Myers, Ghostface, and Wraith should be immune to Spine Chill in stealth.
- Other stealth killers can maybe play around Spine Chill by looking to the side, but Myers and Ghostface don't have that option since their powers require them to look at survivors. Maybe Ghostface can opt out and just go for an M1, but Myers (in tier 1 especially) does not have that option.
- Stealth is basically all Wraith has, and even then it's a pretty terrible stealth since he can be seen a mile away and must announce his presence. Wraith needs a lot of buffs, but can we at least throw him a bone on this?
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Then what would be the point of Spine Chill? Every other killer has a terror radius so the perk would just be pointless then? Nobody would use it for the speed boost. Unless you buffed the boost to work in the TR and not just when the killer was looking?
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Ghostface takes 2.5 seconds to expose someone while leaning, if I am remembering correctly, so Spine Chill isn't really that big a deal since you get to 99 someone and maybe push them off a gen for free. But Myers... Yeah, maybe spine chill should deactivate. It doesn't seem that fair, given his terrible T1.
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Doesn't spine chill activate if your within 36 meters of the survivor? Spine chill will always activate in stalking range.
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Why? So stealth killers can have extra easy mode?
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Yeah right. They are all S-tier and too oppressive even against good squads, I need every help possible to deal with them because I like to browse reddit while working on a gen.
Myers does indeed suffer from it as the only good thing about EW1, the element of suprise, is severely damaged by it.
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######### are you talking about? None of the stealth killers are good
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Either a rework or some form of limitation would be justified imo as of now it does it´s job way too good. The counterplay is stupid as ######### given the survivor has to do literally nothing to benefit from it, yet the Killer has to approach gens blind to prevent being noticed too early.
Either a lengthy cooldown or a token system should do.
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Wouldn't that completely defeat the point of spine chill I thought its supposed to be a counter to killer stealth
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I really don't care if they're considered good or not. Changing Spine Chill wouldn't make a difference. Deal with the fact you're not going to get free grabs and insta-downs on everyone.
What are you guys going to complain about next? Camaraderie lasting too long? I wouldn't be surprised.
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If you think a perk that hurts bad to mediocre Killers more so than any others having no downsides and forcing these already bad Killers into riddiculous amounts of counterplay is fine you´re unbelievably biased.
Edit: spelling
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so we should delete spine chill
okay
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I take Spine Chill all the time now, it does make stealth killers kinda lame and I doubt BHVR will change it but it would make for a much more interesting game is Spine Chill didnt exist.
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The terror radius tells you if the killer is nearby.
Spine Chill tells you if you should be worried that the killer is nearby.
Also, people would absolutely use it for the speed bonus. The informational aspects of the perk aside, its role in Vault Build alone makes it insane.
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Meyer's T1 crawling at start is a design flaw of a detriment that has to be addressed completely apart from Spine Chill. He should have the "option" by tapping Ctrl and holding it at the start of a match and just play baseline Meyers T2 from the getgo. That option left for those who want a fun stealthy first hit and not directly announcing who he is until he is actually spotted (because let's be honest 90% of meyers will stalk to T2 before anything else) - and not mess up his fun addons like Scratched mirrors which leads to jump scare meyers on indoor maps like Lerys. He's a very vanilla killer from back when the game took itself less seriously (for balance) and he survives because of his reduced T2 Terror radius (even more with Monitor and Abuse) and that he can 99% his Instant Down mode (Or even have an infinite version of it with a bit more stalking).
Now for the point of the post - Spine Chill itself is a very strong perk all rolled into one. It's minor but noticeable bonus to everything including vault speeds really doesn't even need to be in the perk but they wanted to differentiate it from Premonition without a need for a cooldown but it gives a lot more information against killers who had no idea how to play around it and red stain manipulate naturally. Good use of Spine Chill is a Stealth, Chase and Detection perk all rolled into one which is why it shows up so often in the top 10 Red Rank Survivor Meta usage.
You could just make it not detect against Undetectable or even disable it during Oblivious like Freddy's dreams as a knee-jerk but it's a single perk that probably servers as the only real answer for Survivors in a alot of scenarios where they can't see past 8m away due to walls (especially on indoor maps where Purple All Seeing Eye Wraiths and Scratched Mirror Meyers can be overwhelming) and the upcoming buffed Trail of Torment or similar perks/addons that give undetectable.
For it to see continued popular use AND be more forgiving towards newer killers who can't deal with it yet it would just need an indicator to the killer that Spine Chill has "activated" SOMEWHERE within the 36m area on something like a 15s cooldown (Just an icon on side of the screen - no sound effect necessary). At that point if Killers can't even adapt to play around a perk they are told is being used against them - then everyone has every right to call them a potato.
Obviously this will "most likely" mean its the generator they are running towards but it will allow them to be more direct feedback and be informed on how they should be playing to get around it like a better player. It would also serve as giving the killer a limited Whispers by running the perk as a downside but still allows you to gain a head start on distance even against Stealth killers and get in psuedo-information war.
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I see why your suggesting this but I disagree. Nerfing Spine Chill like this would kill it and you'd free up a perk slot.
Let's pretend your running DS, Unbreakable and Dead Hard. This will give you a new slot to choose:
- BT
- Adrenaline
- Prove Thyself
- Resilience
- Object Of Obsession (swf)
Far rather Spine Chill than these perks tbh.
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Spine chill doesn't even tell you the direction they're coming from, another complaining post that holds no value what a shocker from this place
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Like it was hard to tell apart from maybe The Game or Hawkins. When I used SC, in over 2 years not a single Killer managed to get the jump on me, and I´m not exactly a great survivor. 99% of Killers can be avoided by stealthing away when it lights up, it´s just stupid.
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lol. You clearly just play DbD in easy mode, aka as survivor, and if you think that stealth killers are good, you probably at green ranks
StEaLtH KiLleRs OP
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It's nowhere near an OP perk and if someone wastes a slot for it they deserve to have the benefit otherwise what would be the point? I've played this game since day 1 and ive seen plenty of survivors get themselves killed by being too cautious with spine chill and run right into where the killer is , it's quite pathetic people want such a weak perk nerfed there's no excuse except poor killer gameplay when there's all kinds of other broken ######### to worry about
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I think they just need to give it some counterplay that isn’t completely lame. I don’t know how they’d change it in a way they wouldn’t butcher it though
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Stealth killers aren't OP but it's sad some people are so bad at the game they want a already not so strong perk nerfed before the other real problems in this game it just shows some people are so selfish and can't own up to their mistakes they make and have to have a scapegoat to make themselves feel better , I don't run it all the time so I don't care if it's nerfed or not but it's laughable this is even a thread
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A not-so-strong perk that is run extremely often. This is why you see so many Killers running fire up, too.
You calling it pathetic that as Killer you don´t want to be forced to never look into the direction you´re going is baffling. As of bad play, I can deal with SC. My main complaint is that the counterplay is riddiculous.
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yeah and if you know the killer is nearby you're going to be looking at him.
vault build is typically Spine Chill and resilience. I've never seen someone use Spine Chill on its own for the action boost. its either for knowing when a stealth killer is coming for you or paired with resilience for faster vaults.
not really used for faster heals, gen repairs, etc
if you want to take away the stealth detection it would require a pretty substantial boost to action speeds to compensate...
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It's one perk that makes obsolete the power of 4 killers. If you don't see any problem there, well...
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Being Undetectable should at the very least, make Spine Chill have an extremely reduced range.
That's not to say it should even work when a killer is Undetectable, i'm just trying to find a middle ground.
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If I remember correctly, wasn’t Myers immune to detection perks before Undetectable was introduced? Spine chill nor Premonition worked against him while he was at Tier 1, which made him very unique, most people haven’t noticed that change.
As for spine chill, I wouldn’t say it’s OP however, it does make stealth killers suffer quite a bit, my simple change would be to just make it 20-24 meters instead of 36. And increase speed to 10. Not sure why it’s 36 meters, if a survivor runs it, they are usually on the other side of the map by the time you go check a gen they were working on.
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It's usually detrimental for survivors me so damn flighty and have no confidence in their own looping to feel the need to run this perk and use it to run off every time it lights up for more than 2 seconds (It's actually surprising that people don't combo with Resilience for actual vault build like they should like SleepyWillio said). The right decision usually is to break chase, kick the gen patrol away then strafe back to the same gen and spanking the exhausted survivor, note you don't have to be fully moonwalking though you can if you want.
Gross exaggeration, they are all far from obsolete even if there are 4 Spine Chills.
Windstorm Wraiths (because Wraith needs that basekit to not be addon depedent) really don't even care about it because he can just catch up to them anyway. Meyers... well Meyers has issues in T1 but that's a design flaw like I said. Ghostface can still easily lean and 99 plenty of spine chill gamers - it's like saying a Doctor has no chance against Calm Spirit gamers, it's just slightly harder. Pig has some other issues in general but her crouching stealth is 1/3rd of her kit and and still useable by using the existing mechanical counterplay.
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If you guys are so hell-bent on nerfing spine chill shouldn't premonition go first? It gives more value by actually providing the direction the killer is in rather than telling you the killer is looking your way somewhere in a 36 meter range , both perks aren't strong and don't need a rework OoO is way stronger than both of those perks sure it hides the killer while stealthing but the information it provides is way better than both of those others put together
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T1 Myers used to be immune to all tracking perks of survivors but they nerfed him by making him undetectable when they brought out that and oblivious into the game.
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Why is anyone even running spine chill? Rank 1 and I haven't ever used sc since install of 16'.
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you know how killers are. The easier, the better. They'll try every trick in the book to make the game less challenging. They don't want to actually have to hunt down and chase and hook survivors 3 times each, because they're afraid that someone might get away. So they look for every short cut they can take. Ebony mori for example... I hate those things.
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But then why even run the perk? It's balanced because you're wasting a perk slot for the information rather than using it on a broken perk combo, so I guess you would all rather have someone run DS, OoO, Unbreakable etc.. when someone wants to use a perk for information rather than a crutch that carries them that should be welcomed not complained on
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You are right, I hate Object with a passion as it is the single most busted perk in the game when used by SWF.
And no, since premonition has somewhat adequate limitations whereas SC doesn´t.
How can you deny SC isn´t strong when very, very many players in red ranks run it? Do you think they are all trolling or deliberately handycapping themselves?
They are running it because it´s so good. For not-so-great survivors like me it´s a convenient crutch to never get snuck upon and always have ample time to make a stealthy escape.
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Good survivors won't be using Spine Chill. They'll be using DS, BT, Unbreakable, Adrenaline, Exhaustion perks, etc.
Frankly you should be happy that they took Spine Chill instead of one of those.
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I agree but it's not a crutch , would you rather have them run DS or something broken? That's what you're asking for by nerfing this perk , it's a information perk thats a guessing game but just says be aware basically , it should be welcomed when people don't abuse crutch perks is my point and it's strong against stealth because that's what it was made for if it were any other killer you would hear them coming a mile away anyway
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Easy fix for Spine Chill. Reduce detection range to 32-28m OR remove action benefits.
Reduced range still counters stealth but not as hard.
Remove action speed boost because the detection is good enough on it's own.
One or the other would be sufficient.
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Actually I´d trade DS for SC any day when I play Myers or Ghostface, I basically never get hit by it anyway.
I think we can agree to disagree on the guessing-aspect of it since our experiences seem to be vastly different in that regard.
I agree, it´s obviously an anti stealth tool. It does it´s job too good though imo.
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Nice generalization you just made. And I'm going to take a estimated guess based on what you said that your play survivor more (it wouldn't make sense to disrespect your own side unless it was outlandish but that's not the case). "They'll use every trick in the book to make the game less challenging" even though survivors have a build that makes them immortal for 60 seconds? And they also have a perk that tells you what killer you are facing at the start of a match and is busted against low terror radius killers? "They don't want to have to chase and hook survivors 3 times each, because they're afraid someone might get away" I'm not scared that someone might get away hell if I get a 6-9 hook game with 2 kills I'll be happy. What I'm scared of is playing fair and trying that and getting tea bagged at the exit gates with only 4 hooks. Also I agree with your stance on moris but that's the only thing I agree on with your biased statement
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Well something should change, as a perk shouldn't be able to hard counter stealth killers. That's why I said reduced range, it keeps the perk useful but no longer becomes such a big counter.
DS + Unbreakable (UB itself is fine) combo should be nerfed too, as well as OoO. Trying to say running it is balanced because you could run more broken stuff instead means none of it is balanced.
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Yep I guess that's where we have our differences but I also want to point out that spine chill is the one of the only real counters to stealth killers in this game that doesn't require you to be in a bad situation already to have use of the perk , and alot of maps are open and by the time you have spine chill you can already see them heading your way anyway , this won't be nerfed due to the amount of things that can make a killer undetectable now and also it's a counter to spirit and nurse not only stealth killers
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If sat just reduce spinechills range if the killer is undetectable. That way theres time to get away with a bit of a headstart but not enough time to hide effectively
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Survivors need strong perks to run. Nerfing Spine Chill just means more people will just use the same meta perks over and over again because there's no reason to run anything else.
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So stealth killers can stealth. Can't be that hard to figure out.
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No, beacause a stealth killer must be stealth, logic. But, no, leave Spine chill alone ! 🤗
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Ghostface is very good. Myers is too. The only one that's bad is wraith.
Premonition is much worse than spine chill. Spine chill tells you that the killer is close and coming to you. All premonition does is let you know what direction the killer is in, and it has a bs cool down too.
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Wraith or Myers sure.
I dunno about GF though. He has no terror radius, doesnt need to uncloak to attack and some gens are in a blind spot. He literally gets a free hit.
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As if games last long enough for killers to have 12 chases and 12 hooks unless the survivors are allergic to gens that's never gonna happen.
I personally like chasing but the game punishes long chases so killers don't commit to them too hard.
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A good survivor will use this perk when he play random.
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- It hard counters stealth killers.
- It helps players know whether it's safe to do gens in the killer's terror radius, since if the killer is looking away from you, you're probably not in danger.
- It gives a visual warning that is perceptible sooner than the terror radius audio. This is useful against killers with faint edge TR audio (Like Oni) and killers who can threaten you very quickly after you enter their terror radius (Like Blight).
- It provides 6% bonus vault speed, which can be stacked with Resilience for a very strong 15% buff.
- It can give info on whatever the hell Spirit is doing in Phase
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No
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