Should dead hard get nerfed?

A slight nerf maybe, but it doesn't need to be gutted.

Watch any high level killer go against it so you can learn to bait it out. It's not as hard as the forum makes it out to be and isn't impossible. A major part of killer gameplay involves mind-gaming and this is one of those instances.

While you are right in a way, this isn't what makes it "OP" in some people eyes.

People call it OP because you can extent a loop by using it, and correct a mistake midloop with it, which you can't counter much even by " baiting it out" on most tiles.

It's just so much better than the rest of the exhaustion perks because it has no downside in comparison to the others. Dead harding to dodge a hit is fine but the "dead hard for distance" can extend a chase far more than any other exhaustion perk and has no counter. For example, right now we have:

• Sprint Burst
  • Sprint burst can only be activated at the start of a chase, meaning the killer can break off of the chase and just go after someone else, or try to cut the survivor off somehow. In order to make it usuable in a chase, it must be 99'd, however then you can't do ANYTHING, because if you stop to heal, do a gen etc. you now ready it. Additionally you have to walk everywhere if you want to hold onto it, making you slower outside of the chase
• Lithe
  • This one requires you to vault something, which means you aren't necessarily being efficient in a loop. If you want to hold onto lithe in a chase, you have to drop a pallet, which is a limited resource and carries it's own risks. Additionally, once you know the survivor has lithe, you can play around it and know now that they WANT to go through the vault, so you can loop a different way, or cut them off early since you know what their plan is.
• Smash Hit
  • Unless the pallet is some really unsafe pallet, getting stunned is already a chase ender. This perk just makes getting pallet stunned to be even more of a chase ender. additionally it requires you to actually drop a pallet and get a stun. Both of which can be played around, as a killer, i can respect the pallet, and back off. Then when they see i do that, and just keep running i can react to that and no longer respect the pallet, creating our own little mindgame around it. Trying to go for a pallet stun can also be risky for a lot of different reasons depending on the killer
• Balanced Landing
  • Balanced only works on a few parts of most maps, outside of that it is very map dependent. This means it won't always be readily available to you, and you are stuck to staying around a certain area if you want to use this perk, otherwise you might not get a chance to use it. Also, similar to Lithe, the killer can play around it, it becomes pretty obvious when you are going for that hill, which otherwise would be useless and actually bad for you.
• Head on
  • Head on can't really be used in a chase unless paired with other perks. Additionally it gives you less distance than most other exhaustion perks. It's main extra function is that you can stun the killer that is carrying a survivor.
• Adrenaline
  • I'd say the main function of this perk isn't really exhaustion related and is mostly done for the heal and the quick getaway. It also can only activate once per game and also only at the endgame, so it can't really be used to extend a chase.
• Dead Hard
  • Then we come to dead hard. In theory the downside of dead hard is that it requires you to be injured. But in practice, this isn't actually a downside. Unlike the other main exhaustion perks, in which you give up some level of efficiency in one area to gain efficiency in another, dead hard has nothing but gains. If you are being chased, you are likely going to be injured at some point, meaning it has no downside. Additionally, you can activate it whenever you want, this is the only perk (outside of head on) that you can perfectly control when it activates. All of the others have some sort of condition that you need to play around or achieve in order to activate. Dead hard is just "press e". Dead hard for dodging a hit is actually fine, and has counterplay, just bait the dead hard, and then swing. Dead hard for distance though, has no counter, they just round a corner, press e, and suddenly they are at a pallet or window they otherwise would not have been able to make it to. There is literally no counterplay around that.

Ideally, to fix dead hard, i would do 1 of 2 things:

• Make it so you can't control exactly when it activates
• Make it so it actually has a downside.

If we want to make it have a downside, i would make it such that using it gives you a debuff that makes it take twice as long for you to be healed for like 60-90 seconds or something. This way it has an actual downside, as a killer, if i see someone dead hard, i now can drop chase with them and be confident that they are either going to be out of the game for a little while trying to heal somewhere, or that the next time i see them i can be sure that they will already be injured.

Another thing that could be done is changing what it does and how it activates. Since it is about being injured, what i would do is make it increase your movement speed when you get hit. This would be similar to what it is like when you get hit and use sprint burst at the same time, you get a super speed boost for a few seconds. If dead hard worked like this, then it has a downside, in that you CAN'T use it while injured. This means that if i drop chase now, again, i can be confident that you are going to spend some time off of the gens to heal, or on the flipside, if i run into you again injured, i can be sure that you DON'T have dead hard now.

Why noed? Remove bloodlust. Dead Hard, especially for distance, is perfectly fine as long as bullshit like bloodlust exists

I agree, the reason people run BBQ is the bloodpoints, thrilling is a far better version of the perk that does more things.

In reality though, dead hard IS overperforming, my post above explains exhaustion perks and their differences.

Dead hard is supposed to be for distance though so idk why people are mad at it.

If dead hard gets nerfed I'm very confident you would want sprint burst to get nerfed 🙄 knowing what you think about survivors running. Anyway most survivors don't know how to use DH strongly enough, which is why DH is the most overrated perk in this game.

Whats your counterplay to sprint burst exactly?

I could make the same case for NOED. It's a problem because a no skill killer that gets 1 hook during the game, they should not have a perk that allows for insta-downs at the end of the game. Without survivors being able to know if the individual has the perk or not.

See how the same could be said about that perk, but I'm not since people should be able to use whatever perk they want.

Sorry my queue popped so i didn't finish writing. But as i was saying:

Countless times i run to a gen with someone who has sprintburst and they do 1 of 2 things:

• They immediately run with sprint burst
• They wait and slowly walk until i get close and then sprint burst.

If they do the first, i just fake walking away, then they start running back to the gen, then i run back to them and now they wasted their distance and they gained maybe 5 seconds while using the perk. Or, they keep running and i go after someone else, or try to come at them from a different angle when they aren't paying attention.

If they do the second option, i just don't swing and i keep chasing them, because they only gained the normal amount of distance they would have if they just held shift + w when they saw me coming initially and used a different perk. If they immediately sprint burst away i also have the option of dropping chase and going for someone else. The other aspect is, like i said, they have a downside, they have to walk everywhere or it activates and they can't use it if i chase them. This means using sprint burst and holding onto it actually acts as a gen slowdown perk because they can't just quickly run from gen to gen. Also depending on the shape of the map i might be able to cut them off.

Back to dead hard though, it has no downside, you just get it every time you do a chase. It also has 0 counterplay, you can't do anything to stop a dead hard for distance. Yeah, maybe it is "hard" to counter sprint burst, but i also CAN, dead hard for distance literally has no counter i can do. At all, i have no options. If they use it, i don't want to abandon chase because, they just used it, and i did all that work for nothing. But if i don't abandon chase, they just gained at least 20 seconds extra into the chase by the time i catch back up to them. Meanwhile the other 3 survivors are on 3 gens and they get 20 more seconds on that gen. A single dead hard in the early game all but ensures you lose 3 gens. The "counterplay" for dead hard for distance is to abandon chase, similar to sprint burst, but unlike sprint burst, there is no downside for the survivors for using it.

You can't counter dead hard for distance. You can't "bait" the dead hard for distance, it just happens. I'll give you the intsadowns, but not every killer has those options available to them, similar to exhaustion addons which are really rare at this point. Exhaustion addons also counter all the other exhaustion perks too, my point is comparing dead hard to the other ones there is no contest.

bait it or...

Instadown with Billy, Myers, oni, ghost face...or

Use exhaustion hatchets.

I feel like I always end up in a game against an Instadown killer when ever I have DH or against plague with inner strength.

Doesn't matter. Nerf BBQ. DH only works half the time and if it needs to be nerfed, so does BBQ.

Did you literally not read the rest of my post? You can't bait dead hard for distance, at all, so that counter is out.

You are left with instadown or exhaustion addons.

As i said, not every killer has instadown available to them. So you are saying that 75% of the killers in this game have no counter to dead hard.

Exhaustion addons are even more rare.

Again, please read the rest of my post. The point of dead hard is not the "1 second of speed" the point is to extend a chase by getting a window or pallet that you otherwise would not have been able to get to. Once you have done that, you have effectively extended a chase by at least 20 seconds if you do nothing but hold w and run to a corner of them map. Additionally sprint burst has a downside, they survivor has to walk very slowly around the map if they want to make sure it doesn't activate. What is the downside of dead hard? There is not one.

Deadhard is fine, it’s as fair as any other exhaustion perk with the exception of Head-On. It’s only favorited because survivors have an easier time using it, rather than 99’ing something else.

Leave as is, IMO

Edit: before someone rants, Im saying HeadOn is the weakest exhaustion perk, not saying it’s tiered above Deadhard