Add longer cooldowns to the 4 Killers with High Mobility Powers with No/Low Cooldowns
With the reduction of map sizes in the last year or so, killers with no-cooldown or low-cooldown mobility powers are detrimental to killers with no mobility powers and oppressive if not unstoppable against survivors on these small maps. These killers need a cooldown added to their power similar to what Spirit has for her mobility power, which is 15 seconds per charge up to 75 seconds to fully recover her power.
Once these no-cooldown/low-cooldown mobility killers have a cooldown added to prevent things such as hooking a survivor on one side of the map and instantly being in a chase on the other side of the map, then a lot of the problematically large maps can be reduced for the low mobility killers such as Trapper, Plague, Doctor, etc. This would allow much better balancing of the game, so slow killers aren’t way outclassed by these broken no-cooldown/low-cooldown mobility killers. Right now, the rest of the problematic maps can’t be reduced because survivors would never stand a chance against these killers.
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Let’s use Spirit as a baseline for a well-balanced mobility killer with a cooldown.
- Spirit – 75 second cooldown. (15 sec per token up to 5 tokens.
- Mobility – 176% using power
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Here are the 4 killers with no-cooldown/low-cooldown mobility powers
- Nurse – 2 second cooldown.
- Mobility – 333% using Blink
- Blight – 10 second cooldown.
- Mobility – 250% using Rush
- Billy – 28 second cooldown
- Mobility – 230% using Sprint
- Wraith – None
- Mobility – 150% (Plus a lot of add-ons the increase this even more: Windstorm Blood, Windstorm White and Windstorm Mud)
Comments
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Billy already has overheat, a sizeable charge time & bad addons that's more than enough
Nurse has blink fatigue AND blink recharge. Normal nurse is fine, with addons it's slightly less fine.
Wraith has to cloak/uncloak to get mobility/be able to hit people. You could argue that the uncloak time IS the cooldown because you are slowed to a crawl while uncloaking.
Blight has his injection animation after every rush, similiar to Nurse.
Point is, these killers do have 'cooldowns' they're just not massive ones.
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This information isn't really accurate
Blight has 5 tokens, each token adds 2 seconds of cooldown + a base 2.5 second cooldown/fatigue where tokens don't regernate making his cooldown 12.5 seconds maximum which is pretty close to spirit, on top of that he moves at 230% speed, not 250%
Nurse can't really do with more cooldowns, mathematically her basekit only gives her 105% speed, anything that would slow her down on top of that would make it impossible to chase survivors that run in a straight line, and minimum cooldown is 2 seconds of fatigue + 1 second for the blink to recharge for 3 seconds because you can't really play with only one blink, or up to 6 seconds for both blinks
Spirit doesn't have tokens?, she just has her power which is 5 seconds of use and 15 seconds of cooldown the longer you use it the more the cooldown
Billy is a 3 second cooldown, or if he overheats a 20 second cooldown, I don't know where the 28 comes from
They all have cooldowns which are usually enough to be played around
and yes you can still reduce the size of maps / the spread of maps, high mobility killers shouldn't limit game design since, billy, blight, and wraith, all still have to play around pallets so even if the map is smaller if they are more dense its fine
and nurse and spirit don't play around the resources anyway, so if you just have smaller maps they can't use bbq to find survivors making it harder for them to play fluidly
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I'm not sure why Spirit is being used as a baseline for "well balanced mobility killer". Her power does make her move faster, but you aren't really going to be using it to traverse the map unless you have Mother Daughter ring.
Nurse is also the same way. You could use her power for mobility, but the actual distance isn't that far unless you are using addons.
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Arbitrarily long cooldowns are neither fun to play as nor are they good game design, quite the opposite. It shows an inability to address the core issues, which the devs are famous for with their bandaid fixes the past 5 years.
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They work fine for Spirit and her power doesn't allow her to Insta-down (Billy), Avoid Looping Entirely (Nurse), Have a speed up after uncloaking (Wraith) and is similar to what Blight does sans her invisibility. (Nurses movement speed would need to be increased to 110 or 115).
Long cooldowns would not reduce the functionality of these powers but would keep these killers from completely dominating small maps, which is preventing reducing the map size for the other 5/6s of Killers in the game.
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Maybe you shouldn't be the one suggesting changes here, you keep making mistakes or misunderstanding fundamentals about certain killer powers.
Spirit doesn't use a token system and doesn't have a cooldown of 75 seconds. But what she does have is, like Wraith, increased movement speed after exiting her power, though unlike wraith, she just carries on with her phase-speed and doesn't need to speed up again. However, mechanically, they're the same thing.
Nurse was never meant to be countered with looping.
Long cooldowns make these killer feel unwieldy and undynamic to play as, which is inherently poor design and should not be the way to go.
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'Mobility Killers need long cooldowns!'
*Proceeds to list every mobility Killer that has cooldowns*
So I guess you mean 'Mobility Killers should be nerfed, but I will hide it behind an attempt at balance'?
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I didn't realize I mentioned Oni, Clown, Legion, Hag, Freddy and Demogorgon. Where was it I mentioned those killers in my post again?
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First using Clown as an example of a mobility killer.
Second, of all the killers in the game. Clown is the closest to having no cooldown on his "mobility".
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So you're just ignoring that people told you Nurse, Blight, Billy, and Wraith have cooldowns on their power? I guess you'd have too, in order to demand nerfs for them.
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I think that since the title contains "No/Low Cooldowns", and that the post contained 4 additional "Low Cooldowns" that I wouldn't need to reply to that. I do still feel that it's blatantly obvious what "Low Cooldowns" means, since I noted the cooldown times in relation to Spirit's cooldown times, so I will only reply to you with this blisteringly sarcastic retort instead of giving you the definition of "Low Cooldowns". Does that help any?
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I think the real question here is, are cooldowns a metric of a balanced power?
You've highlighted The Spirit as your prime example of a balanced power, and said that Nurse has no cooldown as is therefore not balanced...
If that doesn't show you the error in your logic I don't know what to say.
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I'm specifically talking about low-cooldown mobility powers. There are people that consider Spirit's power problematic for other reasons. However, since her power also gives her mobility, the mobility of her power is balanced by the fact that there is a longer cooldown attached to it.
Where as a Nurse has the ability to move from one side of the map to the other over and over again rapidly. This is especially problematic because of BBQ & Chili.
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Billy has overheat. On top of that, it's his entire weapon. He's already juggling it.
Blight has 5 tokens, each having 2 secs of recharge and a 2.5 sec fatigue. Also, Blight is 230%, same as Billy.
Nurse has recharge time and fatigue. Plus, she's 96.25% without her blinks.
Wraith is a hit and run killer. He really needs that mobility to do his job, especially without a cooldown since if he had one, it'd force him into extended chases which is literally his weakness.
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Honestly Ruin with no hex totem should be basekit so that the value of downing a single survivor is higher so people don't have to main high mobility killers to actively subjugate the entire survivor team in order to slow their snowball. Not stop, but slow since 1 deliverance or unbreakable and the whole game resets.
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Ohh, blisteringly sarcastic. 🙄
You're basically saying 'I don't think Those Killer's powers are bad enough, make the Killers worse'. not every Killer has to be compared to every other Killer. You can't compare Freddy to Nurse, for example, and say 'Freddy has <x> cooldown on his gen teleport, so Nurse should have the same!'
Or compare Freddy to Trapper and say 'Trapper has to pick up his traps, so Freddy should have to somehow pick up his Dream Snares!'
Plus, they each have a cooldown of sorts, but you're asking for a cooldown atop a cooldown, because you don't think it's enough. Again; you want to nerf them into the dirt. It's obvious to anyone who reads your post. The fact that you call them all 'broken' shows where your intent is.
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Spirit being balanced but Nurse is OP is already crazy enough, but saying Spirit has tokens and and a 75 second cooldown is just wrong. Is this a joke post?
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Not sure if joke post or if the OP simply has never played killer (very likely), given that the info is so desperately, horrifically wrong.
Or the OP is from an alternate timeline where the Spirit is completely different. Or from the future, after Spirit has been reworked into some god-awful token-cooldown system.
Simply playing any of the killers mentioned in the original post will showcase that hey, they're not as easy or oppressive as Munqaxus seems to think. This is very much a "I suck against these killers so they're clearly OP, even though I have literally never played AS THEM so I don't understand them in the slightest"
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I don't play Nurse but I do play Billy as one of my 3rd main and have played some Wraith, Spirit and Blight. I also play Trapper and Plague and can tell a major difference in how easy it is to get 4ks with the Billy, Wraith and Blight compared to Trapper and Plague. I usually have 4 to 5 gens left with Billy and Wraith without running ruin compared to usually being around 1 to 2 gens with Trapper and Plague before I get a 4k.
I also play survivor and can see a massive difference when playing against those killers compared to other killers.
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Kinda original, but you can do better than that.
4/20
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Problem is that those are included in the killers power. Resulting in killers being punished for using their power.
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If you want to be really accurate, Blight has a 3 second cooldown when he hits someone and 2.5 second cooldown when he misses or hits a pallet or a wall I believe.
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That's a 2/10
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None of those are even close to mobility killers. Clown moves 10% faster. Oni has high mobility for a short while and spends the rest of the time being an m1 killer, Legion is not a mobility killer in the slightest they move 15% faster then eat a 4 second stun. Hag has to compeltely rely on survivors setting off a trap to be mobile and otherwise is a 110. And both Freddy and Demogorgon don't have mobility as their primary power both of them just have it on the side its like calling Pig an antiloop killer because they can dash.
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All of those Killers have a reasonable way to move around the map without being able to move from one side of the map to the opposite side continuously with penalty. For example, Blight can move from one side of the map to the exact opposite, then be right back to the other-side again without any penalties. If Freddy teleports to a gen on the opposite side of the map and doesn't find anyone, he is penalized by having to move at normal speed while his power recharges. The game is always going to have a problem when you have 1/6th of the killers that can abuse their movement power without consequence, having complete map control while the out 5/6th are being held back by mobility.
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Thats the point they cant move to the other side of the map so they arent mobility killers.
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It honestly annoys me when people say Blight has a short cooldown, and I'm tired of it. He doesn't have a short cooldown, for the Entity's sake. His cooldown is shorter when you use less charges. His cooldown in general takes 1000 years to regenerate after using 5 tokens.
What about Demo? It has a slightly shorter cooldown than Blight for its mobility and good chase. In simple terms, it's pretty much Freddy with a cooldown 10 times shorter and a different type of chase, as well as more interactive counterplay. Time to nerf Demo I guess.
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You have wrongly listed that spirit has a 75 second cooldown and 5 tokens.
1) spirits power does not have tokens
2) she has a 15 second cooldown total, IF she uses her entire power, if she only uses half of it it will be 7.5 seconds. If she uses a quarter it will be ~3.8 seconds.
A lot of the other numbers are wrong too.
Blight can be up to 13 second cooldown if he hits a survivor. Blights speed is also not 250%
Nurse's cooldown is 3 per token with a varying time fatigue that is close to 2 seconds.
I have no idea where billys 28 is coming from.
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I know you're joking about nerfing Demo but hell no
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Yeah Demo is perfect as it is I was just mocking OP.
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I'm still hoping for some better addons
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