Small Doctor Nerf

No, this would be dumb. The Doctor is already slower in this mode and there's some Doc's who don't play with range extending add-on's and would render 2 of his add-on's useless which both increase the madness gained from the static field. Doc isn't a Killer you're supposed to be able to stealth from. He's the only Killer that can do this.

@TeambossFloze said:

@Runiver said:
The main point of Doctor is to change the way the game is played.
It may sound unfair for him to be efficient against Stealth players, but it's just how he has been designed in the first place.
Playing against Doc is a battle against Time, since he WILL find you soon enough. That's how it is and how it should stay. Nerfing a "decent" killer would just make him boring to play on the long run.

He just requires you to play very differently, and mostly to understand one factor : a killer cannot pressure more than one survivor at a times. Being in a terror radius do not change that fact, even if that one is huge or giving madness.
Obviously, he can distrupt many players, and that's what he should do if he wanna win, however, but it can be dealt with decently if you are well aware of what he is able to do/not able to do.

Agreed !!

Fully perked/addon DR on Gideons is one of the most stressful games I think I have ever played

Doctor in Gideon is very discutable tho, tbh. Same with Nurse with Range add-ons, M&A and Nurse's calling, that can prove super hard to deal with due to the map design.

A great team can obviously power through, tho. But the rewards/advantage for playing Doc on that map is kinda huge lol.

As someone who goes up against docs regularly almost all of them have the range extending addon and I've been working on gens while someone else gets chased 40 yards away. I get hit by the electrode at that range all the time and it isn't a case of finding stealthy players as much as the doctors just spam it non stop until they get you to phase 3 and or down you.

On Gideon's, Lery's and Haddonfield/Springfield they literally just have to walk around and do nothing but spam it. There's no skill involved there nor any counter to it and in solo queue it's rare to get a group that knows what their doing against him. It's even worse when the doctor just camps and walks back and forth with 40 yards of the hooked survivor and spams it. They'll interrupt saving and any gen work being done.

The only nerf I could see for him would be if you use the range extending it gets a 10 sec cd so you can't just spam it and make it so even with a cdr addon it still can't go below 7. If you're not using a cdr addon then give a addon they can ge to reduce charge time or something like this.

I'm looking at this from the point of a solo queue player since in SVF that enrf isn't needed unless it's a duo in which case buff against SVF.

@projecteulogy said:

@powerbats said:
As someone who goes up against docs regularly almost all of them have the range extending addon and I've been working on gens while someone else gets chased 40 yards away. I get hit by the electrode at that range all the time and it isn't a case of finding stealthy players as much as the doctors just spam it non stop until they get you to phase 3 and or down you.

On Gideon's, Lery's and Haddonfield/Springfield they literally just have to walk around and do nothing but spam it. There's no skill involved there nor any counter to it and in solo queue it's rare to get a group that knows what their doing against him. It's even worse when the doctor just camps and walks back and forth with 40 yards of the hooked survivor and spams it. They'll interrupt saving and any gen work being done.

The only nerf I could see for him would be if you use the range extending it gets a 10 sec cd so you can't just spam it and make it so even with a cdr addon it still can't go below 7. If you're not using a cdr addon then give a addon they can ge to reduce charge time or something like this.

I'm looking at this from the point of a solo queue player since in SVF that enrf isn't needed unless it's a duo in which case buff against SVF.

I doc main as killer and solo as survivor. He doesn't need any type of nerf except that remaining crouch would drastically decrease madness gain(lower to the ground/grounded, if you know how electricity works). However, Doctor is so easily looped its not even funny. If his shock therapy actually hurt you besides putting you in a madness tier, then yes he would be OP. As it is, you HAVE to run an addon that causes Exhaustion like Iridescent King or Obedience.

10 seconds would be extremely long to cooldown his ability. If it hurt you, then sure.

Also, Doc spamming his shock leaves his terror radius unable to raise your madness. The moment you start charging, your terror rad stops emitting electricity. IIRC he's the only killer that doesnt have an addon that reduces charge time. So Doctor has a drastic disadvantage. Unless they run Ruin and protect it, Doc will get gen-rushed almost every time and considering 70%+ of games are "SWF", i doubt he will get any type of nerf anytime soon.

The bolded part is only true at higher tiers since solo queue I've had probably 10-15 groups in total as a survivor and 5 as a killer. But for solo his extended range is op considering group make up and most doctors are all highly ranked/prestiged and have intentionally deranked to farm.

There was a doctor I'll have to see if I took a screenshot of it or not that had a reduced charged time addon going.Which is why I suggest a longer cd on charge time. The Calm Carters notes increases the terror radius while charging. He also has Monitor and Abuse to increase the terror radius so if he has the 75% range and the 2 things he's going to destroy on the 2 smaller maps and even the larger ones he's super hard.

Again solo queue low ranked is where the biggest issue lies since in SVF it's easier for the group to counter him.

But this brings back the problem of they can't really fix this until they rewrite the code from scratch in order to balance the 2 queues better.

Oh I totally understand the looping thing and hopefully it gets fixed sooner rather than later.

powerbats said:

As someone who goes up against docs regularly almost all of them have the range extending addon and I've been working on gens while someone else gets chased 40 yards away. I get hit by the electrode at that range all the time and it isn't a case of finding stealthy players as much as the doctors just spam it non stop until they get you to phase 3 and or down you.

On Gideon's, Lery's and Haddonfield/Springfield they literally just have to walk around and do nothing but spam it. There's no skill involved there nor any counter to it and in solo queue it's rare to get a group that knows what their doing against him. It's even worse when the doctor just camps and walks back and forth with 40 yards of the hooked survivor and spams it. They'll interrupt saving and any gen work being done.

The only nerf I could see for him would be if you use the range extending it gets a 10 sec cd so you can't just spam it and make it so even with a cdr addon it still can't go below 7. If you're not using a cdr addon then give a addon they can ge to reduce charge time or something like this.

I'm looking at this from the point of a solo queue player since in SVF that enrf isn't needed unless it's a duo in which case buff against SVF.

If you get into a locker you'll stop accruing madness.

@Kilrane said:
If you get into a locker you'll stop accruing madness.

But what if I don't find a locker? What do I do then huh? I gotta be able to counter all the Killers and win without any skill at all, you entitled Killer scrub.

The doctor is a in a great place and you just have to play against the screams and time when to try and snap out of it. It is all about how you play against a killer and doc is no different..

@TreblucFayle said:
@Zanfer I'd agree, for the most part.

Biggest issue the doctor has right now (in my opinion) isn't his mechanics, but HOW people choose to use them. The lock-down strategy many people use him for is boring to play against for many people. No other killer can just stall the game as well as the doc can.

sorry but what do you mean by "lockdown"? You mean putting people in constant madness 3???

@TreblucFayle said:
@Zanfer I'd agree, for the most part.

Biggest issue the doctor has right now (in my opinion) isn't his mechanics, but HOW people choose to use them. The lock-down strategy many people use him for is boring to play against for many people. No other killer can just stall the game as well as the doc can.

This is my biggest issue when all he does is nothing but spam electrode with 25+ extended range and sues the extended terror radius to do it. When you're getting hit non stop 25-60 yards way and above and below him through floors/walls you can't do much. There's several maps where the doctor does only that until he gets everyone to stage 3 and or hit and downed. The inevitable ace ensues and quite a few brag in post game chat about how it was too ez and git gud.

This isn't the one I wanted but it still illustrates the issue with the extended range and using terror radius that's extended. I got nailed by a doctor on this map who was near where the red was and around the corner chasing someone else. I've also been hit from the other side of the building and further away to show you how stupidly broken that is.

Some perfect examples are Gideons, Haddonfield/Springfield/Lery's and even Backwater Swamp where he just runs down the center and spams electrode and hits everyone. This isn't about git gud or learning to counterplay.since there is none in those situations. He can even be extremely oppressive on Crotus and Red Forest even more so than other killers.

As @TreblucFayle said adjust it which is what those of us that have issues with how he currently is really want. He needs to be balanced so that in low rank solo queue he doesn't almost always get 4 sacrifices. for higher ranks and or against SVF groups he can be stronger but now it takes no skill to just spam electrode all game.

@TreblucFayle said:
@powerbats whether or not he gets 4 kills every game should not be the point.

All I'm advocating for is that they somehow limit his ability to take a game hostage.

I'm also confused as to whether you're talking about his static field or shock therapy. In your picture, there is no way (even with add-ons) that a shock therapy could reach you at that range. His static field could affect you, but that's passive and can't be "spammed" as you said.

I agree with the hostage taking part but I've been getting hit with shock therapy from those ranges which is what's making me think it needs a nerf/adjustment. The static field I know can reach really far but it also gives an indication based upon ticks how close he is.

But the shock therapy range is stupidly long at the moment and once I finally find the screenshot of where I got hit with doctor in shot chasing someone else I'll post it.

@powerbats said:

@TreblucFayle said:
@powerbats whether or not he gets 4 kills every game should not be the point.

All I'm advocating for is that they somehow limit his ability to take a game hostage.

I'm also confused as to whether you're talking about his static field or shock therapy. In your picture, there is no way (even with add-ons) that a shock therapy could reach you at that range. His static field could affect you, but that's passive and can't be "spammed" as you said.

I agree with the hostage taking part but I've been getting hit with shock therapy from those ranges which is what's making me think it needs a nerf/adjustment. The static field I know can reach really far but it also gives an indication based upon ticks how close he is.

But the shock therapy range is stupidly long at the moment and once I finally find the screenshot of where I got hit with doctor in shot chasing someone else I'll post it.

depends on how close you are to this killer. Should try staying a great distance from him while he chases other people so he doesn't shock you or be as stealthy as you can during the time which is possible if you are trying to going past him, not following him.

I'm a 2k+ hour Killer main and I actually like this idea. I think it would be a fiar change but only after the balance is fixed. Killers don't need a nerf right now. They need fair maps, fair mechanics, and slight buffs. Until then, no bad change for Killers.

No, this would absolutely gimp the Doc. He's already a mid tier Kiler. He's perfect how he is.

GhostEuant said:

A small but maybe meaningful nerf to the doctor suggestion:
Survivors don’t start gaining madness by his terror radius until they are directly shocked by the Doctor at least once. Once they’ve been shocked once they can begin passively gaining madness.

Reasons:
-Doctor doesn’t get a free “here I am” notification by just walking around and not actually looking for survivors
-Better rewards survivors who are good at hiding/evading

@KiraElijah said:

I rarely see that happen, and poor doctor needs no nerf

Lower ranks it's pretty standard in the 15-20 range.

@weirdkid5 said:

@powerbats said:

@KiraElijah said:

I rarely see that happen, and poor doctor needs no nerf

Lower ranks it's pretty standard in the 15-20 range.

Just because low ranks dont know how to overcome it doesnt mean he needs a nerf.

This is the same crap that got Freddy sent into oblivion.

Don't you mean that just because it can be abused on small maps doesn't mean it's need an adjustment? Oh and inb4 you try the low ranks stuff again I'e been in groups with really high ranked players who got nailed just as easily.

If you look even some of the high ranked players have agreed it needs to be adjusted since otherwise you just encourage the survivors to go hide/loop endlessly more than they might normally do.

@powerbats said:

@weirdkid5 said:

@powerbats said:

@KiraElijah said:

I rarely see that happen, and poor doctor needs no nerf

Lower ranks it's pretty standard in the 15-20 range.

Just because low ranks dont know how to overcome it doesnt mean he needs a nerf.

This is the same crap that got Freddy sent into oblivion.

Don't you mean that just because it can be abused on small maps doesn't mean it's need an adjustment? Oh and inb4 you try the low ranks stuff again I'e been in groups with really high ranked players who got nailed just as easily.

If you look even some of the high ranked players have agreed it needs to be adjusted since otherwise you just encourage the survivors to go hide/loop endlessly more than they might normally do.

High rank players can be potatoes too. Doctor doesn't need a nerf. He can still only chase one person at a time, and refusing to down to attempt to kill someone after a long period of time and ONLY focusing gen regression can be considered holding the game hostage, as the Killer isn't attempting to complete his objective and is only impeding the progress of the Survivors.

At some point he has to come out of Treatment mode to chase around. Staying in treatment mode will never catch him anyone. I know we all have a hard time using them, but we were given brains to think through situations like these.

@GhostEuant said:
A small but maybe meaningful nerf to the doctor suggestion:
Survivors don’t start gaining madness by his terror radius until they are directly shocked by the Doctor at least once. Once they’ve been shocked once they can begin passively gaining madness.

Reasons:
-Doctor doesn’t get a free “here I am” notification by just walking around and not actually looking for survivors
-Better rewards survivors who are good at hiding/evading

Yes I agree lets nerf the killers that are low to mid tier so they're even worse so we have even less reason to play with them..... have you never faced a good Nurse, Billy, or Huntress? You're in for a rude awakening once you face one.

@powerbats said:

@easi_solstice said:

@GhostEuant said:
A small but maybe meaningful nerf to the doctor suggestion:
Survivors don’t start gaining madness by his terror radius until they are directly shocked by the Doctor at least once. Once they’ve been shocked once they can begin passively gaining madness.

Reasons:
-Doctor doesn’t get a free “here I am” notification by just walking around and not actually looking for survivors
-Better rewards survivors who are good at hiding/evading

Yes I agree lets nerf the killers that are low to mid tier so they're even worse so we have even less reason to play with them..... have you never faced a good Nurse, Billy, or Huntress? You're in for a rude awakening once you face one.

Translation lets ignore the issue and blame it on other things instead of actually looking for a balanced solution. That's like blaming the fact the doctor isn't meta at high ranks because he's not the best killer. Well there's always going to be a meta both for killers and survivors at higher ranks. There isn't a game out that that doesn't have this issue so stop using that as an excuse.

Ok if you want me to perfectly spell out why he doesn't need to be nerfed I will I didn't want to do a longer response but I will....

He can be looped like any other killer besides Nurse and DO NOT say oh he can shock them and stop it no he can't as long as it's a long look AKA 90% of loops they can stand on the complete opposite side of the pallet loop and be completely safe.

His power does literally nothing for him besides a bit of tracking but tracking is the weakest possible thing for a killers power a real killer gets power from a power that helps them in chases so Nurse can just blink through everything, Billy can instant down and has insane map pressure, and Huntress can throw over loops and do a melee hatchet + melee hit to down a survivor in seconds that is not near a loop.

That's pretty much it really.... he's just as weak as any other killer at chasing but actually weaker at low ranks because the Doc will try to shock a lot at loops which won't help. Only actual killers that I consider a "killer" are Nurse, Huntress, and Billy they're all amazing in a chase because Nurse blinks through everything, Billy can mind game pallets with his chainsaw though survivors may not fall for it, it'll make them drop the pallet if they know what you're trying to do and Huntress can throw hatchets over low loops and people can say "You can crouch" but the Huntress can simply keep it wound up walk around the corner and hit them anyway.

Oh, please. The killer is already kinda weak. If anything, he needs buffs.