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Can Nurse please be tuned down a bit now the update has come out?
I'm sure this topic has been mentioned many times and I know a lot of streamers have discussed with viewers, but Nurse is just too strong in the current meta.
I know she has always been the strongest killer in the game, I don't think that's a fair counter-argument.
Her hits should count as M2 attacks, not M1, I mean, if Blights rush attack counts as M2, why doesn't Nurses?
Also, tune her add ons down a bit, even without add ons she's the strongest in the game.
I'm talking as someone who either plays solo queue or killer, maybe she's not as strong against squads, but I highly doubt that too be true unless in a 4 man tournie team.
I know this will fall on death's ear, most Nurse main's or killer mains will say it's just a survivor main complaining again, but honestly, it's my only issue with this update, if the Nurse is above average, it's impossible to v.s. in solo queue.
Thanks for taking the time to read :)
Comments
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Oh gawd.... does every survivor main have to ask this question individually and expect a personalised answer?
Her hits should count as M2 attacks, not M1, I mean, if Blights rush attack counts as M2, why doesn't Nurses?
She's literally slower than survivors. She is the only killer that is literally slower than survivors. How do you expect her to get M1 hits when she's literally slower than survivors without her blinks??
Blight is a 115% killer. He can literally walk up to survivors and smack them upside the head like most of the other killers. That's why his special doesn't count for basic.
Honestly, if this is the shallow depth of understanding, it's no wonder there's so many complaints about Nurse. Survivor-mains simply refuse to step out of their bubble and look at any other factor other than "duuurrrr... my standard looping skills are no good any more"
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She also blinks and teleports through walls, how is that a counter-argument, that she's slow?
I assume you believe she's in a good spot, perfectly balanced and nothing should be done about her current power level?
Well, thanks for nit-picking a single point you didn't like, ignoring my overall concern with the killer and providing no positive feedback...don't comment if you're just going to be rude, maybe?
Also, not a survivor main, solo queue and killer main...read the whole thing
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What they need to do is increase the fatigue since less time we get to run after the easier nurse is to play.
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YOU: (She's literally slower than survivors. She is the only killer that is literally slower than survivors. How do you expect her to get M1 hits when she's literally slower than survivors without her blinks??)
RSPONSE: She's not, that's the point. Her blinks synergizing with exposed or other on M1 hit abilities is really too much for a killer with the ability to ignore the walls and the entirety of the game's mechanics.
YOU: (Blight is a 115% killer. He can literally walk up to survivors and smack them upside the head like most of the other killers. That's why his special doesn't count for basic.)
RESPONSE: Right, but again, nurse can get her hit's so easily compared to the other killers, and therefore is rewarded more than the other killers as a result with perks that reward M1s.
YOU: (Honestly, if this is the shallow depth of understanding, it's no wonder there's so many complaints about Nurse. Survivor-mains simply refuse to step out of their bubble and look at any other factor other than "duuurrrr... my standard looping skills are no good any more")
RESPONSE: Did you even read his post? He clearly stated he was a killer main that plays solo que survivor on the side. Looping is a core mechanic of this game, anybody that's played this game for a while knows this. I believe the level of YOUR depth of the understanding of the game is what really needs to be questioned here. Every other killer for the most part plays by the core mechanics of DbD. Nurse COMPLETELY ignores them.and basically plays her own game. She should have a smaller pool of perks that synergize with her power because her power on it's own is more than capable of making up for it.
And before you even say it, I am also a killer main with almost 3k hours in the game, so please do not try the "survivor main" slander.
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To be fair, given the debacle without the old DH, for many of them they never were.
Once the dust settles, everything should go back in order, except that now M1 killers will not be easy to stamp on anymore. It will be great for match diversity.
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I hate the slippery slope fallacy, I really do, it's lazy and easy to abuse.
But I know that there isn't a universe in existence where her M1 becomes a special attack and y'all don't immediately start losing your minds over 4 gen slowdown Nurse.
Not. A. Single. Universe.
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Nurse is fine if you are good as survivor
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I mean... should they not. If balance is so important, would it not make sense for killers who are really strong, or even just really strong in one area, not have access to certain perks.
It would actually make the game easier to balance around, as instead of perks being nerfed to the point of being far to weak, you simply prevent certain killers form have access to them. That is what caused the nerf to ruin/tinker. The combination was fine on a majority of killers, however killers towards the top end or with high mobility, the combination was way to oppressive. Instead of just nerfing the perk, you prevent certain killers form accessing it, soft nerfing specific combinations, without actually nerfing the perk to the point of being weak.
The fact is Nurse doesn't need any perks, any half way decent Nurse player can demonstrate this. Preventing her access to most if not all gen slow down perks would quite honestly fix a lot issues with her, without removing her from the top place, you would just need to reach the skill needed play at that level, making her strong, but earned.
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You wrote a whole lot to justify how you feel, using only subjective comments. Thankfully, no dev is going to agree with the people who reccomend that perks should just be turned off al a carte for killers. They know better.
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That's not... counterpoint. This is very common in a lot of games. Certain roles that are suited for specific areas are denied access to certain abilities for the sake of balance.
I don't know why you think DBD is special. If you can point out why this wouldn't fix a lot of balancing issues for the killer side, I would be happy to hear your thoughts. Otherwise there is no need to respond with "your wrong, I don't care what you think."
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You're not reading arguments. Some people want Nurse to have no addons, some want her to have no M1 perks. Some people want her nerfed into the ground and they all think they're right.
These aren't solutions, just petty fantasies.
Again, there's not a single killer who can't use perks, Nurse is not going to be the first. Its bad design.
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No it's actually really good design. Instead of nerfing the killer and risking making them them too weak they are unplayed, they prevent certain combinations from existing. Bad design is what they did to ruin. Nerfed because of high mobile killers, now the perk is too weak and will need to be buffed.
You have responded twice now and have not addressed my point.
Why is it bad for balance for certain killers to not have access to certain perks for balance.
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There is no evidence perks are balanced around mobile killers. You quoted me, ignoring my point about perk disparity and homogenization. Like I said, get rid of all M1 on Nurse and all you're gonna do is get slapped by 4 gen slowdown. It's bad design, I don't owe it more of an answer than that.
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She also blinks and teleports through walls, how is that a counter-argument, that she's slow?
Yes... and if she hits you when doing that - also known as a blink attack - it counts as a standard attack because it's the only way she can really get hits. What you want is for her to be able to blink and teleport... but not be able to hit survivors?? So she has to target a blink, get it right, suffer through fatigue etc, and then what?? Somehow still catch up to the survivor (who's already run away at this point) to get her M1 attack?
Honestly... you guys need to upgrade your arguments here.
I assume you believe she's in a good spot, perfectly balanced and nothing should be done about her current power level?
I do, I think she's literally the manifestation of the definition of gameplay that survivor mains keep crying for, i.e. skill should be rewarded. She takes a lot of skill to master, and for those who've mastered her, deserve their rewards. Survivors should learn to juke her, instead of crying about the fact that they have to learn different strategies to verse her.
Well, thanks for nit-picking a single point you didn't like, ignoring my overall concern with the killer and providing no positive feedback
Well, I exposed the consistent flaw in this argument you and others keep crying for. Your overall concern with the killer is irrelevant when your only solution is literally for her to not work. That's not a solution.
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She's not, that's the point.
Err... she is! That's literally the point. She is literally slower than other killers. Yes, she has speed with her blinks, but if you don't let her attack when blinking, then she's literally slower and cannot be compared with 115% killers in this instance.
I don't understand why it's so hard to understand this simple point?
Her blinks synergizing with exposed or other on M1 hit abilities is really too much for a killer with the ability to ignore the walls and the entirety of the game's mechanics.
So learn to juke her blinks then? She gets a limited number, has to charge them up, aim correctly and avoid any obstacles (including landing on the right side of any walls, etc), and suffer fatigue... how much more do you want? Just get better at juking them.
Right, but again, nurse can get her hit's so easily compared to the other killers
Even if I were to believe you on this (which I don't, there's a reason her kill-rate is the lowest, because she's the hardest to use and actually get hits with), she only gets those hits ("so easily") with her blinks! Without blinks, she gets nothing!! So why should she be denied a whole roster of M1 related perks because of this, when clearly the counter is in the hands of the survivors?
Did you even read his post?
I did... and I addressed a specific comment he(?) made without creating other fallacious arguments or resorting to straw men. I could ask the same of you.
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First of all, why do you have to make this a Survivor Main v.s. a Killer Main argument, the vast majority of players who play DBD (like myself) play both equally, I have 3.7k hours in the game and about half of that I have played killer, so I am saying, objectively, with the current meta after the recent update, she is over-tuned.
Also, either you have never gone against an insane Nurse, but considering you've made 500+ posts, I doubt that to be the case, but to simply say, just juke her blinks, get good, any Nurse with several hundred hours doesn't miss, so...yeh
Look, you're clearly a Nurse main the way your repeating the same points but not actually offering anything useful, you've made you mind up and that's fine, but I and I'm sure the vast majority of the community will agree she is over-tuned. I don't think she's broken, I don't even care if they do anything with her M1/M2 stuff, but, she at high level game play is far too strong and unless you are 4 man SWF team you won't be able to do against her, which ISN'T healthy for gameplay.
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Nurse can't get m1's unless the survivor walks into her...
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First of all, why do you have to make this a Survivor Main v.s. a Killer Main argument
If you understood my point, you'd realise it's not Survivor Main vs. Killer Main at all. This is not a matter of opinion. It's literally a matter of fact.
Can Blight chase down a survivor without using his power and get an M1 hit over the course of normal play? Yes!! Hence using his power counts as special.
Can Nurse chase down a survivor without using her power and get an M1 hit over the course of normal play? No. She's literally slower than survivors. Hence the only way she can close the gap is to blink, and as this is the only expected way for her to get hits, they're not special.
It's predominantly survivor-mains who fail to understand the very basic premise behind this understanding.
so I am saying, objectively, with the current meta after the recent update, she is over-tuned.
You need to look up what "objectively" means. Your position is entirely subjective, and not only that, the point to which I responded to is just plain wrong... objectively wrong. As per my very simple point above.
Also, either you have never gone against an insane Nurse
I've gone against many insane Nurses. I'm also a mod for SupaAlf on twitch. I'm pretty familiar with "insane" Nurse gameplay.
I doubt that to be the case
Nice to read your carefully curated and thought-out justification for this opinion. Shame it's completely baseless and wrong.
any Nurse with several hundred hours doesn't miss
Finally, something I'll (mostly) agree with. And in this case, a good Nurse who's put that many hours in deserves their wins. Skill should be rewarded.
I'm sure you're also aware of another streamer who's done 50 wins-in-a-row streaks with every killer with no add-ons... just because a player with a very high amount of experience and skill is capable of winning doesn't mean there's a problem with the killers as a whole. Because it's easily countered by survivors doing escape streaks too.
Look, you're clearly a Nurse main the way your repeating the same points but not actually offering anything useful
I've consistently offered reasoned based objectively validateable reason. It's a shame that's lost on you.
I'm sure the vast majority of the community will agree she is over-tuned
Logical fallacy. Just because the majority believe something doesn't make it necessarily true. We could look to recent political decisions for examples of that.
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