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Serious question: Why are killers treated as second class players?
Like I get it survivors are the majority and spend the most money so their needs are met first.
But at the same time without killers then the survivors will have no killers to play with
and then that means no survivor can play games so they won't spend money.
So why are killers treated like ######### again? You need us to play the game.
Comments
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When are we treated like second hand players? Can you be more specific?
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dying light gets nerfed in months.
DS gets nerfed in years.
Moris get nerfed
keys ?????????????????
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You’re joking right?
Killers are getting constant buffs. Great reworks for struggling killers, Great new perks and some very solid new killers. On,y real issue is matchmaking but MMR is their priority at the moment
Solo survivors are really the ones treated like garbage
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Depends where you look rn most DBD platforms have survivor bad killer good hivemind but other its the other way around. I just think the Devs are bad at balance and dont particularly care which side it effects. The reason most SWFs are toxic is because there is 4 of them. I doubt any of them would be insulting killers without 3 people to back them up. Just like the game the EGC is a 4v1 in a SWF situation and a 1v1v1v1v1 in a solo Q situation.
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Dying light and DS were released at the same time
Ds actually got reworked first
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EDIT: Realized it's yet another thread by the same killer main with an extreme bias against anything survivor, so this post wasn't worth it lol.
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Killers are only treated badly by survivors that only play the survivor role. If more survivor only players played killer then we wouldn't continue to have the same complaining that pops up on the forums everyday.
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First time on an online game?
People find lots of joy in tormenting or bullying others.
Where they might balk in real life due to the consequences, internet anonymity is too strong.
Not much more to say besides try not to let it bother you.
I'll leave on this: My boyfriend recently started playing and loses Killer a lot. I asked him how he dealt with the "bullying". He said "I don't mind losing or them T-Bagging, because at least they are having fun. I am sure it is not fun for them when they are all on the hook. Its a give and take".
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As a killer main, can we not agree on the fact that 1 hook moris were too powerful? Keys are problematic, but that isn't as simple as just changing the hook requirement for moris.
The devs aren't playing favorites.
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then release mori nerf the same day as key nerf
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One of them was an easier fix than the other. Patience, they'll figure it out eventually.
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I don't think they are.
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Yeah but having to do 2hooks on each and every survivor just to mori them is lame. Mori are pink offering and should be somewhat useful but as they stand right now they don't save you any time compared to a 3hook and rob you of some perk that activate on hooks (BBQ or PoP for instance).
I'd have prefer for mori to require something like 6hooks totals before being used. That mean half the survivor are on dead hook anyway.
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They... aren't? At least not anymore. Back in the Starbreeze days absolutely. But nowadays things feel more even handed. That said the attitude to Survivor VS killer bugs hasn't shifted. The smart option from a business sense is to fix the survivor ones first as it affects the majority, but some time frames for killer bug fixes have been absurd.
Also why do reworks as simple as something like the new Clown bottles take almost a year from first announcement to be added?
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Three questions:
How long are you playing (since when?)?
At which Rank are you playing?
Do you even play Survivor?
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LMAO that comment made me laugh so hard, and pretty much sums up how I feel about some people on here. 😂
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I'm rank 3
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but if the fix was so simple then they could have literally fixed it at any time before the nerf but didn;t.
So again, why couldn't they have ######### waited during key nerf
why the rush now?
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I see these types of post come up all the time, and I'm both annoyed and vaguely amused at the same time. Some of them claim Killers are the red-headed stepchild, while others claim it is the Survivors. Both viewpoints are nonsense, and born of intense bias and an unwillingness to accept reality. I'm going to point a few things out to you. You can learn from these facts, or you can ignore them and live in a self-serving fantasy world.
- DbD requires both roles for the game to function; there are no Bots.
- There being more Survivors than Killers doesn't matter because without at least 1 per 4 there is no game.
- The DEV (and company behind them) do not have favorites; their job is to keep the Ques moving.
- If the Que bogs down or the game tips to far to one role or the other, they lose players, and thus money.
- BEhavior doesn't like losing money, and works very hard to keep things moving and roughly balanced.
- Most people in DbD play both roles, i.e. Killer and Survivor.
- Many people indulge in extremely myopic behavior.
- Many people indulge (or suffer from) confirmation bias.
- Myopic behavior and confirmation bias combine to create selfish, entitled jerks (all genders).
- Some people then come here and post nonsensical rants about favoritism on the part of BEhavior.
So which do you think is more likely:
- The DEV (and the company behind them) just like Survivors better, and are willing to flush their profits down the toilet and kill the golden goose to make them happy.
- You are one of those people discussed in 7-10 above?
- Or you are just frustrated and you let your emotions run away with you this time, failing to look at the big picture. And now that you understand the facts, you can consider things in a less biased way?
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You just keep making extremely Killer-biased threads, Ive lost counter. Are you sure the game is extremely unbalanced or are you overestimating your skill? You may not be as good as you think you are.
Survivors are not bots, they are players like you and players can outplay other players, if you are getting demolished either you instrospect and look at what you are doing wrong and what went wrong or stay the same and keep getting stomped because you refuse to learn from your mistakes or go play Solo Survivor and enjoy the overpowerness yourself...
I like this post, I like it a lot.
I dont think I could have written it better.
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So survivors can say we killers don't matter because we are the minority.
but when I suggest you can't play the game if killers quit then we still don't matter because we are killer mains?!
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The fix for keys was removing them entirely.
Winning the game by not completing your objectives is not a recipe for a fun or balanced game.
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XD Great reworks?? XD
Whew, I laughed so hard.
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Oh Tony, where would we be without your very thoughtful threads every day. Surprised you haven't taken McCote's place yet
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100% this game is balanced towards surviviors without a doubt.
Surviviors control the flow of the game, they decide how long it will last, what map will be selected (majority rule, 1 killer v 4 survs), in modern day if they want to bring on a op addon that never got touched for them (keys) and if you are going vs a swf bully squad that is good you might as well actually just leave the game because the gens are going to be popped so fast that by the time you find someone yet alone hit them one gen pops and another gen is going to be completed soon, the list goes on.
The fact bully swf squads are a thing is a testament to poor balance, otherwise these things would not exist.
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Doctor? Bubba? Clown?
Billy was a bit heavy handed but he is still great
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It's him
it's the one I constantly made jokes about but wasn't sure was actually real
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The way people like you talk about their role getting treated like "second class players" feels borderline offensive and a gross misrepresentation of how BHVR actually handles things. BHVR is slow as hell to change anything, yes, but this feel like you're trying to suggest that you're an oppressed class.
Just stop, ew.
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Nah man, I feel like killers are in a rare timeline where they have an upper hand for once.
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I'm rank 3 consistently getting 4ks and cannot pip despite doing everything I need to do.
meanwhile survivors can ######### up as much as they want and pip
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The real question, before you ask why we are treated badly, is are we treated badly? In what way, by whom, and when?
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Doctor is still a terrible killer, he can only stop certain loops if the surviviors know how to loop around most things while playing vs him, and all his kit is used for is info.
Bubba is actually the only one who got a real rework, he is good but the issue is windows totally counter his ability making it totally useless which wouldn't be a issue if pallets didn't become major mindgames in which you have to guess if the survivors is going to keep running or drop the pallet and in the case they drop the pallet you likely get knocked on the head and cancel your ability, unless they threw it early then you can instantly break it saving time, however you are forced to walk into pallets basically because if you stop in your ability and they instead of throwing pallet they keep running you likely are to go into tantrum effectively making you waste too much time. it boils down to if the survivor is bad at the game, easy 4ks, if they are decent however and understand his weaknesses, you now have a 1/3 chance guess to guess the correct play the survivor makes and if you guess wrong you waste more time in chase.
Clown's rework is unusual to say the least, they really only changed his addons, his ability works pretty much the same with slight improvement, and he has all of the major old issues he had before, like long loops only now with a tonic that I am not even sure what to do with and therefore only see its use 5% of the time when going across the map as it makes anyone who goes into it faster and has a delay.
Billy was not a rework, it was just a nerf in sheeps clothing, all it really did was remove certain good addon(s), useless addons, and give him a dumb mechanic that makes him unviable unless you are amazing at billy naturally and can hit every chainsaw even if they are hard to hit within a time window, otherwise your gauge fills up and you can't use your ability. They should of never touched him, he was a high skill killer, that had plenty of counter play, and now for most people don't play him because that mechanic is stupid and bubba now does better,
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4k is a perfect victory in my book, you can give me 0 pips but if I see 4 skulls I know I have achieved my best no matter what nonsensical calculations were used to measure my success
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At this point. I'm pretty sure OP is a master baiter.
Too much time on their hands, amongst other things.
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Doctor is still great at antiloop but you have to have good timing. His madness T3 can also be used for stopping gens at opportune times
If you want a good idea of how to use the antidote @TheClownIsKing made a great guide
Billy did need a slight nerf but I agree they went overboard on him
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you look at trickster and tell me there is a god.
BHVR thought he was strong enough to be playable. That's bad.
they even nerfed his trick knives too they don't deal double damage.
they don't want to release strong killers anymore and this shows
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No, if they surv understands the doctor then no, I am talking about base doctor and haven't used addons however so maybe he is a killer that needs addons (which is dumb imo)
Noted, I will look at that actually.
Why would you think billy needed a nerf, and how would you even nerf him?
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Doctor has range add ons which are nice but not necessary. Otherwise he doesn’t really need them
The only nerf billy needed was to his add ons. Things like tuning guide and primer bulb were way too strong
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I actually forgot about those addons for Billy, I agree actually.
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I just got a 4k because survivor rush unhooks near me which gave me stacks for STBFL on Demo. I ended up tunelling the Nancy who was doing do (she had DS (fist time I got DS since the nerf)) trying to shred her only so I wouldn't lose my stacks. That gave them time to do 3 gen but I had 7hooks by that time and they were still all injured.
I mean it was a trolled game but by no mean it was a good one. I decided to extend the game because I'm farming BP with puddings otherwise it was a complete waste of time.
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Brilliant.
Just brilliant.
👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
This is pure art. Thank you. Well said.
These posts lately have have been ridiculous. Killer is the easiest, and most balanced it’s ever been. Ever!
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Thanks, but whenever I try to be helpful here, I just get attacked.
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Meh. People are just dead set on the antidote being terrible even if they haven’t used it enough.
Ill admit I was skeptical of it at first but it is very strong and a great addition to his kit
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You seem to have made a typo, there. It's not spelled "killer": it's "console." Console players are treated as second-class players.
In terms of killer vs survivor, I think the devs try, but it's an asymmetric game, 1v4, and that's not a simple thing to balance. Make survivors too weak in a 1v1 situation, they won't have fun. Make survivors too powerful in a 1v1 situation, and it becomes impossible to play killer against a halfway-competent 1v4. Given how the game has so little structure, what they're trying to do might actually be impossible. The way things are right now, in the majority of matches, one side will have fun while the other will be miserable.
The broken matchmaking makes all the problems in this game infinitely worse. Once there's a decent skill-based matchmaking system in place, we'll get a better idea of where the game stands in terms of balance, but it's impossible to determine balance when matchmaking is so borked.
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Your guide was awesome, don't listen to 'em!
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Sluzzy but from the killer side
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Honestly people like you are the reason why killer mains get looked down upon. You literally made a thread complaining that survivors getting healed can still use their DS and took a fat L for tunneling.
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You kind of answered your own question with the first sentence. The reason why survivor ends up as a priority (don't dispute this, look at who's prioritized with bug fixes or how an oppressive killer meta get nerfed way quicker than an oppressive survivor meta), is because they need more survivor players than killers. It comes down to the issue of an asymmetrical game. The killer side has one guy who's his entire team. He has total agency on his performance outside of how well the actions stack up to the enemy team. The survivor side, on the other hand, is cooperative in nature, which leads to frustration when someone else throws the game for the team, leading to good plays amounting to nothing. Even though it's completely logical and balanced, it doesn't feel good. This is why people complain about solos. So BHVR probably feels the need to make survivors feel individually impactful just enough to keep survivor an attractive option even if that design becomes utterly broken against the killers if there's 4 competent survivors together. BHVR probably want killers to eat that occasional displeasure rather than risk driving many survivors away.
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lol, hope you're kidding right?
reworks? like the clown with an almost useless bottle? or...legion with a ######### buff on mend? constant buffs for the killers? pop and tanato got nerfed not long ago and mori got destroyed along with undying...yeah, constant buffs...
great new perks...pffff, and... solid new killers? are you blind? did you saw the trickster!!!?
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While Clown's buff could have been slightly stronger once you learn when and how to use his new bottle you down survivor on strong pallet way faster because they get slowed and you get faster.
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