Why I think Boon perks are not as OP as people think
I like the idea of boons as it now makes totems an interesting mechanic that both roles can utilize, but I don't necessarily think they're that OP.
I hear people mentioning how up to 4 players can run the same boon, but wouldn't this also give survivors the "second objective" that killers have always been proposing? Yes, killers can go out of their way to snuff them out, but totems are typically located in obvious spots and it only takes a second or so to do so. The counterargument to this is specific maps/buildings, but hey, that's the dev's issue. I also don't think killers HAVE TO snuff them out unless they have the extra time to do so. I've played killer and still downed survivors when they were affected by the Shadow Step boon and vice versa when playing survivor. (since CoH is currently disabled)
Do I think boons are perfect the way they are? NO.
I think there's still some room for improvement, but I think people are exaggerating a bit when they imagine the idea of 4 people running boons. On paper, it sounds so good, but it's not always going to perform smoothly when executed. It takes time for the survivor to locate an optimal totem spot and then take 14-24 seconds to bless it which is time that they're not on generators which I'll take any day. Boon perks will also take up a perk slot so that means less chance of seeing the meta-driven perks that I don't even have to mention bc we all know what they are. Tying back to what I just said, boon perks should shift the meta which I think is a good thing. Do you want to see the same 4 perks at high-rank games?
I'm still cool if the devs decide to toy with the boons a bit and maybe lessen the leniency with them, but I wouldn't agree on making them a one-use perk. A lot of totems are easy to spot and as mentioned earlier, survivors blessing a totem are survivors who aren't on generators which equals less progression on their side. Combine that with injured survivors who may want to heal or need to unhook a fellow ally, that's an in-game slowdown for the killer.
With the two boons, we have now, I think a fair adjustment that can be made is to reduce the numerical values of Boon: Circle of Healing. 90/95/100% healing boost feels generous considering it offers the ability to heal yourself without outside assistance so kicking it down to 40/45/50% (or lower) seems more reasonable. The devs could also toy with the time it takes to bless totems and I'd be cool with that too.
This is my personal opinion on boons and it may seem bias since my role ratio (S/K) is 55/45, but I just wanted to voice what I felt about boons. I'm all for changes, but I just hope this won't be another Mettle of Man situation.
Edit: Typo
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The perks are fine. I don't even think they need any changes if I'm being honest.
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They are both too good, but CoH is way too good and needs a nerf.
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I do love how a lot of players are saying "Oh Boons meta here we come plz nerf!!!!!!!!!!!!!" when this is...So far from the truth.
Survivors will never have new meta perks while things like DH,BT,Unbreakabill,Adren and Iron Will. Survivor meta will never change as long as these perks are as strong as they currently are. Notice how the survivor meta hasnt changed in the past....3-4 years? because the devs know how strong these perks are and will NEVER make perks as strong as these again.
Long run people need to stop being drama queens and actually wait for dust to settle before we can claim things are "OP"
On a side note one of the Boons still crashes the game...Circle of Healing we cant even use it yet.
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Personally, I haven't played killer against CoH, only shadow step since I'm just playing survivor tonight. Here's my thoughts.
Shadow Step: Using and VSing it is 120% map dependant. It's oppressively strong on indoor maps but if there's any line of sight it's a wasted boon.
COH: Only used it a couple times, without coordination on heals it's just pretty good with the potential of being ridiculously oppressive.
Edited for clarity
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The thing is, Killer players really grab each straw they can find. Saying "4 people can run Boon-Perks" contradicts with "It will be OP in SWF", because in an SWF, you will not have 4 people running Boon-Perks.
I really hope they dont change the Boon-Perks. While I am not running them and probably never will, it is good that after David some Perks are released which are actually worse running. (That being said, I did not see a single Circle of Healing yesterday, but this is a very small sample size, so might mean nothing at all)
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I mean, they just buffed Dead Hard, so I kind of agree. These perks are objectively as strong as those perks. But why use them when second chances are as effective as they are? There is not much of a compelling reason to do so outside of SWF.
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Yeah people are heavilly underestimating just how much of a time investment it is for survivors.
And while yes i have lost a couple of matches cause of boons. Most of my experience against them is that the survivors waste so much time setting them up that gens just aren't getting done.
The power is there but they are straight up detrimental to the team if the person running them is using them wrong.
Compared to what the meta was before boons are the healthiest strong perk survivors ever had. Powerfull but with a cost and good counterplay if the killer player bothered to learn totem spawns
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I can already tell you so many more survivor deaths/mistakes are being made because everyone wants to bless totems instead of doing gens or opening exit gates.
Had a match were the survivor could've escaped if only the opened the gate, but instead the decided to waste so much of their time blessing a totem. By the time I got their they got downed at about 96% progress. As soon as I was able to luckily dodge the killer, I ran, opened the gate, and they DC'd because they wouldn't get out before the killer picked them up.
This is just one of the many instances a survivor could've escaped, or avoided a hook, just because of these totems. Given that the totem spawns are the same semi random they have always been, they are easy to find and not as broken as everyone says they are, unless the killer decides to ignore them.
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Yeah, that's why I propose that they tone down the values especially since it already offers the incredible ability to heal yourself without outside assistance.
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1 of each boon per map is good. Any more is overkill in my mind. Especially if they plan on adding more survivors like Mikaela.
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I don't really want to change an effect. Just let me destroy boon totems, so they have to find new totem.
Then it would work with same system as other totem requirement perks and survivors would have to think when to use and make some effort in using it. Killer right now doesn't really have reason to leave gens for it, it's just waste of time on his side.
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Good counterplay?
Like what, I have to leave gens, or lose chase to remove totem, that survivors can just bless again in 16s. It's waste of time for a killer, not "good" counterplay.
I know most totem spawns, only map I don't know is Raccoon City, but noone does. It doesn't matter I know where it is, there is just no real benefit for me to leave gens to remove it.
I am fine with Shadowstep, it's super annoying, but not really broken. CoH is my bigger issue. It just destroys weak killers, they don't have time for it and it removes option of snowball with hit&run tactic. It's basically 2 free perks for each other survivor.
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Shadowstep can be fun to use 4x, CoH is supposed to be used 1, max 2. So you actually get that benefit of free perks for other survivors and there is not really a need to have multiple of CoH.
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If a boon is far enough away from the gens you are controlling it's to far away to be a problem.
Shadow step does nothing if you don't want to be in that area
And if survivors have to spend more then 8 seconds to go to a CoH then they are bassically self caring. There is reason why people some people say self care is the best killer perk.
CoH was disabled for the most part. So I'm assuming that you are judging it based on theories. In practise it just isn't that game breaking.
I play mostly Legion and Trickster and played a lot of Trapper during the ptb and I never had much issue with it
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It's too early to tell tbh but they do seem sort of ridiculous in some scenarios and the value they provide seems a tad excessive. I think they'll be mostly fine for solos, mostly, and broken in SWF like most things.
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Exactly! Couldn't have said it better myself. Agreed.
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Yeah, exactly, they are basically self-caring, without that perk. So 1 survivor, using 1 perk, gives everyone else free perk.
And you think it's not my problem, when I waste time of 1 survivors instead of 2 per each hit? That's a big deal and lot of possible gen progress.
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I'd rather they self care than work on gens... it's not a big deal.
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It's the power each one gives. Self care? Not a big deal. But 90% healing? No other single perk gives that, and you'd need an entire build to do what that one perk gives. And it gives it to your entire team.
Same thing with SS. You'd need two perks to accomplish what that one perk does, and one of those is a one time use perk that requires you to get injured. You now get that for free, can be reapplied infinitely, and affects your entire team essentially giving them those perks as well, without them spending a slot on them.
It also doesn't give survivors another objective. It's the same objective you've already been doing, for the same amount of time. The only difference is an additional 8 seconds to cleanse and apply a bless to a hex totem. Even if a killer snuffed it out 5 times in a match, if they're all dull totems, it's the same time efficiency for survivors either way. Just as if you were clearing out all totems before boons were introduced.
Even if they did bring ruin and undying, that's an additional 16 seconds survivors didn't have before. Compared to the killer's time to drop chase, snuff it, and then either catch back up and resume case, or find another survivor to chase.
And most matches, killer barely has time to snuff it out more than twice. I played multiple matches where between breaking walls and pallets, chasing survivors, pressuring gens, and everything in between, I had time to snuff their boon 3 times before 5 gens were done.
It's not an added survivor objective.
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Then you are perfect survivor for a killer.
I didn't mean that survivor that is going to self-care, thing is that you have 1 survivor, that is not needed to travel or heal anyone and can just sit on gen.
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We'll make it gives that, but requirement is little bit harder with limited duration and only for you.
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Exactly my point lol. They're extremely strong right now. Stronger than almost every other perk in the game in terms of strength to cost.
Yes in the hands of the average solo queue survivor, it's not an issue. Cause they're not going to be able capitalize, and they'll make mistakes, and they'll get sacrificed because of it.
But in the hands of a halfway decent team, there power is extremely noticeable. And makes coordinated teams even worse than before.
Add to this the fact that SBMM is a thing, and the fact with how the MMR is set up right it's easier for killers to reach the top than survivors, you end up with a bunch of killers where all they go against is these super strong teams that know how to abuse their strengths to make them overpowered. That's why there's so many complaining about them.
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Best situation for it is SWF (noone will cleanse totem, they find best spawn instead), 1 CoH. So everyone can play alone, split on gens, heal alone and this basically gives self-care + we'll make it to every other survivor and killer just can't get rid of it. So SWF are not playing with 16 perks, they have 23 perks total when CoH is used. They even see exactly where to go and it works basically with double range on multi-layer maps.
Killer has to walk away from gens, to remove it for 16 seconds + travel time of survivor to a totem... not worth it imo
I wouldn't nerf effect yet, I just want killer to destroy that totem, so they have to find new one and killer has at least some reason to do it. Also NOED and Plaything should be able to spawn over boon totem, if there is not any dull totem anymore.
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Boons are op as it stands..
Sloppy butcher doesn't affect the healing from boons..
when a perk beats another perk.. that's bad game design..
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Fair point.
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Only change I think is needed is killers should get the prompt to snuff the totem out for a longer range. Just extend it to a meter or two, so you don't have to wait for the prompt which is annoying.
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I believe Mangled is a 20% speed penalty on healing the Mangled survivor regardless of the source of the healing. Where are you seeing that it doesn't impact healing speed while within the Circle of Healing radius?
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I had a few matches where my teammates were spending time re blessing totems. I felt like I was doing all the gens myself.
I think boon totems are a little too strong but i’ll stick with my usual builds.
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Ok, that kind of begs the question, though, where is that guy getting that info that Circle of Healing isn't affected by Sloppy? He's just saying it isn't with no context. Did they do an experiment where they timed it and confirmed the 20% penalty wasn't changing the time? Because if that's the case it sounds like a bug.
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If you did a heal with a medkit with sloppy, it takes about 14-16 seconds i believe,
Healing with boon is 9 or 10 seconds,
Sloppy didn't affect the time it took me to heal,
Kinda a weird thing..
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We don't have time to deal with these perks, is the point. We can't juggle gens, survivors, AND totems along with keeping track of all the information associated with those things. Playing killer just feels like an overwhelming game of chance now. Maybe I win, maybe I don't. Who can tell?
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I haven’t played much with them because I have been taking small breaks from this game.
I did experience it for the first time the other night (CoH) and I did not feel it was that helpful. It felt very situational because of the location of the totem next to gens. Where the killer kept passing through, and seemingly did not care that the totem was right in front of him.
I realize this is only a single experience with it, but I personally didn’t feel like it affected our match that much.
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Could be a bug. FYI I think the formula would be
16 / (1 - 0.2) (1 + med kit type bonus)
So I think it’s 20 seconds reduced by the med kit speed if you have both a med kit and Circle of Healing. (Circle of Healing cancels the penalty from self caring).
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The boons will not always be executed smoothly though. As others have mentioned, some survivors will prioritize their totems over generators which I think is a better thing for killers. Though this does add onto the killer's plate, the severity shouldn't be dramatic, snuffing out takes a second or two and if the killer has map awareness, they'll easily know where it is.
Yeah, I feel you. Boons do have the potential to do something great, but other variables can apply to make it less impactful.
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If only one survivor runs both Boon Perks then they effectively give the other three survivors an infinite supply of three free perks without cooldown or prerequisites (Distortion, Lucky Break & improved Self-Care) for zero investment in time or perk slots.
That's a far more likely and far more disruptive scenario than all players taking all Boon Perks, especially in a SWF. One player is designated as the "Safe Zone Creator"
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It wastes 1 survivor's time of about 20 seconds to keep relighting a totem, and the killer 2 second to destroy it, but meanwhile the other 3 survivors are doing gens. So "but they're not doing gens" just doesn't work for this.
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Correct my math if I'm wrong here but even 2 seconds to stop and go snuff a totem takes away that 2 seconds from what your initial plan was correct? So this is an positive 4 seconds for a singular survivor. BUT there are 4 survivors so a total of 16 seconds of collective time. This is if you snuff the totem before you get into a chase. If you snuff a totem mid chase, you can go ahead and chalk another 5-10 second chase time for a mediocre survivor.
So being fair here, it's about 30-40 seconds worth of progress getting done to snuff one totem IN CHASE. For something that took 14 seconds to do seems like way to much value not including the time saver on healing throughout a trial.
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That's if you're not chasing a survivor which in most case scenarios you are, so two survivors are on a generator (unless they decide to do something else) and the other two are being occupied due to you and their boon totem.
Once you start getting hooks & hits in, that's your slowdown for ya and if you find the totem which is fairly easy in most cases, the boon-user may feel the urge to re-bless it.
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The problem is 1 person can give 3 survivors a 5th perk.
The fact is that generators go so quickly and you have SO much time to work with as a survivor, that the time it takes to bless a totem or run to one to heal does not make the game easier for the killer. Objectively you are wasting time to run to a place to heal, but you are also equally wasting even more of the killers time by healing yourself, and quick.
This frees up a teammate to just stay on a gen as opposed to healing you. They're not busted, but to say they're fine is.. disingenuous
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