Visit the Kill Switch Master List for more information on these and other current known issues: https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/kb/articles/299-kill-switch-master-list
We encourage you to be as honest as possible in letting us know how you feel about the game. The information and answers provided are anonymous, not shared with any third-party, and will not be used for purposes other than survey analysis.
Access the survey HERE!
SWFs - BHVRs Lies, damned lies, and statistics due to the "persuasive power of numbers"
Multiple People- Will there be any QOL changes for solo players?
"Yeah, kinda?" (Patrick)
The performance of SWF groups isn't that much higher than solo survivors when looking at stats, despite how it may feel. It's a concern, but not enough to be panicking. WIth the upcoming changes to matchmaking (moving to an MMR rating), it will be able to show a performance increase with SWF groups and change matchmaking ratings accordingly. They'll also be able to change matchmaking depending on your group, for a more balanced match. It's not directly targeted towards SWF vs Solo, but it will have that effect. (Patrick)
Could this answer be misleading...
"isn't that much", "looking at stats", "how it may feel", "concern, but not enough to be panicking"
and vague...
"it will be able to show a performance increase with SWF groups and change matchmaking ratings accordingly. They'll also be able to change matchmaking depending on your group, for a more balanced match. It's not directly targeted towards SWF vs Solo, but it will have that effect."
Obviously Patrick plays a chilled SWF as the killer Clown but gets a draw with two one hooks so a draw with a de-pip.
Theres a reason why BHVR want to hide information and it's to manage those statistics rather than show end game SWFs or rankings.
Comments
-
Another SWF conspiracy of yours. You clearly should get help to get rid of your obsession.
38 -
I am curious where the 'isn't that much more' than solos comment was coming from. If we're talking optimal solo compared to optimal swf, then yeah, the difference wouldn't be that high. But if we're comparing the normal solo vs the normal SWF, I'd think SWF would be higher.
Then again, why are they going off current stats? Matchmaking is all over the place right now. How can you get honest data when the stats will be on the extreme ends?
10 -
you’ve taken this from my post and I need to clarify now before it gets out of hand
ANYTHING NOT IN SPEECH MARKS IS ME PARAPHRASING, LIKE I SAID AT THE START OF MY POST. DO NOT USE MY POST AS A SOURCE OF OFFICIAL QUOTES, PLEASE USE THE DEVELOPER’S STREAM. PLEASE READ MY ENTIRE POST.
Secondly, no. They’re not trying to hide anything. Right now in terms of escapes, SWF groups aren’t that much higher, and since this is how survivor’s success is currently measured (by, you know, survivng) then it isn’t a priority. With the new MMR system, these metrics of success will change, allowing the devs to measure success in a different way. This different way could then be used to show that SWF needs to be addressed ASAP, or the stats could remain the same.
You don’t have access to official stats, BHVR does. They’re more trustworthy here.
Again, please refer to the developer stream for official quotes.
APOLOGIES FOR FORMATTING ISSUES, MY IPAD DOESN’T LIKE THESE FORUMS.
18 -
Surprisingly i actually agree wtih you. Hes made like 15 posts abour swf in the past few days
9 -
The last time they put out major stats like kill rates in red ranks
DEV- freddy kill rate red ranks 70% highest pick rate at 21.4%
-FORUMS
Survior mains
said look this killers average is so high ! He's gotta have some nerfs
Look these three killers are used wayy more then the others nerfnerfnerf.
Killer mains
wow... these stats show that the highest kill rate for the top players is 2.6... so 70% of all matches for this killer he looses this game is really unbalanced.
Omg these killers have it way worse and they are so deeply unfun there pick rates are way down killers need alot more buffs to complete
No mains
No no no it means that some games killers steamrolled and got all 4ks and then a handful of games he let everyone go willingly to afk or something and that's why because its a high average 4k with 4E to muddle the stats
No no no DC are so common a bunch of people prolly just left and bosted the stats higher then they are lots of potatoes in red ranks ranks are meaningless
1 -
Nobody, survivor main or killer, no matter how biased, would EVER think SWF and Solo are comparable
but its BHVR so, ya know...
7 -
This is just a rant with no evidence or anything other than some vendetta against the dev's.
Pass
1 -
There is no denial that swf on coms is the strongest thing in the game. If you put the 4 best solo survivor into one match they will do awesome and optimal play. Give the same group mics and voice talk and they will COMPLETELY DESTROY the killer leaving him no chance. The potential of voice communication is high. Just because other casual swf groups don't take advantage of optimal voice calls and just talk garbage doesn't mean swf on coms isn't much stronger than solo Q.
2 -
My favorite part is even the text generator knew what’s up.
13 -
the easiest way to prove their point would be publishing the numbers they refer to, I loved whenever they released those stats awhile back on least played killer / kill-count based strongest killer / map with highest deathrate, etc etc. I don't see why they would say something that would clearly make people question their findings without.. y'know, showing those findings rather than vaguely telling us about them.
I had the same feeling when they mentioned dying on first hook numbers not increasing amid the dc penalty introduction because without any stats that just sounds insane, either I've had some really terrible luck with allies or people definitely die on first hook more now.
2 -
its due to the idea that they can communicate and the killer is alone but youre right its not that much more of a detriment to be up against a red rank swf as killer. survivors are a little more than half a percent slower than killers and they get faster every 15 seconds. theyre going to catch up to you quickly whether they bloodlust or not. not every game is going to be a 4k its unrealistic to expect that from groups or solo queue
0 -
You do realise you keep posting nothing but that I'm posting about SWFs?
Thanks for the killer tip with OoO
1 -
You do realise your post is just about I'm posting about SWFs and nothing towards content of the thread?
1 -
If you really think so. No surprise you cannot comprehend this game.
5 -
15 -
Don't worry, I've seen your other posts. I don't take your comments personally
1 -
How dare people play online games with friends.
7 -
Lol, I hear this so often but missing the point of what DBD is about, time management, looping skills and information.
You're welcome to play with friends except using other software to communicate gives you everything except looping skills
3 -
How dare people play online games with friends while performing the most basic social interaction of all, which is having a conversation.
8 -
Lol, I hear this so often but missing the point.
1 -
(see my previous reply)
0 -
You’re not good, stop blaming SWF.
1 -
"Theres a reason why BHVR want to hide information and it's to manage those statistics rather than show end game SWFs or rankings."
I enjoy reading the replies about where is the information to back up my point of the lack of information being provided by BHVR.
This isn't something like so aliens exist, the information is there but not provided either in game or stats.
@Doddle28 I understand, however the lack of information and transparency from BHVR would make me believe aliens exist even if I thought they didn't ;) lol
1 -
Lol ;)
1 -
For some reason, every time someone admits to using comms in this game they are perfect angels who NEVER discuss whatever is happening and instead talk calmly about their day or the weather. With so many good samaritans, it must all be in killer player's heads that people have an advantage. I wonder what all those twitch streamers are doing right now...
10 -
People have a paranoia with SWF
But the truth is the truth, usually the groups are 2/2 1/3 1/1/2 and 1/1/1/1 rarely i get a full 4premade.
the thing still is even playing solo if they are good can loop you.
and if they are good, gonna do gens, and save others survivors with borrowed time.
and well, not all the killers are able to patrol gens fast enought like billy
or down survivors super fast like the nurse or the spirit.
that's the real problem, the diferences betwen all the killers, people who think SWF are everywhere play no-meta killers and see 3 gens pop in the first chase because aren't playing a instadown killer or a super fast one.
and as i say a lot of time, due, can't balance all the perks due "teacheables"
should exist a mechanic who balance the map around the killer you pick.
weak killers have less windows/pallets
and strong ones have more
idk.
1 -
This is a cool idea, tho I would consider the fact if someone is maining that killer or not
0 -
There are literally perks in the game that 3rd party applications render irrelevant, freeing up the players to choose other options making the game much easier overall.
I know it's true because I also do it. But by all means, continue to feign ignorance if that's working for ya.
1 -
Dude just drop it already
0 -
pretty much true,its dumb to think swf is only slightly better than soloq,most of the times soloq is a joke and if you wanna do good as survivor swf is the only option
4 -
Still not a reason for trying to punish people for something that's been keeping the game alive. There are bigger issues that need attention, instead of trying to forbid people from playing with their friends, because some random Joe didn't get a 4k.
2 -
What's been keeping the game alive?
1 -
@Theetis I don't wish to put words in your mouth but are you saying survivors have been keeping the game alive?
1 -
I don't get it. They simply said: we really don't know what the fuq is going on with swf. We'll release the MMR system and see if it's really a catastrophic problem. That's basically it.
I personally don't think they're hiding something. Maybe it's just you, people remember bad experiences more than good ones, that's why most people memorize swf as unfun.
4 -
Dedicated servers should allow them to know exactly what is going on with stats.
They are constantly tweaking matchmaking right now.
You can't fix matchmaking without balancing SWF eg slowdowns or offer killers option of more BP against them.
MMR batch matchmaking will either see short term gain and reduced or be catastrophic, from what I've understood the killer player base will face any level so giving SWFs a further buff. Long term it will be bad but only from what they have described they will do.
Long term they will have a next gen for Christmas and what...
0 -
Dude, dedicated servers obviously doesn't give em a clear view. They also believe that hey, the data could be wrong! Let check again with the mmr. They don't need to add more stuff if they don't need to.
2 -
They aren't lying because the amount of bad SWF groups is so big it easily whipes the results of rear godlike SWF teams. Pretty much it.
2 -
SWF doesnt bother me, its fine. That said its prettt disingenious to say hes not prividing proof when part of his gripe is they wont show the statistics. Thats the point hes making. Thats the problem. What you want him to do hack their servers?
2 -
You asked for proof in a thread where hes complaining that there are no numbers. What sort of proof are you expecting? Im not saying the ops right, i have no idea nor do i care, its just weird to ask for proof when the proof is literally hidden. What i do agree with is that its pretty sketchy to not show stats.
2 -
Yeah, it's kinda funny.
You even bring it up and someone is going to come at you with, "DON'T SHAME ME FOR HAVING FRIENDS LOL"
Comms are a massive advantage. It's insane. Even when it's just me and my wife playing, the amount of information we can give each other in real-time is massive.
But yeah, if you say that, there's always that one guy that you know is queuing with their "Rank 1, 1, 1, 20" SWF in Discord just looking to steamroll baby killers and saying, "BUT I JUST WANT TO HANG WITH FRIENDS BRUH"
2 -
No apologies necessary 😉
As for numbers, I cant think of any other game I play that hides stats. At the very least I should see my own individual stats. So yeah, personally I find it a little sketchy. But to each their own.
1 -
Your IPad senses all the BS on it (jk jk)
1 -
That's absolutely false.
It has been said on this forum for a long time now. Hell, I've tested it myself. Add a low rank person to a lobby of red/purple ranks and you'll get matched against a ton of baby killers.
1 -
Honestly I wouldn't be surprised lmao.
1 -
Actually what skews the numbers quite a lot is the fact that it's so easy to pip with survivor. The pipping system tends to put survivors in higher ranks than they should be at.
BHVR then tells us the statistics of red ranks when the red ranks are filled with very low skilled survivors. This is precisely why it is so bad to not actually play the games you develop. Putting in 5-10 hours a week playing the game you are developing is not enough to get a feel for the game and it is not enough to reach a level of competitiveness to properly balance the game. This is where a lot of devs fail, but the more successful devs look to the most experienced players to help balance the game. Community feedback, and especially experienced community feedback is largely ignored here. The fact that the devs acknowledge that it feels painful to fight against SWF or be a solo survivor yet are not doing anything about fixing the experience says a lot here.
If you rely purely on spreadsheets to give you clues as to how your game is doing, your game is going to end up feeling very bad to play, especially with players that have more time invested into it. What I'm talking about here isn't even nerfs or buffs, it's just making the game feel good and feel fun to play. It's nice and all to make changes that will alter the win or loss percentages of a certain side, but the goal should always be the player experience. If both sides have fun, regardless of winning or losing, then the game will be in a healthy state. If you can't put 20-30 hours a week into making sure you game feels good to play, you should probably start seeking the advice of players who do play 20-30 hours a week and see what they say and reach a consensus.
1 -
If BEHAVIOR considers SWF and Solo results the same (SWF having not any significant advantage) ...then why not take all the perks that SWF on comms inherently get by being able to communicate to each other and make them basekit for every survivor. Using their reasoning, this should have no effect on solo survival rate. Right BEHAVIOR??
0 -
You want some pictures about green rank killers vs all red ranked swf?
You are right in that you describe how its suppose to work. But thats not the way it works in reality, especially if no killer is availible that matches the highest rank survivor.
So, you are basicly right, and still very wrong.
0 -
That’s because if the killer dodges (which they’re much more likely to do against a full SWF), they’re replaced by a killer of any rank. The devs have confirmed that abandoned lobbies prioritise quick matchmaking.
If red rank killers stopped dodging lobbies, new players wouldn’t get them.
2 -
It really is funny to imagine "Im just finishing the shack gen. Hows your dad doing Tom? ", "He got a new phone yesterday. Btw I know where ghostface is heading but Im not telling you haha!". Yeah right...
1 -
SWF have a huge advantage. Everyone knows this. They genrush all game and then go down to a camping killer due to being overly altruistic so I guess somehow that balances it out. 🙄
0
