Stop crying About NOED
Stop crying about NOED. Cleanse totems. I cleanse every totem I see; I Hunt totems every game. I cleanse NOED before it is even there so often and then you have just faced a two perk killer. So many times I have got to Exit and seen NOED in their build and you feel like a damn survivor god.
NOED counters adren and gen rushing.
NOED is not a clutch perk (unless the hatch is closed and you are the last dude.. kinda.. sorta.. not really), you failed to spend 75 seconds with 4 survivors.
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NOED is the worst crutch perk existing. Thats a fact. Stop your nonsense.
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Noed is a crutch perk. You get a insta down and your killer is faster. What is not crutch about this?
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The problem with NOED is that it is so overpowered that you have to assume the killer is using it even if he isn't. That means in about half of the games, survivors just wasted 75 seconds of valuable time for absolutely nothing. Then the one time they don't go totem hunting, they get killed by it.
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Play for time, play immersed, teamwork.
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But I want to cry about Noed.
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Eh I think it's garbage tier right now. Best to not put it on because some survivors will do totems thinking every killer has NOED it only works on survivors that can't cleanse. If you play Solo I see why you complain though. If you play in SWF you can all communicate to eachother everyone just does one totem and only one guy has to do 2
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I actually tend to agree with the OP. NOED isn't a problem. Is it a crutch perk? Sure, but so is Adrenaline and a ton of other perks. Besides, NOED can be countered so it's not worth crying about.
I remember having a conversation with JenDenise during one of her streams and we were debating NOED. I effectively said the same thing as the OP. If you don't want to worry about it, just cleanse the 5 totems. Her counter argument was, 'Sure, let me just spend all game hunting down the 5 totems in Lery's' she said sarcastically. My rebuttle was, 'Bring a map that can track killer possessions. Problem solved' to which she did not respond.
I stand by that statement. If NOED is such a problem for you, bring a map that can track killer possessions. You can single-handedly take out every totem on the map in less than 2 minutes. If you have a respectable understanding of totem spawn locations, you can get by with Small Game or nothing at all. The point is, the survivors have the option to destroy the totems before NOED ever comes into play.
And honestly, if your argument against that is 'well, we might end up wasting 75 seconds' then all I can do is shake my head and play the world's smallest violin.
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All of what you just said is not crutch since neither of those effects inherently make a perk a crutch perk.
For example, Devour Hope and PWYF are both definitely not crutch perks.
In fact Devour Hope is a perk that has both of the effects you listed at once AND lets you Mori people. But no one in their right mind would call it a crutch perk.
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I agree. Crying is fun
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DH takes actual skill to use because you need hooks and unhooks. They aren't even comparable. NOED requires either a perk or item and STILL takes up more time than Ruin and if you don't find all of the totems bad killers get rewarded.
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Even No Mither and Monstrous Shrine?
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Well if you need a shoulder to cry on I got you.
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I run no mither myself and I agree with you about every perk being a crutch for the most part
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Lol. At least some people got the joke.
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But... it is OP!
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The amount of times totems spawn next to gens is crazy. If everyone got in the habit of cleansing a totem as they see them, NOED would never be a thing. You don't have to search the whole map for totems, just do 1 or 2 each as you will undoubtedly stumble across them in the normal play of the game.
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The reason that DH and PWYF aren't crutch is that you have to do something to earn them, NOED is just handed to you if you play badly.
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Old DS, old MOM and NoEd are all unfun perks that either give free escapes or free kills.
Since DS and MOM have both been nerfed, I think a NoEd nerf would balance the scales. Boosted NoEd Killers will have to learn to be better killers, and survivors should be more likely to attempt to rescue me instead of escaping and leaving me one-hooked even though I did almost all the ######### gens and rescued two of you bastards from the basement.
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Omfg, are there any intelligent unbiased people on these forums??
Firstly, YES...NOED is a crutch perk, but so is Adrenaline, DS, Deadhard...there are crutched in both sides. I don’t see anyone crying about getting rid of survivor crutches, and the killer’s CAN’T disable yours like you can.
Secondly, cleanse your totems!! Survivors crying about not having a secondary objective so have “no choice” but to gen rush, there’s you’re secondary objective, cleanse, cleanse, cleanse.
Lastly, there are SEVERAL post here about NOED haters weekly...this is the 2nd one today! Can’t we please quit flooding new threads about topics that we’re already discussing? Comment on one of the many already existing ones, for real.
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I hunted dull totems and half the team escaped. One didn't escape because he suicided and the other was too dumb to run toward the exit after having stunned the killer with a pallet.
So what's your excuse?
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If NOED got nerfed:
- There would be almost no reason to cleanse dull totems.
- The end game would be significantly more boring.
The entire reason it exists is to A) force survivors to care about dull totems and B) force survivors to still fear the killer during the EGC. This is why completely ignoring dull totems and continuing to complain about something that isn't a problem hasn't gotten it nerfed yet; and this is why it's probably not getting nerfed any time soon.
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You don’t have to hunts totems, there’s are only 5. If you happen to see one in route from gen to gen, cleanse it. When all gens pop, most times NOED will not be an issue.
If you insist on hunting then, use a map or ‘Small Game’...no looking required.
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I was bored with gens, so I focused on totems. I still ended up repairing two gens, give or take.
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It's a real example from a real game I played with @DocOctober. But hey, thanks for letting me know your new excuse.
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I can confirm this.
And no, the "useless sacks" are actually those Survivors not spending a couple of seconds to cleanse a Totem.
It's actually you who is killing your team mates or even yourself with your tunnel-vision of Generator repairs, allowing the Killer to get some use out of NOED. Too many games end with unnecessary sacrifices, simply because you couldn't be bothered to cleanse that Totem you passed on your way to your beloved Generator.
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Let's call it a semi-crutch then, because unlike other crutch Perks, it has a counter to prevent its activation altogether.
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BTW the person using noed is playing with only 3 perks the whole game...
Also you go the possibility to cleanse that totem.... In my opinion this doesn't fit in many builds...
Killer perks are more and more set. As a chased based killer you will most likely run spirit fury and enduring, so first two perks are away. Then BBQ (simply to strong) and the last one is most likely ruin or another perk to slow the game down.
The only perk that you can maybe switch is BBQ.... With the bad feeling of losing half of your BP...
OK you can also build around a topic like basement etc, but basicly in nearly every build you play is better when you don't run noed. Most of the time make your choice is the better option for example. You can't cleanse it and it helps you the whole game.
Noed is simply just a "surprise mf" moment... But basicly it doesn't help that much unless you play against potatoes.
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Once again, ppl conveniently forget that EVERY game has an endgame, even ones where no gens get done. NOED can just as easily activate with no gens done and 3 survivors killed, at the same time that the last survivor gets his adrenaline boost. But... Adrenaline awards good play and NOED awards bad I guess...
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It's a noob-killer, like Freddy. Once people get some experience under their belt it's not even an issue. I can't even remember the last time I was killed by NOED.
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And even then it's more useless...
If I find you at the exit gates you will die. With or without noed. You will die on hook or you will be killed by the Entitus...
The only situation where I would say " yeah that helped a lot“ is when gates are open and I manage to down you right in front of the exit what is pretty unlikely happening....
Usually u are at the right or the wrong door. It's a kind of mindgame...
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why cleanse totems and use the implemented counter play if i can also go on the forums and cry about NOED being "OP", so the devs take care of it for me?
by the way, i WOULD agree with them IF NOED had no counterplay. but it has. a lot.
so if you have problems with NOED:
- cleanse 5 totems before the last gen is done
- remember the totem locations and search for the burning totem once the last gen is done
- cleanse totems that are hidden well and leave the ones at the gates / the one next to the gen your currently repairing, if its the last gen. then search for the burning one.
- open the gate and leave
- be stealthy in the end game
- be decent at looping with windows (cuz pallets are mostly used up) and stall the killer while your team gets the totem done / the door open.
- dont be overaltruistic (important!)
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Not to humble brag but I never get to all gens being done, don't need it to get a 4K.
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People who use NOED often don't get to all gens being done either, and they do it with three perks. ;)
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yeah, NOED is like a gamble you take. you play with a handicap, but therefore have the chance of a big power up when you're about to fail.
the whole "chance" part is why i dislike the perk though. you basically give yourself a handicap but there is no guaranteed power up in the end... and if there is one, it can easily be removed.
id rather have a consistent perk that will stay with me the whole game than a perk that is reliant on luck and can be removed (yes, i generally dont run Hex perks)
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Most survivors refuse to counter NOED, so it goes from "gamble" to "damn near metaphysical certainty".
It's like camping. You know you're taking a gamble that survivors will make their way to the hook, but then you also know they'll do it in the vast majority of cases.
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thats true xD
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Most won't cleanse during the match but if they're equipped for Ruin they'll get your NOED fairly fast at end game the same way they get Ruin at the start, and you'll get maybe one hook out of it. If you get lucky with totem placement you might be able to guard it after a quick hook but that won't happen most of the time. It's pretty much a one hook or one kill situation either way against teams that play it smart. It's not worth a perk slot unless you're dedicating yourself to end game with your other perks imo. If you're playing at ranks where Ruin isn't the norm then you gotta take it upon yourself to be the totem guy if it's that much of a concern.
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that is not a fact, that is a subjective opinion.
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I agree entirely: survivors should just cleanse all totems. However, It is a problem is when:
1. A totem spawns in an obscure part of the map, which survivors are often unlikely to pass through (unless specifically looking for a totem): like right in the corner of a swamp map.
2. The killer establishes map pressure very early, making other objectives, such as hook saves, a higher priority.
It would be much better if:
1. NOED reverted back to the previous version i.e. Tier one affects 2 survivors, tier two affects 3 and tier three affects 4 survivors. It's already a devastating perk and requires no bonus speed boost.
2. Include a counter in the HUD of remaining totems - at least as part of the smallgame perk.
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NOED isn't rewarding the killer even if they play badly, NOED is punishing the survivors if they play badly.
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I agree that NOED feels cheap when the killer was underperforming the whole match and then just get a 3k because of this one instant down. Ok, you could say cleanse the totems when you have all the time in the world but it still doesnt take away that cheap factor. Although i find it cheap i think it's also necesssary in a way to have that threat of being downed in the endgame.
So it's a very hard perk to balance because a heavy nerf would make the end game less dangerous. Finding totems and cleansing against a good killer with lots of map pressure is a hard task for solo survivors who already will run out of time with doing gen repairs... In the end you just don't bother with totems because you have no way of knowing how many have been cleansed as a solo player and you have most probably other priorities like hook saving or gen repairing .
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So you're argument is, cleansing totems makes your experience as a survivor inconvenient? Maybe even more difficult? That sounds like a 'you' problem tbh.
If you die to NOED, you should have cleansed totems. If you die because you are cleansing totems, then you deserve to lose that game.
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I've always had two minds about NOED.
While you can prevent it from spawning, killers have always said that a counter to camping is to do gens, but then you do gens on a camper, you don't have time to cleanse or you guarantee the killer his camped kill and someone else still goes down for free.
So while I can see it can be removed, there's still play styles that almost always benefit the killer with insta downs regardless of what the survivors do.
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I think noed and ruin in the same build is evidence you cant play killer. I got ideas for noed that could be fun.
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I think noed is completely fair perk as it is. The killer's already losing and sacrificed a perk for that at the very end to get a revenge and turn the tables and if the survivors didn't realise to pay attention to totems, it's their loss and there is a chance to ofc find it.
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I'm not entirely sure what camping has to do with NOED. Camping largely counters itself. It's a self defeating tactic and not viable as a game-winning strategy for any killer. In fact, the only time camping becomes remotely relevant is after the gens have already been completed, at which point it's more about trying to secure just one more kill. If a killer camps before then, they don't need to be countered because they already are, to themselves.
NOED on the other hand has a legitimate counter to it. It's a killer perk that only activates if the survivors allow it. That means survivors have to choose their priorities. If they prioritize doing generators instead of slowing down to take care of totems, then they choose to run the risk of dealing with NOED. If they choose to cleanse totems, then they choose to prolong the game slightly but won't have to worry about NOED. It's a killer perk that's entirely at the discretion of the survivors.
I'll also reiterate, if survivors choose to cleanse dull totems and die as a result, then the argument of having it award bad killers falls apart. You died because you got outplayed, not because a killer ran NOED. Hard to blame an inactive perk.
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K, chill dude
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Jesus, the moment I saw the title, I knew this was born for a huge argument
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Ehh, there's definitely some arguing going on but threads like this are good for healthy discussion so both sides can illustrate their viewpoints. I'll be the first to admit when I'm wrong but so far I haven't seen anything compelling to suggest that NOED is actually a problem.
The most problematic aspect about it is that it's no fun to die to it and in that regard, I actually agree. It sucks getting that last generator done and then getting spotted by the killer, chased and then downed in one shot from full health. It definitely leaves a bad taste in my mouth when playing survivor. At the same time though, I have to acknowledge that I could have dedicated myself to eliminating that threat and the fact that I didn't is on me. There comes a point where I have to take responsibility for my own playstyle and stop looking for scapegoats to blame my losses on. At least, that's my take on it.
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I mean you have to get to the end of the game. It is more of a safety net.
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