Love the new GF changes but ...
His power is still fully countered by detection perks. You can so is every other stealth killer but there is a catch.
Every other stealth killer has some other benefit from their power. Wraith gets slight map control + speed burst, piggy has traps and dash attack, michael can instadown. GF's all benefits come directly from his Night shround and one perk shouldn't disable 100% of killers power (old trapper's traps vs sabotage for example) so he needs to have immunity to detection perks while it's active.
I think that this is his last main problem and that it's a very needed change so please give GF detection perks immunity while Night shroud is active like Michael's tier 1 has.
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100% agree
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Agree
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Yes.
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They are aware of the detection perk issues from what I've heard.
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GF should just be immune to OoO, that would be enough imo. Only a very few amount of players use Spine Chill or Premonition and that perk alone does not counter his ability yet.
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Agreed. Object of Obsession shouldn't show a killer's aura if they have 0 terror radius. Period. Spine Chill on the other hand specifically states that it defeats killer's stealth abilities, but it doesn't give away the exact position of the killer and it has a cooldown. Considering that it is fairly rarely used, doesn't give the killer's exact location, and has a cooldown, I think it is fair.
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Yes I also think that OoO is the main problem but overall it would be weird to make OoO not work while making other detection perks work. Still even then spine chill and premo counter his power far too hard and he isn't even that strong to begin with.
I think that eyes should be only real counter to Night shround and any detection perk revealing killer so dependant on hiding his presence is just bad design.
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Decetion itself doesnt disable the power from workling but yea.
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I agree with this. Detection perks shouldn't be able to pick up on him.
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I think a middle ground where survivors can't read his Aura while in Night Shroud would be a better place to start. This would prevent him from being too weak to OoO and some other perks; but it wouldn't make him completely immune to things imo he shouldn't be.
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This sounds like good trade off to me. If nothing more at least this has to happen.
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I checked just now, and damn...
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What have you heard
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I would not compare Michael to Ghost Face. If Michael would not be immune to Detection Perks, he will have a hard time getting out of EW1, which renders him useless.
I think the Ghost Face changes should be fine as they are. In the end, People will only use Perks like Spine Chill on the PTB, but not on live, just because of Ghost Face.
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There are a lot of good loopers on live who use OoO which is the main problem perk that counters Night shroud the hardest. As was said above the least that need to happen is give GF aura detection immunity while Night shroud is active otherwise he's 100% countered and has no power against these good loopers.
And we all know how well do M1 powerless killers do against looping.
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Yeah let's just create another nurse with no counterplay or anything, great ideas in this thread.. let's make MORE survivor perks useless.
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XD
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One Killer being immune to them doesn't make them useless.
Way to create a false narrative.
Recall that Ruin and BBQ are pretty much the only worthwhile Killer perks.
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Did you see in the thread that they didn't even mention the fact that hooked and downed survivors can still pull you from night shroud, so what they're just gonna keep that around? Also I think that 1.5 seconds is still too short to detect you this should receive another buff.
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"No counterplay" only if you lack eyes. Also nurse has counterplay but you probably don't care or don't know any better then mindless looping.
And it seems that you're fine with GF's power is 100% countered by 1 single survivor perk. Those perks not beiing meta doesn't mean nobody uses them. I personally love spine chill and run it frequently in my stealth builds since it's amazing for stealth and even has mindgaming potencial. Unfortunately most of survivors would just rather get broken 0 counterplay perks like old DS or free instaheals with old MoM.
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Yeah that's probably staying but even when it's annoying I don't mind it that much.
Also Peanits said that full time of revealing is about 1,8s I think. With all those other changes it's probably fine since you should also get notification that you're beiing revealed so let's just test it and see if it's still not enough.
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More folks use Spine Chill or Premonition than you'd like to believe. I use it quite often to great effect, especially when I opt for stealth builds (as plenty of folks often do). As the OP mentioned, detection perks like these don't only disrupt GF... they completely neuter him. I'd recommend making Night Shroud react to such perks in the same way Evil Within 1 does. If it makes him OP as the doomsayers are preaching, roll it back. Even if they make it to where Night Shroud has a proximity limit for detection perks, that would still be a middle-ground step in the right direction.
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Last week - Peanits made a post on a Ghostface thread where he listed off all the known issues he had at the time, and one of them was detection perks. He said he would pass it along to the team. Also, pretty much every issue on that list has been addressed with the new GF changes . I believe someone else said Peanits specifically pointed out object of obsession in relation to the matter.
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I also think hooked survivors shouldn’t take him out of stealth.
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The changes are nice, but i still think Object will just be run all the time to troll him.
rendering him unable to do the main thing Behaviour set out for him to do, scare people and get the drop on them.
At least partial immunity would be great for some uncertainty
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Time for the detection perk CRUSADE!!!
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This should happen, devs please make it happen.
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I don't see it being a problem outside of the PTB. How often do you see survivor running OoO, Dark Sense, Spine Chill and Premonition? Even if people will use those perks more, why is that an issue? I thought everyone was sick of the same meta to begin with.
And why can't perks counter Killer powers? Exhaustion perks counter all M1 killers, Small Game counters Trapper and Urban Evasion counters Hag.
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Comparing this to Sprint Burst is hilarious. Sprint Burst has a cooldown that lasts 60 seconds and doesn't cooldown while sprinting. Trapper can use Hangman's Trick to nullify Small Game somewhat by making it so he only has to wait 60 seconds for traps. Urban Evasion prevents a Survivor from Sprinting, so even if they crouch over your trap, you gain distance on them. If you aren't in a chase, you'll never even notice the effects of Urban Evasion as Hag.
OoO completely nullifies Ghostface's power 100% by just looking at him through a wall. There is 0 he can do to counter this.
How are you even making this comparison? Did you even think before you posted?
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You are suggesting that people use Hangman's Trick to counter Small Game. "How are you even making this comparison? Did you even think before you posted?"
He can go and use his 115% ms to down the survivor that uses OoO. OoO has way more of a downside than Urban Evasion does against Hag.
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I'm suggesting that if you're playing Trapper, Hangman's is a good idea in general, making Small Game and irrelevant problem. Not to mention a Survivor focused on trap sabo isn't doing gens.
He still can't use his power and will end up getting looped regardless because his power isn't useful in a chase. Meaning he still can't play how he's supposed to.
You just want to hold on to your skilless counter.
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Hangman's Trick is never a good idea because almost no one uses Small Game. A survivor focused on harassing Ghost Face with OoO is not doing gens either. Trappers don't run Hangman's Trick. No one runs Hangman's Trick. I get it, you want to be a contrarian, but can you please listen to yourself?
And Trapper and Hag will end up getting looped too, who both have hard counters.
I don't use OoO and I just think your arguments suck. Considering how fast you turn to personal attacks, I'm not surprised.
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If you aren't getting use out of the Trapper's bear traps in chases, then you need to work on your trap placements. Half the point of the killer is to herd people into your mines.
Also, a good Trapper probably doesn't run Hangman's Trick. Sabo is almost a non-issue now that traps respawn.
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The point is a hard counter for Small Game exists in Hangman's. A Survivor using OoO on GF could still be sitting on a generator nearby repairing it while keeping an eye on him. Two for one.
Whether or not you think my arguments suck is irrelevant. The fact of the matter is the other scenarios have clear counters that exist. GF only counter is to do the thing he's supposed to do anyway. OoO is an obvious bait anyway as that person is usually the most skilled looper.
That's not a counter.
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In saying that though, ghost has normal speed in chase and has his final power (not tiers) at any time (in theory) (plus increased crouch speed now), Myers T1 has decreased movement speed and decreased lunge, that makes ghost more similar to pig in this aspect of being detected.
That's probably why they didn't initially give immunity to detection perks to him but in any case I do kind of hope they change it. Especially since his counter is being seen where Michael does not have this counter and making ghost immune while in stealth would make him a lot more creepy/threatening in matches or at the very least as Redd suggested earlier: (added below for context, see above for full comment)
"Survivors can't read his Aura while in Night Shroud. This would prevent him from being too weak to OoO and some other perks; but it wouldn't make him completely immune to things imo he shouldn't be."
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A survivor following a trapper around and disarming traps with Small Game isn't countered by Hangman's Trick. A survivor with Small Game could be repairing a nearby generator while keeping an eye on his trap placement.
Lol? "The fact of the matter"? You did not establish that at all.
What counter do you need for people that intentionally reveal themselves? Why not use Rancor?
This is the last post I will be entertaining you with. If you are fine with hard counters shutting down certain killers and not others, you should reevaluate your standards for balance.
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Either way, Small Game doesn't 100% nullify Trapper, and Hangman's nullifies the effects of it so you can get your traps sooner. Small Game doesn't prevent a Survivor from being forced into a trap you set up that they missed due to Small Game cooldown, or going down a bad path and getting hit.
Actually that was my entire point if you read the post I initially replied. I specified counters for all of the perks you mentioned, and made it a point GF has no counter to OoO. Sorry that you have to have someone literally spell out their point for you, you arent able to infer it from reading. Which is why you started deflecting by saying "you're suggesting people use Hangman's on Trapper?" No, no I never suggested that at all. I'm simply pointing out a possible counter. Stay on target kid.
I doubt this will be the last cause I doubt you'll resist the urge to try and be cheeky again by sarcastically trying to use my own argument against me.
Again, they aren't hard counters because they don't 100% nullify the power like OoO does. If you can't see this, you should reevaluate your knowledge in game design.
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You're saying that exhaustion perks counter all M1 killers but that isn't true. They are situational and very strong depending on circumstances but they don't have direct impacnt on if your power can be used or not.
As for small game and urban, they also don't directly counter Hag's and Trapper's powers. They give you small edge when you face them but running urban doesn't magicly make you immune to triggering hag's traps so it's not a counter. Same with traps, you can still run into them while in a chase or miss them by accident.
There are many good loopers running OoO on high ranks and it would be nightmare to face them without any power as M1 killer. GF's power doesn't have any other benefit like pig or myers has except stealth and he's fully dependant on survivors not knowing where he is if otherwise he can never use his power. Old sabotage used to fully and permanently disable trapper's traps and they would never came back. That was a counter and it's happening again today with GF and OoO. You won't be able to use your power as long as there is someone constantly harrasing you whenever you want to use it and if they are good at looping you won't be even able to catch them before most of the gens are done.
Imagine if devs added new killer with strong chase power and he would also have side power that causes his terror radius to disable exhaustion perks. Survivors would go freaking crazy since it would be unfair counter to their perks whenever they face him.
He needs some form of protection against OoO or even all other detection perks. He's far to reliant on his power to have it that easily disabled.
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+1000000
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