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Why do we still try to balance around 2kills 2 escapes?
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well the times would be an average, not a per chase. on average trapper is going to have somewhat longer chases. a good trapper making 200 IQ trap placements is going to have shorter chases of course so should be paired with better survivors
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Why shouldn't face camping 2 people to death not be considered kills. The killer worked the entire match to get those kills. Those type of killers should be pushed up in MMR so that they face players that can deal with that type of play.
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Getting 2 kills via face camping is probably never going to result in high mmr. Rofl. I love the vote of confidence, however.
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But lets be honest. Face camping nets a Killer 3 to 4 kills most matches, so they will move up in MMR.
I was playing with a SWF, with a toolbox and Prove Thyself. We saw a Bubba take a survivor all the way to a basement in the two story building in the swamp. We knew immediately that the Bubba was face camping. We did only gens and didn't attempt to save the survivor. The survivor struggled the entire time. By the time we powered the gates, the survivor died and Bubba came out of the basement and got a second survivor and face camped.
In close to one of the most optimal situations, Bubba was able to get 2 kills by doing absolutely nothing but face-camping. So basically, if any survivor makes a mistake, doesn't have gen speed-up abilities or even goes to check on a face-camping victim, then the Killer is going to get at least 3 kills if not 4.
It's a tactic a 10 year old can pull off, yet it will push them up in MMR way further than some above average skilled killers can go.
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To me the optimal outcome in a game like this is 5 gens popped and one escape.
That means the survivors had enough pressure that they got their first main objective done, but the killer had enough pressure that he could punish them for it. As in Killer should optimally get 2 kills during the first 4 gens and one after the 5th is popped.
One thing I feel should be a thing is making the time after the gates are powered much scarier for the survivors. At that point perks like BT and DS should become inactive. It should be a really dangerous choice to go back in for a save at that point. The killer should be in constant Tier 1 bloodlust, but it shouldn't trigger things like Beast of Prey, if anything they should be even more noticable to up the scare factor.
As it is now if there's more than two survivors left when the gates are powered it's usually the least scary part of the game as they can split up and 99% both gates. If someone gets downed they can BT, DS, and body block all the way to the gate making it an easy escape.
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Aim for one thing but hit something else? This reminds me of a quote.
"Shoot for the stars but if you happen to miss shoot for the moon instead"
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I think until a proper WIN CONDITION is hammered out, we're never going to have a proper focal point to balance around.
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Just talked to people I played with about this.
The devs needs to define a clear win condition. Even if DBD is a casual game, as long as that doesn't exist, this game will have a rough time.
It doesn't even need to deviate from what we already have too.
Killers needs to kill, but the Entity wants to feed.
So instead of the hook system we have right now, what if there is a threshold to how much the Entity is "fed" based on how many times a Survivor is hooked? 3 hooks still kills a survivor. But getting into stage 2 on your first hook doesn't reward as much as finding and hooking someone a second time after giving the Entity a "varied" meal. Meaning you are encouraged to go after different survivors to fill out that threshold.
We can also ditch the Emblem System in favour of filling out this meter. You get 2 pips if you get 80% of the meter filled for example.
Not only that, we also know the Entity loves the hunt. It wants us to toy with the survivors. So it would reward the chase as well as the hunt. If you can keep finding survivors, you get rewarded. If you can keep downing survivors in a chase, you get rewarded. But if you let them go by letting them off your grasp, or letting them sluglged for too long to be rescued. You can get punished for it.
As for Survivors, you would need to do actions that increase their "Hope". Since that is what the Entity feeds on. So doing generators, healing others, thwarting the Killers by doing totems and escaping chases. Stuff that gives the Survivors hope for survival. And this way, you can go all game just being the designated chaser or saver and not do gens or get killed in the end and still win when the game is over.
Because you did enough for your team for you to help them escape.
In my opinion, this system is MUCH better than what we have right now with the Emblem System and gives you a designated win condition. Because in my opinion, "winning" is pipping up in a game.
With the winning condition being how much "hopeful" the survivors can get to escape and how much the Killer "feeds" the Entity. We can balance the game around more than just a Kill/Escape ratio. Because even if Survivors die in 75% of matches. As long as the majority of them "win" their games by doing enough to contribute to the team to help 1 or 2 survivors escape a harrowing death it should be good enough.
This way we can start buffing perks that helps towards that game state and Killers can feel like the threatening monsters they are.
Obviously it's not perfect. But a clear win condition is DESPERATELY needed for this game.
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Actually, they are getting about a 60% win rate. So they hit that target about perfectly, it's at 65%.
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They only do it that way because it's the easiest to do. If they really cared they would balance around maps and perks. The only balance they do is on the most used perks. But lets be honest even the most used perks they dont normally balance cough mostly on the survivor side because if they balanced bt, unbreakable, ds, and exhaustion.... lets just say there would be no survivors.
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That sounds fun to be a survivor then. Not.
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Because a 2k gets a Killer an Entity Displeased.
And Survivors get to escape.
Killer gets Deranked.
Survivor gets fun.
gg ez.
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That’s why BHVR coddles to the survivor side. If survivors have to actually use more than 5 brain cells versus a killer then they’ll call the killer “un-fun”.
Can’t jeopardize those booty short cosmetic sales!!
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This. The reason i look for that early first kill is to put more pressure on other survivors as early as possible. If im having a game where im doing that already, im perfectly happy for 8 hooks and 0 kills and more than that is a bonus for me. But people do see kills as a win. This is what annoys me about the 2K2E argument.
The majority of killers want at least a 3K. The majority of survivors think if you didnt get a 4k then you lost and they won. Half of those survivors will salt you post game for being bad and not getting a 4k.
But no. 2K2E is balance. Makes zero sense.
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Because the game is already in favour of the coordinated 80%. 50/50 at low to mid ranks is fine but theres no consideration for higher ranks in which Killers get activly bullied by swf's and the dynamic shifts. It should be the killer being feared, not the 4 man troll squads.
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I would like the developers to work not around 2/2, but with emblems, since emblems have clear conditions. Victory is +1 pip, confident victory +2, draw - 0. Then the very fact of murder, death or escape fades into the background, and victory or defeat becomes personal.
And the developers need to say this on social networks.
At this point, it seems to me that the developers do not have enough courage (or eggs) to make a statement about what exactly is a victory or a defeat.
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High MMR only affects less than 5% of players. This includes Nurses and SWFs. Both are broken beyond help.
I think the only way to fix the game for those 5% of players is to totally change the game rules when they get that high.
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