It's Time For More Perk Slots
With the number of perks now in the game, it's getting really hard to choose just 4. As a result, many weaker perks are having less and less chance of being selected. I have a solution to fix this issue.
Increase the number of available perk slots to 6. Give each perk a perk value score of 3 (powerful, popular, meta perks), 2 (mid-level perks), or 1 (weak, niche perks). Players now have 12 available perk points to use in their build. They could use 4 meta perks (like they currently can) and be unable to use the other 2 slots or they could use 6 weaker perks or some combination of the two. Hex perks would have a score of 3 regardless of power or popularity so totem numbers don't have to be changed.
Comments
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Could the game struggle even more though?
at the moment, on top of everything else the game is handling, it’s also processing 20 modifiers (5 x 4 perks), and who is/isn’t also affected by these modifiers.
Add in a 5th slot and that’s 25 modifiers.
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*Laughs in RTX 3070*
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It would be interesting if there was a 5th perk slot specifically for hex perks and exhaustion perks.
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Survivors team 16 perks+ teamwork for synergy
Killer 5 perks for build synergy
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first of all survivors don't need anymore perks.
SWF with comms alone is worth 20+ info perks while also countering many killer perks at the same time.
Killers need 5 perk slots at least have the 5th one be dedicated to hexes only.
If survivors get a 5th perk then something needs to be done about SWF because comms alone is already a huge advantage.
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It should really be a limited event game mode. DbD hyper edition or something like that. That would be really fun but I don't think it should be in the main game.
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@TheClownIsKing Ya they could only implement this if they can make sure the game is optimized for it.
@Edgars_Raven I feel like that limits build variety a bit.
@DemonDaddy Giving killers more perk slots that survivors wouldn't go over well. Plus it still may not be balanced. Also, you would need to change the number of totems for that.
@Lord_Tony If the survivors were to have additional perks under my proposed system, they would be sacrificing strong perks for some extra weaker perks. If they all wanted to run all meta perks, they'd still have only 4 perks each. Same goes for killers. That will keep everything relatively balanced. If killers have more perk slots than survivors, it wouldn't go over well so the SWF issue needs a different solution (not related to number of perks).
@gendoss I don't think they are ever going to add another game mode. That being said, I want to see more build diversity in the core game, not just a side mode.
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I feel like the game would just get unnecessarily chaotic. Having to keep track of 6 perks on every player.
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A 5th perk for solo players and killers would be a good thing.
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Lol okay let me try this again without a simple no.... Soo.... That'd be like asking for a 3rd add on for killer powers and items for survivors. I think 4 perks is plenty as it is. I mean I don't think it's a bad idea. But that is a concept to the game that's already pretty established. I mean I could just see the chaos... Luckily there are plenty of useless perks not being used at it is. Tell you what... They fix all the bad perks I'd say yes.
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the solos will just keep lobby hopping till they get their friend in the lobby
or they'll try to make a discord call with the random PC players they find in the lobby
Now we have 4 survivors with 5 perks with comms.
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Of course I'm going to talk with random people who don't speak my langage... I can write in english, I can't speak it.
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the average player speaks in english so I'm not talking about just you.
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You want to give a super buff for killers : ok. But if solo players have 0 buff, it's not a surprise if only SWF play this game in red ranks...
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because comms are worth 20+ info perks
they also 100% counter killer perks like third seal and knockout as well.
that's a huge advantage that killers don't have and killers can't counter it.
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Add a 5th slot exculsively for exhaustion and a hex for each side
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Of course it won't go over well with some survivors, majority of them are always reluctant whenever their position as the power role is threatened. The idea of killers being threatening hinders their access to chill games.
Don't see why totems would need to be increased though. You equip your hex perks up to the allotted amounts and trying to surpass that with something like haunted ground with four other hex perks means your losing the effect of one of your perks.
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I really want another perk slot, but the game is balanced around 4 each. Idk it's taken so long for the game to reach this point of balance. Adding another slot would be 1 step forward and 2 steps back imo.
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The game is not balanced around having more than four perks, though.
Like, consider a build that was Unbreakable, Dead Hard, DS, and two-three other perks. Or Ruin, Undying, Tinkerer, and two-three other perks.
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@gendoss Not everyone will be running 6 perks because of the point limitations, but even with 6, that's only 2 more perks. I don't think it would break the game flow/balance.
@Piwatte I think the game is relatively balanced around everyone having the same number of perk slots. Making some people have less perk slots and not others would be unfair.
@TwitchyMike The difference is the number of killer power add-ons and item add-ons hasn't grown nearly as much as the number of perks has. Many perks are being left in the dust as a result. I think some people might be willing to put a meta perk or two down to get several more lesser-strength perks, leading to more build diversity and a more interesting game overall.
@Lord_Tony I think you're giving SWF more credit that it's worth. Most SWFs aren't depip death squads. They're just people playing casually with their friends. Besides, since I'm proposing upping the number of perk slots for everyone, the balance isn't really changing from how it currently is. I'm not trying to solve the SWF issue with this idea, just make the game a bit more interesting by encouraging the use of lesser-used perks.
@CapricornZeus3 Lol 3 point Hex: Blood Favour. Ya I think that's more an issue of a weak hex perk needing to be buffed. That or just make it not a hex perk, which would mean it wouldn't have to be 3 points anymore.
@TheChaddyCat That just seems like it limits build diversity. Not every build needs an exhaustion or hex perk. Players might want to bring something else.
@DemonDaddy The goal is to keep the balance of the game relatively the same by making sure everyone on both sides still has access to an equal number of available perk slots. I'm a killer main and I don't think it would be fair to have more perk slots than survivors. As far as totems go, how would the game decide which hex perk to deactivate? I don't think that's the way to go. My system would be a bit more clear for players to understand and would mean the devs wouldn't have to change the maps to spawn more than 5 totems. Plus asking survivors to cleanse more than 5 totems is pretty ridiculous and oppressive.
@Ghoste I disagree. The game is balanced around each player having the same number of available perk slots. There's really no reason why 4 perks would be the magic number that keeps the game from falling into chaos. As long as everyone can bring 12 power points worth of perks, I think the game will remain relatively balanced.
@TAG See my response to Ghoste. Also, all those perks you listed would definitely be 3 point perks, so those builds are up to 9/12 points. The players can now choose between 1 more 3 point perk (4 perks total like it is right now), a 2 point perk and a 1 point perk (5 perks total), or 3 1 point perks (6 perks). You see how that balanced itself out? In order to get more perks, players will have to sacrifice some of the powerful, meta perks and use ones that won't have as much of an impact on the game.
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"You see how that balanced itself out?"
No, I don't. Because I'm just gonna take three extra perks to end up with a six perk build.
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I hate the idea. I want to run the 3 most popular perks in the game... They are popular for a reason.
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Solo queue should get kindred base kit at the very least.
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Well then, you must be fun at parties.
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I'm not sure I understand exactly what you're referring to.
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I've always been a big fan of adding more perk slots. The game has gotten stale with the 4 year old perks still in the meta and all of those perks that have situational effects.
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If you believe this then you would be all for non-swf players getting another perk slot. I believe swf should take the place of a perk slot. Remember SWF is no good for killers or single players like me. SWF players only look out for themselves and use us randos as bait to be farmed.
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Only if that then meant only one could be slotted. I'm growing heartily sick of the 3- and 4-hex games. The last thing I want is a 5-hex game.
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Actually killers do get a 5th slot that survivors dont. Its called the killers power!
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Maybe in custom games, that would be cool but sounds like it would be alot more stressful for survivor and especially killer. All in all a cool idea but to actually go through with it would be a bad idea.
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These scripts should be extremely lightweight, no more than a line or two. I don't want more second chances or slowdown perks in my trials, so I don't want more perk slots, but it shouldn't effect the stability of the game at all.
And if it does, then we have yet more confirmation that BHVR absolutely cannot maintain their own game. And I will laugh. Bitterly and with the upmost contempt. Not for the team of skilled and talented developers, but for the terrible management and poor use of their skills.
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That's like saying that the item slot is the Survivor's fifth slot. :P
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Then killers still get 2 extra since they have addons. Killer addons are beastly vs survivor addons. Regardless in truth im down for more perk slots but they’d have to rebalance like all perks
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Items also have add-on slots, so they don't have two extras compared to Survivors.
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and yet the killers power can be countered by tool boxes, flashlights, medkits, etc.
so I guess survivors have 6 perks then the 6th perk is called tools.
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1 more for killers. Survivors have all they need already.
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@TAG Ya but 3 of those perks would be weaker 1 point perks... The kind of perks that aren't game-changing and have really minor effects.
@ThiccBudhha You still can run the 3 most popular perks under this system. That'll take up 3/6 slots and 9/12 available perk points. Nobody would have to change their current build. It would just reward players for using less popular/powerful perks by giving them more of them.
@Thrax Even though Kindred is pretty good, the devs could assign it a perk value of 1 to help reduce the gap between solo and SWF. I doubt they'll make it base kit.
@Exerlin I completely agree.
@stvnhthr The devs will never give some players more perk slots than others so it's not even worth discussing. I'm not trying to completely solve the SWF issue with this system, just make the game more interesting.
@Starshadw Under my system, there would still be no more than 4 hex perks in a game since they would get a 3 point value by default.
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@WormMilk I really don't think it would make games any more stressful for anyone. In fact, it might make some games less stressful because some people might actually put down their meta, game-changing perks to equip more, less-powerful ones that might not even have a noticeable effect.
@MadLordJack Ya it really shouldn't affect game stability but this is BHVR we're talking about... Also second chance perks and slowdown perks would have a 3 point value so you can't stack any more than you already can.
@Generic The devs will never give some players more perk slots than others so it's not even worth discussing.
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Unless the one-point distinction is reserved for unusable perks that you'd never run anyways, the three perks have more flexibility and would add up to more than just one additional perk slot. Especially considering the other three slots can still be reserved for meta perks no problem.
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I'd use Fire Up, Coup de grace, play with your food, Eruption, save the best for last, and brutal strength.
With each passing gen... I get stronger.
On a unrelated note. There needs to be more transformative perks
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@TAG Yes, 1 point perks would be perks like This Is Not Happening, Deja Vu, Distressing, Bloodhound, etc.
@DwarvenTavern Ya that build might work. If BHVR were to assign those perks point values they would probably be Fire Up (1), Coup De Grace (2), Play With Your Food (2), Eruption (2), Save the Best For Last (3), and Brutal Strength (2), which adds up to 12.
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Id say instead of a 5th perk slot instead add a new catagory like a ultimate perk that you can only equip one of for killers it could alter their power like addons do and surivors i dunno but a similar idea
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Then this system doesn't really accomplish much, does it? Because those perks are not worth anything, and you're still going to just end up using the meta perks and maybe one non-meta perk and one perk that doesn't mean anything.
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@Jetgrind That doesn't fix the issue of the increasing number of lesser-used perks.
@TAG No it definitely does. Just look at my response to DwarvenTavern right below my previous response to you. That build wouldn't be possible with the current system and many of those perks don't see much use. This system could change that.
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The solution isn't to add more perk slots and either risk upsetting the balance or changing little. The solution is to buff the underutilized perks to make them more attractive options.
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is there a perk counter or is that only something that behavior would be able to tally because im curious what the least used perks are now
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@TAG While that would be ideal, all the perks will never be at an equal power level and metas will always develop because some perks will always be stronger than others. I think the ability to bring more less-powerful perks would definitely incentivize many people to set down some of the meta perks and give some others a try. And the game would still be as balanced as it is now because everyone would have 12 perk points to utilize. Plus you could have more interesting combinations of perk builds this way.
@Jetgrind The devs have stats on how often perks are used and the survival/kill rates while using those perks. That would allow them to properly assign perk point values to each perk. They would also break away from stats for certain exceptions that might lead to more balanced gameplay. Like making Object of Obsession a 3 point perk even though it doesn't have a high escape rate and making Kindred a 1 point perk since it helps reduce the gap between solo play and survive with friends. And as I've mentioned before, all Hex perks would be 3 point perks.
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Here's the problem: It's not 12 points for the Killer side and 12 points for the Survivor side. It's 12 points for the Killer side and 12 points for EACH Survivor. Leading to a total of 12 points for the Killer side and 48 points for the Survivor side. Adding more perk slots disproportionately benefits the Survivors compared to the Killer because for every one additional perk the Killer is allowed to use, the Survivors are allowed an additional four. One Killer perk is not equal to four Survivor perks. The balance of the game was not designed around suddenly adding an additional up to eight slots to one side and up to two slots for the Killer.
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@TAG By that logic, the number of perks in the game doesn't work right now because the survivors have 16 perks and the killer has 4 perks. As far as I'm concerned, as long as each player has the same number of perk slots available, the balance will be roughly equivalent to what it is now. Congrats on 10,000 posts BTW.
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Except the game is fundamentally built around the idea of the Killer having four and the Survivors having sixteen total. It's not built around the Killer having six and the Survivors having twenty four.
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