Killer is getting hilariously unfair and unfun
I'm posting this again, so we can all discuss it while trying to keep this post alive.
Greetings:
I have been playing Dead by Daylight for aprox three years now. I fell in love, made a latin america community, helped new players and old alike and continously support it. However, I cannot deny that the current changes and old flags are getting annoyignly unfair, making the game not fun at all. I will try to list what I think down bellow.
1) Pip system simply does not work properly for killers
Countless games I have been penalized because one or two survivors decided to rage quit by giving me the "brutal killer" score screen, giving me silver and gold emblems because, through the current system, I didn't get to hook them one final time, so that counts as me not having a "proper" game.
Same goes with playing efficiently. Last night, I played The Oni. Killed everyone in less than 3 minutes. THEY messed up, didn't unhook other survivors and chases ended quickly. Still, I got bronze and silver emblems, because I notice the system seems to work for survivors; as a killer, YOU are the responsible for making their game fun. If you are efficient in doing the whole purpouse of the game, well, you get penalized, again.
Now, I understand that this responds to the very design of the game. Before, you had to get at least 3 kills to get a decent ammount of bp and pip. This produced tunneling, slugging, etc. However, this does not justify what I've specified above. Playing killer is getting annoying, hilariously unfair in rewarding you for playing "well".
2) Changes aimed to new players, ignoring veterans
Yes, I'm talking about the recent nerfs. Changes like the one you did with The Spirit are great, because those are generalized issues that the vast majority of players have been discussing. However, the Ruin change is totally survivor biased. While I can understand that you are focusing on improoving the game for new players, you just can't ignore the ones that are in lower ranks, playing between people who KNOW the game.
Many experienced killers will know that Ruin IS for early game. If you were lucky, survivors wouldn't find it in the first minute, so it gave you an advantage to hook one or two survivors before that happen and avoiding getting 2 or 3 gens done within your first chase.
It's not a coincidence that streamers and experienced players alike find this change ridiculous. Th new Ruin works in theory, yes, but it has no point for lower ranks, as survivors won't stop doing the first gens (not going deeper in survivor behavior. If you are in a chase, three others are working on one already) Like many have stated, this will encourage to use area control killers: Billy, Nurse, Freddy with other perks and other killers will slowly get totally unplayed, unless you are a masochist.
Yes, I've played without Ruin and if you don't get a SWF group, you can have excelent games. However, the problem resides exactly there; SWF tends to be the issue, always. There are alternatives that work pretty fine: Dying Light. Sloppy Butcher, etc, but again, it's more likely to get genrushed if you are playing against and experienced SWF group and the game limits you to take advantage of survivor's mistakes rather than rewarding you for being efficient, again.
3) At the long term, this will affect both sides alike
As I mentioned above, the old issues will come back. Less killers playing, and those who will play, will use tactics to compensate those points. You will probably see more camping and tunneling until the point that killers are going to be nerfed so they work alongside survivors and finally hook themselves. Survivors will likely encounter the same killer over and over, because other characters (like Wraith) are just non-viable in higher ranks.
So, what is it going to be like? I don't know. Behaviour has not dissapointed me in these three years. I have not always agreed with his opinions and changes? Of course, but these ones are getting annoying for me, and I know, for many others. I just hope you just don't ignore older players and don't just dedicate every effort to make the game more "fun" to newer ones through making it unfair to the killers, because there's currently nothing to keep you playing in red ranks. It's better to de-rank on purpouse and play with more unexperienced survivors so you can really enjoy the game without the annoyingly issues I've mentioned.
I hope that you get to read this and consider it as feedback instead of a ranting. Please, don't try to convince me otherwise because I know these things are facts. If you believe otherwise, please, I encourage you to read and watch other players's arguments and concerns about this topic. I'm just writing my personal views on this, as I know I'm not alone having this issues. It IS a problem and I hope it doesn't get ignored. I love the game, and I really want to invite new players to it. Hope this year it's a great one for us all.
Have a nice day and thank you in advance.
Comments
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Yep. In fact I consider it a miracle if you somehow got merciless killer with Plague.
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i agree, we all love this game.
But the only way to keep the game alive is keep it challenging.
If new kids complain, they will complain for a little while till they learn the game,like we did.
The state in which dbd now is terrible ,games are unfun for both side (at least if u need a challenge to have fun), and I start to feel the interestest is going down.
Sadly I am sure the way to get the game back is not what the devs are doing.
We already lack good killers, they are abandoning it really fast.
I keep on hope for a change of direction.
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Help DBD is dying, help help. My ruin is getting nerfed!
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I personally didn't say the game is dying, but I believe its health will be affected in the long term because of the things I stated. I never said the game is gonna die because they nerfed ruin.
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Considering 90% of the threads are killers complaining about the ruin nerf, can you really blame me? I need a TL;DR for that wall of text.
Balancing around new players makes more money. The hardcore vets are a very small percentage of the player base. That's the reason for these changes.
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Just want to go over one point:
"1) Pip system simply does not work properly for killers"
Thing is, only minor things should get changed. The Pip System should be a different one for each Killer. E.g. a Trapper should not be penalized in the Gatekeeper Emblem, because he needs to prepare at the start. Or the Chaser Emblem should not punish people for using their ability (Plague, Billy for example), but reward Legion, who stabbed a Survivor 30 times without doing any meaningful impact, resulting in an undeserved Iridescent Chaser Emblem.
Also, while they are doing Changes to the Gatekeeper Emblem, I feel that it should be Iridescent when not all Gens are done when the last Survivor dies (or escapes via Hatch). Because the Killer did his Objective, not all Gens were done, why not give the maximum reward?
Regarding your 3 minute game with Oni: I think this is fair. You obviously played vs some Potatoes. Should you really be rewarded for playing vs players below your own Skill Level, when you did not even have a challenge? I dont think so.
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Just facecamp or slug survivors until they bleed to death, problem solved.
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Its possible... but... you have to derank aloooooot.
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For facecamping are already bp penalties in place. More maybe to come by all the threads around it.
Still... It is just too satisfying sometimes, to see that 1 toxic survivor die. Even with the bp loss and the loss of the match in mind.
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good to know my killerques will be instant
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Stalk up on green mori's and then mori the first survivor. Proceed to take the match hostage with Surveillance against the last 3 survivors. IF you haven't maxed all categories by the time they finish their second gen. Then kill another survivor and farm off the other 2. Then when you maxed everything...
Kill them both, because you need the 4k to stay in Red Ranks, and they can double pip and die.
They will get mad, but that's just how broken the emblem system is - at least they got iri Unbroken for being in the match for 9 minutes.
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Every killer should look at the bright side. With many of these new players getting their way, refusing to learn things such as counterplay, and wanting killers nerfed instead; they'll be easier to beat in red and purple ranks.
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I'm not complaining just because of Ruin. Of course it's one of the reasons, not only due to the nerf itself, but what it means. Besides, if 90% of them are complaining, IT IS because of something, right?
I am also aware of that. That doesn't mean it's right or that I have to agree with it. That's why I'm complaining.
Interesting points. However, I doubt they will take the chore of doing so. Great idea though.
I do not agree on that. So, you shouldn't be rewarded for doing the ONE thing you are meant to (of course, omiting the break pallets, chase, etc). Sometimes they are not potatoes, they are cocky survivors who make more than one mistake. That shouldn't be on the killer.
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As someone who enjoys playing Bubba, it seems like even whilst using Nemesis/PWYF - I'll have to sweat, or just be downright an ass by tunneling & camping to win.
Ruin gave me time to play fair. It allowed me to make 1-2 hooks if I was somewhat lucky. Now? If its a big map, then it is pretty much gg.
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These posts are getting hilariously repetitive and uninteresting
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That would work in any other game.
But bhvr actual support those survs and that means... Killers will be getting nerfed, so that they need not to be bothered with counterplay and all that crappy and confusing things^^.
I had high respect for survivors... Until I had saw how they gang up on every possible forums to get 1 killer nerfed. Since then my respect has got some leaks here and there.
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"How dare you?! You should be able to kill them all without no major issues. If you can't do it, you're just simply crying and are a baby killer" - Average survivor
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jUsT aPpLy PrEsSurE
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If they want to be that way then many killers will make it as unfun for survivors as possible, ebony moris that many killers haven't used will probably be used more.
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Considering ruin usually only lasts a minute or two at red ranks, I don't see the reason for the outrage. Corrupt was always the far superior perk. Ruin is only there to stop 3 gens popping while you get your first down, and corrupt does the same job.
Sure, some games it will spawn in a great location, but there's other games the survivors literally spawn on top of it. Corrupt was a far more consistent perk.
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Author's writing is not illegible or improper for most. Thus it's not a wall of text, and it is a maximum 5 minute read.
You provide no substance for your text. He said this will affect long term. What you say is new players make more money. When i read that carefully, i understand you did not read what you typed, nor what he typed.
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It's not dying; but it's also not getting bigger. It's stagnant.
That being said it will likely die though, starting with the next update. Killers will become an endangered species, and without them, there is no game. Even more, DBD content creators are all praying for DBD to die so they can move over to another game without whining from their communities. They've all said it, multiple times.
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Yellow ranks iirc when I got Adept.
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Cmon man. I 4k at red ranks so easily most of the time. It is so easy to rank up as a survivor, I can literally 2 tap purple ranks sometimes. You just need a well-built killer and a good strategy.
Killer absolutely dunks on solo Q players currently. Survivors have been nerfed into oblivion. The last bastion of BS is the keys. But killers still have an overwhelming amount of BS characters and items to call upon.
It is only a 4 man on comms,who are all really good at the game, where DBD becomes unbalanced, and that is a rare occasion.
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Thank you. People see more than three pharagraphs and are scared.
That's exactly my point. All players, independent of their prefered role, will suffer if these changes keep mantaining this tendency. My intention wasn't to just cry over a nerf, but dig deeper into what this excessive nursing for new players means to everybody.
Hope I'm wrong and everything turns out great!
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I've been playing killer lately because of the extremely long survivor ques and it's beyond frustrating to play against nothing but SWF teams that 2 people torment and slam pallet after pallet in your face while 2 others finish gens so fast that you literally have no choice but to tunnel since you get the first hook after 2 gens are done already. God forbid 1 survivor sees a totem and mid chase it's destroyed by a comm'd up teammate and they can relay killer location, totem placement, and god knows what else...lol. it's no wonder everyone feels it necessary to use NOED, Ruin, BBQ, and good add ons because it's getting a little ridiculous.... the difference in a game with a couple solos and comm'd up SWF is so astronomically different, I can't believe the Devs think it's remotely possible to balance the game unless they make universal communication for all survivors and buff some of the killers that are lower or mid tier. And the maps......holy crap but that's another story altogether...
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I am a survivor main that plays killer occasionally. Killer is much more challenging. I have to agree with what cosmicmain says on this, both as a survivor main and killer. Game is getting boring. My interest has started to fade.
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I have so many ebony mori's that I've never used because I am a survivor main and I don't like to be a camping tunneling killer. I like the game to be fun for everyone but as hard as killer can be sometimes, especially against SWF. I say killers have at it with the mori's.
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The game is balanced around new survivors, because survivors have to be 80% of the players (4 suvs, 1 killer), new players buy DLCs, older players don't have much means to invest, because they'll either use shards or already bought all DLCs, is this a smart business idea? I don't know, but there is your answer.
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Nobody is obligated to give you a TL;DR just because you can not be bothered to read a post, if you do not read it, stop commenting on it.
BTW where is your video where depip squads disconnects against you when you play tombstone myers? Still waiting 🤗
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That was like 2 years ago, and it's not like I record my gameplay. I don't even think the marth88 depip squad exists anymore. I have posted plenty of screenshots on this forum to prove I am rank 1. Most of my clips are just me playing against streamers.
I am not reading your wall of text because I know at the end of the day, it was just a low key ruin nerf complaint. I don't even play with ruin most of the times, so I could care less if it gets nerfed.
Here's one of me dumpstering a rank 1 SWF. I still play against the ID SWF's and win most of the time, who is the main SWF squad that is worth anything at the moment.
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It's takes far too long to get a survivor game on ps4, and playing killer...is sadly...not fun anymore. This player base is by far the most 'toxic' one I've ever encountered. The game is just not enjoyable anymore. That's my feeling.
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Yeah plague is a Hard one in green and above.
So the best way to get adept with her is definitely in yellow ranks.
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My favorite meme of the forums. If I can apply pressure to those survivors with Clown, I didn't actually need to apply pressure to those survivors to win. They were spuds. "Oh no, he's pressuring that survivor, I guess I have to stop working on this gen! If he chases me off, they can't jump back on the gen!"
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Took me awhile, but I found it. It took me a few times to derank enough to get that low during rank resets.
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Yeah, like plague isn't as bad as I thought originally (when I started to play her more)
But With low rank it is the easiest way to earn adept
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I have a habit of refusing to play a killer without adepting then. So I only play adepts until I get the trophy. I oddly started to enjoy Plague a lot more after this when I could make actual builds on her.
Of all my adepts Billy, Wraith, and Plague were definitely ones I had to get to low ranks for. I try to stay Green - Purple for adepts.
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Yeah so i doubt it did happen. Sorry pic or it didn't happen. You don't need to post me links to badies or a 30second clip idc for that, you stated you made depipsquad dc which i doubt.
I didn't even start the thread so it is not my wall of text. Maybe you should leave the forums when you are not willing to read, seems to me you do not know why a forum exists in the first place. Perhaps a blog suits you better?
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Yeah, I just linked a rank 1 SWF absolutely raging at my gameplay style because it doesn't make people DC ever.
Here you go. For the record, I was the guy who originally tombstoned monto to make him make the "tombstoned" video in the first place. Back before anyone even realized how BS play with your food tombstone really even was.
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You have a really hard time reading do you?
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I have people DC against me in maybe 1/4 to 1/3 of my matches, depending on what killer I am playing. I have already shown you enough proof. I am done wasting my time arguing with you.
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Im a survivor main, PS4, purple/red rank. And imo.. These changes mean absolutely nothing, in relation to "catering to the new players". Ok. Make it less frustrating for new survivors then. Fix the matchmaking, so that new players won't be frustrated by the imbalance of rank in games.
Or.. are you only catering to new survivors? Yeah.. sounds about right I guess.. Literally, the lack of killer enjoyment is the reason for stuffed matchmaking.
That is destroying itself. Doesn't matter if the new people want to play if they can't get matches because killer isn't fun anymore, so they get matched with high killer. And it's too difficult to try and maintain rank when you go up against crazy high tier survs. Killer needs to be more interesting, and more fair. There shouldn't have to be restrictions on which killer you should or shouldn't use in certain ranks.
If they really want to cater to new players.. they'll balance the damn game, because it is possible to pull in New players and keep the veteran ones, for both sides. I know it has the potential to do that, it CAN do that. It needs to address the underlying issues first. These changes would benefit both sides a whole lot more if they did, and they would not lose player base.
Because it's a giant cycle. And it will continue to be if they continue looking only at new survivors. How? Matchmaking, being as it is, and putting inexperienced players with high experienced teammates and killers with perks that newer players shouldn't be exposed to yet(ruin, perfect example actually, because hag must be bought & levelled for ruin) and as a result, devs look at it and decide to nerf it because it's "too frustrating" for new players. Result? More disadvantage to killers, who will keep quitting, and no one will keep wanting to play as them. Result? Worse matchmaking, longer wait. Not too appealing to the new survivors.
It used to be like actually levelling up, in a way. The higher you got, the more different perks you'd be exposed to, not just because of experience(so ideas for better builds) but because the higher you got, the more variety there was, people buying and unlocking dlc perks and things.. y'know.. when people actually wanted to play killer a little bit more..
Next time they get random people to test a change.. get them to do it from both sides. Not just survivor.
This game won't exist without killers, and the way things are going.. they're making it real hard for them to want to stay ://
.. sorry
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I played against that guy yesterday. His first game last night was against me playing doc.
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Killer is still fun to play, I don't know what you are talking about.
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This is so out of the main topic. Besides, I've noticed that you tend to disregard every argument others have mentioned. If you just disagree because "you're too good" and limit yourself to assume, not even bothering to consider facts, well...
To be honest, you already stated that you "knew" this was a post that only purpose was to rant about the Ruin change, which is not, but, if you do believe so, you should stop wasting your time as people here are having a real discussion about this.
Cheers.
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I never cared whether you are a rank 1 or not, it was just about depip squad that interested me, nothing else.
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Next on BHVR's nerf list - Mori's
They my aswell just start the matches with the gates already powered.
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The emblem system for killers has been problematic since it first was put in. On that we agree. It's a problem that playing one hit down killer or against survivors that don't heal, effectively negates chaser. It's a problem that DCs and survivors that don't save dumpsters devout. And it's a problem that without a grimy build, going against some squads nukes gatekeeper, particularly on setup killers.
However, if you look past the fact that there's problems with killer requiring constant specific interaction with survivors to pip up while survivors can kinda screw off and still auto pip, you'll see that a lot of the rest of your post is not exactly correct.
There has never been a better time in this game to play killer, with the way dedicated servers are if your net is crap you get hits you shouldn't. They've started over the past year reworking the most problematic maps, balanced landing pseudo infinites are gone with the balanced rework, we don't have pallet vacuums and window vacuum fast vaults anymore, there are no true infinites left save for two, insta heals have been nerfed, exhaustion got reworked ages ago now, the past few killers though not all top tier have been fun in their own ways and their perks have been off meta but fresh and usable.
This was one of the top most profitable games on steam last year, so:
Should we be demanding that map reworks and a rework of the emblem system, and fixes to alotta survivor exploits that've been cropping up go through sooner rather than later considering they should have the money for it? Kinda, we don't see their books but, kinda.
Should we be out here all doom and gloom pretending that the developers only nerf killers and that it's miserable to play killer? Nah fam, you need to remember the dark times.
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