http://dbd.game/killswitch
can we buff other exhaustion perks or nerf DH?
there iss literally no reason to use nothing else than sprint burst or dead hard like balance landing WAS good but now its trash since we dont have the passive effect and i see no reason why ANYONE would run smashit... i mean overcome has tis place im tired of running dead hard becuase 30% of my downs i dont actiavte it since they are obviously to far away to hit me but surprise surprise servers think its a valid hit :)
and its just a super boring perk to run anyways i kinda get why BL doesnt have its passive and yet i dont there are literally maps where you CANT use it on like there isnt even a hill to activate it on... and maybe lower the passive to 30 40% instead it would be a better experience for killers and survivors to refresh the perks a little because now its pretty much the same 95% of all survivors you go against use dead hard the otehr 4.9% use no exhaustion perks and then we have those 0.1% who are SB chads
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We need more perks like Dead Hard. Exhaustion perks that we are able to use during a chase as a means to extend the chase rather than gain distance.
It’s the reason why DH is so popular because of its benefits in short loops.
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I prefer buffing other perks to be viable as opposed to nerfing one of the only good survivor perks to be perfectly honest. Dead hard is NOT the problem. Map design is.
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No giving a perk that has both distance and Iframes is a problem. Not only does it allow Survivors to correct big mistakes they make they can gain distance but the killer can't do anything to them while gaining that distance while the animation is going on. While SB gives distance but a skilled ranged killer can still get a hit or two in.
That's why the Devs are looking at DH because players are using it more for distance than Iframes. DH is the only exhaustion perk with new negative side effects as some of the others.....SB can't run or you activate it, BL if you fall too far it activated, Lithe slow vault or you accidentally activate it. DH you have the choice when to use it and not worried about it activating when you don't want too.
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While DH is a large offender, Exhaustion perks in general are way over tuned.
For example, lets say we literally doubled the Exhaustion debuff. That is a massive nerf. Yet, we would still see an Exhaustion perk on every single survivor, every single game. That in itself should illustrate how over tuned they are if you could nerf them that signficantly and they would still be in every single game, on every single survivor. If they were even remotely close to balanced then that hard of a nerf would make them nearly unseen, but that isn't the case.
There is literally no reason you would not always have an Exhaustion perk on every single game unless you just didn't care about winning, that is bad design. Every single perk should make you weigh the pros and cons and debate whether it was worth it that game. There is no consideration to make with Exhaustion perks, you just auto equip them no matter what. Bad design.
Either Exhaustion perks tuned down tremendously or killer Exhaustion perks tuned up tremendously. One or the other.
This all said I will throw some disclaimers. I think some Exhaustion perks that are designed well and totally fine are ones such as BL or Head On. They're situational, require you to play around them, and have high or low value depending on map rng so there's some risk attached to using them. They aren't just default auto high value every game regardless of anything. I'm fine with these. This is how the other Exhaustion perks should be.
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Deadhard needs a Nerf for sure. Unlike other Second Chnace Perks it doesnt have a reason to be there. DS is for Tunneling, UB is for Slugging and BT is again for Tunneling. They have their Place to be this strong, so Killer Players get punished for trying to get a fast Kill and not letting the Survivor play the game.
But Deadhard ? Its just there to extend the Chase even when the Killer played Correctly and The Survivor simply missplayed. Thats why i think it needs to be changed.
And yeah, Balanced really is ... not all that usefull, but it needed a Nerf because it was able to turn some Places into Infinites. But with reworks to all of the Maps maybe they could buff it a little again.
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you would not i have frineds with 4000+ hours who doesnt run any exhaustion perks they are generally useless if you loop perfectly anyways.... dead hard is cheap i agree its i frames AND distance... while i do know they all are situational but you might aswell 99 sprint burst nad use it as smashit i mean balanced landing and overcome do different things balacned reduces the stagger but they removed it due to infinites and that so many maps had drops (when there are maps that IT CANT BE USED ON...) infact BL is probably the only perk that has 0 use on some maps literally 0 liek you CANT even use it
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yea i know how old balanced could turn loops into infinites but they could keep it at like 20% or something so it still gives you a little reward for running it instead of sprintburst i mean yes the first fall is reduced but i dont think a 25% reduction to stagger would bring back infinites
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i dont really think dead hard is a huge problem either but its definetly one of the better exhaustion perks
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and its literally invincibility against killers... if you go against a nurse you can literally dead hard to guarantee a dodge unless you mess up really really really big... + if you loop good you wont even need dead hard and if we look value wise SB is better you can 99 it and get way more distance. its just that dead hard is so easy to use and its rewards is very good for the requirements be injured and run
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You would. You're friends would simply be doing better if they ran an Exhaustion perk regardless of how good they loop. Most the time you ever don't see an Exhaustion perk is simply because they want to challenge themselves because it's already too easy or they're just meme'ing. If your intention is just to win you would always be running one.
That's actually wrong on BL in regards to some maps with zero use. There are some maps with very little use, but there are some spots on even the worst maps. No map has literally zero spots.
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I disagree. DH IS a Problem. it just punishes the Killer for playing well and rewards Survivors for missplaying.
Sure, it takes Skill to use it correctly. But in my Book its unfair that you as a Killer can play well and Outplay the Survivor just be Outperked by a Player pressing E at the right time.
I dont say: Delete this Perk completly, but atleast take one of the effects away. The I Frame or Distance, but both is too much.
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Pls No. Not more like Deadhard. You should extend the Chase by Skill and Map knowledge being able to go from Loop to Loop. Not by using a Perk that does all the Hard Work for you and making Good Survivors even more untouchable.
Skill should be rewarded just like it should be earned. Not by using a Perk.
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nah, then there is justification to take away NOED and i like NOED. survs have DH, and killers have NOED.
take away invincibility on DH and haste on NOED and i think it would be a good spot
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I hate when People say: Yeah that is bad. But what about THAT ?
Yes. NOED is #########. Yes, it should be changed. But thats not what we talk about.
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It’s not invincibility… just because you keep repeating it doesn’t make it true.
The rest of the exhaustion perks are also easy to use. You only pick on DH because you don’t like it, not because it is unbalanced.
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When they stop releasing non-safe pallets you can complain about chase extenders.
I wish killers would rely on skill too when they refuse to break a pallet and wait for bloodlust T3.
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If a killer is letting themselves get to T3 bloodlust for a single hit, they are already losing the chase. It takes 45 seconds to hit T3.
You should honestly be proud of them wasting time hitting T3.
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Remove the invincibility or the distance. Even if one of these were gone it would STILL be the strongest exhaustion perk in the game.
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All Exhaustion perks are broken, and they always have been. You'll never change my mind on that, but some, like DH/SB, are simply more broken than others. You can't 'bring other perks' up to their level because they're on another level that they shouldn't be at in the first place.
SB pretty much turns any area into a safe area. No fear of the killer knowing where you are, no fear of them as you sit on the gen and they're walking right up to you. You just.. SB away to a pre-planned safe area. That, however, does not really feel as bad as DH does. Dead Hard rewards you for making a mistake and getting outplayed, or playing greedy, and with such a short CD, and on all 4 survivors, can extend chases to have a severe impact on the game like no other perk can. That on top of the fact that it just feels really bad to deal with as a killer. Of course, lots of things feel bad for both sides in this game.
I think there's a reason most Exhaustion perks have more clearly defined pre-reqs, like Head On, Lithe, Balanced, and why you have limited control over the scenario in which you can use them. If things like Exhaustion perks didn't exist, and breakable walls didn't exist, then something like Bloodlust wouldn't be required to exist, either. But that is the game we play and I wouldn't ever expect them to change, I just think there was a point a lot of issues in this game (cough anti-loop killers cough) could've been dealt with, not made worse.
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Point is bloodlust isn’t skill. It’s a crutch.
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Nah. The extension of chase can sing handedly win you the game. As it did my last match. One early game dead hard pretty much did me in. I didn't even get the down. I had to peel off and defend gens and still ended up with no hook until the gens were done.
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Unless you are exposed, that's at least 90 seconds spent hitting T3 to hit you twice. Your other 3 teammates can easily get 3 gens done.
If you are losing to bloodlust, you have other issues.
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The game would be a lot better with no exhaustion or exposed perks.
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Buffing other perks to the level of already broken perks isn't really an answer. It's as silly as when people say SWF is broken and solo Q sucks, so lets buff solo survivors to SWF levels. DH is as strong as it is because of map design and game mechanics. On some maps you get such good tiles, it's way too easy to loop a killer in perfectly safe tiles and then the second the killer bloodlusts you or mind games you, what do you know you get a free second chance because of your perk. It's bad enough to have one perk like this, why should we have four or five or however many exhaustion perks exist?
Personally I think SB is great, as is DH. Overcome is also very good, you get a ton of distance. I also like Lithe. But I actually don't run any exhaustion perks anymore. I am not a very good looper and I still have no problems giving teammates at least a decent chunk of time when I am in a chase.
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Yet, there is those of us that DH does not have that same effect because we know how to deal with it.
If you are losing games simply because of DH then I have to question your overall skill as a killer.
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Just make it so survivors can't chain chase position, so if a palette is broken they WILL down.
Now dead hard is not that strong anymore.
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You mean issues like unsafe pallets?
Why don’t we talk about that when we talk about DH? Because they are all relative.
Bloodlust gets the killer hits they would have otherwise not gotten.
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Don't forget DH is so popular because it's op
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I'll trade you removing dead hard for removing ruin and NOED. A two for one deal where everyone wins!
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I'd use Balanced Landing SO much more if it always made you silent when falling from a high place. I'm sorry but there's no reason it shouldn't silence you every time you drop down. I think this is the best way to buff it without making it over tuned.
I understand it can't have the stagger reduction on every drop down since that enables infinites (I think?) but I think this small change would be OK.
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Ehhh they need to overhaul exhaustion as a whole if they're gonna keep map sizes as they are now. Simply nerfing isn't going to be enough.
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yea just silent drops would be a good buff and yes the reduced stagger allowed for infinites but i dont think 25% reduction would do it... but just a silent drop would be a little game changer
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op meh its popular becuase its easy to use and very convenient if you want to use sprint brust effectively you have to run with it 99 and keep running thats annoying and not so easy to do (its easy but you get what i mean) with dead hard you just become injured and press a button its fast and often gets the job done
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And is uncounterable when used for distance, so my point still stands
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Keep telling yourself that.
Its not OP.
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Seeing how other exhaustion perks are stronger than Dead Hard. I would suggest not buffing them? Maybe Balanced Landing, but balanced landing is weak more that most maps can't use it - than it being a weak perk.
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I've yet so see a reason as to why it isn't that actually makes sense.
One of the counter-argument I've seen was "Bait it out", which doesn't apply to using Dead Hard for distance.
Another one I've seen was "Dead Hard doesn't give as much distance as other Exhaustion Perks, like Sprint Burst", which is true, Dead Hard gives less distance, but it depends when Exhaustion Perks are used.
Dead Hard is the only Exhaustion Perk that can reliably extend chases after the Killer already put in time into the chase, which is stronger than either denying chase, or ending the chase before the Killer got their first hit.
It's the same reason I think Overcome is better than Sprint Burst but worse than Dead Hard. It activates after the chase already started, but ends it immediately after activating.
Dead Hard activates in a moment of vulnerability from the Survivor side, most of the time when they wouldn't have gotten to a Pallet or Window, and gives them the slight amount of edge that helps them make it, but is also a small enough amount of distance that ending a chase for wouldn't be worth it
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Dead Hard let’s you dodge hits you otherwise would have taken.
You know you lost an argument when you bring up Bloodlust
Besides, it takes like 40 seconds to T3 provided you never break a pallet
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Keep telling yourself that it's not OP.
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Isn't it 45? I mean, it still doesn't matter, that's half a Generator per Health State so the Killer should lose all Generators in a maximum of 5 chases, minimum 2
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If Dead Hard is granting such a massive advantage to survivors, then nerfing it would require major buffs to all the exhaustion perks to make up for it or nerfing Killer speeds somehow. It's being used by 47% of survivors.
You can't nerf something being used by that large a base of players and not balance it out somewhere else. You have to remember that kills/escapes are at 50%, according to the developers and that is where the developers want the balance to be.
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What if they made it to where: When a Survivor is suffering from the Exhausted Status Effect (whether it be by their own perks or the Killer's perks or power) they cannot vault period? Would that fix anything? Or would you have to make it to where they just can't interact with stuff while running/in chase since they are.... you know.... EXHAUSTED???
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Nerfing Dead Hard doesn't mean that other Exhaustion Perks would need buffs.
Dead Hard is the most used Exhaustion Perk because it's op, not because the rest are bad. Sure, Head-On and Balanced Landing could use a few buffs, but the rest are good and balanced Perks
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Not being able to vault Windows is too harsh.
Not being able to fast vault Windows would be more fair, but i don't think Exhaustion, the Status Effect itself, needs a nerf
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Ah I see. There's got to be something with Exhausted that can be changed to make it a decision in the Survivors mind before just YOLOING whenever..
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When overcome was activated with bt it was a very good Perk. Now it’s another trash perk
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Yolo'ing whenever and wherever usually bites Survivors back so that's why I don't necessarily think Exhaustion needs a nerf. Dead Hard, however can rot in hell
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No, almost all of them need to be nerfed, just in different varying degrees. You are basing your opinion here on the kill rates which are not only flawed to begin with but also absolutely terrible in terms of measuring balance.
"and that is where the developers want the balance to be."
Which is where the developers are messing up and why the games balance is in such a terrible state in the first place. Balancing around kills is a terrible metric for a multitude of reasons.
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That's always on my mind when I see them use it too.... I'm like yay... You YOLO'd... (proceeds to cry as they made so many mistakes I lost count but got away because of that DH YOLO)
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I'm not basing my opinion on anything.
The developers have said they want the kill/escapes at roughly 50%. The developers have said they are happy where the kills/escapes currently are. If a Dead Hard nerf changes that percentage, then the developers are going to buff other things in the survivor kits or nerf other things in the killer kits.
All of your thoughts on balance needs to be constrained by what the developers are aiming for.
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Personally, I highly doubt Dead Hard is outperforming other exhaustion perks. I think Dead Hard is used a lot because it a much more fun perk for survivor-players and because it gets daily advertising from killer-players.
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