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Make killers choose ir they want to play against survivor friends

bloxe
bloxe Member Posts: 81
in Feedback and Suggestions
Its not fair to play with your 3 boyfriends while the killer plays solo. 

Not to mention the people from rank 2 and 3 that plays with friends with ranks way lower just because they cant handle the killer of their own ranks.

Is frustrating to play with survivor friends both as a killer and as survivor.

Unless the other side agrees, real gamers play solo.
«1

Comments

  • Youkari
    Youkari Member Posts: 53

    well if real gamers play solo or not is another discussion but i get ur point and i agree. SWFs are ofc a fundamental adding for a asymmetrical game like this but as balance and mechanics quite broken especially if survivors utilize SWFs it really gets annoying for killers who either just want to have fun and/or get a decent amount of BP. A good matchmaking makes alot of difference for any PvP games, the downfall of Paragon for example was due to flawed matchmaking and no ranking mode. I understand that this game main focus is being a casual partygame, but they should realize there alot of people seeking the competitive side of this game and should add more matchmaking modes for example; first a normal matchmaking with no affect on ranking and random matchup, as well offering decent amount of BP. second the ranking mode we now have of now BUT it should finally add a reward system to it like entering pink rank or staying pink rank after match u gain 20% additional exp/shards and BP as in red rank u gain 30% and by staying rank 1 after a match due pip or safe pip u gain 50% bonus. that way ranking gets also more purpose. then finally the KUF mode wich is actually the private mode but it would help giving it open servers as well as it's the best mode to freely use perks and add-ons to test build since it won't reward with exp and BP. and as u sign up to servers in that mode, u can choose if u go up against solo players or SWFs partys as SWFs can consist of 2SWF+2SWFs, 3SWF+1solo and the full 4SWFs... ofc killers volunteerely going against SWFs should gain a separate bonus after match like 25% since as things are now it's a huge trial and risk for killers going against SWFs. what u think of my suggestion?

  • Bravo0413
    Bravo0413 Member Posts: 3,647
    The devs have spoken of making the grind easier since it's getting quite big now with all the perks and such... why not give a reason to go through what is the BS that SWF brings to the game... SWF complains about wait times and lobby dodges... if the devs gave us 25-50% more BP I would gladly give them a match 
  • will_i_am_14_85
    will_i_am_14_85 Member Posts: 489

    The matchmaking should be done from the highest ranked survivor, I know they try to balance it out, but a green ranked killer isn't going to have a good time, even if there is one yellow survivor but the other 3 are purple and red ranks. Its no fun for the killer and the only fun the high ranked survivors can have in a game like this is to bully the killer and waste there time.

    if a rank 14 wants to play with there rank 2 friend, then put them in a game with a red ranked killer, that way the red ranked survivor has the task of protecting the lower ranked survivor, which in itself is its own mini-game as part of the main objective.

  • rafajsp
    rafajsp Member Posts: 475

    Once you get used to play against SWF it will be a pleasure.
    I love to play against SWF no matter if i win or lose (not 4 bbq stacks).
    It's rewarding, except you gain nothing but BP.

  • darktrix
    darktrix Member Posts: 1,790

    I would like the ranking system only apply to solos, but then I'd also like killers to lose the ability to cherry pick their matches if ranked. People play SWF because there is a special kind of masochism needed to play solo these days - there are not enough of that kind to fill your lobbies.

  • Malakir
    Malakir Member Posts: 799
    darktrix said:b

    I would like the ranking system only apply to solos, but then I'd also like killers to lose the ability to cherry pick their matches if ranked. People play SWF because there is a special kind of masochism needed to play solo these days - there are not enough of that kind to fill your lobbies.

    I agree About the first part. The second part.. Well its your opinion, not a fact or even close to reality
  • powerbats
    powerbats Member Posts: 7,068

    @Malakir said:
    darktrix said:b

    I would like the ranking system only apply to solos, but then I'd also like killers to lose the ability to cherry pick their matches if ranked. People play SWF because there is a special kind of masochism needed to play solo these days - there are not enough of that kind to fill your lobbies.

    I agree About the first part. The second part.. Well its your opinion, not a fact or even close to reality

    Well if we go of the past data set that said that solo was 34.1 % of all lobbies then his 2nd part is actually quite accurate. Now if we go off the assumptions of quite a few of the killer sided preference players that sWF lobby % has increased.

    Then his opinion is even more accurate due to an even smaller solo lobby playerbase.

  • Dragonredking
    Dragonredking Member Posts: 874
    edited December 2018

    Will survive with friend can be infuriating at time NOOOOOooooooooo

    They should buff solo player to bring them to have the same tool as swf and then balance the game from there

    Mainly the dev should had in game voice chat for survivor so they don't have to do silly thing like making perk baseline

  • ShrimpTwiggs
    ShrimpTwiggs Member Posts: 1,181

    This would increase lobby times for both sides.

  • powerbats
    powerbats Member Posts: 7,068

    @bloxe said:
    ShrimpTwiggs said:

    This would increase lobby times for both sides.

    I'd wait half an hour gladly if I knew I would be going only against solo survivors.

    You'd be waiting for a lot longer than that, more likely hours as in several hours in a row since the player base of solo players isn't that big. There's already been killers over the last few months complaining about lobby wait times.

  • bloxe
    bloxe Member Posts: 81
    powerbats said:

    You'd be waiting for a lot longer than that, more likely hours as in several hours in a row since the player base of solo players isn't that big. There's already been killers over the last few months complaining about lobby wait times.

    Survivors would probably go solo more often than now, duh. 
  • powerbats
    powerbats Member Posts: 7,068

    @bloxe said:
    powerbats said:

    You'd be waiting for a lot longer than that, more likely hours as in several hours in a row since the player base of solo players isn't that big. There's already been killers over the last few months complaining about lobby wait times.

    Survivors would probably go solo more often than now, duh. 

    Why would they do that if they're already playing SWF to begin with? I play both modes depending on if my friends can even play or not and other times like today and yesterday I've not really played. So logic and common sense would say they're not going to suddenly change their play habits just because it fits your narrative.

  • Wolf74
    Wolf74 Member Posts: 2,959

    @powerbats said:

    @bloxe said:
    ShrimpTwiggs said:

    This would increase lobby times for both sides.

    I'd wait half an hour gladly if I knew I would be going only against solo survivors.

    You'd be waiting for a lot longer than that, more likely hours as in several hours in a row since the player base of solo players isn't that big. There's already been killers over the last few months complaining about lobby wait times.

    And here we go again… the myth of the lack of survivor.
    Killer Lobbys got longer, but the reason is most likely NOT a lack of survivor.
    Survivor are still the vast majority of all Dbd player.
    From former experience with BHVR we can rightfully expect, that they messed up the MM again with the last event patch.
    That's when it got the worst and only got a little bit better after the event.
    And they are a already about to release a new MM system, so my guess is, they don't bother fixing the current one.
    But still survivor jump on that and claim a loss of survivor player to encourage more buffs to survivor.

  • SwearDie
    SwearDie Member Posts: 9

    @darktrix said:
    Killers like easier games against packs of uncoordinated solos. The way I've been abused playing solo I have zero sympathy for killers. I hope you all face four man crack SWF squads 24/7.

    If the devs intended for the game to have all survivors co-ordinated they would have implemented voice chat to the game.

    It's clear that the main game is not meant to be played with communication. Also probably why there's the point and beckon emote.

  • powerbats
    powerbats Member Posts: 7,068
    edited December 2018

    @Wolf74 said:

    @powerbats said:

    @bloxe said:
    ShrimpTwiggs said:

    This would increase lobby times for both sides.

    I'd wait half an hour gladly if I knew I would be going only against solo survivors.

    You'd be waiting for a lot longer than that, more likely hours as in several hours in a row since the player base of solo players isn't that big. There's already been killers over the last few months complaining about lobby wait times.

    And here we go again… the myth of the lack of survivor.
    Killer Lobbys got longer, but the reason is most likely NOT a lack of survivor.
    Survivor are still the vast majority of all Dbd player.
    From former experience with BHVR we can rightfully expect, that they messed up the MM again with the last event patch.
    That's when it got the worst and only got a little bit better after the event.
    And they are a already about to release a new MM system, so my guess is, they don't bother fixing the current one.
    But still survivor jump on that and claim a loss of survivor player to encourage more buffs to survivor.

    Actually it's not a myth since even when there hasn't been an even like recently and before the ptb killers have complained about long lobby wait times.

    You're correct about survives being the vast majority of the player base but it's already been shown that only 30% as of the last data point is solo q only. That's only partially correct in and of itself since some of those solo players also play SWF as well.

    But using that 30% of the player base and going off that we can also assume that 60k (pc only) at peak give or take that one time is a good number to use. Now assuming it's a 4 to 1 ratio of survivors to killers that means there's 12, 000 killers out there.

    Now that's 12k killers fighting over 18k survivors and that's assuming those 18k survivors are actually only playing solo q and not SWF like some probably will be doing. But lets assume for this arguments sake that all 18k are indeed playing solo only.

    Since it's a 4v1 ratio that means there's way too many killers since there's not enough survivors then to go around. If we take the 99% of all killers argument it still doesn't add up since there's still way too many killers.

    That's 11, 880 killers fighting over just 18k survivors which means a lot of killers are going to get screwed out of matches. Due to the 4v1 ratio your lobby wait times will be in the hours timeframe. Now if we throw in the variable of survivors playing SWF as well as Solo some of those 18k survivors aren't going to be playing solo. which means your available pool of people just dropped even more.

    Some other numbers that can be used again PC only here let's assume that only 6k of al killers or 50% would choose to go solo only. Now using that as a baseline the only way no killer would get screwed is if the game was a 3v1 since that'd cover the 18k completely.

    This would mean killers would have to get tweaked and so would solo q all separately, all taking time from further game development and also quite a bit of money to please a minority.

    Now to further put the proverbial nail in the coffin do you honestly think that solo q survivors are going to want an extended lobby wait time if there's not enough killers? No, they'll either choose to play SWF thus lowering your player pool even more.They'll also clamor for an option to queue up with SWF lobbies so they get faster lobby times.

    So again you're not going to get what you expect and instead quite the opposite you'll get longer lobby wait times. The solo people who're left are going to be the hardcore types. They're going to be the swat team types that're even more difficult to play against because they know what to do.

    In fact you can't use their teamwork mentality against them the same way you can against a swf group. To really put this into perspective you think those hardcore types won't do what they currently do in solo q lobbies?

    The really experienced players at rank 1 quite often post Discord info for that match, I've never joined since i'd prefer not to take the chance at getting flamed. But that's what you'll get because the solo people will know the ones that opt out can't handle it.

    For them it'll be like ringing the free win here button because the ones that want solo only lobbies want an easier time. The ones that stay for the SWF want the challenge and also because they know how to face them.

    No matter how you try and spin this it doesn't work out for the killers wanting solo lobbies, but if all of you really want this then commit to it. You agree if they make this you'll be forever stuck in a solo lobby only system. You can never as a killer queue up against anything but solo q even if you find the wait times suck you got what you asked for.

  • Wolf74
    Wolf74 Member Posts: 2,959
    edited December 2018

    @powerbats said:

    Actually it's not a myth since even when there hasn't been an even like recently and before the ptb killers have complained about long lobby wait times.

    You're correct about survives being the vast majority of the player base but it's already been shown that only 30% as of the last data point is solo q only. That's only partially correct in and of itself since some of those solo players also play SWF as well.

    Where did you get that number from?
    Last time the Devs showed stats it was less than 50% survivor playing SWF.
    70% of all lobbies contain "some sort" of Swf, but only (actually less than) 50% of all survivor join lobbies via the Swf option, including people that join solo, but click Swf anyway.
    So I do not understand where your 30% calculation come from, but any further calculations from there are doomed to be flawed.

  • powerbats
    powerbats Member Posts: 7,068

    @Wolf74 said:

    @powerbats said:

    Actually it's not a myth since even when there hasn't been an even like recently and before the ptb killers have complained about long lobby wait times.

    You're correct about survives being the vast majority of the player base but it's already been shown that only 30% as of the last data point is solo q only. That's only partially correct in and of itself since some of those solo players also play SWF as well.

    Where did you get that number from?
    Last time the Devs showed stats it was less than 50% survivor playing SWF.
    70% of all lobbies contain "some sort" of Swf, but only (actually less than) 50% of all survivor join lobbies via the Swf option, including people that join solo, but click Swf anyway.
    So I do not understand where your 30% calculation come from, but any further calculations from there are doomed to be flawed.

    That was the dev stream stats from December 2017 and the most recent dev stream they didn't explain if the 2 week time frame included the Halloween event or not. Which if it did would've heavily skewed the data due to ppl suiciding to killer after harvesting nectar. It also would've been all the ppl playing killer so much and not getting lobbies for so long.

    But also killers taking far longer to get their vials via way more matches during the 2nd week of the event. Again if this is where they got the numbers you referenced the survivors survival rate being under 50% is also highly suspect.

    @Orion and I discussed the stats possibly being flawed in another thread and i broken down all the categories in a different thread how it'd be skewed. Which if they are the extremist on the survivor side which are calling for no killer buffs due to survival rate being under 50% which would be false.

  • Wolf74
    Wolf74 Member Posts: 2,959

    @powerbats Do you have a link to that stream? My last info was ~50% of all survivor are playing SWF and after that info they did not show a whole lot of stats anymore. So we need to stick to the old stats and have to believe they still hold true until proven otherwise.

  • powerbats
    powerbats Member Posts: 7,068

    @Wolf74 said:
    @powerbats Do you have a link to that stream? My last info was ~50% of all survivor are playing SWF and after that info they did not show a whole lot of stats anymore. So we need to stick to the old stats and have to believe they still hold true until proven otherwise.

    Yeah I kept the link because no one could remember it except for a few and I got the dates mixed up, it's from October 2017 apparently.

    https://steamcommunity.com/app/381210/discussions/0/1489987634004297840/?ctp=2

    This below was my response in a different thread trying to head off more the devs have spoken so my side is correct flame wars again. It basically arose off of the as I said extreme survivor side people saying the devs stat prove that survival rate is below 50%.

    But if the stats are skewed due to an event of any kind they're not really relevant for the discussions as well as 2 weeks isn't a lot of data. If it was 6 months to a years worth that'd be different. That would of course not include event since that skews it along with free to play times.

    The escape stats aren't the end all because we don't have a complete data breakdown by any of the following metrics.

    By rank (Both killer and survivor rank as well as average for survivors)
    By time of day
    By region (if this is still meaningful)
    By groups solo, 1 duo, 2 duo's, 3 or 4 man swf etc.
    Was this an exit gate escape or hatch escape.
    For the above if it was hatch how many gens were left.
    Did someone dc/crash on either side?
    Did the killer let 1 or more escape either via gate or hatch?
    Did people just suicide either on hook or to the killer (example the Halloween event is a perfect one)

    You'd really need those and the breakdown in each of those within the other categories as well.

  • Wolf74
    Wolf74 Member Posts: 2,959
    edited December 2018

    You mean this stream?
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChqQ7HHjPKQ
    So it is just 47.2% of all survivor playing SWF (including those that join via SWF, but play solo anyway; for whatever reason)

  • powerbats
    powerbats Member Posts: 7,068

    I believe that's the one where the stats came from possibly but @Orion knows for sure.

    Perhaps they know which one exactly and where the exact stats everyone has been referencing since around 7 or so months ago.

  • Orion
    Orion Member Posts: 21,675

    @powerbats said:
    I believe that's the one where the stats came from possibly but @Orion knows for sure.

    Perhaps they know which one exactly and where the exact stats everyone has been referencing since around 7 or so months ago.

    You overestimate my memory.

  • powerbats
    powerbats Member Posts: 7,068

    @Orion said:

    @powerbats said:
    I believe that's the one where the stats came from possibly but @Orion knows for sure.

    Perhaps they know which one exactly and where the exact stats everyone has been referencing since around 7 or so months ago.

    You overestimate my memory.

    LIES !!!!!!! and besides I'm the old decrepit fossil here so my memory is the worser of the pair of us, 😜

  • Orion
    Orion Member Posts: 21,675
    edited December 2018

    @powerbats said:

    @Orion said:

    @powerbats said:
    I believe that's the one where the stats came from possibly but @Orion knows for sure.

    Perhaps they know which one exactly and where the exact stats everyone has been referencing since around 7 or so months ago.

    You overestimate my memory.

    LIES !!!!!!! and besides I'm the old decrepit fossil here so my memory is the worser of the pair of us, 😜

    I have ADD. If I'm off my Ritalin, I can literally forget what I'm saying mid-sentence. This becomes very obvious during my streams.

  • powerbats
    powerbats Member Posts: 7,068

    @Orion said:

    @powerbats said:

    @Orion said:

    @powerbats said:
    I believe that's the one where the stats came from possibly but @Orion knows for sure.

    Perhaps they know which one exactly and where the exact stats everyone has been referencing since around 7 or so months ago.

    You overestimate my memory.

    LIES !!!!!!! and besides I'm the old decrepit fossil here so my memory is the worser of the pair of us, 😜

    I have ADD. If I'm off my Ritalin, I can literally forget what I'm saying mid-sentence. This becomes very obvious during my streams.

    I think I've got AHAD or w/e it's called or was it Aspergers my oldest has it as well. I'm still a handsome old devil though. I even come with my own built in deviousness so no need to ever put an offering up. 😁

  • Wolf74
    Wolf74 Member Posts: 2,959

    @powerbats Anyway… you have to do your calculations anew. 52.8% instead of 30%.

  • powerbats
    powerbats Member Posts: 7,068

    @Wolf74 said:
    @powerbats Anyway… you have to do your calculations anew. 52.8% instead of 30%.

    Ok, Ill redo it then sigh I'd gone through so many recalculations of that to make sure it was right fml haha. But on the positive side at least I don't have t calculate cross platform play numbers.

    I do still wonder however how long the data set was for and whether it was during an event or FTP time frame since both will really skew the numbers.

  • bloxe
    bloxe Member Posts: 81
    CornChip said:

    Calm down bloke you can already dodge the SWF players you seem to hate so much. Just leave the lobby.

    I know, but I feel like this is what the game is from mid-rank onwards, so I'm trying to learn how to play against them. 

    But it just makes me want to close the game, even if I get 4 kills.

    Its just way too abusive.
  • Wahara
    Wahara Member Posts: 237

    They say that it will increase lobby times by splitting the player base in half, but that seems to be overstated.

    Every other competitive game can get away with this. I'm sure dead by daylight will live.

  • powerbats
    powerbats Member Posts: 7,068

    @CrowS said:

    @Wahara said:
    They say that it will increase lobby times by splitting the player base in half, but that seems to be overstated.

    Every other competitive game can get away with this. I'm sure dead by daylight will live.

    I'm with @Wahara every other competitive gaming community seems to do fine with this, why is it a problem for DBD?

    All these other ones you refer to all have MASSIVE player bases to them.

  • bloxe
    bloxe Member Posts: 81
    powerbats said:

    All these other ones you refer to all have MASSIVE player bases to them.

    But he didnt refer to any game.

    ??????????
  • se05239
    se05239 Member Posts: 3,919

    @CrowS said:

    @Wahara said:
    They say that it will increase lobby times by splitting the player base in half, but that seems to be overstated.

    Every other competitive game can get away with this. I'm sure dead by daylight will live.

    I'm with @Wahara every other competitive gaming community seems to do fine with this, why is it a problem for DBD?

    Survivor fun has always been more important for the developers, so not letting SWF squads feel skilled by reaching rank 1 with minimal effort would cause some dissatisfaction to their beloved player-base.

    I am thinking practically though. How would unranked SWFs match up? With killers who go casual too? Against killers of any rank?

  • Visionmaker
    Visionmaker Member Posts: 2,051
    edited December 2018

    SWF is a part of the game and will always be. It is everyone's responsibility to adjust.

    Similarly, just because I don't like to and don't want to play against Nurse, widely accepted as the strongest killer, doesn't mean I get to opt out.

  • bloxe
    bloxe Member Posts: 81
    Visionmaker said:

    SWF is a part of the game and will always be. It is everyone's responsibility to adjust.

    Similarly, just because I don't like to and don't want to play against Nurse, widely accepted as the strongest killer, doesn't mean I get to opt out.

    Thats one of the stupidest things I've ever read. Nurse is a pick. And it also requires some skill to be strong.

    The mere act of communication as SWF brokes the game.

    For example: if I'm using a Hex perk, and one of them finds it. I kill him, and bring him to a hook away from it, but then all other 3 know where it is. He broke my game by using a communication app, outside the game. Is that fair?
  • powerbats
    powerbats Member Posts: 7,068

    @bloxe said:
    powerbats said:

    All these other ones you refer to all have MASSIVE player bases to them.

    But he didnt refer to any game.

    ??????????

    I used the same generality they did and your confused by me doing this but not them why now? Below is the 2 posts right above mine that you couldn't have missed. So how did you miss their generality for games but somehow noticed it in mine?

    @CrowS said:

    @Wahara said:
    They say that it will increase lobby times by splitting the player base in half, but that seems to be overstated.

    Every other competitive game can get away with this. I'm sure dead by daylight will live.

    I'm with @Wahara every other competitive gaming community seems to do fine with this, why is it a problem for DBD?

  • Orion
    Orion Member Posts: 21,675

    @powerbats said:

    @CrowS said:

    @Wahara said:
    They say that it will increase lobby times by splitting the player base in half, but that seems to be overstated.

    Every other competitive game can get away with this. I'm sure dead by daylight will live.

    I'm with @Wahara every other competitive gaming community seems to do fine with this, why is it a problem for DBD?

    All these other ones you refer to all have MASSIVE player bases to them.

    The devs said that ten million people have played the game so far.

  • Visionmaker
    Visionmaker Member Posts: 2,051
    edited December 2018

    @bloxe said:
    Visionmaker said:

    SWF is a part of the game and will always be. It is everyone's responsibility to adjust.

    Similarly, just because I don't like to and don't want to play against Nurse, widely accepted as the strongest killer, doesn't mean I get to opt out.

    Thats one of the stupidest things I've ever read. Nurse is a pick. And it also requires some skill to be strong.

    The mere act of communication as SWF brokes the game.

    For example: if I'm using a Hex perk, and one of them finds it. I kill him, and bring him to a hook away from it, but then all other 3 know where it is. He broke my game by using a communication app, outside the game. Is that fair?

    Thats one of the stupidest things I've ever read. SWF is just more than one person playing together. And it also requires some skill to be strong.

    The mere act of teleporting past pallets and obstacles as Nurse brokes the game.

    For example: if I'm using Borrowed Time, and Nurse sees me from across the map. I unhook a teammate and try to run, but then Nurse can just ignore my Borrowed Time and teleport straight to the injured guy. He broke my game because Nurse is overpowered and we can't do anything in the game to run. Is that fair?

  • RWoodrow
    RWoodrow Member Posts: 270
    Opting out of facing SWF groups wouldn't fix the issue.
  • powerbats
    powerbats Member Posts: 7,068

    @Orion said:

    @powerbats said:

    @CrowS said:

    @Wahara said:
    They say that it will increase lobby times by splitting the player base in half, but that seems to be overstated.

    Every other competitive game can get away with this. I'm sure dead by daylight will live.

    I'm with @Wahara every other competitive gaming community seems to do fine with this, why is it a problem for DBD?

    All these other ones you refer to all have MASSIVE player bases to them.

    The devs said that ten million people have played the game so far.

    Yes and how many those are from FTP events, probably a huge portion so that number is inflated and not really relevant to the discussion at hand. League of Legends is FTP, OVerwatch has inflated numbers every time they've got a free event.

  • Visionmaker
    Visionmaker Member Posts: 2,051
    Orion said:

    @powerbats said:

    @CrowS said:

    @Wahara said:
    They say that it will increase lobby times by splitting the player base in half, but that seems to be overstated.

    Every other competitive game can get away with this. I'm sure dead by daylight will live.

    I'm with @Wahara every other competitive gaming community seems to do fine with this, why is it a problem for DBD?

    All these other ones you refer to all have MASSIVE player bases to them.

    The devs said that ten million people have played the game so far.

    And yet it still gives me opponents with ridiculous rank disparities!