Why people think MM instakill add-ons are fair?!

Judith’s tombstone is fine as is and using lockers to evade it should be removed.

Tombstone piece is busted and needs a nerf.

So... HOW MANY MM did u seen in this weekend?

First off, Myers has got to be one of, if not, THE least powerful killer in the whole game. Second, while I do agree that the Tombstone piece is a bit broken, being able to take someone out of the match within minutes, the Iri Tombstone addon is by far one of the least powerful addons of his, only seconding something like the glass fragment which becomes completely useless when you progress to Tier 2. Even with a whole bunch of slowdown perks and PWYF, the Iri Tombstone is far from powerful.

It takes 3 times the amount of stalk points to get to Tier 3 for the first time with the Iri Tombstone, meaning he needs at LEAST 15 stalk points to get to Tier 3, and each survivor has 10.1 total, meaning he needs to basically fully stalk someone to the max, and then drain someone else of half their stalk points. At max stalking speed, he takes 6 seconds to gain roughly 5 stalk points, meaning that in order to get 15 he needs to stalk for a total of 18 seconds at 100% efficiency, and that isn't including the time it takes to find the second survivor required. To stalk at 100% efficiency, he needs to literally be right on top of you, at about 2.5 meters. Chances are, you aren't gonna be that close to him for the duration of him stalking you, the average may be something like 15 meters or more, which means he stalks at about roughly 67.5% efficiency, the max being roughly 40 meters at 10% efficiency. Taking all this into account, it isn't really that powerful, just break LOS.

There's also a dilemma with the addon. The Myers could bring the J. Myers Memorial page and stalk 25% faster, but then the tombstone isn't infinite and hardly even makes it worth bringing, or he could bring the Fragrant Tuft Of Hair, further increasing the required amount of stalk points by 10, up to a total of 25. That's at MINIMUM 2 survivors' worth of stalk points, and an extra half in there. Completely draining a survivor of their stalk points would take 12 seconds at 100% efficiency, or something like 24 at 50% efficiency which is likely going to be the average.

This sort of thing is exactly why it's so hard to obtain the Evil Incarnate achievement, because it just takes so long to get to Tier 3 with infinite tombstone, and even with 3 slowdown perks (only 3 because PWYF is essentially required because of the slowdown Iri Tombstone gives), by the time you get to Tier 3 there may be 1 or 2 gens left at best. And once you've mori'd two people, the last two survivors will likely catch on to what you're doing, and then they'll just jump in lockers to deny you your achievement.

Now compare that to the Tombstone Piece, which only requires 2.5x the amount of stalk to reach Tier 3 for the first time That's still at minimum one survivor's worth of stalk points, but is significantly more powerful because of the fact you can combine it with the J. Myers Memorial page and get it no problem. The fact that it completely sends you back to Tier 2 once you mori someone makes hair addons irrelevant and not worth bringing. You do get a penalty for killing someone with the piece but it's so insignificant because you can turn a 4v1 into a 3v1 very quickly, and the survivors can't really do anything against it.

That being said, if you're really having issues with Myers players bringing tombstone often, just jump into lockers if you notice it takes him a while to Tier up to Tier 3, or just do it to be safe. Yes, I know that's what people keep telling you, but it's really the only counterplay to it, vaulting windows and such is too risky, and you can't get mori'd while in a locker or on the ground, not by tombstone. I rarely see Myers to begin with in my games, let alone ones running purple or iri tombstone. If this sort of thing only happens to you occasionally, get over it. It may not be fun to play against since you don't even get a chance to get saved off hook, but it isn't like you're seeing it every other game, sometimes ######### happens.

With Huntress you literally just pressed M2 and could down someone and hook them literally not even 20 seconds into the match. Myers takes significantly more time than that, even with just the Tombstone Piece. But regardless, Tombstone Piece does need a rework

Another thing to consider, tombstone games often result in ALL players depipping and ALL getting low BP. On top of being relatively boring matches in the most case. So you are not very likely to encounter tombstone matches to begin with.

Just because you didn't see Michael, doesn't mean he wasn't watching you like a creep. The reason people don't complain that much is because it's difficult to get on good teams. Also he's so big and slow, can't even peek around walls, like GF can. Just have some situational awareness and don't let him stare at you like the last donut in the shop.

My only issue is when I'm the last person to see him and he just pops tier 3 and insta kills me in our first interaction all game while the people who fed him just live their lives

Judith's Tombstone is fair. It's difficult to use because it only really works with the other iri (which jacks up the stalk requirements even higher), has a speed penalty that requires a perk slot and even more extraneous chases to fix, and can be countered by playing smart and hiding if Myers hasn't seen you yet. It's also fairly easy to tell he has it because he'll spend a long time in T2 without trying to hit people - so even in solo, you can figure out when you need to pull out the tombstone counterplay. Unless 3 survivors feed him without making him work for it, there will be enough time to do gens to the point where you'll nearly be done with the game by the time he gets T3 off and most players can make it out the gate.

Tombstone Piece is busted. It's much quicker to activate and reliably lets Myers delete one survivor very early without a proportionate drawback. Two, if he's smart about it, and then he's an M1 killer with a 16m TR for the rest of a game that only has two other survivors in it. Though smart players will get in lockers once they realize he has it, the first kill is... basically guaranteed unless you're dumb about when you activate T3.

Judith's more or less requires him to stalk the whole team; Piece lets him instakill you the first time he sees you. Difference of needing 17.5 stalk points versus 30, IIRC.

The problem with Judith speed penalty was never that it applied when it other tiers. It literally hurts your ability to get close enough for the instant kill.

Also the main strength of judiths is that unlike piece you don't go back to t2 when killing someone but myers t3 is fairly short and with the mori animation and speed penalty you need survivors to throw to hand you multiple moris in 60 seconds. Which is why you only ever see it ran with tuft of fur to make the most use out of that aspect.

You basically might as well play piece instead because there's less drawbacks to it.

And all of that equates to Judith's being completely useless in any actual competitive game.

Tombstone Piece isn't a common addon, and at least it actually does something.

There's also a general consensus that Michael is one of the "worst" killers in the game, so I don't see why it matters if he has one addon that's actually powerful. It also essentially requires you to equip another addon to increase stalk speed in order for it to be any more usable than Judith's, so it takes up two addon slots, plus at least a perk slot or two for slowdown.

And how often do you see it, after all? I'm a Michael main, and I have fifty-something unused Tombstone Pieces lying around; it's not a staple in any of my builds or in any of the major Myers builds that I know of. It's a fun thing to play around with, but running it is a gamble considering that you need a good bit of stalk to use it to gain a competitive edge, and it precludes running any other addons and costs at least a perk slot or two on top of that.

Your only hope in using Tombstone Piece to gain a competitive advantage is to run something like Lethal Pursuer and try to get a kill in before more than one gen pops (and even then, you have to fully stalk one survivor and then go find another one to stalk), and then you can only get two kills out of it, max.

Tombstone Piece is fine as is, and using lockers to evade it should be removed.

Judith's Tombstone is useless and needs a buff.

On the contrary, Michael got a huge buff recently, albeit not one that many people talk about. Vanity Mirror used to be a completely useless addon, but now it's even more busted than Tombstone Piece if you combine it with Dead Rabbit and M&A. No terror radius, plus X-ray vision without the speed penalty of using Cracked Mirror.

This was one of the most brilliant things they could have done to turn Michael into a competitive killer, and nobody seems to have even noticed.

Yep. This is what Tombstone Piece is really useful for. 99% it and grab one of the T-baggers at the exit gates. There is no better feeling in this world.

It's not any more broken than Dead Hard, CoH, or the baskits of killers like Nurse and Blight.

You do have to work hard for it, and it's not something you can use all game or run without risk. It's not something you see in every Myers game for a reason.

You can read my main points above, but Myers doesn't need a nerf of any kind. Half of his addons are complete ass, and the other half are so insane that they can actually make him useful.

I take issue with people calling him the weakest killer in the game because of Vanity Mirror, Dead Rabbit, and (to a lesser degree) Tombstone Piece, but nerf any at all and people like Otz might actually have a point.

I like vs MM because of this add-on. Until I see MM hit Tier 3 and hit someone else preferably I run like a bat out of hell as soon as I spot Myers since I'm scared of the killer. I want tension in my games.

Also, when playing MM I find Fragrant Tuft to be a lot more rewarding than Tombstone. Tombstone requires quite a bit to activate and if your teammates play cautiously instead of tbagging in front of Myers it's a lot more difficult to pull off and you only get one kill with each usage.

I agree with you it may not be "fun", and or balanced when paying survivor. But it sure is fun for anyone who has played with those add-ons... At the end of the day in my view, I'm looking at this from a fun perspective. The add-on makes myers fun to play as. And even with the tombstone piece if the user does not play it right, said user will only be able to insta-mori two survivors. So the other two could make a play under the right conditions. And it's a purple add-on so it's still okay because of that.

Tombstone Piece needs a change, but Judith's Tombstone is fine.

Judith's pretty much requires you to use Play With Your Food if you want a good chance to actually catch anybody once the addin fires. And Play with your food pretty much requires you to give up injuring anybody if you want to keep your speed boost. (And heaven forbid you actually get an obsession who actually knows how to remain out of sight and prevent you from getting the tokens) So Myers actually needs to give up a lot of pressure to actually use the add-in effectively. Which is why many of us just don't bother using it.

And good luck getting Tombstone grabs with these servers - we have a hard enough time getting gen grabs these days....

Yes,nerf it to the ground completely and give him nothing in compensation.

He's objectively among the bottom 5. You can do well with him but you can do well with a 0 perk blight, too, if you get bad survivors. Myers is bad, and I don't believe anyone who mains him really has much more authority than the 500+ streamers with tens of thousands of hours who feel he also sucks.

You wanna nerf his tombstone add-ons? Fine. But guess what his baske kit needs a HUGE buff if that happens.