General Discussions
General Discussions
Simple Yes or No - Is anyone else ok with the MMR details?
Totally not expecting to be in the majority, but I appreciate any and all replies :3
Yes
Comments
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No
It's not skill based match making, it's escape based match making. That's what I'm gonna be calling it from now on
A survivor playing well and dying so everyone else gets out/getting facecamped to death from the beginning somehow determines they are of lower skill than those who escaped in the match. It's BS
62 -
No
3 -
No, I'm not OK with how they calculate MMR. Someone that spends the match hiding until escape should not be rewarded over someone that did objective and helped teammates but died. It is not SKILL based and they need to stop calling it that.
4 -
no
0 -
Don't care. I get nothing from gaining MMR. I focus my play just like I always have....Getting as much done as I can to pip and get BP. If I win great if not so what.
3 -
yes
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Yes.
0 -
Why not?
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No.
Honestly puts me off playing. Like what's the point in even having it if it's not on skill. Nothing is more a kick in the balls that you doing insane chases and lots of gens and carrying a game to die on first hook while others escape and be told you lost. Like no I didn't. And the less you escape the worse teams youd get, worse teams means less Escaping etc.
ITS A JOKE!
btw my nemesis is still stupid high mmr and iv barely played him. Thanks for sharing my nurse mmr with him :)
2 -
I'm not sure if it works like this. You may actually be paired with better survivors to compensate towards a certain MMR, based on the killer you are matched with.
It also means that you will face less skilled, less meta killers. You would be unlikely to face a billion Blights, Nurses, Spirits etc.
0 -
Definitely not.
2 -
I'm more surprised that people are surprised.
I mean, we knew this weeks ago.
8 -
Well, the objective of the game is to survive, so I fail to see how that's "playing well." You died.
However I do agree with the sentiment. It's escape-based matchmaking and frankly is the previous system. Just with less meaning behind the colors.
2 -
Hey listen
If I run the killer for the whole game, but then I'm facecamped because all the gens are done - in what world does that mean I have less skill than my three teammates who (to their credit) did what they were supposed to do
I get that the objective is to 'survive' but then that's not SBMM that's EBMM.
Glad we agree on that
8 -
Hey listen
Running the killer for days is not the objective of DBD.
2 -
But do we agree that chases are the only thing in this game that take any semblence of skill (On both sides, mind you not just one or the other).
2 -
No
2 -
no. because no one has told me what MMR is yet. What is it?
0 -
you only gain mmr as survivor if you escape
you lose more if you die first, then you lose slightly less if you die 2nd, 3rd, 4th
hatch doesn't give or remove mmr
you gain mmr as killer for (shockingly) getting kills. I'm guessing the more kills = more mmr
and you only lose it if everyone escapes (I think?)
1 -
Yes
0 -
Basically before 5.2.0, the game used ranks for matchmaking.
Now it uses a hidden value to match people up together based on your skill.
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Thank you. so MMR is the name of the hidden value system?
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No for killers (individual killer mmr should be 50 percent of main killer mmr).
Yes for survivor (it is chill mode for a reason)
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No.
And I'm incredibly displeased with how the Devs spoke of the issue.
To quote Patrick, Lead Game Designer, using mostly a rather condescending tone: "There's sort of, a question I get asked a lot, I see from the community, I've even had people on the team talk to me about. They talk about the Survivor perspective of: I was playing a game of Survivor and I looped the Killer for seven consecutive hours and I unhooked, y'know, eighteen other Survivors and I healed for ninety-three health states, I fixed ten generators, it was such an amazing game, I truly am a god amongst men when I play Dead by Daylight. But then, right at the end, I got thrown on a hook and I died and I don't like that counts as a loss. And the idea here is, wouldn't it be nice if you could do all of that and sometimes you get out alive? Right? Wouldn't that be nice? That's the idea, that's all that MMR is trying to do. It goes, I know you've died, it's ignoring how you got there, because there's too much nuance to be able to make a real, effective system."
Like, on what planet is this an okay thing? How is this a mindset the Devs should have? I'm actually blown away that this is just the thought process that goes down and nobody's questioning it. Yes, there's too much for MMR to calculate, so maybe instead of trying to make DBD a competitive game, maybe instead of trying to force MMR, they could find a better system. And ######### me if the tone and delivery of that statement didn't answer any and all questions I could ever have about how Behaviour views their game.
11 -
Ironically the old pip system worked better
3 -
Oh, yeah definitely. That's why the new system is so ass-backwards. It just doesn't make sense to put the 1v1 skill test as a non-objective. At least they give bloodpoints and pip progression though...?
2 -
We're on the same page then fellow forum goer, I agree with ya.
2 -
HELL NO
0 -
This. Before if I was "God amongst men" in the game and died I would pip and next match be matched with teammates of equal skill and have better chance to escape. Now, if I'm "God amongst men" and die I have high chance of being matched with those that died because they are terrible and increases my odds to die again. His "you'll get easier matches if you die" applies to 4swf not solo or 2swf.
This is just like Almo when he said "Based on stats OoO is fine" and Cote had to point out stats wise may be fine but how does it FEEL for players, they say it feels bad so we should look at it. They need to look at how the game FEELs with SBMM. It doesn't feel good to die and get a bad team after over and over until you luck out with team that actually had skill. It doesn't feel good to know you played the match great but died and now you are getting sent to play with other players that aren't necessarily skilled - you just all died recently.
3 -
No. SBMM has done nothing but punish killers for being even slightly good. It's not fun having to play sweaty every single match so no, their explanation was sh-t because they didn't even mention this glaring fact. They made it sound like they don't play their own game or understand the systems they implement.
3 -
nope
1 -
no.
why it even took them a year to implement such primitive system
3 -
I'm glad they gave us details but other than that, absolutely not. They've lied to us for months about how the system wasn't just kills and escapes just to turn around and tell us it's kills and escapes. If that system is so sucky then why are we using it for matchmaking? That doesn't make sense. At least with the ranked matchmaking, your rank was determined by fulfilling different requirements that happen throughout the match. Now we just have a worse version of that.
3 -
What bothers me is that they knew that basing SBMM around kills and escapes doesn't work. And they did it anyway.
They had months to work with and a team to make this SBMM work. And yet, they based it around kills and escapes.
So it's either:
- The devs can't or don't want to make a working SBMM, or
- The devs found out that basing SBMM around kills and escapes is the only good option they have.
So, no. I am not ok with this.
5 -
A funnier name is Survival based matchmaking
2 -
No.
It's awful. The previous Rank based system was actually superior. Basing your skill level on escapes is ridiculous for Solo survivors. It does nothing but encourage selfish game play. That person who wasted the Killers time through the last 3 gens? yeah, LEAVE them to die on the hook during EGC. Don't even try to rescue, because the Killer is face-camping and God knows, if I die, I'll be increasingly stuck with potatoes as team mates and camping Killers being sucked further downinto the bog. Not to mention it works entirely contrary to their pip system, which encourages team work? So if I escape (through a door mind you, not the hatch), and I've done next to nothing but hide, I won't pip and get their "monthly reward". But if I do everything to pip and don't escape? I'll be screwed in MMR.
Do these narcissists even play their own game?
3 -
No. How could be anything else? Wins revolve around kills and escapes. There's no skill involved.
2 -
No
0 -
No, I'm not.
And as someone who defended MMR in the past, I'm more than willing to eat my words because that is an awful way of creating a SKILL BASED Matchmaking system.
3 -
I do wish that it was a bit more nuanced on the survivor side of things, and it feels like it's naturally going to increase killer MMR faster than it probably should (depending on whether a 2-kill is a net gain, a net loss or neutral) - but I actually don't hate it.
MMR systems are really difficult to get right, even in relatively simple games.
I do expect it to be further refined going forward.
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It's called "skill based matchmaking". It should be based on skill and not one factor.
3 -
And a killer who did poorly all game, only to get hooks and kills at the end because of NOED, gets to advance.
5 -
The problem is killers don't get any benefit by raising their mmr.
As a survivor you are getting teammates who are more efficient at least.
But don't get me wrong. I am not a fan of sbmm in general now.
1 -
I'm ok with it because it puts more emphasis on people escaping instead of just messing around with the killer all game. It might even normalize the gameplay a bit. Not saying it wont cause some people to play a certain way... but overall I think it's better this way, because everyone has the same goal: survive and leave, without using hatch
0 -
Good point.
3 -
Lol no. I do find it hilarious though
2 -
No.
And now that we know it's based on gate escapes/kills, it's incredibly easy to game it by farming as much BP as you can before throwing. This is even easier to game than the old rank system, as once you dipped down to purple ranks you'd always safety pip doing this.
2 -
All I know is somehow my games are better now than it was with the old ranking system. So my answer will be YES.
Though after watching videos of Patrick explaining how it works made it feel not ok.
1 -
No. System might be ok for killer due to being based on kills, but escapes is not ok for survivor. Also, a hard-capped system has the same issues that using ranked has is that the grand majority of people (maybe even all killers or survivors depending exactly how the system works) will end up at the top meaning matches are essentially just random again.
1 -
No.
2
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