I feel like non-pallet stuns, should be shorter, and grant equivalent distance through a speed burst
Not touching pallet stuns (or flashlight saves which count as stuns)
I feel like a lot of the issue that comes from decisive strike, head on, and perks that create stuns the killer has to deal with, comes from the fustration of being stunned - no one likes to stand still for 5s, watching their charecter be injured. (Decisive strike also requires some additional work, or tweaking but still)
So why not make gameplay more reactive? the killer is stunned for a shorter period of time, but survivors get an equivalent sprint burst that allows them to travel the same distance they would have, had the stuns been the same time that they already are at the moment. This would slightly buff killers, by allowing them to be "Active" after a shorter period of time, but still reward survivors who actually pull of these stuns with the same amount of distance.
It would reward singular survivors, over an entire team as well. Playing killer is a time efficency game at times, working against the clock to sacrafice survivors before they finish all the generators and escape. Making killers stunned by lets say decisive strike, for 3s, rather then 5s, would be a huge gain in time efficency. having the potential to be stunned by multiple decisive strikes, can technically leave a killer "inactive" for up to 20's of a match.
Making stuns shorter, but giving a temp speed increase to achieve the same distance, would feel far less punishing, but achieve essentially the same effect for a surviour if their smart about it. if a survivor traveled lets just say 20m in the time it took for a decisive strike stun, im saying that they should still be able to travel that exact 20m with a 3s stun, or a 2s stun.
pushing the stun down to 3s, would make max stun time by being hit by all 4 12's. an 8s decrease to doing nothing in a match, which can become groan inducing expecially when you thought their decisive strike ran out. Making sure the survivor can gain the same amount of distance, or atleast equivalently not-nerfing it in the aspect of just decreasing the stun is key here however. a 3s stun, with no speed increase is just 2s less of distance a survivor can gain.
Pallet stuns are 2s. they feel a lot less grating, on people because their short, even if at times they can grant as much distance as a good decisive strike or head on (or let you go behind cover/protection which can be even more valuable.) They feel fair and balanced, because their balanced around their enviroment.
TLDR : Whilst i don't have a problem with head on speciifcally, and think decisive strike could use some more tweaking, i feel that stun time's for perks should be lowered in order to feel less grating and like you can't do anything, with survivors being granted an on-stun, sprint burst effect, to grant equivalent distance to what they have now. This isn't looking to nerf these perks, just make them more reactive and involved to play against.
Edit : Suggestion by Dustin below - making decisive strike cause exhaustion. (still single use or changed to make it even more of an anti tunnel perk.)
Comments
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This would have a significant effect on how useful Enduring is, in that it would make it far worse. Conversely, it would make these effects much worse vs Nurse (yikes!), spirit, slinger, huntress, and kinda Blight and Billy. It also hurts the ability of these perks to allow you to make creative jukes to break chases and pushes the game into more of an eternal looping mindset.
However, I agree that the main issue with these effects is the loss of control. I think this is a very insightful read on why people dislike these perks, despite the fact some of them aren't even really that good right now! A lot of the problems killer face are more 'gamefeel' than 'power level.'
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The twins is one of the worst. Exit back to charolette and it's like, loading, loading, stunned, nurse fatigue and then legion slow.
It's like holy cow could you not balance this killer in literally any other way than turning me into a statue?
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This would make Head-On stuns worse, because you wouldn't be able to help your teammates as much and I don't even know how it would work for flashlight saves (which person gets the speed boost?).
If the Wrath gets burned while in proximity to multiple survivors do they all get the speed boost or just one of them? If multiple, how close do your teammates have to be to get the boost when you stun him?
I mean have you seen how inconsistent getting protection hits is? It would be like that only even worse.
It would just be way too complicated to get this done right and what do you get out of it? A pretty minor QoL upgrade for the killer.
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Never said once that it should be affected by enduring...? And it could make it worse for those charecters, but your also making the same exact distance? ie the stun is shorter, but the survivor gets a speed boost to compensate and make the same distance as default.
the result is to make the stun feel less punishing, even though it effectively has the same effect, and less like your waiting you know. 5 whole seconds.
I mean, i didn't even think of that, but yeah i completely agree. Just stuns in general feel horrible gameplay wise. I mean sure, they should be balanced and it shouldn't be "instant" but at the same time, it does feel really odd, switching between the two.
I mean, i was refering to it in reference to decisive strike and maybe head on. The survivor jumping off the shoulder would get a speed boost. and even if it did effect head on, i'd suggest only lowering it by a second (which would really only reduce the chances of chaining head ons due to the 3s charge up, meaning two survivors wouldn't as easily be able to get into two lockers next to each other)
Wraith would be uneffected. thats a flashlight stun, and i specifically said at the start of my post not including pallet or flashlight stuns. why would it effect that? im talking about perks that are like decisive strike (and any others they choose to add to the game.) also wraith being able to be broken out of stealth by a flashlight always felt horrid to me anyways. he's massively punished for it, and it seems rather unneccessary in the state of the game atm.
if a survivor pulls off a flashlight stun, they should be rewarded (and the stun is only 3s, compared to ds which is 5s.)
And it wouldn't be a minor quality of life upgrade, it would be rather major tbf.
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OP I honestly agree with your suggestion purely because your goal is Decisive should be more reaction on both sides rather than the killer is out of the game for a long period. I'd agree with all stun perks having a much shorter stun duration but in return the survivor gets a speed burst for a short period making up what would be the same distance. The effects would be far less noticeable on killer and you could stop BS like survivors getting grabbed to perform hook saves and such with DS. However it would be exactly what it was meant to be in the first place. An anti-tunnel perk. The other perks are debatable but I like the suggestion for DS and if anything it could become an exhaustion perk.
Your suggestion is pretty much the only one I've seen so far that in my view fairly addresses this and I'm surprised no one has mentioned it before and if they have I've missed it this long.
This is why I find it more fun to just slug as The Twins otherwise it's unfun to play them. I'm just going to say it - Make the transition instant and move from there on balance changes for The Twins.
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Thank you Dustin. im sure ds would need a bit more adjustment besides this, but bringing it inline with things like adrenaline - causes exhaustion but is exempt from exhaustion, and making it far more reactive on both sides would be incredible for the game. I'm actually going to add that to the main post as another suggestion
on the twins though, instant would probably be jarring, but having the fade in be max a second long would be great. putting a cooldown on attacking could solve instantly attacking out of switching. concerned about the balance of it because i understand why they have the stun, but i also think it could be handled better, as even with the stun its jarring. Having a slight nurse style fatigue to prevent instantly attacking, but regaining full control could be massive in making the killer feel more enjoyable to play, not that they aren't already.
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My point is that enduring would be worse because negating a shorter stun in exchange for the the faster speed is a worse deal.
The reason it would make those killers stronger is because chase distance matters significantly less to them, and preventing them from using their power is the important part of a stun. Like nurse doesn't care if you got a speed boost.
One potential solution to the power issue is to instead of full stunning these killers in this hypothetical change, making it merely lock out the power for the same amount of time. So if you stun a nurse (which is hard and SHOULD be rewarded) she both can't blink for 1.whatever seconds, AND you speed boost away, to simulate the stun.
Inevitably though, this is an instance of limited camera controls (which I think SHOULD be reduced on killer, especially in the case of pickups which don't need them at all because flashlight saves while your anim locked are a bad mechanic) are important, as the camera control loss when stunned is important for jukes. Perhaps it could be emulated by having you get the slowed sensitivity effect for slightly longer than a stun makes you look down, but not as long as the full stun?
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Nah. In fact, I believe that killer powers should also be disabled for about five seconds in cases of "non-pallet stuns", to help prevent tunneling further (looking at you Spirit and Nurse).
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