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MMR should be based around chases

Alen_Starkly
Alen_Starkly Member Posts: 1,160
edited March 2022 in Feedback and Suggestions

I feel like a big mistake with the current MMR is that it is based on kills and escapes. Which really cannot accurately gauge a player's skills.

Example 1: You facecamp a survivor as Bubba and they die (or you chase 1 person for 3-5 gens and can't down them). Last gen gets done, NOED activates. You end up getting 3-4 kills, because the survivors weren't on comms, and actually tried to save the camped person. MMR considers you a great killer! (even though it's the opposite!)

Example 2: You loop a killer for 3 or more gens because you're genuinely really good. Eventually the killer gets you and camps you, and/or they have NOED. You die because the killer is really mad at you for running them for so long. You die, and MMR considers you bad , even though that's completely false!

Example 3: You get downed and hooked twice, very easily, 'cause you suck at chases. OR, you successfully evade the killer for the entire match. And then you get lucky with escaping. The MMR considers you a great, skilled player! (even though that's completely false, or you just got lucky with evading).

Example 4: You SWF with your friends. You are really bad at chases, but you manage to escape most of the matches, 'cause your friends know how to protect you and take aggro. MMR thinks you're a god. But then the other day you do solo queue, and get matched with really good teammates and a strong killer. The killer keeps getting you downed and killing you, to the detriment of your teammates. The match is too hard for you, and suddenly you hate this game, 'cause the killer is too strong. Your teammates hate you, 'cause you can't loop the killer, and now they have a harder time doing the gens with 1 person less.


I think MMR should consider chases. If you can run the killer for 3 gens, then even if you die due to facecamping, the MMR recognises you as the looping god you are, and will be matching you with equally good teammates, and against stronger killers.

If you keep getting downed early, then even if you get so lucky to escape, the MMR will recognize you as a less-skilled player, and will put you with less-skilled killers in next matches. That way you won't suck at matches, and you'll have an easier time practicing looping and enjoying the game.

When it comes to killer, it's a bit more complicated, 'cause should a facecamper's MMR really go down if they can't catch anyone until their NOED activates? MMR on killer definitely needs much more consideration, but I feel that the MMR for survivors is really straightforward: gauge their skills by for how long they can loop the killer without going down.

Comments

  • Starrseed
    Starrseed Member Posts: 1,774

    And when I play perfect stealth and don't get chased a single time

  • Alen_Starkly
    Alen_Starkly Member Posts: 1,160

    If you don't get chased a single time (which should happen rarely), then your MMR shouldn't change after that match, 'cause your skills weren't put to the test.

  • Letholldus
    Letholldus Member Posts: 49

    MMR is a mess in general. Only counting escapes and kills overlooks a lot of what happens in the middle. While the devs feel that that stuff is not important I disagree. You can do half the gens, get 3 dehooks, heal two people, cleanse a hex, then run the killer for the last two gens and then go down at the exit gate and get camped with noed and lose MMR for it. The old system was not perfect, but it measured your abilities more. I think expanding upon that instead of narrowing it down to something as basic and trivial as escapes vs kills would have ultimately been more successful, though at the end of the day the game is a party game not balanced enough for competitive and MMR really isn't needed or only needs to be applied lightly but in a way that's also intelligent if it is used. Hence why I liked the old system more. But basing it completely off chase is arguably just as bad as only counting escapes as it only looks at a single aspect of the gameplay loop.

  • jesterkind
    jesterkind Member Posts: 7,607

    Some of these are poor examples, because they're not things that are going to happen frequently enough to impact your MMR- take example two, for instance. That kind of thing would have to be happening every match before it's statistically relevant to the MMR system, it happening every now and again makes very little difference.

    Example three is another one. Even in the example, you say the survivor in question gets "lucky", and they surely can't be getting lucky enough games in a row for it to impact their MMR that much, right?

    Part of the problem with the mindset of MMR needing to take more into account is that it tends to assume that one match actually matters more than it does. The premise of an MMR system is simple; if you're winning more matches than you're losing, you must be doing something right. This is correct, with one caveat; any time you're winning consistently but not doing something right (EG, facecamping NOED Bubba), that is not a matchmaking issue. It's a balance issue.

  • GoshJosh
    GoshJosh Member Posts: 4,992

    It doesn’t work due to various play styles. Also, at least one killer would be totally screwed by it: Twins. Arguably Trapper too, concerning trapped survivors.

  • Marc_123
    Marc_123 Member Posts: 3,502

    The ranks / grades do exactly that. They are good for the different actions you do in game.

    They only need to construct a decent system around that. Easier said than done sadly.