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Recommendation for Franklin's Demise
Hello,
Before I start the discussion, I would like to say that I'm playing both roles equally.
In my honest opinion, I believe that Franklin's Demise is indeed OP and uncountable. By OP I am referring to how a perk can make an item unusable just in one hit.
I am suggesting to make the item drop only after the survivors is downed, not after one hit. In this way, it will make the perk a little more balanced for both roles.
One more thing, make it so when your item is dropped by Franklin's Demise, and you have the protection against item loss offering, you shouldn't be losing the item.
Thank you.
Comments
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make it actually kill franklin,
Whoever he even is.
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I dont think its op, yeah it feels unfair when it happens to you but its one perk slot for an item you can take back.
However i totally agree about the offering, didnt knew that and it shouldnt happen imo
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I agree with the last thing but that's it.
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Yeah, no. Just put your item down in a corner you recognize - you should do that anyway, considering how many survivors seem to enjoy sharing items.
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The problem with it is that the charge loss is so fast you have literally no time to pick it up. You get hit, you get chased, hooked then by the time you're unhooked your item is gone.
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Could you explain further why "no"? Why should be someone forced to put their item in a corner until they're not chased anymore? A survivor is bringing an item to use it, not drop it in a corner so they won't loss it in first seconds. This is not a solution, the perk requires absolutely no requirements but just one hit and the item is gone. By increasing the requirements, it will make it more challenging.
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yea make it kill him
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Franklin's Demise isn't particularly powerful - while it potentially eliminates an item, Built to Last still works on a Franklinized item, more items can be pulled from chests or Appraisal, and despite your initial claims you have to admit that putting an item in a corner is counterplay. Their perk slot is overtly wasted if you already used up your item or aren't carrying one, so you're at a distinct advantage either way.
Not to mention that survivors, as the power role in the game, do not need items to dominate killers.
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It is powerful when it comes to destroy player's items immediately. I've never said it is a counterplay, I said it's not a viable solution for this perk. Not many survivors uses Appraisal or chest perks to increase the luck for rare items.
You're comparing two completely different things, a chest search takes more time than hitting a survivor with Franklin's Demise. You can make 4 survivors loss their items under 20 seconds, but for survivors it'll take them approximately 40 seconds to search in the chests knowing it takes 10 seconds for a chest search. What if they don't get same item or even worse, a lower rarity? What about the time it would take to find a chest?
Furthermore, you mentioned Built To Last. This is a viable solution, I'm going to admit. However, wasting 10 seconds in a locker is a lot, not to mention the time it would take to find and take your item back. Your survivors could literally just grab your rare item while you're chased, it isn't fair, is it?
It's not about dominating killers - it's about bringing a rare item and loss it in first seconds of the game.
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Your complaint is disingenuous. You don't need a solution, you need to readjust your expectations for the game and realize that their largely useless perk countered your unwillingness to adjust your playstyle.
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This is not an expectation, this is a reality. The perk is legitimately too easy to use, hard and annoying to go against. I still did not get an answer to my questions addressed in the previous response. How often do you play survivor?
I can't adjust my playstyle accordingly to a perk that'll make an ultra rare item be unusable in a very short matter of time.
It's just too powerful, survivors are not powerful, especially against a good killer. Items are a great alternative to balance the powers. Let's say a survivor brings a syringe, but the killer got Franklin. This survivor will lose their medkit on the ground while being chased, maybe another survivor will pick it up or it will be out of charges. Either way, it's completely unfair for the survivor.
I already said it and I'm going to repeat it, survivors equip their items to use them, not to be wasted on the ground without using at least one charge. Give the survivor a chance to prevent it from happening. A hit could happen anytime without realising, a surprising hit, anything.
Flashlights are mainly used to blind the killer breaking a pallet, how is the survivor supposed to blind the killer if the flashlight is wasted on the ground?
Okay, you got hit, your item is on the ground. You may pick the item while the killer is in hit cooldown but yet, it's situational. Could be in the middle of nowhere, which could risk your chances to escape the chase.
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FYI in patch 4.1.0 Franklin's Demise was changed from making the item lose charges when dropped to making it possible for the Entity to destroy the item after a while after it was dropped. The devs realized that was too weak though so in patch 5.0.0 they put back in the charge depletion as well.
So the 4.1.0 version was already considered too weak by the devs and got buffed to its current state. They're definitely not going to make Franklins even weaker than it was in 4.1.0
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I don't even want them to make it weaker, I just want an opportunity for the survivor to take their item back. My suggestion, for example, would be a good implementation because it will give the player a chance to prevent it from happening. First hit would be like a warning: "Hey, you're about to lose your item", and then the second hit would make the survivor lose the item. That's it. I don't think it will make the game in survivors' favor just because Franklin would work only on second hit.
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If all you're suggesting is that survivors don't permanently lose items after the match that they dropped due to Franklin's I'm ok with that. 🤷♂️
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This would make the perk utterly worthless. "It's time to drop your item now in order to make my perk entirely pointless, sweetie"
Like, Franklin's would just never do anything. Why would you let it activate?
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Franklin's is fine. It's one of the few scenarios where a Killer can bring a tool that allows them to assert themselves as the power role.
Remember kids, items are optional. Me thinks you're getting too accustomed to always having them.
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The main point of using the perk is to make your item completely useless, therefore if it makes you drop your item then the perk's role is completed. Even if you can drop your item mid-chase, they'd lose distance which is a win situation for the killer.
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I believe you don't play against Franklin's Demise. I doubt you've read the other comments as well.
A condition to the perk wouldn't affect the perk's value. It'd still make your time drop, it'd still make your item lose charges, it will ONLY give the player a little chance to take their item back before its charges gets lost. I don't play with items much because of this perk.
I already said this again, but this is the problem if you wouldn't read all the comments: The way this perk can be getting rid of your item is ridiculous.
-> A situation: you get hit and your item is dropped, you are in a chase but you got downed. You get hooked immediately, by the time someone unhooks you and back to take your item back, the item is completely unusable by this time already. It's not fair for the survivor. Instead, if the item would drop once the chase ends and you're getting downed, you'd have more chances to take your item back before it's unusable.
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I for one think franklin's is fine. I've had it used against me and I've used it myself.
Losing the item on a down seems like more of a risk for the survivor...they'll lose their item charges for sure this way. And since either way they'll lose their item...what the problem with how they lose it?
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You're wrong. I do play against Franklin's. Hell, sometimes I even use it, thought not as frequently as you'd have some people believe about killers based on the gripes in this thread. I also read the other comments, and I disagree with most of them, except for the ones that correctly ascertains that BHVR already made a pass on this perk and they're not going to revert it to something worse than how it was originally.
You are misunderstanding me. The way this perk can be getting rid of your item is AWESOME. It gives the Killer a modicum of his power role back. I, and many other players who partake of the Killer role, like it like that. It is one of the few things that demand a survivor's respect, save for a 4 man SWF that will put down their own item to preserve another's who is in a chase.
Your situation doesn't matter, alternative: A killer juggles your health state and moves on to a new chase, you go back and you grab your item. See? Committing to a single player comes with upsides and downsides, he's going to lose some more gen progress and you're going to lose your item.
There are several ways to conveniently counter Franklin's Demise; Bring front-loaded items, drop items you don't need temporarily, and one I haven't heard yet, reduce the # of items you bring as a group to disincentive the killer to bring Franklin's. I won't waste a perk slot for 1-2 items, but if I see 4 survivor's running med kits you can bet your sweet patootey I'm rocking Franklin's and I'm get a bulk order discount on their health states.
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Woe is me, survivors have to use skill instead of purple medkits and BNPs, whatever will we do???
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The counters are:
Drop the item in a safe place, and go back grab it when need to use it.
Not getting hit.
Telling a teammate via voicechat, where the item fall to stop the charge draining.
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Ok then, rework the perk in another way, BUT given counter to the fact that survivors can just leave the item on the ground and that's it, you can't use Franklin's at all sadly.
There must be a counter to this thing
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The alternative situation you've mentioned in your post, is rarely happening. Why? Because a killer will focus on one survivor at a time. A killer that knows their priorities wouldn't go for a full health survivor just so you get the item back. They will probably commit to the chase until you're downed, which happens more often than the alternative situation you've mentioned. By this time, your item is already consumed by the entity. I don't understand why doesn't my situation matter, but yours does?
The perk is mediocre for the simpliest fact that it doesn't implies requirements, it only asks you to get a basic attack which can happen anywhere with ease.
Back to main discussion, if this perk would actually have a slightly higher condition to met in order to put the survivor's item on the ground, which I mentioned in the main topic - make the survivor drop their item when downed, not on first hit then there wouldn't be any problem. What if the killer hits you on a side of the map and your item is dropped there, then the killer chases you until you're on the other side of the map? You would have to make all the way back there to get your item back. Oh, but surprise! Your item is no more usable, you could leave it there like you never had an item. However, if you would be to keep your item on first hit, you could potentially save your item and even use it mid-chade.
I've asked million of times, yet no one answered the question: why should the SURVIVOR drop their item until the chase is over? A survivor is bringing an item to use it, not to sit on the ground to use it accordingly to the killer's desires whether to chase the survivor or not. What if it's a flashlight? A flashlight is used to blind the killer in a chase, but the flashlight is temporarily dropped on the ground, how does that work? Not to mention the possibility that another survivor can just pick up your item.
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The survivor bringed the item to use it, not to have it sitting on the ground. How many times do I have to repeat myself, please read the previous comments.
"Not getting hit" how are you expecting a survivor to not get hit all the match?
The third alternative is not a solution because most survivors are playing solo.
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It's not risky because by the time you're getting hooked and unhooked, you still have the possibility to get your item back.
They would potentially lose all the chargers if the first hit would make your item be dropped. Why is that? You get hit, you get chased (a chase can take up to a minute which is just enough for your item to be unusable), then you get hooked.
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Yes, that's a great suggestion. I don't agree with that either. If the survivor is dropping their weapon in the killer's terror radius, it will automatically activate the perk on the item and it would consume the item's charges. Or I don't know, there are options for a rework which I would love to see.
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The item staying on the ground is a real problem, because a survivor can drop it mid chase just when is sure they're gonna get hit, and then come back to pick it.
As you mentioned solos, it's a problem for them because they can't communicate to drop items on the ground.
At this point Franklin's is just useful on Pinhead, because you can't drop the box.
Edit: even with Stealth killers it doesn't work, because you can just press R at last, and no Franklin's is applied.
(Btw don't use mint rag and rusty shackles with it, it's garbo)
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Yes, I've never agreed for a survivor to be able to drop their item down without being affected by Franklin's Demise.
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Ok!
Also I just edited the post at last, update the page.
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The time the surv Is downed and hooked and unhooked varies. Unless you expect to be isntantly hooked and unhooked then you'd probably not get your item back anyways.
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Are Items, addons, and Power addons base-kit?
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