Dear BHVR, now more than ever survivors need a nerf.

corrupt might lead to them spending the time finding your ruin totem much more often int he early game, I'll quickly scope some totems on that side of the map to get some points off of dull ones and hopefully break a hex and get some work done without being corralled onto the mid map gens or possibly being cut off going too soon to the other side of the map depending on how ######### it would be for hiding or getting around safely at that point in the game. To me, it's better than being the first guy seen and possibly caught, which would lead to a big chance of being tunneled from my more recent experiences. corrupt alone is fine, and I might combo it with tremors (and pop, since you can stall two gens periodically with those two together and find somebody that won't leave a gen with tremor and maybe find a good one to pop on), but I'm choosy what I use with it. Tremors is a good way to get amini corrupt on some gens mid game as well as finding one being worked on, it's long cooldown and short duration but great when you're having trouble finding people or stalling gen repairs. But maybe I'm just thinking that way because I don't have the fortitude to play killer often to not have to rely on those sort of crutches.

If you face survivors who do gens, you're not gonna win with fairplay and alternating hooks.

How is that an argument

It matters, because the killer is not eliminating one survivor. As long as its 1vs4, the survivors will win. If it 1vs3, the killer will win unless 1 gen is left.

If you deny the option to kill someone, then the only option left is playing 1vs4. Which is an easy task

I dont tunnel. I rarely eat DS'es, but when i do, its from yolo unhooks, doing last gens, jumping into lockers etc. All the stuff that people complain about. Like i said, i dont like tunneling and i wish this game was fairer in a basekit. But DS is the wrong solution, it gets abused.

I cant speak for Dota 2 or CS:GO, dont and never have played those games, but I think they work in a similar way to LOL in this regard. And lol has mmr in Normals. It was based on how well you were doing in normals rather than in ranked but it was still there. The problem with trying to introduce a "casual mode" in this game is....the entire game is casual, the ranking system is a poor attempt at matchmaking and thats it.

For there to be a competitive, there would have to be something to strive for/try to achieve. In most of the games you talked about its the highest rank and the prestige people feel that comes with it. Or as you said the possiblity of going pro. In league there were skins, avatar icons and other such stuff, cosmetics in general (but it stopped at a rather low rank so it was easy to get for most people. And most players in Red ranks if not all people in red ranks will tell you that rank means nothing in DBD. Its not something to strive for, because its basically a guarantee if you have played the game enough to understand most of it and just play it enough to rise in rank more than the reset takes away.

Ontop of that, piping and black piping is easier to do than depiping, at least if you try to play. Does it still happen? Ofc but considering that you have 4 posibilities and only 1 takes away rank points. Yes I know 2 pipping is a lot harder so counting it as a "equal" possiblity with the rest isn't fair. But lets say you just got rank 10. How many games would you have to lose in a row to fall out of green ranks? Over 10 games without ever pipping or black pipping. Thats basically impossible if you are trying to win and got to green ranks by your own strength.

Now that was just a side rant. My point still stands tho that if they introduced a "casual" mode I cant imagine it ever ending up in any good way without them butchering the part of the game thats fun. Now im only guessing, so correct me if im wrong. The kind of casual you are talking about is without rankings, and possibly without mmr?

Now without the rankings what happens? Well nothing. As I said rank means nothing to most if not all red rankers. A lot if not most wanna be red ranks because they have a higher chance of getting better opponents there. Those are the competitives. But there are a lot, and I do mean a lot that dont care about the competitive aspect. They want to "bully" the opponent into submission. Either trying to make them angry. Making them rage quit. Or just "torture" them with whatever advantage they have. And these people aren't just in red ranks, when mmr went loco and matched me vs a lot of low rankers I noticed that these people, while really bad at it, were trying to do the same "tricks". And trying to get the same reaction.

Now whats stopping those last people from just going into casual and, occasionally getting good players but most of the time just getting people that wanna chill and have fun? I would say MMR, but then we are back to Ranks doesnt matter, its only for matchmaking, so whats wrong with the current game mode?

EDIT: Just checked, both CS:GO and Dota 2 use MMR in unranked as well. But im still willing to be convinced, what would you suggest "casual" do different.

1. Actually it does justify it, any shorter and it would 100% be done by the time the chase is over, you want to call it an anti-tunnel perk, right? If it doesn't last long enough for a tunneller to be wary of it then it isn't an anti-tunnel perk :)
2. Then the point of no gens being done doesn't apply to pop goes the weasle being active :)
3. If killers want to claim chases last too long, but also want to claim that they're always being hit with 60 seconds of ds then which is it? Killers love to make believe that everyone is being ran for 5 gens but think 60s, so you either want the perk to be useless because every chase is super long therefore it would be deactivated once the chase is over, or you admit that chases don't last nearly as long as most killers want to make out.
4. Ahh yes, "this point doesn't matter because i don't use moris", yaaaa, tell that to the rest of the killers
5. All your PGTW points are irrelevant because it literally ties into kicking generators which of course takes absolutely no amount of effort besides a button press, there are also perks that affect skill checks, there's nothing stopping a killer kicking a gen besides that cheryl perk which even PGTW has a longer timer than.

Killers can also choose to stop a chase to kick a gen etc etc, ds is fine and mostly avoidable, only change it needs is something in end game, 2x speed skill check sounds fun :)

I do not think the problem is that survivors perks are too powerful. I think its more that majority of the killer perks feel less impactful compared to the survivor perks, especially new ones that have possible cool effects but they get put down with too many restrictions. For example, Furtive Chase on paper looks like a cool concept perk where its obesssion perk that reduces your TR over time during the match, but the perk for some reason only reduces TR in a chase and loses all its tokens when Obsession dies. So many perks have cool ideas behind them but they are not worth using which leads to a very stale narrow selection of perks creating stale gameplay that have guaranteed effects for guaranteed impact. Its super anti-fun for killer to have a dead perk slot as it makes you feel like your always on back foot from the passive nature of the survivor perks. The game in the past was different back then because less players were good at the game, so the power in the past is less relative than power in the present. I feel like killers in the past relied a bit less on perks than in the present simply because opposition was worse. Maybe that is good thing, maybe it is a bad thing. Who knows I guess.

Tbf if Furtive chase reduced your terror radius by that much outside chase, you could stack it with MnA and have 8 meter terror radius. So at the very least if it can reduce it by that much it should disappear if the obssession dies. But yeah that perk needs some love/changes.

And I do agree that some perks have a few too many restrictions(some restrictions are fine), but Im fairly certain that both killers and survivors were worse in the past. And they both learned tricks to counter playstyles or specific killers. Like looping, when survivors found out you could play a pallet for longer than one loop killers had to learn to "mind game" instead of mindlessly chasing survivors. Sure that one probably didnt take years to get around to. But I guarantee you most didn't do this back then. Why am I so certain? Because a lot still dont do it now.

yes but that would be cool. Unless you enjoy only going against the usual bbq/pop/Corrupt/Stbfl or other consistent perks. The thing with survivor is that survivor perks are so strong that even if you do not equip them, the killer often still respects them, for example they'll still slug you on the floor after unhook even if you do not have DS or they will still hit unhooker even if there is no borrow time and in this sense, it allows survivor to have perk diversity at the cost of risk. no such thing really exists for killer. Peanut is right though, killers over complain about survivor perks when they aren't in play most of the time. In some sense, they do a good job at discouraged disliked gameplay from the survivor side but it does make a bit of killer side more stressful. Its give and take.

It would be cool, but im just mostly worried if it woulld be too powerful. Technically being a permanent stealth killer seems insanely strong even if it requires 2 perks. It could be that its fair because you have to work for it, but I would say that it should probably have some sort of counter/weakness. Like Devour hope(cleanse totem)/STBFL(Obssession)

you need to hook obsession, that itself is luck based. Technically you can use Nemesis to lower luck component but now its 3 perks. Very old perks don't even require any perk synergy. STBFL is classic obesssion example. Its good single perk slot with no real requirements and limited drawback. Old survivor perks work like that as well. new survivor perks have similar problems too restrictive. I think it would be a fine perk but who knows, maybe I'm wrong.

However much like anything in this game, its justifiable use of a perk slot. If a survivor is using DS then he's not using other perks that could be useful to him. You usually find players run a balanced set of meta perks, a speed perk, a second chance perk etc. Rarely done ever see someone using all second chance perks, that is cheap but then so is using iri hatchets so I dont know what else you want to be said lol.. if theyre running all second chance perks then theyre sacrificing sneaking, gens, scratch marks, and other things.

The key thing here that fungoose and true talent and top guys like this say is "if youre spending too long chasing one survivor, you've ######### up." Or my other favourite is "if youre chasing someone who is good at looping, go for the weaker survivors." Tactically take out the weaker first and if one gets away then they get away. If you have to eat a DS then you have to eat it my friend and you have to realise when a survivor is deliberately trying to run you. Punish them later after you've got their friends out of the way.. I never see these guys struggle to not get 4ks usually and true will tunnel a survivor if he gets the chance but its not his go to play and he will happily eat a DS to get it over and done with early, ive seen him do it many times on stream.

It's barely been different for me, it's still the same sweaty high rank teams you'd face on console.

They jukes were a bit different, but they're always so easy to deal with once you just predict them.

If you're really doing that bad every game, it might just be you.

Or, you're making this all up to try and use crossplay to persuade the devs into survivor nerfs.

Really, don't have anything better to do?

How many DS do you see normally? At least half of my matches don't have obsession or DS is not chosen.

If they're like me you ask which around 70% say they are 2 man, 3 man in most instances

Are you sure about that? I've been playing DBD for almost 3yrs now and with the current DS I only get hit with it when

1. I intentionally tunnel (Something I can't even complain about because I deserved to get hit with DS)
2. Survivor's go out of their way to annoy and harass the killer just to use DS and if they fail to do so the DC
3. I could literally hook 2 other survivor's and still get punished with DS for "Playing my cards right"

I don't play with obsession perks, so it's easy for me to know if a survivor is carrying DS, and instead of tunneling right of the hook if I'm near, I down the DS user and proceed to chase the rescuer (not counting on BT cause wasn't mentioned), and if they're far, I'm pretty sure I would be in a chase by then. And you don't get 'punished', cause DS doesn't punish tunnelers, just save from being in the hook too often. Most killers tunnel and destroy teams when they realize there's no obsession. Maybe that's where " dS ToO Op anTItuNnel Perk"

Asking for survivor nerfs, like, really?

All that the survivor side needs is an extra objective to have more diverse things to do, not a nerf overall.

Since the crossplay kicked in I've had the easiest matches as killer ever, so I don't know but this sounds like you're just bad at the game.

I would just nerf DS and OoO. It would make killer games much less stressfull. For OoO complete rework and only change DS needs is that it de-activates if you go touch a generator.

o.o ive been winning every game confusing