ngl I'm getting pretty tilted with the amount of keys recently.
(Inb4 "Just bring franklins 4head")
Been a lot of key gamers recently since the mori nerf, probably since they know keys will be nerfed soon and that the mori nerf was a massive red flag. Maybe they should've been changed at the same time to avoid this exact issue happening.
Anyway, I've seen quite the varying playstyles with them. I've seen people get a 3 man escape out of a 3 gen with a key they've got from a chest with NO chest perks.
I've seen somebody literally let their 2 teammates die on hook for BOTH stages and get out for free with a key.
And finally I've seen the people who are so bad at the game that they don't even get to use the key in the first place.
So, this begs the question, when keys are changed, are they going to be changed correctly?
The current rework people want which is letting only 1 person escape with them does NOT fix the core issue with the item - getting effortless, undeserved escapes after a bad game. As long as people bring one or more key then it's just as BS as before.
Will keys be removed from chests? I don't run chest builds myself, but my friend who runs them got a key in 4 of the 6 survivor games he had. If keys are still going to appear out of pure luck they shouldn't be strong, at all.
Idk, I just really don't have faith that keys are going to be changed in a good way.
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Yeah on top of all the key gamers the devs need to stop adding hatch challenges until keys get balanced, I'm pretty confident that the change will be pretty good, it's clear they haven't changed keys along side mori's due to how much work is required to rework them instead of just a number change. If I were to guess I think they'll add an animation to opening hatch so it's not instant, and the hatch will probably stay open for a shorter time or only let one person through. While this doesn't completely fix the issue, I can't see them doing anything more then that because the whole point of keys and mori's are to make games that you might not have won winnable. A healing or generator repair requirement to activate it wouldn't really make sense on an item. I think they'll probably also make it so the better the key you have the faster the hatch opens, green will still probably suck as not to create an influx of usable keys, but I think it would be really cool to make it so that the purple key takes twice as long to open hatch as the pink one, and maybe the amount of time the hatch is open will change depending on the key and they'll change some of the add-ons so that you can make hatch stay open longer.
This turned from a response to me spewing ideas but either way I don't think the key change will be that bad, it will at least be better then what we currently have.
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I just ignore them tbh, I've never had a problem with them really.
I either curbstomp them so bad it's not an issue for me or I lose so bad they never needed it anyways, and usually don't use it because they get more points for a normal escape.
The killer reveal addon is a little gross tho.
Either way they'll get a nerf too eventually, till then just gotta deal with it or dodge the games. I can't tell you what you can do about it if they pull one out at the last second, but you can do -the thing- and dodge the game if you are THAT bothered by them in the meantime.
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Tbh that effectively would put it in line with how the new Mori's work. Seems perfect honestly.
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That's a really interesting idea that seems very obvious, but clearly not many people have thought about it. I think that would honestly be one of the better options out there, changing the spawning rule itself would eliminate a lot of frustration of survivors escaping super early and would also make it a lot simpler for new players to understand instead of the current rules. The question is whether the devs have thought about this or if they're overthinking things.
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Yeah but it's also BHVR too.
People were telling BHVR to just make mori's only useable on second hook for YEARS and they wouldn't do it. Anytime they were cornered on the matter they would get defensive about how complicated or delicate the matter was or some nonsense, and apparently it wasn't that hard at all they finally did it years later!
So I dunno, simple changes seem to be a mountainous ordeal for BHVR for some odd reason.
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Tunnel them.
Make them understand what it means to bring a key into a lobby.
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I think the key changes are planned for around christmas 2021, the change being that opening the hatch now requires a 1 second chaneling. Chances of keys spawning in a chest reduced by 1%.
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I mean I sometimes take a broken key to make killers do that, and then run them for like 3 - 5 gens because they don't break off; I pull all aggro while my teammates rush the gens. So works for me haha.
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Just play Nurse.
Easiest solution imo
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Yeah,i had the same idea back then.
It's really the easiest and most fairest solution to keys
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Oh man, I like this. I really, really like this. It fixes so many things.
The fact BHVR said fixing keys is more complicated than fixing moris means this is almost definitely not that they're going to do, which is very disappointing because damn, I like this. This change to the hatch makes sense. It's easy and fixes so many things (DCs and hatch camping and keys) and makes sense.
Damn, man. Just... damn.
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Why'd you have to show us this?! Now I'm going to be sad when their fix turns out to be something dumb like creating an unlocking animation that takes 10 seconds, which helps in a chase but doesn't help against the three survivors who found the hatch that spawned next to a completed gen the killer has no reason to go near. Hell, I'm already sad.
You've made me sad.
(I'm actually just playing Animal Crossing and drinking tea, but I could be sad.)
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Kinda weird but isn't that the case like prior to End game collapse update?
Then again it's been quite some time and I must be remembering wrong and all I remember prior to EGC is the hatch stand offs with the last survivor lmao
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Nah, pretty sure you're remembering it wrong. The hatch spawn conditions were mostly the same as they are now, but they were actually more strict. At least two generators needed to be complete for the hatch to spawn if only one survivor was alive.
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https://deadbydaylight.fandom.com/wiki/Hatch
- The Hatch now always spawns and opens when there is only one last Survivor remaining in the Trial (used to only spawn and open if there were at least 2 repaired Generators).
Went and looked it up. That update came with the addition of the EGC. Since I started playing Halloween 2018, it's always been # of survivors alive + 1 for how many generators needed to be repaired for the hatch to spawn. And before the EGC, that held true even if only one survivor were alive.
I wasn't playing DbD in 2017, so I don't know how it worked at that time. Could've been totally different.
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Hatch spawned with four alive and only four gens done. Working as intended, I see. lol
Yeah, sometimes I'm amazed the game runs at all. I won't even be surprised when my PS4 bursts into flames one day when I try to start up DbD; I'll just be wondering what took it so long.
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I did see an increase in keys, but I just equip franklyn's and camp the ######### out of the item. Ngl it gives me a sense of evil satisfaction seeing a survivor rage dc when they realize I have franklyn's. 😈
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Honstely, i dont think keys are that bad. It gives solo survivors a chance that are screwed over by their teammates. Also, the game ends at least. When i played killer, i didnt care about a 3k or 4k, because both meant i won big anyway.
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I've had a few extra key users in my matches as killer but I've not had many key escapes happen in my recent matches, despite not running anything "anti key" and sticking to my normal gameplay. Just because they're in the lobby doesn't mean they will get used effectively as the survivors still have to get all the gens done or a majority at least, unless I've already killed 50% of them, and it's amazing how many people use the key add on that protects the key in the event of your death, so the key is pretty useless to the rest of the team if that person dies.
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I´ve encountered far more keys than usual, too. Feels really dumb getting 1-3 Kills robbed because of 1 item. They work the exact same way for Survivors as (now) old moris worked for Killers and should be dealt with accordingly. Not much can be done about it, a competent team will pretty much always put the key to good use.
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I've gotten a lot with appraisal. I wish they didnt nerf hoarder cuz that would rly help against these keys
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The protect the key on death addon becomes so much more meh when you get more keys on your survivor.
like i got around 20 skeleton keys and 10 dull keys i would rather just run addons that allow me to use my skeleton key's aura reading then protect it since i have so many of them.
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I don't understand why killers just don't take a break until then, and only come back if the keys are on equal ground to mori removal meaning if they can't die early they can't escape early and just not coming back until that's the case? Can't really complain if you still are willing to be killers. If you took a break for months and survivors could still escape early under any circumstances while being unable to be killed early under any then there would be room for complaint, but in that case, just don't come back until they make the game fun again? swf could threaten to quit all theyw ant but the game could survive ata low pop without them with balanced queue times, but the game without killers and without bots to replace them would just be a lobby simulator. That's called leverage, time to use it and stop complaining.
Enough killers removing themselves from queue would work, but even better would be placing themselves into survivor queues instead to really bump up the queue so that enough of them quit or complain since their voices are the only really heard. Put those voices to work for yourselves. If 2020 taught you anything, your three main takes should be that 1: most people actually are naive or even stupid, 2: most would turn on you easily with the right circumstances if they even liked you to begin with and weren't just conveniently being peaceful with you, 3: you can't make your own omelet without breaking somebody else's eggs. Just do it.
Or keep being an unpaid behavior employee in their entertainer department. There is nothing wrong with volunteer work, just understand that's all killer is. You volunteer to make 4 other total strangers that couldn't care less about you have fun for a few minutes at the expense of your own time, fun and fulfillment.
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I actually haven't seen much of keys, same as before.
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Same here... I've had like a max of 2 key games in like 20 games, If we're not counting broken keys, it's more like 1. Everyone's talking like keys are in every game meanwhile I've only seen one black lock key and they said they brought it for the hatch challenge.
Keys aren't that bad IMO. Maybe it's because I play Nurse though.
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Yup, constantly losing matches that I should have won because of keys. Its like they know our moris got nerfed into the ground and they want to key as often as possible while they have a significant edge
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They did give us a warning to be fair. They said they realize how problematic keys and moris are and would be changed "soon". 1 "soon" later and moris were nerfed. Keys will be too, just more effort is required than changing a 1 to a 2. This community is so overdramatic. One change happens and it's always "what about...".
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I mean I brought a key for roughly 8 matches in a row last night because I had to escape from 5 trials. Not once did I ever actually use the key to escape. I either got out the exit or the hatch was opened because I was the only one left.
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I bet you'd rather have your car keyed at this point.
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As much as I am not a key user myself, I find it hard to believe that every single key carrier is bad at the game, some people just like to bring it as a wildcard, in case their teammates are trash/trolls (and trust me, I've seen quite a lot of those). Still, someone escaping through a hatch is not, by any means, bound to an "undeserved" escape. I mean, sure, I'd rather walk out the gates as a survivor, and not get a hatch escape as a killer, but still.
Moris, on the other hand, were quite the opposite. And they changed them in a good way, they balanced them. It took them a long while, but they did. I'm going to trust the same will apply to keys, as in those will be nerfed, but not become completely worthless.I suggested removing keys from chests if one is equipped before the trial starts, and only having the key carrier escape through an hatch opened that way.
You can't really remove that aspect from keys, tbh, as that is pretty much the only reason why keys are used, to begin with. Some people use aura reading add-ons on them, but ultimately they serve the purpose of hatch opening. So I guess that one survivor, at the very least, will always be able to use a key to escape. Personally, I don't have much of an issue with that. I can live without a kill, which is something that most killer mains on these forums seem not to be able to do.
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Especially since its my wife's car lol
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I imagined Al Bundy saying that lol
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Run Forever Freddy or Iri Head slug, survivors want to troll.. do it back
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Surprisingly, I’ve actually seen less keys than usual. Doesn’t mean they aren’t a problem though, hope the nerf comes soon for everyone that’s being swamped with them. I just dodge them when I see them.
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if the times they're playing the queue length is 10 to 20 minutes in their area that's the best way to deter bad behavior or undesired gameplay, by dodging the lobbies you don't like, and also crashing or closing the game by/on the offerings screen to counter those that hold off till 16 seconds to suddenly swap out their sooperdooper trolly swf setup and think they're gonna finally get a chance to use it
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They are "that" bad if going against a team who knows what they are doing and bring map offerings along with that stupid Vigo's blueprint offering. Just not that much of a problem for nurse.
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Simple solution. Everyone play Nurse.
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Yea but I play slinger, and he has no pressure so most of my games get to at least 3 to 1 gens remaining assuming I don't lose.
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Usually when someone brings a Key and I'm the killer, only one person makes it out. Big whoop, congrats on their end and GG. I don't have any problems with Keys and honestly bringing franklins does nothing. From the perspective of Survivor, just remember where you got hit and boom go back. It's that not hard.
There are Hatch challenges, this is true so what can you do? I have to complete the same dang challenges lmao. From the perspective as a Killer, I understand the frustration but it's not as much frustration as when a David smacks me in the face with a pallet, t bags, and then blinds me ._. Keys don't bother me, nasty players do. CURSE YOU DAAAAVIIIID....
If they played good, did gens and were respectable(not total you-know-whats), iiiiight take that hatch, get outta my face, and complete your challenge- good on you m8 as far as im concerned.
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I love imagining the look on their faces when they can’t quickswitch to their key in the last 6 seconds (I can still leave the lobby during the last 16 seconds) and actually use it because I close out the game too fast. Sorry, but I’m not letting you use your busted item. Maybe another Killer will.
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There is also an achievement related to the hatch as well. If people are worried about keys being changed, they may be trying to get lucky for their trophy/achievement.
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^ I agree with Lyfe right here.
Just bring nurse with IF and slug ezpz.
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Yep, nice and easy solution, but with the potential to increse slugging for 4k.
I posted my own idea working quite similar a few months ago: Keys being only usable when EGC timer is running. So you could only use it when the killer closed the hatch themselve (so only the last one can get out), or when a gate was opened (so the achievement can still be done).
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Worrying about the killer bringing a Mori to counter was the biggest reason I didn't use keys.
Now I got a huge stockpile to use up before they change too :D
(They shoulda waited and did them both imo)
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It'll give you more satisfaction quickly closing the app on console or having task manager open and tabbed to so you can let the offerings show up a split second first just to really let them think they made it before closing their dreams down lol. both sides get their offerings back with no dc so it's harmless. But real satisfying, plus beats afking 5 minutes. That's what they did to killers every time they saw amori anyways, I would roll my eyes wondering if I would have to not be the first found by the killer or wondering if I was gonna be going straight back into queue from survivors doing that ont he offering screen every time the other 3 guys in a lobby looked suspicious or were all 3 pc players lol. So survivors dished it out long enough, it's time for killers to let them sit through along loading screen to see that somebody dropped during load and that they gotta start their queue over again. The end of 2020 should be full of examples of that which goes around comes around.
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If I still bothered to touch killer, which I don't plan to even for rifts, I'd simply dodge a lobby where somebody didn't ready up or had a key especially with a flashlight combined and when on steam them all also being clearly on pc or when on console them all having the crossplay icon on their group. Killer would get another lobby in seconds at least the time of day I played where I live. And if I did let one pull the old switcheroo I'd just task manager kill the process byt he offering screen or hold the ps button and kill the app on the homescreen on ps5 so they'd go right back into a long queue and I wouldn't burn an offering lmao. Once killers get tired enough of the bs they'll start doing that on a larger scale for those that still play as killers. So burn those keys while you still have a chance given by them. I'd honestly started doing the same myself on my survivor characters thats till had keys before uninstalling to make room for other games lmfao
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That's almost the same thing as only spawning the hatch once the gens have been completed or only one survivor is left. The difference is that DCing for the hatch is still viable with the EGC method, as is hatch camping. Also, the "Where did they go!?" achievement becomes a lot more difficult if they have to open the gate, and it's a pretty annoying achievement to get as-is.
If the hatch conditions are changed instead of the key conditions, it'd be a lot easier for new players to understand because whenever a closed hatch is visible a key can be used.
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curious under what conditions these games were in they a key caused you to lose the game entirely?
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Blame the devs. I saw TONS of ebony moris before the nerf and they were already more common than keys ever were. There's also the challenge in the tome again. I personally hate keys as a solo survivor. Killers have no idea how many times one person has screwed over other teammates by refusing to help with gens and then leaving.
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Well the most recent one i can think of was:
-1 gen left, 3 survs alive, im playing blight
-downed 2 right near the hatch, the 3rd is injured
-stepped away to see if 3rd was near, step a bit farther away as I have nurses and didn't know they had a key
-Turn around to see the 3rd running to the downed survivors and think "no way he picks them up in time before I get there with my rush"
-3rd surv opens the hatch just in time for all 3 to escape, my lethal rush just barely whiffing past the back of his head
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