Ideas to help alleviate camping and tunneling
Camping and tunneling is a pretty unfun thing survivors have to deal with most games. Sometimes survivors don't even get a chance to properly participate in a match because of it. Being hooked and camped from 1st hook till death or when a killer completely ignores all but one survivor, tunneling and camping them till they are dead. It is very frustrating only being on a hook or holding w the entire match. So here's some thoughts on what could maybe be done.
- If the survivor is hooked 3 times in a row (so no other survivor has been hooked since this survivors 1st hook), they get an extra hook state to allow them another chance.
- If the killer is within a certain radius of the hooked survivor, the hook timer is significantly slowed down in order to give the other survivors a chance to attempt an unhook or get gens done as a sort of trade off for the killer camping.
- Base kit Borrowed time (or something like that). Killers tend to wait out bt anyways, so this wouldn't be too taxing on killers and would allow survivors to get some distance or a chance to escape the killer if they tunnel off hook.
- If the survivor is on their first hook and the killer is within a certain radius of them for an extended amount of time, the survivor gets a 100% chance of getting themselves off hook, allowing them to possibly make an escape from the killer, especially since you'll find in solo queue your teammates will not attempt to save you if you are being camped.
These are just some fairly vague concepts of what could be put in place, please take them with a grain of salt, they are just intended to spark inspiration or be a rough guide of what the devs could do. There could be buffs for killers in areas to encourage not camping or tunneling, there also could be nerfs, I'll take anything. As camping and tunneling is not a "legitimate" or fair strategy (at least not towards the start of the game), as a solo queue survivor can not do much to combat this playstyle, and end up leaving game getting basically no points and their mmr goes down, while a killer who just camped a survivor to death has their mmr go up, make it make sene. Hopefully we'll see something done in the near future, thanks for reading. :)
Edit: I don't think all of camping and tunneling is inherently bad. Proxy camping a hook when there is one survivor left makes sense! So does tunneling or camping when there is 2-0 gens left and you have no kills, it's a killers job to kill obviously so by all means camp and tunnel to at least secure a kill or 2 at the end. The kind of camping and tunneling I'm fed up with is the ignore all other survivors and only get this one person. Or camping from first hook till last at 5-3 gens, these "strats" just don't allow the survivor to earn points or properly get to play the game
Comments
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Ideas like these are extremely abusable as well insanely overpowered. Some have already been tested and scrapped for that exact reason. There is nothing inherently wrong with camping and tunneling, they are strategies with risks and benefits that can be punished accordingly when done recklessly. The reason strategic camping/tunneling exists is for the need to gain or regain pressure. Nerfing those strategies without giving large mechanical buffs to replace the need to use those strategies for gaining and regaining pressure is a terrible idea.
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How about we just make the entire killer roster viable. So they don't have to camp and tunnel for kills.
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Uff. Sorry you got tunneled but no.
Try play some killer.
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I play both killer and survivor pretty much equally...
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I didn't say killers don't need buffs in certain areas to balance out putting any of these ideas in place because they will! However this post is just specifically mentioning what could be done with the survivor side of things since this is largely a survivor issue.
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In a utopia, it would be up to the rest of the team to punish Camping and Tunneling by rushing gens and leaving. While survivors continue to reward killers, the issue will persist.
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All of these are really, really bad and abuseable ideas
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The biggest problem is probably that SWF can completely destroy the balance.
Therefore you can´t really balance for Solo Q or for beginners. The broken MMR comes on top.
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I don't see any of these ideas being inherently bad or the first 2 ideas being abusable. But I respect your opinion. I also like how most of these replies are from people with killer or killer perk pictures, hopefully we see more people who play both equally and can see it from both perspectives 😂
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Ideas 1/2/4 are beyond busted regardless. 3 is the only feasible one with some counter buffs or adjustments to how the base BT works. (EG, the unhooked survivor can't bodyblock for their unhooker)
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Most people here do play both equally. Also, giving an entire extra life for a hook state is insanely abusable. Let alone paused/stopped hook timer or guaranteed self-unhook. BHVR has explicitly tested anti-camping/anti-tunneling ideas before like these and had to scrap them BECAUSE they were abusable.
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These are very loose concepts that if they were put in place the devs would know a lot more of what parameters to put in place and change to make these feasible. These are more just to give the devs some inspiration with what they could maybe play around with. Again, take these ideas with a grain of salt.
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I just thought it was interesting that it seems to be more killer sided players replying. But that's besides the point
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Sadly most of these where already tested and survs found ways to abuse them in a heart beat so survs are responsible themselves for having to deal with face camping proxi camping and tunneling are tactics aproved by the devs so there is nothing going to happen ever
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If you can't see the problems with these ideas, then you haven't played enough DbD
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Not supporting extremely busted ideas does not make people killer-sided.
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They seemed to hint at a sort of bt base kit mechanic in the last dev stream, so I don't know about that. But yeah unfortunately people will abuse stuff. Like i heard they had a pause hook time feature in the beta of something, so if a killer was within a certain radius of a hook, but killers abused it by taking the game hostage. So that's unfortunate
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The problem I see with calling camping/tunneling "legitimate strategies" is that it treats the survivors as 1 entity. People are absolutely correct that camping/tunneling to regain pressure is a thing if the survivors were treated as a group but on the individual level, it is a terrible experience. Dead by Daylight isn't an actual team sport like football or hockey or something silly like that, its essentially 4 separate 1v1 matches.
If someone is in solo queue and gets camped/tunneled out without even being able to touch a gen or help a teammate, does it matter to them that the rest of the team was able to escape? Their miniscule bloodpoints, and most likely depip, says otherwise. Having the team "slam gens" to punish the killer does nothing for the person on the hook (especially if they got the hook early and have end game perks like NOED or No Way Out).
This is why I personally think tunneling/camping should be addressed rather than from punishing the killer, it should reward spreading hooks. Additional points (similar to BBQ obviously), giving the killer a speed boost after hooking all survivors, or less gen speeds for survivors with hook states.
That being said, there are still the jerks who just want to ruin other peoples experience (face camping Bubbas or AFK Pigs will always be a thing) regardless of the rewards or punishments. Another thing that would be nice is if the end game thumbs up actually did stuff (give BP, eventually award a cosmetic, etc) to encourage positive feedback after matches.
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No it's not that. Its just obviously there has been 0 survivor related profile pictures. So there's obviously a bias here in terms of the kind of people commenting
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YES thank youuuu. The comment I needed!!
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A profile picture has nothing to do with being sided lmao.
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The devs have LITERALLY EXPLICITLY acknowledged that tunneling and camping are strategies, and ones that this game is LITERALLY balanced around. But as you have said, the only correct way to "change" that is to give buffs for NOT doing so. Giving BP for people tunneled/camped out would be fine, but mechanically, killers would need buffs to incentivize not having to use those strategies.
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There are 5 people with killer profiles and no survivors. Obviously doesn't mean they don't play survivor, but it does show where the people who are replying preference's lie
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Or... they just like that character/perk.
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I'm up for anything to lessen the amount of camping and tunneling. Again, take these ideas with a grain of salt
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Point by point, my responses are as follows
1) Given the amount of potential "extra health states" survivors already get with second-chance perks like Dead Hard, BT and so forth, th is is a non-starter. Survivor has other team members that should be protecting them anyway.
2) This has already been tried and was quickly discarded by the devs as it was exploited by the survivors too easily.
3) Basekit Borrowed time is reasonable.
4) No - this is another non-starter. If people are coming near the hook, the killer has no reason to leave and every right to defend it.
Nothing here you've posted hasn't already been suggested and rejected.
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Ok? I never said they weren't strategies and even acknowledged why they are done. The caps lock usage here seem unnecessarily aggressive in this context.
What I was doing was pointing out the flaws in how they effect the player base, especially newer players or those in solo queue. Hence why I called for them to be REBALANCED to a healthier option of spreading hooks by rewarding killers to do so.
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Yes, because camper is no abusable
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Camping is a strategy explicitly acknowledged and accepted by BHVR.
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The way to "fix" tunneling and camping is to incentivize the killer to go for more chases. Because they know the moment they leave they're gonna get ripped off the hooked and healed in 9 seconds.
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You know for a fact that bhvr doesn't always get things right. There are many things they've done now compared to the start of the game to make it balanced and more fair as they've grown. So saying that they think it's a legitimate strategy, isn't an excuse for them to not look into it or do anything about it. The learn, and they develop and maybe they'll see it's not a fair strategy to be used.
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This would certainly be something I'd like to see, something to see less tunneling or camping as a survivor, but also get something out of not doing so when I play killer too.
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Facecamping isn't fair and that's a fact and even bhvr is looking into it right this moment. But proxi camping has its place just like tunneling the thing why in discussions like this killer mains often act a little bit hostile is cause survs often just want them gone completely and want killer to bu punished and that would also apply to the times where it's fair and square to camp or tunnel.
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Dude posts extremely broken & abuseable ideas, then claims anyone with a Killer PFP is Killer-sided in an attempt to dismiss their opinions.
Looks like a Survivor main to me. 🙃
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They are some interesting ideas but I would have to disagree with the fact you said that tunneling and camping isn't a legitimate strategy. Tunneling and camping at 5 gens is just a bit scummy in my opinion but near endgame with one or two gens left then it's a good strategy to even out the playing field for killers and secure some kills, why leave the hooked survivor when the gens are gonna pop anyway? I've camped to secure a 1k or 2k when it's a bad match.
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Yes! Thank you. I don't think all of camping and tunneling is inherently bad. Proxy camping a hook when there is one survivor left makes sense! So does tunneling or camping when there is 2-0 gens left and you have no kills, it's a killers job to kill obviously so by all means camp and tunnel to at least secure a kill or 2 at the end. The kind of camping and tunneling I'm fed up with is the ignore all other survivors and only get this one person. Or camping from first hook till last at 5-3 gens, these "strats" just don't allow the play to earn points or properly get to play the game
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Yeah endgame camping or tunneling makes sense. I'll edit the post to accommodate
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Really the only time I can somewhat understand early camping is when hit and run killers tunnel the one booner cause they hurt hit and run so much every other times I don't get it. I always try to let them run and only smack them if they run into me and try bt stuff or when they think I am. Not allowed to tunnel so they can heal in the open
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A Time out box would end the camping gameplay. After they get hooked they go to the time out box.
The survivor gets released 2 ways
They served their time or another survivor helped them get out.
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To me, getting myself camped is akin to fighting a boss I wasn't ready for (LIke a certain monster that tossed me out on my ass in 20 seconds flat last week). I didn't really get to "play" the encounter or learn anything from it. But instead of thinking the game was unfair, I just accepted I wasn't ready and did something else.
Sure, this is a multiplayer game and we don't get to choose our opponants, but the concept is the same. You faced a strat or opponant you were powerless against and obviously not ready for.
We as players are the only ones responsible for being good enough for our points.
That being said, I like that you are at least trying to address the perceived problem instead of calling anybody toxic or scummy. I respect that.
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Healing has become too fast.
If you only hit a surv and don´t get a down you wasted your time. He gets healed immediately especially with boons.
You could build pressure by injuring people, if they don´t have a medkit or self heal they need to find each other and heal.
Look at recent videos - everbody injured - healed in a few seconds.
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Oh good, and so the Killer can't secure kills because it literally lets the Survivor go after a set time?
Sure; lets enforce the 12 hook idea while Survivors have 16 second chance perks per match, plus 5 minute gen speeds. Great way to chase away every single remaining Killer, this.
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And what can surv do to secure 2 escapes when they have a bad match?
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Yeah, this is an open discussion. I'm happy to talk out things and bounce back and forth some ideas and thoughts and opinions with people. I'm just not here for the comments that just completely dismiss even the thought of putting something in place for camping and tunneling. So thanks for being respectful
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I assume that you have something similar in mind, when the killer barely gets hooks.
The increase of Camping and tunneling are directly caused by the current gen speed. While sure, nothing has changed in the gen speed per se, its undeniable that on high mmr, the killer gets between 3 and 4 hooks by the time all gens are completed. A killer who feels confident about the gen speed and being able to 12 hook, doesn´t feel the urge or need to camp and tunnel.
Meanwhile, a killer who loses 3 gens in the first chase, isn´t motivated to play "nice".
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Whatever it's just an idea but, like always someone has one on here and someone has to come along and ######### on it because how will I kill anyone if I can't camp.
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Yes, my reply was totally because I selfishly want to camp, and not because it was a terrible idea. Sure. 🙄
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Camping and tunneling suck....especially for solos. Losing a pip because of it is the cherry on top. For the most part killers camp/tunnel because they feel forced to in order to get any kills. Right now there is not enough time in a trial for a killer to get 12 hooks (lots of reasons why) when survivors still only have 1 objective (4 survivors repair 5 gens) if the team have a few brain cells between them.
Survivor is the power role its up to the team to do there part and they will rarely lose. Played on the game last night with Wraith and got 8 hooks with 1k. I played terrible not sure how I managed 8 hooks but after I seen a message come through. Was expecting "GG EZ" but instead was a GG. I know most of time that only happens when they escape but this one was different. I responded with "I played horrible lol GG". They resonded and said no you did great...this game is busted on survivor side. Survivor is way to easy rn. We can screw around and still win. His words/opinions but he aint wrong.
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Yeah. Can we not completely dismiss peoples ideas or opinions. Open to discussion but no need to berate someone's thought because it doesn't align with yours. Please be respectful!
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I can give you some abusable idea right now
1- giving the survivor a fourth hook state if they get tunnel. Me as a survivor im doing anything for the killer to tunnel me just like that my team do gen and the killer waste his time on me after the third hook i play so i dont get caught at all if the entire play like that the survivor just pass from 12 to 16 hook.
2- a survivor is hook let me just run the killer around the hook while the other 2 do gen and the killer cant do much against that best exemple for a place a survivor can do that is around the killer shack.
3- that give the survivor an extra perk meaning instead of bringing BT the survivor can use delivrance and because he get a free BT he dont need any of his teamate to bodyblock and can start to loop the killer right away and because of DS even if the survivor go down he wont go back on the hook right away and if he get slug he will unbreakable all the way up and he still have is exaustion perk available all that because BT is basekit and if a teamate got a boon he got a free medkit too. Free perk are a dangerous thing.
4- again this is a free delivrance without the downside this can leave to a bunch of problem with perk combo.
Honestly the dev need to do something about the game so the killer dont have to feel pressure that the only way to even the playing field is if they camp and tunnel. Exept player have no faith in them they can pull that off specially with the balance decision they took i the last year they had some good thing but its nothing compare to the bad one
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