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Keys & Hatch Priority
A common phrase killer mains like to toss around is that keys reward survivors for being bad. I never understood how keys "reward bad survivors". It doesn't make sense if you think about it.
If anything, it rewards the ones who actually did their job and stayed alive while their garbage teammates died off. And if you specifically only mean it for when 4 people get out through hatch, they still did all 5 gens... BEFORE you killed one person. They deserve a reward at that point.
The only reason why I am highly against a key nerf, is b/c of the current hatch priority. If a survivor has found the hatch first, they have to stand on top of it while the death animation plays out before it opens. However, if the killer gets there before the animation is done, the killer is the one who gets hatch priority to close it. NOT the guy who found it first. The hatch should be based on who gets there first. Not some priority system.
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But you can turn it around and say that the killer did a good job and sacrificed all the survivors and now he/she deserves their 4k. Why should they lose out on the extra blood points because one extra survivor got lucky and found hatch first or brought a key with them.
It's a never ending argument and I will not comment on any the balance of keys but I do think killers should always have hatch priority.
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No one should have any priority. It should be given to whoever gets there first.
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Right now survivors get priority with keys though. It doesn't matter what killer does if a survivor has a key. The hatch itself I have some issues but the key thing alone is a big problem. Doesn't matter if killer closes hatch, hatch hasn't been closed, hatch never opened, etc. If a survivor k ows where a hatch is nearby and they have a key and are at full health they will get out
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I think it would be good if the survivor has the key and find the hatch they won't be able to open it if they dont have 20,000 blood points earned from the mach if there are more than one survivor. And if they are the last one and have the then they can get in. And show how many blood points your erne during the game so you now how much have for killer and survivor.
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Keys aren't a reward for good or bad play, they're a stroke of luck, a hail mary, an RNG free escape.
Question is if a killer has played their best and a survivor their worst, is it fair that they get a free escape?
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Franklin's
Most games end with survivors hardly making any BP unless you count the 5k for escaping. You don't play survivor for points. Killers are point sponges.
Keys are not a free escape. Generators still have to be completed.
If a killer has played their best and a survivor has played their worst, then the worst playing survivor wouldn't be the last one alive.
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But that's specifically if you have Franklin's, not a natural game balance mechanic. That only works if you equip it before the match. They could very likely not start with a key and find one during the game.
Even Franklin's is a poor counter tbh. It's not that good of a perk, survivors hide Keys all the time which makes Franklin's worthless
(I'm not a killer main either just for the record, but you have to admit keys are busted)
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No. Keys and hatch are just crutch and outdated mechanics that need to deleted from the game. This is the worst, most laziest "alternative escape route" the devs could have done. "Oh, I see a random door on the ground. Press a button and win!"
And yes it does reward the worse survivors more often than not. It's not always the "garbage" teammates who die first. You could be running the killer for 5 minutes and your teammate decides to camp hatch instead of easily doing the last gen, so you get downed and die for nothing, because they could have finished the last gen and opened the gate for you, but they didn't.
And then the super fun thing the killer has to do to avoid the last person getting hatch: slugging for the 4th person. Neither side finds this fun, and it's all because of stupid hatch. The killer owned the survivors and clearly deserved a 4k, but no, the lasts survivor gets their hand held by the game and gets a free chance to escape.
The hatch isn't "killer sided" as some people like to twist it, because if a killer and survivor are both running towards the open hatch, the survivor gets priority because they can vacuum in, whereas the killer has to stand right on top of it to close it.
And even if the killer finds hatch and closes it before the survivor finds it, now the exits are powered for some reason, so the survivor gets ANOTHER free chance to escape, and often times they do, because contrary to the extreme stretching of the truth around "the exits gates are always 2 inches from each other, wah!", they actually almost never are. Unless you're a mobile killer, you can't patrol the exits effectively and the survivor can just 25% a gate, hide, and then open it all the way the next time you leave to check the other one.
If you think hatch is fair, you're either a survivor main, or you're a willing idiot if you play killer and think hatch is fine.
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Almost every game I play survivor I make around 20000 BP and that by taking protection hits,unhoo,doing genes,cleansing totems, get in a descent chase with the killer. It's not that hard.
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Keys are indeed Survivor sided. But the current state of the hatch is most certainly Killer sided due to priority.
However, I do agree that the entire mechanic of the hatch is horribly outdated and needs a good rework. Have it be less random, and less abusable by either side.
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Yes, you get the 20k... AFTER escaping with the 5k.
Besides, if hatch was based on points, we'd just have more people farming rather than focusing on the objective. We don't need more of that.
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Better then people looking for hatch for half of the game not helping with Gene's that deserve to be killed by the killer
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If you gave the killer enough time to find hatch thats your problem... go stand next to a door and wait for them to close hatch. If you picked the furthest one away you get out most times. Also tell me that keying out with 2 gens left and 2 players sacrificed isnt op... thats the situation im in 99% of the time with keys. If the killer had a way to kill all remaining survivors instantly halfway through the game you'd be ticked off. If you hatch out the killer cant counter that in any way. He cant grab out of hatch and the killer at that point has 4 gens to patrol. (which you probably wont be able to get any of them done with only 2 people so hatch is the only way to win at that point) you get a free instant escape and your teammate does too if you hatch out far enough away. PLUS theres the fact that keys are super common in the bloodweb AND CHESTS. 70% of matches i have to deal with keys. You seem like a survivor main so i understand if you dont get it but keys are absolute bull.
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If people aren't helping with gens, then lead the killer to them. Bond works both ways.
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Nice ok I always use that with mettle of man but nether thot of that thnks🤗
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Ah yes. Because if I found hatch first, and the killer comes straight to me during the death animation, they are given priority, despite not having found hatch before me. Yep. Totally my fault. I should've just sped up the animation.
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No, it's not fair if a survivor get's a "free" escape. They should have to work to avoid being sacrificed, find items or risk items (if key will be necessary based on ratio of generators/survivors), do generators (once again, based on ratio of survivors to generators), locate the hatch prior to the killer, and use it.
That isn't free.
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Stand on hatch by the time they hit u and go into cooldown you can hatch out even if you get downed. don't let them on the hatch. body block it.
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Honestly I wouldn't be surprised if we don't even see the key nerf in the next chapter, I mean look how long this is taking?? I feel like the easiest way to nerf them is only have them open the hatch when all 5 gens are done. And then if the killer closes it then the hatch can't be opened again.
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Or, instead of it rewarding those who did their job you have the case most of us have seen where a Blendette hides the entire game then uses their key to get a hatch escape ASAP.
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You have never played survivor if you think you can body block the hatch from the killer.
I've never seen that be the case when playing either side.
As killer, I never let a blendette leave my sight. I make sure they die.
As a bond-using survivor, if there's someone not doing anything all game, I will bring the killer to them.
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I'd like to see SOME sort of hatch rework again. IDK, just something needs to be done. My #1 reason for NOT playing suvivor anymore, actually is just that. Because of Solo Playing and the removed reward of the hatch. One might say that it is the most contreversial topic of this community. Since each side sees a few different view points.
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This is a bit off-topic in a way but, regarding the amount of work and the relative lack of reward, I had a match today in which I was the last survivor - wasn't even seen by the killer until the last generator left to be repaired, and three of those I repaired by myself with no help. When the game was over I got like 6,000 BP, or not even enough to replace the items I took into the match.
It seems silly to me that a survivor who manages to elude the killer until the very end of the match AND do more than half of the generator work winds up being the person with, by far, the lowest score in the game. I guess I was supposed to do a bunch of unhooks in front of the killer and get knocked down five or six times in order to demonstrate to the game that I was single-handedly winning the match for my team.
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Agreed. Stealth should be rewarded.
The game rewards too much "in your face" playstyles. Not that those are bad or wrong. Everyone plays differently. But good stealth should be rewarded with more than +13 boldness.
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Exactly.
I understand the killer mains who equate "stealthy" with "hiding". I totally do. I've had a few survivor matches where one of my teammates literally just camped all match, moving just enough to avoid the crows, and / or moved from hiding place to hiding place until we were all essentially whittled away and they could just await the hatch. Believe me you guys, other survivors hate that as much as you do.
But, there are also a lot of killer mains (many of whom gave their thoughts in a thread about stealthy play a day or so back) who seemed to just despise anybody who used stealth at all, they said - more or less - that they found the game boring unless the survivors were running around more, revealing themselves more, allowing themselves to be chased more. I understand that too, I honestly do. But to me there's a real dividing line between "this person is basically AFK for a cheap win" and "this person is successfully eluding me and I don't like it".
Sometimes I gen rush, sometimes I spend more time focusing on altruism, it really just comes down to instinct based on the killer I face, the teammates I get, and how everyone else is playing. I try to find a balance. But for me, sneaking and trying to avoid capture is the funnest part of the game. I'll take it over the looping game ten times out of ten. And that's fine, neither side is "wrong". Everyone has their playstyle. As long as they aren't breaking the rules, everyone should be allowed to play how they like.
So yeah, it was really kind of a smack in the face to see that even though I did most of the actual work, completed most of the actual progress, and survived longer than any of the of the others, I got the least amount of points. I was punished for playing carefully. That sucks.
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Keys allow the survivor side to completely bypass their win condition.
You ######### up, lost a teammate, and gave the killer a perfect 3-gen?
Congratulations! You deserve to lose this game!
What's that? You have a key?
Congratulations! Three of you get to escape.
They're just as bullshit as old Moris, even more so in the way that with a Key, you don't even need to engage with your win condition past a certain point; once you have four gens done with one death, just immerse with your team and roam around until you come across hatch and get to scum your way out.
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Heres the thing tho... this has happened to me. You body block the hatch keeping killer from bodyblocking it (they can still close it so you have to be faster than them. The point is to keep them from body blocking it.) Assuming that u are healthy itll take 2 hits to down you which gives you plenty of time to crawl into hatch. Your right that i dont play survivor often but these are the tactics rank 1 survivors have used on me.
Edit:removal of bad word, added the last sentence at the end
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