Nerf idea for Dead Hard to keep it strong but fair
Alright so I came up with this idea from another game, but I feel like this can put the perk in a healthy spot without completely killing it. So basically, Valorant has a character named Jett where she has a dash ability that is pretty much a get out of jail free card in a bad situation without any planning ahead and it has caused a big unbalanced. In the next patch however, it’s about to get nerfed to where to use the ability, you first have to activate it and then you have 12 seconds to use it otherwise you lose the ability.
I was thinking Dead Hard can have the same treatment. Basically, while injured, the perk isn’t activated while running until you press E to activate it. Once it is activated, then you can press E again within a X second window (it doesn’t have to be 12 seconds) to use the benefit of the perk. If you don’t use it in that window, you become exhausted.
Comments
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I liked this idea.
Dead Hard needs to be less stronger. This idea looks decent.
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I mean, coudnt you just double tap E and just Dead Hard immediately?
I feel like activating it would need a separate animation to avoid the above
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Remove the distance and it's still fair.
Iframes have alot of uses, it just gives DH a set role/ability instead of multiple uses such as the broken free distance to correct mistakes.
Your idea actually makes DH less useable than just removing the distance as you can use the iframes to dodge/bait an attack then drop a pallet. Or if you mean you just have X seconds to use it then it's still busted as before, the distance has to go.
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Alright to combat that, just give it 2 seconds after you activate it until you can use it to avoid double tapping.
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Nerf? Like Nerf Guns?
Those are fun..
what else is fun, you ask?
well, Hollow Knight.
(and valorant)
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I am now for the make it a one time use idea.
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It has to be the other way around- remove the iFrames but keep the distance. If you remove the distance, the perk becomes useless and no one will use it. We have too many useless perks as is (on both sides). Remember the DH bug that would leave survivors “exhausted on the floor?” No iFrames would work the same and stop survivors from greeding a whiff AND making it to a window/pallet. Also, survivors won’t be able to use it after unhooking someone while injured (in front of your face), and they won’t be able to bait a swing from you while you carry their teammate to a hook. No iFrames, so they’ll foolishly get downed if they try.
If it’s being used tsolely to dodge a hit with iFrames, killers would just bait it out or even if they do whiff, they’ll catch up in no time because distance is gone. A lot of ppl use DH today ‘incorrectly” as is, only to go down 3 seconds later. Stopping those at mid-high MMR from greeding with DH will make life a little better for killers.
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Wrong. Iframes have so many uses, my recent post actually lists it all.
All the distance does is punish the weak basic attack killers and corrects mistakes on loops, it's also the easy part of the perk.
You want DH to require some skill, the distance part lacks still and is unfair. If you think DH is only good for the distance you're using the easy and broken part of it.
The fact you dont think basic attack killers should be able to counter a perk says enough.
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Chill out with the passive aggressiveness, we have a difference of opinion and nothing more. Notice how everyone here is able to convey theirs without being condescending.
‘Even if you are right, the main problem with that is the perk would become very unpopular and it would barely be used. Like I said before, we have too many perks that are not good & not worth using a slot for. Let’s not throw another one on the pile.
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I just said wrong, because it is... the iframes alone can counter 12odd killer abilities and yet I get people telling me its pointless.
And it's not about how often the perks used it's about balance, just because something isnt picked much doesnt mean it's bad.
DH iframes have many uses, mainly against the stronger anti-loop ones it just requires some effort from the survivors.
Like I said if you dont know what the iframes do check my post, it's my most recent one. My change balances DH against all killers (strong against antiloop, not as strong against basic attacks) if people dont use it that's their choice. Doesnt make it bad, just makes it more situational and skillful.
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I feel like this is still really strong.
Even with this I don't think it's enough. Personally I feel they should just make Dead Hard a permanent exhaustion after 1 use. This would keep it strong if used correctly but it can't be used 3/4 times a game.
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This doesn't change the perk at all.
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Weird nerf. It doesn't adress the main issue of dh, which is distance it gives survivors. I think a better way to nerf dead hard is to make it about dodging attacks. So if you dodge m1 or m2 from killer you gain 4sec speed boost but if you fail at dodging or you try to use it for distance you won't be able to vault pallets or windows for 5sec.
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it's better to do a complete rework on the perk and remove the instance of "press button to escape" which is why people complain.
My idea was to base the perk rework to avoid hits that cause insta down (bypassing healthy state of the survivors). It would be something less frequent, but it would still make the perk useful, as seen below:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/306524/just-one-idea-about-the-dead-hard-rework
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Your idea is very cool, however, I would make it situational and planable, and you can predict situations to activate DH with mind game, however,your idea is valid.
inspired by your idea I created one that might be interesting too:
-When you're injured and in chase,perk active for 20 seconds (time subject to adjustment)
-during this time you can use the skill by pressing the button to give the boost, after that time if you not using DH you will exhaust yourself
like, I thought like this: DH would be more useful for those who really need it , like, a person who plays well, she holds a killer for more than a minute while a baby survivor he sometimes falls in less than 20 seconds, so DH would be more useful to this type of player.
but I liked your idea, it can be a solution too
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I like this idea.
Something like press e, then after 2 or 3 seconds it becomes active for 6 or 8 seconds. During that entire 8-10 or so second window the survivor enters a unique running animation. At any time during the 6 or 8 second activity window you can press E to dodge as you currently do. If you don't use it you become exhausted, but with a reduced duration, like 20 seconds.
Makes it so the survivor has to have a little bit of foresight as to whether they'll make it to safety or not and can't just use it on reaction anytime they mess up, and simultaneously solves the problem where no matter how patient you are sometimes a survivor will just straight up get lucky with their DH timing because of the wind up and animation indicating whether or not it is a momment where its dangerous to swing.
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I have better idea change dead hard on pc how it works on console. Cause on console you can't dead hard if killer is about to hit you have to do it earlier. So then those hacker dead hards would not be problem when I hit the guy but he still dead hards which is super annoying. There is also sprint burst for distance so I don't find dead hard for distance as big problem and it even gives less distance. Killers also have very strong perks like noed, BBQ... so I don't think dead hard is issue.
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The biggest problem with Dead Hard is that there's no way to know if a survivor has it or not, there's no indicator that a survivor is exhausted either on the UI or on their animations. If a survivor bluffs that their dead hard is off cooldown, and you waste an extra 5 seconds trying to bait it out then that's another 20 seconds of gen time they got for free.
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Simple DH fix, remove the invulnerability. That way it can only be used to gain a short amount of distant quickly, but cannot be used to dodge a hit.
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I don't like this because it basically has no true effect.
You press the button when you want to use it.
Now, you press the button TWICE when you want to use it.
I could understand if you HAD to use it within a certain context.
'When you are put into the Injured state by any means, Dead Hard activates for 8/12/16 seconds'
Only within that window can you use the perk. Yes!
But having people press it twice doesn't make much sense.
It makes sense for Jett in Valorant, because that split second is all that matters. They're sick of her dashing to cheese ping and avoid getting headshot as a team lights her up. Literally this puts the perk on a fraction of a second delay - which is how Valorant works.
Dead By Daylight, though, making people press E twice won't change much at all, except annoy survivor mains for no reason.
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Thats why you add a delay between the first press and second press. Ie. You press the button the first time and then the perk becomes usuable 3 seconds later. This means you can't just react to making a mistake and double press E, you have to have the foresight to have acitvated it 3 seconds earlier when you believe you're about to be in a situation where you wont be able to make it to saftey.
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Dead Hard should just be a little duck, remove the distance. Not only would it be unique but it would be infinitely more skillful. I'm always way more impressed at a perfectly timed dead hard than a distance use. The animation can even stay the same, just don't make them dash forward.
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In that case - it may work, but not by too much.
3 seconds is a lot of time - and the perk use is very quick.
The length of activation time would be the most difficult aspect to balance.
How long should survivors be given to use their 'everything proof shield'? 16 second may be too generous, as survivors can easily activate it once a chase starts and have more than enough time to use it within. Drop it to 8 seconds and the picture becomes so incredibly narrow that it requires either clairvoyance or wastefulness to find use... and that's never a good thing.
It's an interesting and simple concept, but I fear it may add just another impossible-to-balance layer on top of what exists.
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Jett's voice is so annoying
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Great. There's already sprint burst for people who want a distance perk. DH shouldn't be looked at as a better sprint burst. It should be its own option. Iframes are more than enough.
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Well, I thought maybe they could make it to where dead hard activates after you're hit and you have a 60 second window to use it after being hit or else it deactivates, no stacks but reusable, should only work with health states, i.e get hooked it deactivates, bt shouldnt count towards this as a health state, getting knocked down also should deactivate it
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