I’m genuinely disgusted at BHVR supporting NFTs
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Ok, here's the thing. The idea is that it's a limited collectable that may or may not pay off (depending if you have another sucker to bye it from you). The scarcity of an NFT is completely artificial, and the content that you "own" with an NFT is easily mass produced, so yes, I do consider it a scam.
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*pyramid scheme intensifies*
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Sorry, but your whole understanding is wrong...
The whole "environmental damage" of NFTs comes from the fact that they are stored in a cryptocurrency database and building this cryptocurrency database (blockchain) needs a lot of computing power, i.e. electricity, i.e. cheap electricity, which is made using fossil fuels.
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Pyramid scheme is something different.
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IGN put out article about DBD working with NFT company and fans being unhappy, this was how they ended the article... 😂 😂 😂
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You say that it is a scam, because it can be mass produced. It would be a scam if you didn't know about it and someone would sell you while claiming the opposite.
Btw I guess even if a lot of NFTs can be created for the same stuff, most likely the first one will have the value for people. But I am not an expert on this.
Note: I would also not buy NFTs, I am not interested in them.
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Crypto, and by proxy NFTs, are a ponzi scheme. They only have value if there's someone to sell to, and they're not goods which accrue real value. The mass production is not the true issue from an economic standpoint - it's the intrinsic volatility of unbacked intangibiles. However, the ecological impact of a single Bitcoin is a cost, and one we as a community ought to be against.
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Yeah, till none of that matters because the support from the community stops.
All this hard work, gonna go to waste because the company you work for just wants the money.
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Ponzi scheme is:
Invest in my company and then I will give you profit. But the profit actually does not come from company business but from new investors.
Bitcoin is not really that.
There are many things that don't have real value and their value comes only from what people are willing to pay for it. E.g. paintings.
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All crypto is exactly that description of a ponzi scheme. "Invest in [cryptocurrency of choice] for a chance at some big dividends! Ignore that the profit only comes from market interest (and thus new investors) and has no tangible backing beyond that promise" - that part about no tangible backing, by the way, being an intrinsic selling point to the rubes who believe in blockchain.
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In Ponzi scheme the organizer claims that the profit comes from a legitimate business (which is in reality fake or makes no profit).
So what is the fake business in Bitcoin? Isn't it obvious that it has some value, because people believe it has value? Buying Bitcoin because you think their value will go up is speculation, but not a Ponzi scheme.
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The fake business is Bitcoin itself. No, it doesn't have value, and the lie that people tell themselves that it has value is just part of the ponzi scheme, not a miraculously self-evident fiat currency.
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I don't agree, because nothing in Bitcoin says "buy me and you will get more value back" or something similar.
There are people speculating that their value will go up. There may be companies selling Bitcoins with fake promises of their value going up. But it is not Bitcoin's fault.
Based on your logic everything is a scam, because e.g. someone can create a scammy business selling that thing.
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I agree that NFTs are absolutely horrible and a scam, but they're not a ponzi scheme; a resource does not have to be finite to have value, therefore an NFT has legitimate value (however small) and a ponzi scheme is not possible. If it was, money itself would be a scam.
It's possible, however, and very prevalent to basically mass produce extremely similar NFTs at no cost and completely nosedive the price of the bought NFT's value, completely screwing over consumers and keeping all the profit. This is why it's a broad scam: investors aren't being tricked into investing by being promised profit, consumers just straight-up get scammed by giving away money like idiots, wasting energy/resources, and losing most if not all public credibility.
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NFTs and crypto aren't real currency, and NFTs do not have legitimate value.
Everything can be a scam. Not everything is. Crypto is just a scam skirting a long documented history of backing being a limiting factor by deluding people into thinking it's not needed.
The entire selling model for Bitcoin and crypto is that promise of value - saying any different is just proof positive of bad faith.
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If you don't believe NFTs have legitimate value, you've forgotten how economics works.
An individual NFT is one-of-a-kind, therefore it's a scarce resource. You can also look at it as an NFT uses energy, therefore it's scarce by proxy (even if the supply of NFTs is infinite).
Scarce resources are inherently sought after, so there's value in having that resource and its price increases in response to the demand people have for owning it.
Again, NFTs are scummy and only a piece of ######### uses them but they technically do have value, and are not a ponzi scheme. If they were, it would be outlawed.
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In other news, the steamchart is looking tasty
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Sure, if you think it is a scam, you are free to think it, and for you Bitcoins or other cryptocurrencies will have zero value. Some people think it has value, some don't. This can be told about almost everything.
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I cant believe I'm actually going to say something in support of what a mod said...
"Remember some peoples lives depend on this game" This is always something to keep in mind everyone. I am empathetic to that.
That being said I completely suck at translating some things for people to understand. It might be an idea for someone to post a concise thread - pinned - on how NTFs work and how they can work along with Pros and Cons of them. Most people are not going to understand them.
Education is better than fear and you can't make good choices if you don't understand. Understanding is the key to many things.
Also this is a VERY important note:
"Absolutely zero blockchain tech exists" and they can verify that if they wanted. It would ease a lot of this.
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Totally nothing to do with the servers being down, I'm sure.
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We'll see about that. I expect a drop regardless of when the servers come back online.
If people's lives depend on a video game, ESPECIALLY this one, I'm moving to antartica to live with penguins. At least their brains aren't walnuts.
If you mean the devs, that is such a terrible excuse for forgiving a game company that I've lost even more faith in humanity. That's like saying EA hires lots of developers, so you can't criticize them for being the scummiest game company.
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Let me rephrase it... livelihoods. As in paying bills, eating etc. Life basics :-)
Right about now my comment "Also this is a VERY important note:
"Absolutely zero blockchain tech exists" and they can verify that if they wanted. It would ease a lot of this."
Is looking like a really good idea for them to do.
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NFTs are created using blockchain tech. If they said that, it would be misinformation
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It all depends on the type you're referencing and how it's all implemented and place together. Not all NTF's contain what most people consider Blockchain Tech.
It's why I thought it might be a good idea to have one thread with a full explanation that's easy for an average person to understand.
Sadly I understand it - but would be the worst person ever to try to explain it.
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A non-fungible token (NFT) is a unique and non-interchangeable unit of data stored on a digital ledger (blockchain).[1] NFTs can be used to represent easily-reproducible items such as photos, videos, audio, and other types of digital files as unique items (analogous to a certificate of authenticity), and use blockchain technology to establish a verified and public proof of ownership. Copies of the original file are not restricted to the owner of the NFT, and can be copied and shared like any file. The lack of interchangeability (fungibility) distinguishes NFTs from blockchain cryptocurrencies, such as Bitcoin.
Unless wikipedia is wrong (and the argument about it being unreliable is completely bogus), NFTs are created and stored USING blockchain tech. Even if somehow everyone else is missing something and some aren't, the concept itself is extremely dangerous to the internet as a whole:
"You don't own this NFT, therefore you can't have or use it! Only I can, haha :)" - Someone trying to profit off of a copy and paste of a .jpg
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So, from all I understand now (if the 'lower ranking' devs etc are truthful) : No one doing the actual working on the game itself (art team, modelers, coders etc) were apparently informed about the nfts business, while the higher ups knew what was going on for MONTHS? AKA the big head honchos didn't just lie to the customers (and had the twitter guys lie as well (after all the 'news' are things written by someone else and usally the social media crew has to tweet them out) but their own dev team?
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Sadly that is how it's looking. A higher end programmer also would have had to know.
Not quite was I was aiming for - but thank you. You have probably helped people a bit. :-)
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Well i guess this is the straw that broke my back
I wonder if you have an idea of how hard it is for me to write this, and moreso for me to do this.
First, i'll write some of my problems with this game...
- 5th Anniversary was quite the disappointment to me, which i REALLY needed to not be.
- Hackers are going loose right now and they're showing very little care about it too. (Devs, if you read this: SHOW! SHOW that you care.)
- And now this whole ordeal with the Hellraiser chapter.
- Some patches & statements REALLY made me question if they know what they're actually doing, with 2 prime examples being Mcote saying: "Infinites take skill." & the patch which made Survivors able to Pallet-stun or blind the Killer at any time during the pick-up animation and it would trigger the rescue, removing any timing needed besides having to be there during the animation.
- Survivor gameplay is VERY much the same since launch, so i got bored with that after a while, and thus i wasn't playing half of the game anyway.
- Don't like Battle Passes, and while i didn't enjoy the Rift either, i tolerate it.
- Linked outfits are quite terrible to me but i just didn't think about them.
- QA more often than i'd like feels non-existant after patch releases.
- With the current Boon Perks and more surely coming up, using Hex: Devour Hope on its own is no longer a viable option for me to generate my kind of fun, and this reason alone would surely eventually kill my desire to play DbD.
- Crashes/freezes. No other game of mine has crashed or frozen as many times as DbD has, and crashes/freezes are a HUGE demotivator for me to play, i'm usually done playing a game for the day if it crashes or freezes.
- Optimization for consoles is absolutely astonishing and i don't mean the good astonishing.
But guess what?
I don't regret a single thing, because i enjoyed all of MY decisions in the game...
- I don't regret getting all Perks on one character, as they helped keep the game fresh for me, good or bad.
- I don't regret getting all those cosmetics, as i enjoyed making my own personal outfits and show them off.
- I don't regret sinking so much time into this game, as it's the same as any other hobby: You sink time into it cause you enjoy it, and enjoying DbD i sure did. (Half of it, but that half was pretty damn good.)
And i am very confident i won't regret this decision either: ######### this, it's time to quit!
It's been a good run DbD, but it's time to put you to bed.
I feel no more joy starting it up and enjoyment is all i play games for.
The ONLY reason i'm not permanently deleting DbD isn't because i don't want to remove my playtime.
I've deleted many save files in multiple Dark Souls games before, all of which contained AT LEAST dozens of hours per save file.
No, the ONLY reason why i'm not doing that is cause, despite all this, it hasn't changed me: I'm still a hopeful man.
Call it blind faith, but perhaps there's a future out there where a different company buys DbD and simply does way better.
Heck, i might get into a different asymmetrical game. (Don't count on it.)
I could probably write lots more, but i don't think it's worth it, plus it's late as i write this.
Took me like 2 days to make this decision too and whenever i had free time, this decision was all i was thinking about.
Some of you will think i took way too long, some of you will think i'm overreacting and will come back soon.
Both of you could be right, both of you could be wrong, i really don't care cause this is my experience.
I'm just really ready to be done with this game now.
See y'all in other games perhaps IDK i'm not much of a multiplayer-only guy besides DbD of course.
I'll probably check on this comment again tomorrow, but i suspect i'll be done with the forums as well after that.
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Except to show BHVR that this is unacceptable, we have to hit them where it hurts, their wallets. That is going to include hurting everyone who is working on or with the game. If the staff and mods are supposedly against this whole NFT business as they claim on Twitter, then they should understand and aid us through actions, not empty words on Twitter to appease the mob.
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I just made an NFT of this post and sold it for 37p.
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I'm sorry you decided this and I hope it's for now. I feel you. I really do.
I have a love hate relationship with this game. It's a phycological mine field of poop on the best of days. (That's playing it.) Never mind the rest of the issues you mentioned.
For the foundations of the game itself, there are a lot of security holes. Very few can be patched properly without a tare down unfortunately. Financially that simply wouldn't be viable and that's a sad truth.
Correct. It's always how I have protested something of major importance to me. Cash is King. Rather than feed into something if I am that against it. I stop feeding it. It's also why I'm empathetic in this case as well. It's hard to hit where the big boys lay without devastating the innocent. It's a fine line. One everyone needs to choose themselves. Tough calls. I don't envy anyone right now.
Post edited by MaybeShesCrazy on4 -
*sheds tear*
I now you've been here a long time. I was here before you got your red/trusted status. I've been I'm a similar sort of mood with the game BEFORE the NFT bs. It takes a fair bit to stop playing a game that you love (and essentially addicted to). But there is little integrity with the responsibility at BHVR, especially now more than ever.
For a good while, from my introduction of the game when Clown came out, to about when Deathslinger released, I was playing DBD every day. I actually did not play any singleplayer game during that time frame. Then I got burned out and then got miffed and further burned with how console performance was (still is) and then the removal of Events, the battlepass rift nonsense etc.
Then we come to this and their huge silence until they give a pitiful explanation that doesn't answer nor addresses the major issues and concerns people are having. Just a ######### show. I wish ya the best and hope you stick to your guns, because this situation needs to be burned into the Industry's mind, that they don't forget.
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My empathy for anything BHVR has or will do is none because they give none, they don't care for a lot of their communities feedback on a lot of stuff when THEY should have had empathy and known when not to do it, I feel all this NFT stuff is a bit of karma, why should I be empathetic for BHVR who has never been empathetic for so many of their community?
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I’m sorry to see you going man - I’m in the same boat though, I’m taking a huge step back from the game and may never come back. We only talked a few times but you were always a respectful presence on the forums, and it’ll be a colder place without you. I’ve been sticking around to see if the frustration with the NFT was going to stick around longer than the average attention span, but after that I’ll probably join you in the general idea of things. Hope whatever game you land in continues to bring you enjoyment.
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Life isn't this game or any game. Don't take it so seriously specially knowing the history of dbd from the start, they can do whatever they want with their game, we decide to play it or not.
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If this is insinuating that the devs of dead by daylight are a few missed paychecks away from losing everything then we can add to the list that DBD doesn't pay its devs enough. sound fair?
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Millions of people in developed nations are only a missed paycheck or two from poverty. That's by far not exclusive to DBD, or even the video game industry as a whole.
That's an inherent issue with capitalism, and simply playing your devs more is like applying a bandaid to a decapitation.
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Im not trying to solve world poverty though. the what aboutism to the extreme when talking about activism is so underhanded. Lets for a second narrow our lense of view to something we are apart of. take DBD. If the argument is dont punish the devs because it will mess with their livelihood then maybe we should also concern ourselves with them being grossly underpaid. Or we can acknowledge that the devs are probably paid pretty decently and are not on the brink of ruin and the comment is only brought up as a way to silence people who feel strongly about something others fail to care about. because it is a failure to not care about this.
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also appealing to poverty does not work for me. I have spent my entire life well under the poverty level and have scratched and clawed my way to try and get out. dont think for a second that im unsympathetic or dont understand the struggle. That still doesnt mean I cant be concerned about other things. activism doesnt mean all your energy into one thing or even the most important things. Activism means spending the energy you can on causes you believe in, to the betterment of others but not to the detriment of yourself.
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I feel really bad for those tied to the company in any way that didn't know about this until the bombshell dropped.
Like that's just sad...
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Exactly. This is just a whine fest
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you should look up a study on the Bitconnect incident, which was a big ponzi scheme to do with crypto.
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I didn't look too much into the details, but it seems like Bitconnect was the scam, not the Bitcoin itself.
Example: Just because some car dealer does some fraud and operates a scammy car shop you won't say that cars in general are a scam. Right?
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right, but the difference here is that Bitconnect is part of a standard that many people associate with cryptocurrency. Given how easy it is to pull off these schemes. Also cryptos involvement with a list of illicit activities doesn't do it any favours either.
I'd be willing to bet there are more bad examples than good of crypto users. And all for what? An unregulated digital currency? I really don't see any benefit in using crypto over conventional currencies. Especially seeing as how volatile the actual value of the cryptos are.
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Most people are exactly that.
Very few have the luxury of not worrying about day to day living or have enough of a stash, or are frugal in how the live their lives that they could comfortably do that. Financial security is something majority of people don't have. Some people like me, live well under their means and could stand on their own a little longer than others. Cost of living where they reside plays a role as well.
In order to fairly say they were under paid - I'd have to look at the duties, cost of living where they are at etc. etc.
In saying that though - majority of people are under paid for the duties they perform. So yes, they probably are underpaid. IF this was all done behind their backs and they were lied to - it's even worse as there is a lack of respect for what they do on top of it all.
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So just because Bitconnect was a scam it means that all cryptocurrencies are a scam? Sorry it doesn't make sense.
You can create scams like this with everything, even selling candies. Just promise a beautiful profit and you will find enough dumb people who join you. But it will not make candies a scam.
The benefits bod cryptocurrenccies is not really related to this discussion and I don't want to get into it.
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I stand corrected. There is Blockchain Tech.
Something's not quite right. I have to say I'm a bit disturbed. We'll see how it all plays out though?
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Cryptocurrencies gain their value from other people buying them.
Value only goes up as more transactions are made.
Which means there's a clear hierarchy. Early adopters make the most profit, late adopters see the least profit, with a progressively lower chance of gaining profit.
That is basically a pyramid scheme. At some point there is a poor sap at the bottom who loses out, and you only get a return on your investment if more people are recruited into the scheme. The only difference is you aren't (necessarily) the one directly recruiting your source of profit, so it feels more like stocks than a scam.
As opposed to stocks, which are tied to tangible companies making certain business decisions, trading real goods and services that have value to society. Still gambling, but not an entirely circular system.
Post edited by Seraphor on8 -
Hah,well he got banned eventually,guess BHVR doesn't like being called out,glad I quitted this game.
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