General Discussions
General Discussions
Totem Placements 101: Update 1.1.4
Update: What's New?
- Added a legend which explains what going on in the picture.
- Added clarification format to Distrubed Ward.
- Organized the first half of the thread.
- Fixed the formatting.
Picture Legend
When this is above the picture, it means:
🧱1 = Pretend the other player is an object in this picture.
If the picture is from the killer point of view, then the survivor is an object (and vice versa).
🚫2 = No one is an object in this picture.
💀3 = Bear traps represent totems in this picture.
☠4 = Pretend the other player is a totem in this picture.
If the picture is from the survivor point of view, then the killer is a totem (and vice versa).
Prologue
Me and @Masantonio explore maps in order to find better totem spots for the developers and community. While totems are supposed to be risky, they shouldn't be found easily when the killer can be handicapped, and should require survivors to actively search for totems.
Disturbed Ward
Bad Totem Placement
No offense to the developers, but these spots are terrible. You will see the reasoning below, and later, suggestions on better totem placements. :)
Reasoning:
This totem is literally exposed from all directions, which means any survivor who spawns near this totem will likely walk into line of sight to it and that's it — totem cleansed.
I'm not sure who had this idea, but if you're going to keep these bad totems, then make sure Haunted Grounds (or future trapped hex) have a higher chance to spawn here.
Reasoning:
Same as the picture above, but the tree doesn't make a difference when it's exposed more than 180° degrees.
Reasoning:
Look at the generator, and look at the line of sight the generator has to the totem. This normally wouldn't be a problem, but generators are the survivors' objective, so you can expect survivors to be around generators.
Therefore, any survivors who works on this generator will also find a totem. From now on, I will call these Generator Totems, so I don't have to explain everytime I show you one.
Good Totem Placement
These are good examples of great totem spots, but through these spots are a supreme upgrade, keep in mind they won't make totems invincible. You will see the reasoning below why these totems are great, so take notes developers! :)
🚫2 💀3
Reasoning:
Look at how much the totem is covered, and the opening isn't exposed as there map border wall directly behind me (you can't see it in this picture). Survivors will check the LT title as it's a common generator spawning location, but they won't be able to see the totem if a generator does or doesn't spawn there (unless they check the border).
This makes the survivor do more than what they need to do in order to find a totem, which makes this totem placement great!
🚫2 💀3
Reasoning:
Same as the one above but it has more angle coverage!
I understand survivors will memorize these land marks, but that's when you add more of these land marks; survivors will have to waste more time searching!
🧱1 💀3
Reasoning:
Basically, another version to the one above with even more coverage, so survivors will have to check everything!
🧱1 💀3
Reasoning:
Probably the most covered totem, and it also gives more things for survivors to check!
Like I said above, as long as this totem force survivors to do more than what they currently do to find totems, then this is a solid spot.
🧱1 💀3
Reasoning:
Note: The bear trap is in the grass.
This is probably one of my favorites as the grass can be made thicc to conceal the totem even more (think about Yamoaka Estate).
🚫2 💀3
Reasoning:
Through this totem is somewhat exposed, it's a curveball because it's not in the center of the map, but not on the edge of the map like our other totems.
As mentioned above, totems can be concealed by thick grass and/or the title can be rotated.
🚫2 💀3
Reasoning:
We talked this one out, and we're fine with this totem placement as long as a generator doesn't spawn in this room. Also, when a generator doesn't spawn in this room, add more objects or overgrown nature, so survivors have to check everything in this room!
🧱1 💀3
Reasoning:
This totem is literally perfect as it can be placed within loops while being concealed. Survivors shouldn't be able to find a totem while being chased because most totems we feature require survivors to be in a dead zone (I.E. No pallets nor vaults). However, this one won't be in a dead zone, and it should catch survivors by surprise as it's the last place a totem should be at!
Wrecked Shop
Bad Totem Placement
Not exactly bad, but not ideal because you can expect to find a totem in one of these hills. Either make different types of hills which requires the survivors to search every part of the hill instead of just one cranny, or remove this as a totem spawning location. Better yet, if there are no more valid spawning locations for totems, THEN use this hill placement because survivors won't expect it when this rarely happens.
If you place a totem at a common map title, it's bound to get found. Maybe add tall grass around this area, then place the totem inside of the tall grass like Yamoaka Estate. Make sure that there are multiple spawning areas besides the one in this picture, so survivors will have to check all of them.
@Masantonio told me about this totem spawning location (where he's crouching at), and this isn't necessarily bad, but should only be used when there are no other options remaining. Having a tire covering that totem spawning location would be a huge plus incase it does get selected, and as a bonus, it adds a hiding spot for survivors! :)
This is a neat spot when there isn't a pallet here because pallet loops will be where survivors hangout at. There have been countless situations where a survivor loops me just to see my totem as they run me around. However, to make this even better, pretend @Masantonio is an object that helps give this totem better coverage! Furthermore, move this totem spawning location to where the door of the truck is at for even more coverage. :)
There should be a rule that a totem shouldn't be able to spawn within LoS of other interactables because that means a survivor can see it. Furthermore, this is a common tile, so make sure you use tall grass to make survivors check everywhere instead of this one static spawning location.
This is meh because the opening is exposed for everyone to see, which eliminates checking that spot if you don't have to waste time check walking over there. @Masantonio is pointing in the direction where the opening should be facing, so survivors will have to actually walk to this area to check it. Bonus points if you add more of these because it adds more potential spawning locations, but it also buffs stealth! :)
From now on, if otherwise stated, traps will represent totems, and @Masantonio represents an object.
This is a bad totem spot [the opening on the other side of this rock that's facing the bus, not the trap spot in this picture] because you can bet survivors will be here if there's a strong window spawning location here, and a potential pallet spawning location. In our example, having the totem spawn on the opposite side of the rock, as seen in this picture, would help it stay hidden during chases. Also, another good spot would be where those tires are at in the top right corner of the picture. Just make sure the tire is covering the totem, so survivors won't be able to see it easily while vaulting it.
Good Totem Placements
If a chest doesn't spawn here, this would be a great location for a totem, but if we need ultimately want to put totems in the basement, we need different basement layouts to surprise survivors! :)
In this situation, @Masantonio is where the totem would spawn at, but don't worry, it would be more into that corner. We also checked with both 1st and 3rd PoV to see if this is hidden, and it is if we make the wall beside of him more opaque! :)
The trees actually makes this totem spot pretty great! @Masantonio worked on a generator that was nearby this spot, and he couldn't even see me standing where I placed my trap at. Like I said, you shouldn't be able to see a totem when you're interacting with something because it shouldn't give away your totem like that.
If we move the tire that's directly in front of me, then squeezed a totem in there with some tall grass, that would be a great totem location since it's covered very well! :)
You should be able to see where my trap is at, but if you can't, it's in between those two trees. :)
Epilogue
This is a WIP totem placement guide for BHVR, and hopefully, y'all will learn something! This thread will be updated as we review more maps, and also, if you, the community, have any pictures of bad totem example for our existing maps on this thread, please share them!
Credit
Credit to @Masantonio for helping me!
Comments
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Post edited by Awakey on3
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O.o thank you for your work
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@Patricia @Peanits @not_Queen @Rizzo90 @MandyTalk @Gay Myers (Luzi), give us some feedback!
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I love that you're playing Tapp for this, ''Detective Tapp on the case with my partner Evan. We're here to find bad totem spots, you know the kind, right next to Gen and a chest, eye candy baby''.
Good work, exciting thread :)
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Feel free to add on to our existing maps on this thread! I'd love to see what else we can fit in this guide for BHVR! :)
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It's our job as community members to contribute what we can to a game we are a part of.😊
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If you guys need someone to help out in your KYF to find totems let me know, I'm usually free.
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What a great post! Gives both feedback knowledge and why it is/isnt good placement.
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Hybrid Panda found this totem, it's tucked inside this crevice of boxes at the bottom of a water tower <3 Ironworks of Misery
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Appreciate it, will take a look when we start working on Ironworks of Misery! :D
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They should make it so totems do spawn near the map edges on maps other then swamp.
There is nothing ther are the moment but few rocks and walls.
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We made sure to include some totems that spawn on the outskirts of the map because survivors don't usually explore the outskirts unless they are going immersed. :)
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that ironworks totem has always been a spot
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Yeah, it's quite a common one too, and I think we're looking at one of those maps next, namely, Wretched Shop. :)
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Sorry for double quote:)
We'll look into that spot in particular and see what we can do.
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For Totem spots, i want 3.5 things...
- Do not spawn in LoS of a Survivor who just spawned (Idk if this can still happen)
- Always be hidden against something, so it can't ever be in the open (preferably hidden against something that covers 3 sides, leaving only 1 direction to see it)
- Do not spawn in LoS of primary objectives
- BONUS: Remove hill Totems
Other than that, considering the devs' latest maps, the placements have been meh to awesome, and meh isn't all that bad.
In fact, i'd say that's part of the RNG they want in the game, like the Exit Gate distances.
Well okay, i want one more thing, which is for them to revisit old maps now, especially Disturbed Ward.
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That's exactly our objective with this post. We are eventually going to visit every map, and redo the Devs mistakes.
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I agree with this! Surprise to some people I'm sure.
Of course this means that some new totem spots should be removed for reasons I've discussed elsewhere. 😘
EDIT: There should be a totem spawn on shack tile, not sure where though. Maybe between the lockers but only if a gen doesn't spawn there. IDK that tile is tricky, but IMO a everything should have a chance to spawn on that tile.
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The problem with including a totem on such a famous title is well... obvious, survivors will know to check the shack if they know there's a chance of totem spawning there. Even if you're not actively searching for a totem, you could stumble upon it since the shack is a popular pallet loop for survivors, ya know?
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I like seeing more attention be put into this matter, so naturally i like this post.
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I get that but shack is like THE tile in the game. It just doesn't make sense to me for it to not spawn on that tile. Everything spawns on that tile. And the spot behind the pallet isn't really that bad as long as there is no gen in the shack. If there's no gen, it's hidden well enough that a survivor would need to actively search it. The problem is when there is a gen survivors flock to the shack as a pack.
I would just like to see a totem spawn on that tile even if it's exceedingly rare based on what else spawns. I get why you wouldn't want that, but like I said it's the tile where anything can spawn there so it just makes more sense to have it there. Plus it might be necessary due to maps like Shelter Woods and such, as there might not be enough places elsewhere to spawn totems evenly. You'd end up with like 2 totems on the same tile too often.
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I can see a totem spawning in the basement of the shack since survivors don't usually go down there, but that's really it for me. I don't want to see a totem spawn anywhere on the shack because like I said, it's a very popular spot that almost every map share. :(
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I was gonna suggest that too, but the only thing is that spawning in basement would create a weird situation if the basement spawns elsewhere. Like maybe it could be just a shack basement thing but it could be confusing if that were the case.
Also there's not much room in the basement for it to spawn, so they'd have to change the basement's layout.
IDK I just think that tile should have a totem spawn. If anything, block the totem spawn if a generator spawns there, maybe even the basement, just to make it a super rare thing. Because, if I'm being honest, at the end of the day top survivors will memorize all the totem spots anyway. As long as the totem at shack isn't in plain view from the outside, and there is little reason to go into the shack except to loop, it shouldn't be any more of a bad totem spot than any other spot.
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Personally I'd love it if totems that spawn in easy to find spots, like in the open or next to a generator, had a higher chance of being a Haunted Grounds totem if you have it equipped. Giving the totems a "If its too good to be true, it probably is" feeling that would condition people to be wary of hex totems they find too easy. I'd also like to see another hex perk like Haunted grounds in the game to throw survivors off. Here's one I suggested in a killer concept I came up with a long time ago:
Hex – Multiplicity: A Hex drawing its power from illusion and concealment. After the first 30 seconds in the start of the trial 2/4/6 more false Hexed totems appear in the trial grounds. Survivors who cleanse any of these false totems receive considerably reduced point rewards and have their aura revealed to you for 6 seconds. If this Hex is cleansed all false totems disappear simultaneously.
“This needle needs a haystack.” – anonymous.
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I read through it. Definitely a lot of effort went in and I can agree with some totem spawns being quite... frustrating. Personally, I don't use totem perks as it makes it quite easy for me to play Killer then and it's not what I enjoy at all, but I can see why these spots are frustrating.
Some of the spots you suggested can be easily seen too though. There are a lot of outer walls, like single Z or L walls or just one wall, maybe those could be utilized for the purpose. Survivors check a lot of nook and crannys.
I would like to see overall diversity and not just set spots as people will learn them. I know every totem spawn on every map. I've it all memorized, so I think there needs to be more work than just that in the long run.
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Green part of building isn't really good place for a totem when window is open. It's a favorite palce for all survivors to run through, so it's gonna be exposed basically after first chase. I would like to see totems placed at "sometimes dead end" zones when there is no windows or passes through, and basically never near actually existing pallets or windows, because those places are magnets for survivors.
Also I like totem placements close to edges, like this one on last screenshot, but just make that piece facing the border of the map (wall) instead of center.
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good idea!
Lets place totems in places that survivors dont check so often
however buildings are still a bad idea
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We came up with the idea of placing a totem in the basement, but we deemed that unreasonable. Instead, we could work on completely redesigning the basement to potentially add a totem down there.
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I've had my ruin totem literally on the ouside of the killer shack. horrible. btw how would you guys feel about the killer being able to manually place the totem before the match starts?
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I don't know, I feel like Hex Perks should be risky because they offer more strength than the average killer perk. Giving the killer the ability to pre-select a location would ruin the risk factor because you're guaranteeing yourself a great totem spot, ya know?
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The arrows imply "behind" an object. If there is no room there in-game, it is suggested to add room. This part of the groaning storehouse is worthless in terms of gameplay. I thought I'd add this here as a comment on your post before making my own post in the future.
The brown structure is a ramp of sorts because levels always make things more interesting.
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As decent as these spots are, the current totem placements arent changing sadly. We just kind of have to wait until the new maps with the new placement styles, outweigh the old.
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No matter how good the spot, you're still taking a risk at someone destroying it. Even the best spots can be found pretty quickly, especially with small game.
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True, but I would rather have survivors look for the totem than the totem finding the survivor. :)
Also, someone had idea, but I would like one totem to spawn beside a generator, and it having an increased chance to be a trapped totem like Haunted Grounds.
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