Battle Pass/Rift Discussion
So did everyone just forget about this? It seems right after the release of Ghostface everyone dropped discussion. Originally I had disagreed with Behaviors decisions due to a misunderstanding, and I now see that I was clearly wrong, so please take my comments on this thread with a grain of salt.
Please voice your opinion below. I'd love to hear peoples comments and concerns.
Comments
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"It's a scam it has already been proven"
You could literally just not buy it?
You could also just play the game, because the pass changes nothing, and then if you complete the free pass, you can then buy the pass and unlock all content at once.
If you get to a point where you could unlock 30 extra pieces of clothing by buying it then go ahead, if you don't play much then don't buy it, but you'll still earn the free stuff.
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This isn't as much of a concern about pricing or whether it is worth it or not, it's the fact that people hold grudges and people who drastically disagree with the changes will leave the game. It also looks incredibly poor on the companies behalf. Again, i'm fine with more ways of micro-transactions. This just isn't the way to do it.
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I only have one single concern with the battlepass that has yet to be addressed by the devs so it might not even be an issue, and that is if it reintroduces timed cosmetics. I have no issue with a new method of earning cosmetics, wether it be paid or free, as long as everyone has access to it.
The devs made a point awhile ago that they didn’t want to do exclusives skins anymore unless they had to, ala the exclusive trapper skin for the switch port, so I don’t want to see exclusivity return.
Now I know that the rifts/battlepass will be temporary as the devs have said this in the 3 year anniversary stream, but that doesn’t necessarily mean the cosmetics will be timed exclusives. There is the possibility, and I really hope this is the case, that cosmetics that are in the rift will be put into the in-game store once the rift period is over. This way those who weren’t able to unlock the skins during the time period will still have the opportunity to unlock those skins, just for a much high price.
This is a win-win as it incentivizes people to still purchase the rift, while not feeling scummy by pressuring players to get it or miss out forever.
Well see what the case is as more info is released about the rift, but for now I want to remain nervously optimistic that the devs will do the right thing for the players.
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I'm just curious what the free pass will be will it rise to common cosmetics to uncommon to rare?
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I agree that exclusive/timed skins should not be in the game and that everyone has access to them. I'm still worried about this monthly/timed pass that they are using, it's going to put a bad rep on both the devs and the company as a whole. Especially if they go the route they are doing by copying a pre-existing extremely poorly received format.
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Boo to timed cosmetics. I'm willing to pay for things I like and want, or even just to support a company I enjoy, but I don't always have money right now to do it. I have to pay rent on pennies, and after that I have to feed myself somehow.
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I didn't forget, but I was tired of talking about it so much...
I'm over it now and tomorrow's video will be about the battlepass again :)
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The battle pass will be just another way to offer purchasable skins for those players who want them. How is that going to ruin the game?
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The game won't be ruined but the community will be very cross with the decisions the devs are making. The battlepass system has always been frowned upon since it became a thing, and to have them add this to the game while knowing it is extremely unpopular does not look good on their part.
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This is incorrect. Players have a problem with pay to win. What they want to do is pay for cosmetics, as is already in the game. Anyone crying about this is just ridiculous. If you're a cheapass, or not that into the game, or can't afford it, then don't pay for it. Really easy. Those of us that do pay for stuff will keep carrying those that don't.
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i already stated my opinion on that matter when the battlepass got announced first, but i'll do it again:
it is fine.
a nice addition to the game, a reason for long time players to actually keep playing.
its literally free stuff for everyone! its just more stuff if you buy the pass, but no one forces you.
and no, its definitely NOT a scam.
no one forces you to buy a battle pass and if you do, you actively decide to purchase something that requires you to work for it in order to gain the rewards. therefore you can most likely gain more rewards than with just purchasing them directly with real money.
and no, the game wont end like fortnite.
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Another view. At work.
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I will have absolutely zero problems with the battlepass if there’s no timed exclusivity. In fact I’m pretty excited for a new method of earning cosmetics with playtime.
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Again, I don't have a problem with ways to monetize the game. I just wish they wouldn't go with this route.
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I honestly already forgot how they work exactly.
But it's pretty simple to me: If i like what i see and think it's worth the money, i'll spend it.
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I personally stopped complaining about it because I don’t see the point.
But as far as I understand it, its going to be timed cosmetics you have to grind just like other games based on the anniversary stream.
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Honestly if it's timed cosmetics then everyone is going to throw a fit, not just the people that disagree with the battle pass itself.
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If we get something like this I will laugh so hard, any company who does something like this is a piece of ######### and deserves nothing. I will drop this game so fast, respect is important.
There is a right way to monetize and there is the WRONG WAY.
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Battle passes could be interesting I think
It just depends on how they do it
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This is exactly what I've been trying to say, this is going to leave a bad reputation on the company, and will lead them in this direction.
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My issue is that it's a game you have to buy. Not only that, but a game with DLC. Adding a battlepass when most of the content is already locked behind a paywall seems scummy to me.
Thankfully it just seems to be cosmetics though, meaning the only paywall I have to care about is the paywall for teachables.
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Why's that all knowing seer?
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Because imagine a world where you pay $5-$10 dollars for a cosmetic in a video game, and you only get access to it for 2-3 months.
(please note at the time of writing this I misunderstood the meaning of "timed cosmetics". This has since been resolved, Thanks!)
Post edited by MiniPixels on0 -
I highly doubt they'll introduce cosmetics that leave your inventory after a set time. Typically when ppl talk about timed items, it's along the lines of "buy it now, you won't be able to buy it later".
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What @LordGlint said.
But also, if someone wants to spend money on that...so what? It's their money. No one is forcing you to buy it
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@MiniPixels That's not what people mean by timed cosmetics, especially in relation to cosmetics offered by battlepasses (in any game that has such a pass).
Each Battlepass exists for a set amount of time, be it two months or three months. Within that time, you have a chance to play a lot and grind Battlepass levels for rewards, with some levels granting Battlepass exclusive cosmetics.
When the battlepass time ends, you got the rewards you grinded out. Those levels you didn't achieve, you didn't get.
The battlepass goes away, and with it the chance to earn those rewards. Then a new battlepass with new rewards is put into the cash shop. Rinse, repeat.
By timed, it means to have a limited time to grind for them, and if you miss getting them, you miss owning them. Sometimes forever.
Those you earned, you keep for the life of the game.
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So you have base paid game, then you have a lot of DLC's that in total cost 3x times more than base game, then you have store that each very rare cosmetics cost 5€ and full one outfit cost more than one DLC and now on top of that all you want add Battle pass.
I mean... I am not suprised that some people are and will complain about that.
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I might just buy the pass depending if some of the awards are BP or shards. I play this game so much that a battlepass could be worth it since i will complete it.
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From what they showed all rewards that have a gameplay benefit (BP and Shards) would be on the free track as well
Which is good. You shouldn't be able to pay for an easier game
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The benefit I'm seeing from a battle pass, free OR paid, is it's likely to encourage me to play in a way I usually don't. I've actually NEVER played hag, although I DID lvl her up to 40. If one of the battle pass lvls requires me to play her to progress though... I just might, and ya never know...I might like her. I probably won't get the paid battle pass, since I already don't buy cosmetics that require auric cells, but I don't mind having a system challenge me to different tasks and granting me rewards for it.
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Two different teams are in charge of these areas if the game.
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@MiniPixels here is how i see it. BHVR will do what they want regardless. It was in a survey as a question when the play was already to add a pass to a game that was not free. Members of the community were outraged at the pass but it is simply this.
If you don't want it don't buy it. I don't purchase cosmetics anymore. they are all just skins. The idea of paying for the right to unlock new skins in a game i already paid for plus additional content and chapters feels slimy to me so i just won't .
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Is BHVR listening to EA consultants again?
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So I believe timed cosmetics would be if you don't get them during that battle pass season they never become available again. Why in the hell would there ever be cosmetics that disappear eventually? That's ridiculous why would any company do that
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I don't mind the Battle Pass, they did not say it was necessary, its optional so you choose to buy it or not
I know I am buying it
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Pretty much all things in life that are ongoing cost money. Membership at a country club costs money, going to the movies cost money, going to a bar costs money. Living breathing video games with continuing content have gone to this model for a long time now. This isn't a one player stagnant game that you can play alone forever and that noone is spending money developing. Why is there some expectation that bhvr should work for free? They aren't even making you pay monthly for it like a subscription game. If you don't want any of the new ######### then don't buy any of it and freeload off the system, but don't come here and cry about it. Spend a couple hundred bucks on a game you've spent 3 years playing? Big deal. That's a meal at a nice restaurant spread over three years. If you can't afford it, don't come here and cry about it, the rest of us would like to support hard working folks and get more and more content.
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Personally that is what I dislike about battlepasses is that they are timed, which means they cater only to people who can play everyday. It's not a surprise the battlepass model became so popular with Fortnite, a game played mostly by kids.
Imo the content should be available in the store or in some other way for people who can't afford the time investment a battlepass requires. They did it with the halloween skins, so there's hope they'll do it again.
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That is the least bad solution. Hopefully that is how they are implemented. Another sensible alternative is a system that is similar to the reward tracks in Guild Wars 2 PvP modes: Once unlocked you can activate whichever one you want and fill it up to unlock the rewards (though all of the reward tracks are unlocked immediately or by completing certain ingame objectives). I would be fine with a system where you buy the different battlepass tracks either as DLC directly or with Auric Cells and get to keep them forever. Then you activate whichever one you want and progress is tracked only for that particular one, but you can switch at any time you want.
That still has the downside that the developers can upsell crappy cosmetics that no one wants by bundling them into a battlepass track that has cosmetics that a particular player wants but whose value is less than the total cost of the battlepass track. That however seems to be an inherent problem with battlepass systems, I don't think there is a way around that.
To make that more clear, an example:
- the battlepass costs 1500 Auric Cells (this is just an example, no pricing structure has been confirmed to my knowledge, as of the time I am writing this)
- the battlepass has a complete outfit, those sell for a bit over 1000 Auric Cells (I don't know the exact price off the top of my head)
- the battlepass also has a bunch of recolored outfits worth a total of 800 Auric Cells
In this example you get stuff worth 1800 Auric Cells for the cost of 1500 Auric Cells. You save 300 Auric Cells! However the only thing you really want is the outfit which would normally be sold for 1000 Auric Cells in the store. Unfortunately it is exclusive to the battlepass track and so the only way to get what you want is to pay 800 Auric Cells extra for stuff you don't care about.
If you are one of the people who want everything in the battlepass then it is a positive for you, but for the majority of players this can be expected to not be the case. Most likely the battlepass will contain old cosmetics and some new ones (as of the time of writing this is not confirmed and just speculation) - if you care about the old cosmetics then you could have bought them at any time beforehand. Therefore old cosmetics in the battlepass will, for pretty much any player, be cosmetics they would not pay the store price for. This lowers the overall value they get out of of the battlepass and will, in most situations, mean players have to pay extra to get the things they want.
In the end battlepass systems are exclusively anti-consumer: For the vast majority consumers there is no advantage that battlepass systems have that can't be achieved with other systems.
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I’m looking froward to getting more cosmetics for a cheaper price.
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Exactly this. Please just release the skins to the store once the battlepass is over. If you grind/buy the pass, you are getting skins for FREE or a highly discounted price (and getting them first), while people who wait to buy them in the store will have to wait 3 months and pay more money.
There doesn’t need to be timed exclusivity to make the battlepass worth it. If the battlepass does turn out to be timed exclusive skins, I will be extremely upset since this game isn’t even free to play, and the devs said themselves they no longer wanted exclusive skins.
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When you think about it though, it actually makes sense.
People that play more often will likely spend money on this service...which makes sense when they use it more.
If you think of this game like a service, paying for this makes sense.
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So I woke up this morning to 20 new comments on my thread. And yes, clearly I did misunderstand what people meant by "timed cosmetics". Super sorry for the misunderstanding. Didn't mean to scare people if I did. Honestly though after hearing peoples thoughts and opinions I'm not too worked up about it anymore. I'm sure behavior will handle things in a way that will make most people happy. Thanks everyone for your input. I'm so glad I got some people to come together and discuss other possibilities.
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See my post, especially the example, above.
You can only get cosmetics you don't already have, because duplicates that you can trade away or so don't exist. Therefore you could already buy the old cosmetics that you can get from the battlepass, right now, if you wanted to.
Why do you not buy them? Most likely because you don't think they are worth the price, or you want to wait for the battlepass to get a kind of discount.
You could have access to discounts if the devs implemented a weekly/monthly/quarterly sale. What makes that system better is that you then have more control over what you buy. If you pay 1500 Auric Cells (numbers taken from my example above) to get 1800 Auric Cells worth of cosmetics then you save 300 Auric Cells if, and only if, you like all the cosmetics and would have bought them independently of them being in the battlepass.
Another example (worth refers to the price in the store):
- the battlepass contains a new outfit, that you like, worth 1000 Auric Cells
- it contains old cosmetics, that you like, but feel are not worth the current price so you don't buy them, worth 300 Auric Cells
- it contains old cosmetics, that you don't like, and would not buy ever, worth 500 Auric Cells
- the battlepass costs 1500 Auric Cells
You still get 1800 Auric Cells worth of value. However you only really care about the new outfit and some of the old cosmetics, with a combined value of 1300 Auric Cells. In this case you have to pay 200 Auric Cells extra for the cosmetics you don't like, because it is the only way you can get the new outfit. If the outfit is also sold in the store directly (either immediately or a while after the battlepass launches) then you get no discount: You pay 1000 Auric Cells for the outfit, 300 Auric Cells for the old cosmetics you like.
With a system based on rotating sales you might have to wait until the things you like go on sale, but you have more control over what you spend. With the battlepass there is a decently high chance that there is not actually a discount if you don't want all of the things in but the system is designed in such a way that you believe there is one to make you spend more money.
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You guys are having a really good and civil discussion about this subject. Keep at it! We have a lot of good feedback and concerns here. These points have been passed on to the team that is developing the feature.
When we are ready for it, we will communicate about the Rift, how it works and what it is exactly. At the moment, we are concentrating on the Stranger Things chapter as well as Dedicated Servers (and Switch release).
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I for one would over joyed if I could buy the battle pass with shards I have like over 40k I never see any outfits I like to buy off the store with them so they just sit un used.
I highly doubt they will allow us to pay with shards but I hope they consider it as it would be good to be rewarded for my devotion I've put in.
Or make more cosmetic for shards that are decent please i can't be the only one that's hording shards because they see nothing to buy with them??
🐷❤️
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Thanks not_Queen for your input! I'm very happy that people have come together to discuss things and shut down my concerns, and hopefully other peoples as well!
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Are they reusing skins that were previously for sale like somebody said? Doing that with the real money only skins would be a bit dirty imo. I guess it's not much different than a game or its DLC getting cheaper with time or going on sale shortly after you buy it but it still feels a bit wrong with skins to me. I don't care too much even if that's the case, and if I like what's included and have the time I'll get it.
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A problem that I haven't seen discussed in this thread (but in older ones) yet:
Battlepass systems are bad for people suffering from video game addiction and encourage unhealthy play patterns in general.
This is due to the feeling of missing out on things if the system is limited to a specific timeframe. If each battlepass track is available only for 3 months for example (this is just an example, nothing has been confirmed) then the closer the deadline comes the more people are encouraged to spend time on the game. This is due to two reasons:
- you miss out on content that might never come back (cosmetics exclusive to the battlepass)
- you spent money and don't get your money's worth if you don't grind out the battlepass to the max
When I brought this up in the past people have said that it is not the developer's responsibility to care about people's mental health. I disagree heavily with this. A timed battlepass preys on people who are either already suffering from video game addiction or encourages unhealthy play patterns by playing more than they normally would. Some people are also more suspectible to this effect than others due to their personality. I don't have any statistics at hand but I feel like it can universally be accepted that there are some people who care more about having every item/cosmetic in a game than others. These are the kind of people who will then spend more time than they normally would in the game not for recreation, but out of an urge or sense of obligation to have items that they can otherwise never get again.
A timed battlepass where the cosmetics are then put into the store addresses the first point from above, but not the second one. There might be reasons a certain player is unable to progress on the battlepass track, such as unexpectedly having no internet for a few days but this is just ONE example, who is then not only encouraged but rewarded to play more to the point where they neglect their life outside of the game to not have their money wasted.
The solution is very easy:
- battlepasses are not timed in any way, you can always buy them and always complete them at your leisure
A non-timed battlepass system has no disadvantages for any players. Anything else is problematic for the reasons outlined above: encouragement of unhealthy play patterns, preying on people suffering from video game addiction or having an "addiction-prone" personality.
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