Killers get to keep instadown (noed) since forever but survivors lose their perk after a few months
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the EQUIVALENT LOL
Where is Adrenaline the eq of NOED?
To trigger you have to do all 5 gens and you have to survive until then. Noed is just: Im afk for 5 minutes and get a insta down + movement speed.
Adrenaline requieres that you did everything as survivor, noed nothing. Adrenalines counterplay is it to kill survivors before they win. That's the trick ;)
Noeds counterplay is "survivor have to do another objective, 5 times"
Sorry mate but you can leave now because obviously your opinion is crap at this point. Sry for that <3
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And yet, you completely ignore my comment above yours equating the firing of NOED as a failure on the survivors part.
Interesting.
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another one of these...
let the Doc give you some advice for dealing with NOED:
that should solve all your NOED problems :)
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NOED shouldnt exist as a reward for doing nothing. Thats the point why killers always complain about new survivors perk to get them trashed (like MoM or DS). Double standards on high level.
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Wrong. I solo queue at high ranks exclusively and I cleanse the hell out of totems. I used to run Detective's Hunch to find them but now even that isn't necessary.
If we make it to end game and the killer has NOED then me and the other survivors failed, plain and simple.
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NOED has PLENTY of counterplay.
DS or MoM hadnt. so they needed to be changed.
thats how easy it is.
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@MegsAreEvil what´s really funny, are survivors double standards.
Hatch = totally fair and deserved.
NOED = a reward for doing nothing.
/facepalm
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You basically repeated me, so of course I agree. The only thing wrong with your examples are NOED and an open gate. NOED procs before the gates are opened, therefore survivors do have "fear" as you put it as they have to get the gates open without being one shot downed first. Otherwise, I agree, Adrenaline is NOT a counter to NOED, that was my whole point earlier, nor is it equivalent.
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@Tsulan my point was the two perks aren't a one to one trade like people say they are. While I don't personally care for Noed, I don't have a problem with it.
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Once genrush is fixed i might agree on a NOED nerf but right now it's a fair perk
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You’re acting like adrenaline is compared to NOED even In the slightest. Adrenaline is a perk that affects one person and is a gift for doing good and completing the gens. PLUS you get exhausted AND sometimes you’re already full health so it’s pointless besides the speed boost. But NOED affects the entire team just because the killer was doing bad and couldn’t kill the survivors. It doesn’t matter that you can take out NOED it’s still an OP perk. It shouldn’t be used because a killer couldn’t kill. There should be some requirements like you have to Hook survivors at least 5 or 6 times or something.
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NOED is a failure on the part of the survivors to make sure all the totems are down.
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I think when comparing killer perks and survivor perks, you need to acknowledge that survivor perks have the potential to be used 4x times ie. If all survivors equipped it whereas killer has 1. It is 16 perks against 4 so if 1 or 2 perks are powerful, it will definitely have an effect.
A killer running noed is still only running one perk and can be countered fairly easily since 4 survivors can work together to make the perk useless. A killer shouldn't be demonized because the group of survivors didn't priorities countering noed, if it was pre-patch noed I would understand since there was no counterplay but now there is.
The same can not be said the other way round, if all 4 survivors used pre-patch mom or pre-patch ds etc. That one killer has to simply power through those perks and is robbed each time due to a lack of counterplay. It wasn't unusual for killers to be bullied due to this.
So pre-patch ds and mom got the same treatment as pre-patch noed so as far as I'm concerned they are all in a good place right now.
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Except you’re wrong. First off survivors do feel fear when opening a gate if it’s not close to opening because the killer is most likely going to get a hit or 2 off on them if they see them. Second, the survivors did all that hard work so why get punished THAT hard? And “adrenaline kicks in when the killer closes the hatch which now means slugging for the 4k is the preemptive counter to adrenaline” but if the killer closes the hatch then the speed boost on adrenaline isn’t so useful. Most people run self care so their most likely to be at full health already since the killer went and closed the hatch and wasn’t chasing the survivor. And now the killer can patrol the doors which is very easy to get 2 hits off on somebody especially when they are the last person alive.
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oh sorry is the objective of the game to do the totems to open the doors?
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No but don't complain about the consequences for not doing the totems.
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Totems and NOED/Hexes are their way of trying for a second objective. To see if it may be feasible in the future, which is why they are loosely based on survival.
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Blame that on team incompetence, noed never procs if the team does all of the objectives. Killer has no say in whether it activates, they're just hoping it does or that it wasn't needed.
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You’re right, it really needs to go. Cleansing even one totem is too hard!
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Do you want NOED? Because not doing totems is how you get NOED.
FFS, people have been whining survivors need another objective. Well congradulations, a killer with NOED just gave you a new optional objective.
Now do that objective and quit your whinin'.
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@HURRI_KAIN Sorry, I was trying to reply to both you and someone else in one reply, so I guess it came off strange. I just wanted to get it all said in one go. I apologize.
@ZacKskills I didn't say survivors feel no fear when opening a gate. I said they feel no fear when running towards an already open gate. There's a difference. Watch uninjured survivors body block for an injured survivor in an exit gate, they have no fear of dying. Hooking a survivor during the end game is stressful, with BT and DS and exhaustion perks and (even though it's been nerfed and a lot less likely to be seen) MoM that all help an unhooked survivor reach that open exit gate. BT, DS, Dead Hard, and MoM can all counter NOED. Cleansing totems counters NOED. NOED counters Adrenaline and an open exit gate.
Next, the survivors are being punished for not cleansing totems. Everyone's always talking about a second objective. The whole point of a second objective would be to give killers a bit of breathing room, especially killers like Trapper, Hag, and Myers who need setup time. Right now, cleansing totems is the only secondary objective survivors have.
Killers get punished for tunneling by DS and BT. They're just trying to do their objective, which is sacrifice survivors in the most efficient way possible. Should they be punished that hard? Well, it sucks to be tunneled as a survivor, it's not fun, so the game uses perks to encourage a certain playstyle from killers. Survivors get punished for rushing through gens and ignoring totems by NOED. They're just trying to do their objective, which is finish the gens and escape. Should they be punished that hard? Well, as a killer it sucks for gens to get completed super fast and have no time to do anything, it's not fun, so the game uses a perk to encourage a certain playstyle from survivors.
DbD uses perks to fix problems instead of working on the core game mechanics. That's well known. That's part of what we're seeing here.
Often, killers run either Ruin or NOED. Ruin slows down gen repair from the beginning and encourages survivors to look for the hex totem. I see a lot of survivors complain about how Ruin is no fun. Other killers forego Ruin for NOED, which instead of slowing the game down from the start punishes survivors if they don't slow themselves down and cleanse totems. Survivors complain about NOED, too. If killers have neither, then a lot of them just get gen rushed to crap because survivors only have the one objective.
I don't run Ruin or NOED, because I'd rather run other perks. When the gens go too fast, I sometimes just give up and go wait at an exit gate so I can open it, because I don't really care and just play to screw around; if survivors prefer playing a gen repair SIM where all they do is hold M1, I'm not going to force them to stick around and interact with me. I've never gotten a complaint, so I assume survivors prefer my way of playing to Ruin and NOED.
I hate NOED as a survivor. I hate cleansing four dull totems and then getting sac'd on my first hook because NOED still proc'd. It sucks. But I understand why it's in the game. I think it would be better if the problems NOED is there to fix were handled in a better way, but until then, NOED is what we have. And if and when NOED goes, Adrenaline still needs to go, too.
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if you're spending all game cleansing totems against a competent killer in solo queue you're probably losing the game
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It doesn’t take that long.
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looking for 5 totems around increasingly large maps does take a very long time, especially on maps like swamp that have obscure totem locations
in a solo queue game with questionable teammates against a decent killer you simply aren't going to have that time
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If every survivor does a totem when they see one, noed would take care of it self. I get that you can have incompetent teammates but the killer shouldn't be punished for it. There are also perks and items that can speed up the process of looking for totems such as small game or a map etc. If a perk has counterplay than it is ok and it goes for all perks whether it belongs to killer or survivor.
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No. It's called "destroy all the Dull Totems since they changed it too affect ranking score" and why would they balance the game for bad survivors when the survivors should just learn how the game works and get better? MoM had 0 counterplay, while noed does if you aren't lazy. If you have trouble finding totems, run Small Game or Detectives Hunch too counter.
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Noed has been reworked, like, 8 times now. It's pretty much a requirement at red ranks since everyone gen rushes. Even Tru3 and Monto get gen rushed if they don't bring ruin (and sometimes even then they still do) so Noed is a solid counter too it. Bring Bloodwarden and you got yourself an endgame build.
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IMO they are both kinda braindead, but both have uses.
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8 times and its still too strong.
It needs to get completely reworked as another perk that don't instadown.
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How is it too strong when there are multiple counterplays?
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solo queue isn't coordinated, by definition. a killer who applies pressure properly won't give you time to go looking for totems, and it becomes even harder when none of you know how many totems have been done
i'm not saying noed is overpowered (i mean, i don't think it should give both a speed boost and an instadown; it should probably just give the instadown), or that it's uncounterable, i'm just saying "cleanse the totems" is a poor argument for solo queue players. i actually think it's a better idea to take note of where totems are as you run around, and then if noed procs, go look for those totems you saw and see if one is lit
items and perks aren't a good argument either. telling people to bring items or perks to take care of a perk that may or may not even be in the game isn't really reasonable
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No, its not. If you can't be bothered too cleanse 5 totems, then you know the risk you take. If you are struggling too find or remember Totem placements, then use Small Game or Detectives Hunch.
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Only a handful of killers can apply pressure to all the survivors, the rest not so much. If that was the case you wouldn't be able to do gens let alone totems. Apart from hex totems, the killer does not know the locations of totems so is less likely to find you on a totem than a gen.
It is a perk that can be countered without the use of perks but they help alot. The main reason noed is so effective is purely because of incompetent survivors.
Just as you mentioned you can take note of a few totems, cleanse the rest then come back end game to check the remaining totems.
The whole "cleanse totems" or "use perks" are examples for the argument. The argument is simply that it can be countered and that reason alone is what makes the perk ok.
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Neither one is a poor argument, they are very valid. Every game you know their are 5 totems, and you know every game their may be Noed. And bringing perks and addons for "just in case" is what this games about. I don't expect Trapper too always bring Hangmans trick, but if you see 2-3 Jake's with toolboxes, it's probably not a bad idea. Not all killers run aura perks, but bringing Distortion just in case they do could save your life.
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my argument is that it cannot feasibly be countered in normal solo queue games, and not being able to cleanse 5 scattered totems around a large map while also doing gens, going for saves and getting chased isn't a sign of incompetence, it's a sign of competence on the part of the killer. any killer, even without the top 3-4 killers, can spread pressure to the point of necessitating staying on gens. looking for and cleansing 5 totems wastes a tremendous amount of time and people (largely killer mains) really love to underplay it in order to highlight how "counterable" noed is, ignoring whether or not people are generally in any position to counter it. it's a hypothetical counter at most
@BunnyTheHutt they are poor arguments. every game you know there may be a spirit, that doesn't mean you should have to bring iron will. every game you know there may be a nurse, that doesn't mean you should have to throw a lery's offering. perks (and everything else) should be counterable with gameplay, not other perks and items, so "use x item" or "use x perk" isn't really fair, especially for newer players who may not have maps or small game on their characters
"cleanse the totems" is a legitimate counter to noed, it's just up for debate whether or not people can reasonably expected to get 5 totems in a game that isn't extremely one sided since looking for 5 totems as a solo queue player takes up a huge chunk of time. someone looking for totems isn't doing anything else, and if everyone's looking for totems to counter noed then gen progress slows to a crawl
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Until doing gens AND destroying totems are the way to open doors, totems are Not the objective.
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All I said that it was an experiment for them to maybe implement second objective in the future. If survivors could handle cleansing totems, than a second objective could be installed. I never said they were the objective or even an objective. It is an attempt. But misinterpret all you want.
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This is a giant load of crap. The "easiest to counter perk" lmao you ever heard of Devour hope?
Noed is the safest hex perk by a mile and a half and considering its status isn't contingent on the killer playing well, they did nothing to deserve it. It's only contingent on survivor action, which makes it a crutch perk. It's there for bad killers and bad players.
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The safest hex perk is still a hex perk and thus can be countered therefore does not need to be nerfed.
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I like the thought that it doesn't reward the Killer for failure.
Rather, it punishes survivors for not doing totems. Even dull totems give a little bit of ranking now. Just because you don't know how many totems are up doesn't mean you shouldnt cleanse the ones you do come across.
Or memorize their locations so that you can easily defeat NOED if it actually becomes a threat.
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Before complaining after having read what I want to say, read the list of changes: https://deadbydaylight.gamepedia.com/Hex:NoOne_Escapes_Death
As you can see, devs wanted to make NOED a balanced perk and they achieved that. It's left in its current state because:
- It can be countered by spending a few more minutes in the trial to cleanse all the totems and prevent it from activating. You even have Detective's Hunch and defaultly Small Game to help you out
- You can immerse to not start a chase and be somewhat exempt from its effects
- There are more reliable perks for killers that are not only a bandage for you in case of coming across a team not caring about cleansing totems
And I'm not a killer main to defend it. I play both sides equally and although it sometimes annoys me, I don't cry for nerfs
To sum up, thanks for making my day!
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You simply don't seem to understand that giving survivors LESS to do is not a positive change for the game.
Gen speed is one of, if not THE biggest issue in the game right now. NOED is a threat so that you commit time to doing totems so that the game is slowed down.
It's the same reason that MoM was nerfed, adding extra hits on every survivor for free was game-breaking because it meant there was so much time bought to just keep doing gens.
You keep saying it should be nerfed so that you don't have to waste your time doing totems, but that's exactly the point, you SHOULD be making sure totems get done.
Generators are the only objective required to power the gate, they are not your only objective to secure a safe escape. Gens, unhooks, heals, and totems are all "objectives" in the game, even if they don't specifically give you "objective" bloodpoints.
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This games mainly about mindgames, so yea sometimes you will use a perk that doesn't have a real impact, but you use it for a just in case. And I usually get 2-3 totems as a survivor at green ranks, so it's reasonable. Even if a killer is putting down pressure, they can't be on all of you at once (at least they shouldn't) and totems take only 10-15 seconds. not including the time too find them, you would spend less time too cleanse them all then you would on 1 gen. And again, if you have trouble finding totems, using a perk too find them would make it faster.
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Your argument that the killers pressure is stopping you from doing totems is not a strong one. There are 4 survivors and at least 1 of them can do a totem when they come across them. Your argument only holds in the scenario that you are expected to cleanse all 5 totems while your teammates do nothing which can happen in solo q but that isn't the perks fault.
There is barely any pressure from the killer at the start of the game so you can usually get a free totem there, if ruin is being used, that will eventually go anyway which already leaves behind 3 totems. I wasn't saying that getting chased and doing gens is incompetent of survivors but rather purposefully ignoring the totem next to the gen they are repairing.
I understand where you are coming from, it is difficult for one survivor to cleanse 5 totems but 4 survivors cleansing 4 totems?...not so much
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This games mainly about mindgames, so yea sometimes you will use a perk that doesn't have a real impact, but you use it for a just in case. And I usually get 2-3 totems as a survivor at green ranks, so it's reasonable. Even if a killer is putting down pressure, they can't be on all of you at once (at least they shouldn't) and totems take only 10-15 seconds. not including the time too find them, you would spend less time too cleanse them all then you would on 1 gen. And again, if you have trouble finding totems, using a perk too find them would make it faster.
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Oh good lord, just when I thought I seen it all... Survivors have LOADS of strong perks... SC, DS, Literally any Exhaustion Perk, BT, Adren... Deff a Survivor main with very little Killer experience would post this.
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Just because it "can" be "maybe" counterplayed doesn't mean its not overpowered. Especially since you spend more time in a match just to "maybe" make sure u dont get 1 shot.
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An old piece of parchment made out of a skin-like material. Is rolled and sealed with an uncoloured leather string. Holding and channelling the Map unlocks great potential in one's Aura-reading ability which slowly burns the Map. Generators' Auras which you have already encountered are revealed to you for as long as the Map has charges left.
Add On: Red Twine- A bristly and rough piece of twine of a deep red colour. Can be tied around a map to enhance its Aura-reading ability.
- Unlocks the ability to track Killer Belongings.
(Due to how my tablet behaves, I'll put the description of the Rainbow Map above the pic)
A piece of parchment made out of oddly fresh skin. Blood on its edge has yet to dry. It is rolled and sealed with multiple coloured ropes and cords. Holding and channelling the Map unlocks a great potential in one's Aura-reading ability which slowly burns up the Map. Objects with Auras which you have already encountered are revealed to you for as long as the Map has charges left.
Things to note: The Rainbow Map doesn't need any of the twine add ons, being able to track EVERYTHING the map item could if it were able to apply all it's twine add ons.
"It disheartens me. All this unspeakable knowledge and gruelling effort and yet nothing tangible, nothing usable to get out of this nightmare." — Shad03
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Well you don't need to worry about it being overpowered when it wont even activate. Get out of the mindset that you only need to repair gens and you win, there is a lot more to the game that survivors forget about.
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