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Anti-tunneling bonus for killers
I have always believed in the inalienable value of a healthy community, not overly contentious, and of a style of play that allows you to win without humiliating or vexing your opponent unnecessarily. BBQ is a great anti-camping perk: it shows the aura of the other survivors, motivating the killer to go and hunt them, and offers a +25% bonus for each fresh hook, up to +50/75/100%.
Since the 3.1.0 patch is going to strengthen the average score earned by survivors in a game, there would be nothing wrong with introducing a new scoring event for the killer, a small bonus given to them if, in the 60 seconds following the rescue or escape of a hooked survivor, they will refrain from hitting him (no matter if he falls into a trap).
In detail, it could be called "slow agony" (because the survivor will not have an easy and quick departure from the trial) and be worth +4% for each unhook (the unhooks are at most 8, so the killer can earn up to a maximum of +32%): I'm speaking of a stackable bonus to all Bloodpoint gains, to be only awarded post-Trial, of course.
Comments
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That sounds very nice. But if I don't tunnel or camp, how am I supposed to collect those delicious salty tears? Not to mention that the rest of the match gets easier with one less prey to worry about
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@RoKrueger It's a win-win proposal.
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This sounds like a reward for less tunneling rather than a punishment for doing so, much like BBQ is a reward with a prompt not to camp.
You get the same BP you normally do and reap the salt mines, or you get some more BP. Killer already gets plenty, so you get to prioritize points or toxicity.
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It shouldn't just be BP bonuses, though. I've seen people suggesting getting a debuff while the killer is chasing a new target (a.k.a., not tunneling) to justify killers changing targets and help them out if they choose to do so.
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No, thanks. If you don't want to be chased and caught again, just get better at looping. I will always go after and eliminate the least skilled player of the bunch first. Don't be that player and you will be fine.
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Sorry, I now realize that eliminating people fast, scummy, and early is the best way to prevent Hatch-Giving DC's.
My eyes have been opened.
Praise the Entity.
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This is a cool idea.
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@Entità I know that. I was giving perspective. As I have stated several times if they balanced around 6 hooks instead of 2 kills. There wouldn't be an issue with tunneling. It simply is a matter of efficiency. Survivor's ability to complete all gens in under 5 minutes is what cause it. I am saying the extra blood points isn't gonna be worth much. This mechanic is also powered by survivors. The survivor doesn't HAVE to unhook someone. Again so you would probably really only reach 4-6 stacks in a general game. How many times does someone pull the plug on first down? There goes 2 stacks like snap.
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Imho a small BP bonus is not a big enough motivation. Who is going to throw their game for a small amount of BP when it would be necessary to tunnel for tactical reasons? With the current state of balance, the reward would have to be higher.
Also: Hitting an unhooked survivor within 60 seconds doesn't necessarily mean that the killer has tunneled. (That point also often gets forgotten when DS is being discussed.)
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Well, Make your Choice Perk had potential to be anti-tunneling do that, but then they went and made it useless with the terror radius requirement. I don't know about you when I use Make your Choice I never get the free downs.
The Exposed survivors always hide and I just find another survivor or the unhooked.
Anyway,
I actually would like a Perk that boosts the Brutality Score events by 200% on unhookers for some minutes.
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OR we could make a bonus for survivors for not farming other survivors off the hook in front of the killer. We could call it the "not a dumbass" bonus. The survivor changes are to make them equal to killers in terms of BP. Not increase their BP over killers anyways. The problem is with survivors unhooking directly in front of the killer without caring. Not killers making the obvious correct choice(with the exception of BT).
Post edited by Atrushan88 on1 -
I'm all for healthy & rewarding game play as only time DS and BT procs in my game while I'm killer is when gens are done. It's just too bad that tunnelers and campers would still tunnel and camp.
I wish DS would become base kit for survivors. When playing survivor I hate to see that 3 out of 4 survivors are running DS and then the guy without DS get tunneled and camped.
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@Jdsgames Not survivors', but full teams' with powerful toolboxes ability to complete all gens in under 5 minutes... Don't extend to all trials the bad experience related to facing a perfectly coordinated team.
@NoShinyPony It's a reward for those who want it, but no one is punished for tunneling. Are you suffering because a full team found Ruin in 30 seconds and 3 gens are done before the first hook? Good, you are not compelled to earn the bonus... Maybe the next trial you'll find 4 solos and prefer a nicer playstyle. It's up to you.
@Atrushan88 It's irrelevant why the killer tunnels: if they want to stop a gen rush, if the rescuer is a potato, if the unhooked guy runs into the wrong direction. It's not funny, because you can't play: DbD is not a hook simulator. We all know the killer sometimes has good reasons to tunnel, sometimes is simply toxic, so a new basekit bonus, irrelated to any perks, could convince people to remember DbD is a game, and all people deserve the fun they paid for.
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Survivors want +100.000BP for unhooking someone, so we don't gen rush
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This is a nice idea but I don't think it is gonna stop the camping/tunneling. These guys will always find a reason to do so. If Barbique and chilli, BT and DS did not stop these people from going after the unhooked survivor, I dont think any amount of bloodpoint would.
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If your going to say BBQ is the incentive not to camp, couldn't you just as easily say MYC is the incentive not to tunnel?
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@LordGlint Almost all killers run BBQ, but only a small group of killers choose MYC. :(
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It's most likely not gonna change a killers mind who really wants to target someone. But it would be good for killer who COULD tunnel but decide to be nice
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Great Idea! The People that play fair should get a bonus because if we dont have this guys the most wouldnt play anymore. Tunnelers and Campers destroy the fun. How often should we say this? Do something.
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You do not need toolboxes and a good team to do gens in 5 minutes @Entità the math speaks for itself. If you have 4 survivors the most you could chase at one time is one survivor. Meaning there are three survivors to work on gens. The average chase for a single hit lands in the 25-45 second range assuming rng is decent. So a total chase lands anywhere from 50-90 seconds this is not taking account animations and walking to a hook. By this time the survivors have the capability to have nearly 3 gens done if not completed. At high ranks you generally see the later the gens being completed by the time they are on the hook. This is without toolboxes and swf it is pure solo capability.
Now lets say the best is the survivor hooked stays on the hook and you open another chase. There are still two remaining survivors to do gens. Again the average time of the chase leads two egc. That is if you play optimally. Survivors, however, seem to like to pretend they played optimially when in fact you might have a teammate urban evading in a corner somewhere. This is why the games appear to be balanced. Survivor stupidity or mistakes. If a chase ends subpar to the 25 second per hit time. The killer has a severe advantage. However, this is generally done via instant-downs or a severe mistake on the survivor's part.
This is what the core of the 'No-Healing' meta is. Even if the killer leaves your chase just hop on a gen. They can only go after one person at a time. This is where tunneling comes in. If you save the hook quickly the killer is going to optimize to removing an extra set of hands quickly. It simply provides the highest ability to 4k or at least get a decent number of hooks. This is why I stated the balance point should be 6 hooks not 2 kills because they are not the same.
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The Hag has an achievement called "Even Punishment" for tele-hitting each survivor in the match. I was always hoping playing round robin with the survivors would be rewarded.
I, personally, try to avoid tunneling, and only resort to it when I'm far behind. The moment I take the lead again, I start slugging if they're on their death hook.
Everyone wants a chance to play, and games I smash in a 4K in 4 minutes with 0-1 gens done isn't fun for me, either.
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I will say: Adding more BP to the killer side would be counter productive given the changes to survivor aim to bring the point gains up to the same level. That would just immediately widen the gap back to what it used to be.
On a more personal level, I'm not completely sure if that's necessary. You already get quite a bit of points for not tunneling, so throwing even more on top of that might be a little overkill. I could be convinced otherwise, but I don't feel like I'm every struggling to get points when I don't tunnel.
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@Jdsgames You are assuming that:
1) all people spawn in front of a gen;
2) all people immediately start repairing that gen.
That's not real. Some people look for totems or chests; some people follow their mates with the flashlight to try a save; some people want to do gens, but spend time to find them; some people wait the killer patrols their gen before starting the repairs...
@Peanits I play 65% survivor and 35% killer, so to give a small bonus to the killer it's a proposal made to help the survivors. XD
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@Entità I am assuming the team you play with are being potatoes are of low-rank. Play killer at rank 1 as any non-top tier killer. Let me know how many gens pop immediately. I would assume at bare minimum 2/3 without ruin. Again the killer gets the power from the SURVIVOR not working on gens. Something you shouldn't have to consider as a valid arguement. Doesn't make tunneling any less viable.
1.) Totems - Survivors complain about noed. This shows totems are not being done.
2.) Chests - Only really see them done at early early match or someone brought coins.
3.) Flashlight - HAHAHHAHHAHA that is generally the reason you get a 4k. Some idiot is following you not touching anything. Then can't flash light save to save their own life. It is apparent you are at the bully killer ranks. This never works at high tier play.
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I have an idea then, Perhaps Brutality points for Killer Hits could be changed.
We give more points than now for hits that take out of Fresh Health.
We give less points than now for his that down survivors out of wounded.
also, Pls give even more points for EXPOSED DOWNS.
Making sure ofc that Brutality point gain is equal to normal as it is right now.
Without changing overall point gain, We can guide a profitseeking Killer like so?
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@Emeal this wouldn't do much. Just like the penalty for disconnects do nothing. The killer gains the points if they tunnel or not. You know what they don't get when they choose not to tunnel? Pressure: It is easy to remove a leg of the survivor team than play nice and go hook and hook.
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This isn't necessarily true. To give an example:
You tunnel:
- One survivor is in chase
- Three survivors have nothing to do but generators
You slug the guy that was unhooked and chase the other:
- One survivor is in chase
- One is down
- One needs to save
- Only one survivor can be doing generators
Killing someone early will definitely help once they're dead, but until then, you're applying no pressure to generators and they're going to be popping off left and right.
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@Peanits in many cases you can get both the unhooker and unhooked down. Again you are still tunneling the person that is injured. Slugging the unhooker is more common. Then you are stuck having 1 slugged 1 almost dead 1 having to heal 1 on gen. This is a far better situation than leaving to find someone not injured. You have the issue of instant saves and back on gens with the no heal meta. Keeping people on hooks longer gives more time for that counter chase. Once they get off the hook and back on a gen healed or not you lost even more pressure. I generally play Huntress/Wraith and can keep decent gen pressure. I am just saying for most situations this game heavily makes tunneling viable. While not making leaving the hook and trying to go for the 12 hooks viable.
I frequently still hear the balancing around 2 kills. Now I can get two kills by tunneling one and camping another. According to the design that is a good game. In reality it is not. The game should be balanced around 6 hooks. Which is far different from tunnel and camping. The killer should be in the power role when they mobilize and play fair. IE: Spirit/Nurse/Billy their mechanics are built around simply getting someone else. Bloodpoint gains don't matter much in a situation when wanting to get in more chases and doing multiple things causes you to lose as a killer. The game should be making tunneling/camping not viable. At this point I rarely find camping other than EGC. However, tunneling is a more viable choice. Go after someone with 2 hits to be downed or 1? Even if you come down to a 3 gen and two/three people left by doing so. Pressuring 3 gens is a lot better when you can slug at this point. Again game rewarding everything but multiple hooks. (Disregard Pipping)
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As a Killer who does tunnel, if the most profitable way to play was to kill the unhooker then I would. So If BHVR wants the attention of profit Killers such as myself, they should do that.
Let's say move 50 points around, So.. 250 for downing a wounded and 350 for hitting a healthy survivor. and Give 400 for exposed downs.
I mean do this and you would remove 1 out of 2 reasons I'dd tunnel.
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@Entità Tunneling is not the killer's fault or problem EVER. The survivors should be rewarded for not playing like idiots and "tunneling" wouldn't exist. This is why I said what I said. If you played survivor you would understand this. Survivors foolishly unhook you right in front of the killer's face without a care in the world. The only way to fix the problem is to fix survivors, not killers. Giving this bonus to survivors would likely let them at least think twice about farming you off the hook and give them more BP for playing smarter by waiting until the killer leaves instead of being douchebags and farming you in front of the killer's very eyes(A HUGE misplay) which is what causes "tunneling"(as much of a thing as gen rush is, meaning it's not).
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For some killers its not about the points, its about sending a message.
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