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So survivors shouldn't be allowed to RUN now???
I've really seen it all now! Killers who are complaining about when survivors "hold W"? Seriously???
And the fact that it's being called a "meta"? BAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHA ROTFLMAO
Last time I checked movement was a pretty universal game mechanic. So. . . I guess that makes it meta?
Killer mains these days are something else. And all this time I thought survivors were the ones with all the petty complaints.
P.S. I play both sides and I just have fun. Maybe try not taking the game so seriously people?
Comments
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I think "Hold W" is shorthand to refer to the notion that you buy more time for your team just creating as much distance as you can rather than trying to buy time by winning loops.
35 -
Um. No. You have the complaint wrong. They are complaining that survivors run *in a straight line and predrop pallets.*
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Your mistake was thinking that both sides weren't capable of hilariously petty complaints.
You would be hard pressed to find something that someone hasn't earnestly complained about on these forums. Trickster is OP and uncounterable, most loops are infinites, and survivors are toxic for attempting to run away. Maybe absolute bottom-of-the-barrel neverused perks like Predator and No One Left Behind? But I've seen someone straightfacedly complain about Furtive Chase because it encourages survivors coming back to the hook, and Monstrous Shrine because it encourages basement camping.
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I think most people dont complain about survivor doing it, they complain about the game design.
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It’s more about game design then an actual problem with the players who use the strategy. Most times you can buy your team more time just running to a corner and getting downed then trying to loop a tile, which is what people don’t like.
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Oh ok. So my post title should have read, "So survivors shouldn't be allowed to RUN and DROP PALLETS now?"
Thanks!
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I don't consider it an issue for me. I main Hillbilly and Hag. Hillbilly just catches up and Hag just needs to place a trap. As well half the roster can already counter it and there's small maps. Although it can be annoying on big maps.
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And yet they have no complaints about bloodlust, weird
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Well maybe they should stop releasing killers that hit through windows and pallets so survivors actually have some sort of defense against them other than holding W.
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Thats not what holding w means but whatever.
Too many threads about this today for me to care anymore
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Survivors complained about Killers like Deathslinger due to the lack of Counterplay at Loops.
Killers told them that Survivors should not only Loop but adapt.
Survivors adapted and figured out that running in a straight Line buys more time against most of the Killers, including those with a very strong Chase Power.
Killers: :O
31 -
OP, have you actually read the explanations and arguments about why this is an issue?
PS: Some people have fun by playing competitively. Just because your fun is in not taking the game seriously doesn't mean it's the only type of fun people are allowed to have.
10 -
Well, I never told anyone to stop looping and adapt when facing Deathslinger.
Therefore I shouldn't have to deal with survivors holding W and pre dropping every single pallet.
3 -
The three survivor play styles are looping, predrop and shift w, and stealth. There are complaints about all of these. The best thing you can do is learn all three and use the best one depending on the killer you get. If you struggle with one more than the others, bring perks to help.
There are killers to counter all of these. If you are a killer player and struggle against a particular style, bring perks to help or play a killer that does better against that style.
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I'm aware of the complaints. My post was trying to use humor to point out that it's kind of ridiculous when you think about it.
The issue seems to be, as with all the other petty complaints, is that people get good at a certain playstyle and then pitch a fit anytime something is introduced that requires them to adjust their style and adapt.
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That’s like asking what is the fun of people playing killers like Nurse, Spirit, Deathslinger, Hag, etc.
There’s no looping. You see survivors and they go down without anything they can do if you are playing well. Or they step in a trap and you hit control for a free hit.
8 -
I will admit I was one to say something that I don't like how survivor counterplay against 90% of the killer roaster.
I'm not saying survivor's shouldn't be able to run, it's the fact that Shift + W is very powerful but requires 0 to no skill or brain usage vs the skill and brain usage killers use.
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Obviously survivors are supposed to run. But let me ask you, what is the more fun game (and i mean for both sides.)
Game 1:
- Killer starts a chase with a survivor and they run to a loop, now starts a mindgame between the 2.
- Did the killer double back?
- Did he fake doubling back?
- Is his red stain actually showing the direction he is going?
- Did that survivor actually vault the window?
- Did he fake it?
- Did he slow vault it?
- Maybe he has Quick and Quiet?
- If the killer guesses right, he lands a hit and the cycle repeats until survivor is downed.
- If the killer guesses wrong, the survivor just bought their team 15-20 seconds of gen time.
Game 2:
- Killer starts a chase with a survivor
- Survivor immediately holds shift + w and runs in the opposite direction
- Survivor immediately drops every pallet they run across and force the killer to break it.
- Killer loses 3 gens in 2 minutes before landing a single hit.
I think game 1 is far more fun and engaging for both sides. Game 2 is a snoozefest.
Survivors should only buy time on generators when they "win a loop" against a killer, not just by holding w and running to the opposite end of the map. If survivors hold w, and don't vault a single window, don't drop a pallet, just hold w, it will take a killer 48 seconds to down them. Factor in picking up the survivor, finding a hook, walking to a hook, and hooking the survivor, you likely just lost 3 gens against a team playing efficiently.
4 -
LMAO. You are so right about this. Everytime survivors complain about something, killers reply with "Survivors don't want to adapt". Everytime solo survivors say that the game is unbalanced for them, killers say that solo survivors are just bad, yet they complain about SWF, but it's not because killers are bad, it's because SWF is OP. So much hypocrisy.
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Yes. If youre going to be sarcastic at least be accurate 🤷♂️
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The difference is, this version of "adapting" is very boing for both sides.
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Thats always been the counter to freddy since he was changed. Loop him if youre awake, run straight and predrop pallets if youre asleep. People are starting to collectively realize this and it amuzes me
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In Game 2 you don't have to chase the first survivor the whole time. You break some pallets then switch chase and coax the new survivor towards the unsafe area where there are no pallets.
Part of this game is adapting to different situations. Try thinking out of the box and it makes it fun and engaging like game 1.
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Yeah, but what does this has to do with what I've said?
I don't want people to hold W and pre-drop everything. I want the loops.
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That's the thing about life. You don't always get what you want. It's amazing how many people don't get that concept these days.
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I mean, you know windows aren't walls right?
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This^ person has the power of conciseness on their side. Follow the advice in that^ post.
And if you're a survivor and struggle against killers countering your main style, then learn when to use the other two.
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Wait, so now you get to decide how comedy works? Pick a lane man.
2 -
The thing is, fam, I used to get it. People used to actually loop, try and mindgame each other. That is how the game was intended to be played, that made it fun.
There is absolutely nothing fun in following a survivor on a straight line until you get them or Bloodlust kicks in, while gens fly across the map. That is boring.
0 -
People getting hit through windows and pallets isn't a killer problem. Every killer's attack is a cone barring a few power modifications and the reason your getting hit through windows and pallets is because the game isn't in exact perfect sync between killers and survivors. When an attack happens near a survivor the killer can see themselves on top of you where are you're already through the window a good on your end. The server tries to split the difference between both sets of information and you end up getting hit as that is what it determines is the most reasonable outcome. Sometimes it can be the reverse where a killer "knows" they hit you, but the server's hit validation determines otherwise.
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I made this point to someone else, its silly to get mad at survivors for using the counter that the devs specifically built into the killer you are playing. Its like complaining that people duck and break los against huntress. Its every bit as silly as when the survivors complain about camping and tunneling. If you dont like shift+w predrop playstyle, run stbfl and tinkerer (both great perks on fred). Run brutal (great perk that oracle said tru3 should have used). Zone them then break the pallet. Switch targets after getting rid of a couple pallets. There are things you as a killer can do to counter this play style. Ive been dealing with it at r1 for a few years now. Learn to adapt.
2 -
That’s not what I mean. I’m saying there’s a ton of ranged killers in the game now, a bunch who still chase you at 115 until they ready the attack, and who will literally collect free hits any time you go to use a pallet or window.
Pyramid head can follow you for like 8 seconds with addons with his sword in the ground, nemesis doesn’t even need to pull out his tentacle until the last second, Victor is impossible to dodge if the player is good. Slinger and Demo zone you by existing as well. If the killer is playing well most of them leave you little options other than to pre throw and get distance.
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Its not really funny when its inaccurate though. People just roll their eyes. Cringe is the word im looking for. Its cringy. Their laughing at you, not with you. Could have been funny. It wasnt
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Nobody is saying Survivors can't run. In fact, many of us don't even see the problem with the so-called "holding W." It is just a tactic. Me and mine refer to it as burying the Killer. One of us will run in a straight line to some dead area where there are no Generators and it will take forever for the Killer to get back from. Ideally I will reach some extreme corner. Survivors do what Survivors have to do, just like Killers do what they have to do. This tactic has been around forever. The only STUPID reason people are making a fuss about it now is a Streamer whined about it. I swear the hype people put on someone doing a video in the bedroom is ridiculous.
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There is no difference. Tunneling and camping is boring for both sides, yet killers defend them, because it's a "valid strategy", so sorry.
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I already do this and I already run those perks from time to time, but that doesn't change the fact that it is boring. This is not how the game is intended to be played.
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In game 2, if you drop chase the next survivor does the same thing and the 1st survivor you were chasing hops onto a gen as soon as you stop chasing them.
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It IS how the game is intended to be played. You are wrong about that sir. This IS the counter to many killers. Why do you think there are so many oblivious perks? Why do you think Fred has oblivious buikt into his kit? Oblivious coubters this playstyle
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I doubt any dev has ever said that they want people to ignore the tiles they've specifically created for looping. The fact that this playstyle, if it can even be called a playstyle, serves as a counter to many killers is nothing but a flaw.
Also, to my understanding, Freddy doesn't have Oblivious built into his kit for people to pre-drop everything. He has it to give the player a feeling of control: this is HIS world, not yours. Just like Old Freddy had, but with different effects.
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Point out an issue with survivor gameplay, perks, items, offerings - "you just want all survivors to start the game hooked"
Point out an issue with killer gameplay, specific killers, addons, offerings - "so you want all killers deleted and just a gen simulator game"
There's not much point discussing balance with anyone who isn't interested in balance or game health and just wants to one-up "the other side" whenever possible.
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With maybe the exception Huntress who throws beluga whales, you can dodge almost everything you've named with a little bit of practice. Most of the power based attacks are very linear, but at the same time if a player has put time into maximizing the way they use their power you should get hit. You're statement reads as if you're more upset that someone who has acquired skill is using said skill along with the power. Even though the power itself isn't unfair and through your own application of skill up to a point you could dodge it. I'm unsure how to interpret the Demo thing as he's extremely basic as his power is to just do basic attack while jumping. It's not like he can tunnel around loops faster than you can run it or leave entirely. There are many videos of Victors being juked and kicked, but if someone is playing skillfully then yes you most likely will get hit. That shouldn't be a complaint.
I will never understand why people get mad about people playing the game intelligently and making the most use of a killer's ability. Is that not what people want when they play a game?
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Yep lol. It’s insane isn’t it. These killer mains literally want an open field with immobile survivors they can hit, hook, and leave. These people have lost the plot officially.
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You saying thats a fact doesnt make it one. Yes, they build that into the game. His weakness is this style, one of his perks adds oblivious and several of his add ons either apply oblivious or make you undetectable. Thats not an accident bud.
So you think its just completely random and coincedental that when survivors are asleep it counters what makes him weak in that state? I dont really no what to tell you. Keep dreaming I guess. 🤷♂️
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Well they took out the loops and half the pallets because killers whined all day about looping. So there’s that.
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I did not. Therefore, judging by that logic, I do not deserve to deal with that boring playstyle.
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Thats why I said it’s a design issue. The last 3-4 killers are pretty much anti looping, so people started using a strategy that was strong against them. I could go on a small novel rant about what lead to this, but I’ll leave it at that. It’s a design shift in the game, and the meta is shifting as a result.
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Nope. About the only thing left to nerf is "holding W to run". As other have alluded to, pallets are totally unsafe against most of the killers.
Nemesis totally negates pallets. When he has tier 3, it's unreal. I still think he is slightly weaker than the others.
And they released Trickster where the only thing you can do is run. Dropping a pallet will actually hurt you more than not. 60 uncounterable knives.
5 -
New Cold wind, New Game.
The loops never gone, its just RNG decide to put in 5 pallets
0 -
The fact that killers catch up so slowly to survivors just holding in a straight line is problematic. Obviously survivors should be able to run. The issue is that basically survivors behaving no different from the tutorial bots is an effective strategy. It's ridiculous that they can get so much value from doing something so mindless a literally bot can replicate it with similar success. It is ridiculous because its low effort for how effective it is which means survivors that are actually good break the game in their favor. People are just mentioning it now more cuz some youtubers talked about it...because god forbid this community actually thinks about problems with the game on their own.
And some survivors are acting like this is a new thing...like "oh you gave us killers with nO cOuNteRplaY, so now survivors are adapting and holding W". That's just BS. Holding W has always been effective. It's just that a lot of vocal survivors are too lazy to have to make a read instead of just being telegraphed by the game everything the killer has done and will do. Like the killer is an NPC or something...
1 -
Uhh I’m a Pyramid Head main, I’m not complaining about anything. I’m just stating the facts. I very rarely play survivor because you need a SWF to have fun as survivor these days and I prefer solo Q.
If I’m playing on point you are not looping me very long. We get to a window, I put the sword in the ground. You take the window, you get hit. You fake it, I bodyblock the window while canceling the M2 into an M1. There’s no real input from the survivors half the time. So why would they want to try and loop me instead of just physically getting as much distance as possible?
You are saying “ooo killer should be rewarded with uncounterable hits because they can aim” when most people playing this game probably play tons of FPSs as well.
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