Gen Times Are Fine
One chase, 3 gens. Even if I had found Claud, or dropped trying to look for her I'd still have lost 3 gens minimum before getting a single hook. Of course after this I was told to just apply pressure, how easy the game was, etc, etc. Please, explain to me how I was supposed to pressure those gens, and keep up the chase, and somehow prevent them from doing that within the first minute?
Also, before anyone says it, don't say just run Ruin. That wouldn't solve anything. Every time I have run ruin it blows at the beginning of the match, or the gens pop anyway cuz they're not rank 20s who can't hit skillchecks. I get that Legion is arguably one of the worst killers in the game now due to the pitiful "rework" but I don't think any killer outside of maybe Nurse or Billy would've done anything here. Even then plenty of safe pallets and loops so I still probably would've had a rough time.
Notice how that was the first instinct, just run to the pallet. Some didn't even try to run the loop, just sat at the pallets, not on the end to extend the chase. What I can do then? Nothing, I can eat the pallet, or run after you. There is nothing I can do in that situation, I just lose. I can't even catch up to anyone. I played the second Frenzy badly cuz for some reason my game was running sluggish and I haven't played them in a while so that's on me, but there's just nothing I could do in this match.
Yet I'm told constantly told how easy killer is, how op killers are including Legion. How hard it is to play survivor. I don't get how afking and holding m1 is difficult. Especially when you get a good runner. Of course I'll probably get flamed, and this'll be ignored by the devs cuz, "It's just them doing their objective." Funny enough they complained about me camping their friend end-game like I had a choice.
I don't get why survivors think they're slick waving and taunting, I'm not leaving when gates are powered. You come get your friend, or I'm camping them to death. I have no other objectives to defend and I'm not risking you running out the gate or looping me while the others save. Don't even try.
No, I don't want free wins, I don't want easy games. I want to feel like I have a chance to play the game. I either play like a complete #########, or I just lose all my gens and get no points/emblems while being told how easy the game is, and how bad I am. Killers are supposed to be the power role, don't get how it's going on 3 years now and people STILL cannot seem to grasp that concept, but oh well.
Comments
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Sometimes dude, there's nothing you can really do.
That's the real issue if its a SWFs or just a good solo team, some people just know what to do in every scenario and they do it to their maximum potential. Not everyone's perfect, but if they know what they're doing... and EVERYONE knows what they're doing... it can really be a problem.
And sometimes, we just have to accept that.
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Inb4 someone says your post title but isn't being sarcastic.
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I don't even think this was a swf. It might've been? I honestly had no clue. I just know they were hyper coordinated and super focused on gens. You're totally right. I just hate being the power role and feeling powerless. It defeats the purpose. I like to play with off builds, and play fair and let people get points. Then I get games like this, and another similar game with someone running the Asylum "infinite" and I just wonder why I bother?
Quoted, I want in on this.
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Personally, I think it's the beginning part of the game that's the problem because you have no pressure. All 4 survivors are free to do whatever they want because there's no rescuing they need to do until the first survivor is hooked.
I think we need something to help the killer during the first 2 minutes of the game, and preferably, a fun second objective. :)
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I don't think you understand how difficult it is to play Survivor. Holding down a button and having to press another button. Stop playing easy mode Caretaker! Play Survivor once in a while. Also if you're having a difficult time, just equip Ruin, Sloppy, Hardcamp and Tunnel for 30 minute games.
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Why I became a Nurse-main. I will never look back to the times where I tortured myself with M1-killers.
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1 chase and three gens are common, that is when things start shaping up though, in my last match the survivors did three gens through ruin before my first hook but I still got a 4K, I usually start building a snowball at this point, it won’t always form quickly or at all but you can easily recover from this.
Also, you’ll have less gens to patrol making things easier.
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100% agreed. You're definitely at your weakest early game having to spend time to find a survivor. I usually have good luck and know the spawns fairly well. Even then between finding and the subsequent chase you're going to lose gens if they're smart.
I'd really like it if we had gears or something needed to fix the gens before you can repair them. If regressing it worked like Overcharge and you had to hit skillchecks before being able to repair it again. Anything really.
Ah, very true. A disciple of Morf's I see. :^)
See, and I could just go Nurse. I know in the end I said Ebony Omega Nurse time, but I don't really play the hard meta killers much. I don't run addons, I don't run Ruin or Sloppy(I think they're both trash if I'm being honest). I try my best to double hook everyone, I don't tunnel etc. Sadly I think it's come to the point where I can't play my fave which is Legion. Hell, I played M1 addonless Legion before his masssive nerf and still had fun/did well. If games keep up like this then yup, I'll have to play Nurse. At least her new skin looks fantastic.
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Your gate keeper will be destroyed and pipping near impossible in that situation though.
A 4k sure that can be clutch'd but you won't pip at higher rank brackets.
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The problem is the gens were on opposite sides, plenty of pallets, and they were hyper focused on gens. The time it took me to chase/down I'd already lost my 4th gen. If I had a 3 gen scenario maybe, but there was no winning this match. If I kept ping-ponging back and forth between the gens they'd have just popped them, popped adren, and got out anyway. 1 chase 3 gens shouldn't be a normal occurence.
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Why would you run Brutal Strength on Legion? Agitation is nearly useless, too. Get rid of one of those trash perks and run Corrupt Intervention. You're playing Legion which means:
- People will either try and wait it out near the blocked generators allowing you to create early game pressure as Legion can find anyone using FRENZY.
OR
- people will run through the map looking for non-blocked generators giving you enough time to create pressure anyways.
All of the generators in this video popped just after the 80 second mark which is exactly how long it takes to repair a generator by default if you spawn next to them.
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This as well. 3 gens popping that fast is a guaranteed Bronze assuming you even stall the game that long. Even then I focus more on points, and getting kills. Not hyper focused on killing, but I do like to go for the 4k. So, at least for me ranking isn't a huge deal. Other than not wanting to stomp new players, ala the free weekend.
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You're playing a bottom tier killer with no ruin.
You can't really expect to down people quickly enough to not have gens pop.
On the bright side they did every gen on that side of the map allowing for an easy three gen. Which you could have exploited.
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I like Brutal, and Agi is pretty helpful for body blocking, and I like the synergy it has with Pop and Brutal. Corrupt might've helped but then they could've just hid for 2 minutes, and worked on the gens while I searched.
Also, you have to be in range to use FRENZY, and you have to HIT THEM TO APPLY DEEP WOUNDS. So, it's not a guarantee, or even a remotely good power compared to it's previous iteration.
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Some Survivors are just cruel to Killers, probably cause some Killers were cruel to them. So screw all Killers right?
Idk, some people just wanna play the game super optimized and try-hardy, in a game where that literally doesn't matter at all. This game is just bragging rights simulator tbh lmao.
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Did you watch the video or read the post? Ruin would've popped, or they would've worked through it. Ruin doesn't do anything to anyone with half a brain that can hit checks or bring a toolbox. Legion is a low-tier killer, but I usually don't struggle THIS bad. I used to play him this way at 110 and had no issues.
Also, exploit the 3 gen how? They were spreading out so I couldn't make full use of Frenzy, had two gens on opposite sides and were safe on both sides should I choose to chase. By the time I got a down the 4th gen was pretty much gone already.
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That is why I don’t care about pips anymore, snowballing is effective but pipping is much harder.
I didn’t watch the video but you might’ve gotten a bad map which makes things harder but the scenario is still winnable but it’ll be very very challenging.
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This is also true, sometimes I also lose 2 gens before the 1st or 2nd chase, doesn't mean I still didn't 4k because they 3 gen'ed themselves lmao.
Or they just couldn't snowball again after those 2 gens, losing gens doesn't really mean you lost. It actually makes it a lot easier to snowball with less gens on the field.
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You're not wrong. I just hate playing fair and trying to have fun only to get a game like this back to back. Just kills all will to play the game. I only like to play with my friends and they don't really play the game due to the horrible balance so I stick to killer. Which I honestly prefer. However, it's so stressful cuz you either play 100% optimal, and sweat your ass off or you just get run around and eat wood for 5 minutes.
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What hurts me is that you played Legion incorrectly at the start there, effectively denying your power. You should have abandoned the claud and found the other survivors. Claud had to mend and heal; if you went for other survivors you could most likely have frenzy chained them and got everyone injured and off gens except for the claud who just mended/healed.
As legion, you want to keep everyone bleeding out as much as possible, taking chases when a survivor or two are mending. Depending on the loop, let them pallet stun you out of FF, since it's quicker then the cooldown, and either continued the chase or started applying pressure to other survivors depending on the situation.
Legion works when you make a point to keep everyone as injured as possible (run sloppy, it'll help), because they're off gens and injured.
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I spawned in, found a Claud, chased her, and lost 3 gens immediately. Had gens situated on opposite sides, and they had a toolbox/were coordinating gens together whenever I left to apply pressure. I had no chance of winning that without hard camping/tunneling, and even then I'd have probably barely got a kill like I did.
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We have to be careful with what we choose because if we add a requirement of gears, survivors won't be at generators during the beginning of the Trial - they are looking for gears. The killer won't have any clues to find and initiate a chase, then once all of the gears are finished, the same thing will happen.
Personally, I think we need Fuse Boxes that survivors need to repair once the generators are completed because it gives you a place to find survivors unlike your suggestion. They will need to find a fuse, and once they grab a fuse, maybe you see a noise notification?
I hate to post this in your thread, but I feel like it's necessary instead of me writing a wall of text about how to add a second objective for survivors! :)
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Ok so, 40s in to find Claud. Activate power, Frenzy, and run across the map so I can what, fatigue? That'd take another 10s or so, +4s fatigue, so roughly 55-60s~ gone right there. Then I'd have to wait ANOTHER 20s to get my power back, so that's 80s gone, which is basically a generator and nothing would've changed. Except Claud would've been mended, and working on the other gen, while I chased in a super safe area. Also assumes I could've chained 3 hits and they wouldn't scatter or stay separated.
I know how to play Legion, as you can see I ate a pallet for a faster cd. Mending isn't scary, and doesn't take much time or Doc would be top tier. Even if I did start tagging them they'd just split, mend, do gens, or loop while I was on cd.
Sloppy doesn't help, cuz it doesn't work on mending and it's a terrible perk in general considering no one heals, or should be healing when they can just rush into adren.
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If you run into rushers a lot use NOED. People are gonna get salty, but the whole point of the perk is to punish gen rushing.
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Nah, I can see your point, but you might also catch someone roaming around looking. That's also a good idea and it's relevant to the topic. Gen times are just way too fast for killers to put reliable pressure. Especially weaker killers.
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Also, idk why you don't use Ruin. Like yeah, back before they destroyed legion with the patch you could 4k without Ruin pretty casually, but you should honestly invest in the Blood-Web to get Nurses Calling and Thantophobia.
Trust me, people heal from Thanato because they think the reduction will destroy their game, where it'll honestly just make it go significantly slower. And Nurses because if you get a Frenzy chain-stab off on 4 people in a row at the start, you'll expect people to heal right after the mend. Nurses lets you know where they are when they're healing (not mending) and overall helps you track people a lot faster.
Try it out, I wouldn't use Agitation or Brutal Strength on Legion, but that's just me.
If you're curious, my build I run is Thantophobia, Nurses, BBQ (Because Legion is a points machine) and either these perks for the last slot. Either Discordance, Ruin, Pop Goes the Weasel, or if i'm REALLY feeling it, devour hope.
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I could run NOED, but I'd honestly really rather not. I have no issues with it, but I still don't like it.
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Then the alternative is to suck it up and instead pressure gens instead of survivors into smaller areas for easy defending later on and take the Gatekeeper hit.
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Yeah, if you wanna try out another build though that might help, just refer to the post I made before this one, it might actually help slow the game down.
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There's nothing preventing survivors from working on gens individually while someone is in chase. 80 seconds isn't that long if they're playing super safe at pallets. B tier and lower killers are reliant on survivor mistakes to a certain degree.
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Again, how do I apply pressure here when they're making me ping pong back to back on gens on opposite sides of the map? If I focused on a chase I give up the gen on the other side. If I don't chase, I give them time to heal/work on the other gen.
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Ignore the gens that you can't hold; cut your loses and hold the closest 3 gens you can. If you're a good legion you should be able to do this; I've done it myself with decent success.
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I've done the slow-down builds. CI, SB, Ruin, Thrilling, etc. I didn't notice a change against coordinated survivors, or even a ragtag bunch of solos that just know how to run the loops and focus fire gens. I might mix it up, but honestly probably just gonna shelf Legion sadly. The 4s fatigue is just absurd, and his power is not nearly as powerful as it used to be. I know people will disagree, or say I have no clue what I'm talking about, but I've mained Legion since launch, and never moonwalked or used Frank's so.
Sadly, and they only made a few, but that still cost me the match.
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There's really not much you can do in that video, and yes, I seen you made some mistakes as the killer. However, I don't think it would be fair to say that was the problem because I know if you didn't mess up, you still would have lost in my opinion. :)
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The gens were opposite of each other, I didn't have anyone on hook, and they were focus firing the 2. By the time I downed/hooked and stabbed multiple survivors I'd lost the other 2 gens.
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You're right, I did make a few mistakes. I'm not about to pretend like I played flawlessly. That second Frenzy was REALLY bad. Granted there was a few issues with the game, but I'm not using that as an excuse it was on me.
I do agree though, even playing 100% optimal I was screwed. They were smart players, they knew what they had to do, and they did it. I got a bit scatterbrained and I lost. I do feel like that start wasn't THAT bad though, not worth losing 3 gens. That's just wow. I haven't lost gens that fast in a long time. I don't want my games to go like that every time. I don't wanna have to hard camp or tunnel either. It's so boring to play that way, and I feel bad for the Kate.
I'm just not gonna let her go though.
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Also, another point I wanna tell you that might help in the future with that build.
When you start the game as Legion, you should always focus on getting as many people Frenzied as you can first. This will maximize the time wasted mending and healing, and overall will improve your chances of getting a snowball effect going on. Don't Frenzy all the time though, you'll honestly know when the time is right the more you play Legion... Its common sense.
People naturally heal against Legion, if the team is good they wont. But this just hurts them in the end because they're a one hit down. Its the same with Plague, having people in the injured state really does make the game go by faster.
And since they improved his walk speed from 4.4 to 4.6, its actually easier to down people now. Granted, hes no way the same as he was before, which made him more unique and fun... but the way he is now, can be worked around if you know what to do.
Try to focus on using add-ons based around extending his Frenzy time also, this will help chain-stabbing Survivors in the long run, and also once all people are injured, don't be afraid to continue the cycle of Frenzy hitting injured people if a stack of Survivors are in one area. If you also use add-ons that increase his mend time, this too will waste a lot of time. And with the help of Pop goes the Weasel and Thanatophobia, this will make it really hard to progress in-game...
If people are mending and healing, this benefits the Legion greatly, and a lot of Survivors really don't know that for some reason... even Post-Nerf.
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Welcome to my world where i get rushed a lot. sometime he also happen with Billy because i don't use the insta-saw combo.
That's why Nurse should stay as it is until all maps get reworked because i don't think killers want to be looped and gen rushed every day.
If you want my opinion i think the maps are too big and gen too scattered to put a real pressure against solid solo or optimized SwF.
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No, it won't. I main Trapper. 1-3 gens done before the first hook is the norm. I set the field with my traps and chase anything near a gen off while doing it. After , the snowball starts. Usually there are bo more gens done as my map pressure skyrocketed. I have half the gens trapped with 3 to 4 gens to guard. I pip easily and 4k more than 3k.
It is about picking your battleground. Don't try to pressure the entire map if you don't have the means. Pick your spots.
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I do try to get multiple hits off, but in this case even if I had gone across the map I'd have fatigued before hitting anyone, and then I'm on CD for 20s, so sadly no go there. Also, they had We'll Make It, and were healing SUPER fast as you can see.
As above, they healed SUPER fast, otherwise yea I prefer them not healing cuz it makes my life easier as Legion.
I actually liked it when he was 4.4 funny enough. I'll take the faster FF numbers over the current cuz I still got downs as a 110 killer. I play the same exact way I did then, as I do now. I've got vids showing it too.
I don't use addons, and I do FF on multiple survivors despite being injured. One cuz I want points, and two if there's a few I want to get some mend time in but even then it's not super worth. You have to stab, chase, stab, possibly stab again or a 4th time. By then the first guy is mended, and you gotta fatigue for 4s +the last person you choose to chase won't have to waste time mending sadly. Thana could work, but it did get kinda nerfed. I might try it, but 15% at 4 injured isn't super crazy either.
Yea, I have no clue why people heal against him, but then again staying injured against me just makes my life easier so I'll take it lol.
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I feel you man. Matt Walker strikes again. These maps are so god awful and they just keep getting worse. Definitely the biggest problem next to gen times.
Ok, but Legion doesn't have traps so this doesn't help me. I know how to play killer, this was an unwinnable situation. Maybe as another killer, perhaps, but I highly doubt it. Also 3 gens popping for set-up shouldn't be normal. That's kinda ridiculous, but yea, Trapper arguably has some of the best snowball in the game if your traps are popping off right.
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Idk what to tell ya, it works wonders for me especially at Red Ranks.
You honestly gotta focus more on hurting Survivors, than you do with protecting gens. The more Survivors that're hurt, the easier the Trial gets. Pre-Nerf Legion was really good at this concept, and could FF everybody really easily.
If you use Legion, use his add-ons that extend mend times or his add-ons that increase the FF timer, it really does improve post-nerf Legion. If you focus more on having them mend, they'll honestly do worse as a result, if you focus all the time on generator defense, you'll lose a lot on Legion.
Legion is the type of Killer to honestly have you focus on a different objective than the actual one, which is defending generators... It really does play into their character, that they really do enjoy causing people pain more than they do Killing them.
Knowing this, will save you a lot of games.
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Matt Walker should play against sweaty SwF sometime. I'm sure he will not be fun.
Trust me Mathieu cote learned from it.
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Guys, I know how to play Legion. That's not the point of the video. I have plenty of videos of me 4k, and quad Iring as Legion. On the PTB and after PTB rework. This was a losing game, and there was nothing I could do. That was the point. I'm not looking for tips on how to play Legion, or what I did wrong. I know what I did wrong, and I know how to play Legion, but thank you. And again, I don't use addons.
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Poor Mathieu. Flashlights got nerfed REAL fast after that. If only he did lol.
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I do just fine with every Killer, of course I don't 4k every game, but its rare for me to get a 4 man escape loss...
Also, Billy is just fine, even with the grey add-ons (Spark Plug + Vegetable oil) due to how lax that Killer really is, and hes honestly the most fleshed out Killer there is currently...
Even with a solid solo or SWF, you can still 4k them or get some of them killed, idk why everyones so afraid of SWFs... they're honestly overrated at this point of how "hard" they're to face. Yeah, they're not easy if they're good, but they're not gods lmao.
It depends on the Killer, your awareness of the map, the scenario, and your skill if you'll win or not. And this should go without being said, but 4king isn't always a win, even if you 3k or 2k or 1k its honestly ok. Not every game should be perfect.
(I know you didn't mention the 4k part, but it should be said because someones gonna say it lmao.)
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You really should use add-ons... Its your Killer though, do as you please.
I'm just suggesting things that could've made that situation a lot easier to prevent.
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You can technically play any killer at high ranks and still technically win. However against a hyper coordinated team you're just not gonna have a good time without really pressuring and taking someone out fast. There's a lot of RNG involved which can be super frustrating.
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Even with addons I'd have still lost 3 gens, if not more. With Sloppy wouldn't matter cuz WMI/double healing. I probably should, but I hoard my addons. Imo addons should be minor power boosts/change up gameplay not be a requirement to play a killer. Which sadly I don't think even addons will save Legion. If they were a bit more clustered then yea, I could've got a good FF off and some early stall. Just got unlucky with spawns and they did the gens.
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The RNG part is true, but I have to disagree that every coordinated team isn't a good time. I stand by that every scenario can be won, it just depends on how you play it.
For the scenario you faced, had it been that you went to the where the other 3 were, it could've been a different outcome. But when it came to who you went to first, it wasn't going to work out. That's what I meant with the first comment, your SPECIFIC scenario, the route you took, the things you did, couldn't have prevented that 3 gen pop.
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