointless mate.
You comparing it to someone being rude is actually a bad point. Someone being rude is INTENDING to disrespect you. Someone playing a VIDEO GAME to win isn't being disrespectful. You are TAKING it in a disrespectful manner because you are mad at the way they play the game. There is a huge distinct difference in your analogy, and the fact you can't see this line means you take video game actions on a personal level. That is a problem, just pointing that out. A conversation is on a personal level. A dude camping me on a hook is just trying to win. Annoying yea, but whatever, he's a player trying to win. I could give two shits less about feeling disrespected. As long as he says gg at the end of the game I'll know he was playing legit and not specifically TRYING to make me angry. This is the main difference in being disrespected and being trounced utterly in a video game.
It's like when my buddy plays Villager. He makes me mad as #########. But I keep playing him even though it isn't that fun always. Because it's fun to beat him when I do, and he's a great player.
And sorry, but I will always say the Killer already proved his skill when he downed you and hooked you in the first place. This isn't a team game where people are required to help you. At the end of the day, if you die, it's your own fault and you have no one else to blame for being on that hook other than yourself.
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