When playing as survivor, which killer perks annoy you the most?

Pain Resonance and Hex: Bloodfavor. They're not particularly OP, but just very annoying to face and I've been seeing them a lot recently.

All the truly despicable stuff on Killer is tied to add-ons, but if I really had to choose out of the perk pool, I'd pick Bamboozle or Blood Favor as they are a slight annoyance.

Merciless storm if the killer is doctor because of the flipped and changed spot skill checks.

Having to pay attention to the entire screen for skill checks is annoying especially when they are fast paced ones

Easily corrupt because it has some brain scrambling effect on my teammates.

"I never said Bamboozle wasn't good, I just said its lazy"

Bamboozle forces people to not be able to follow an "optimal loop pattern". Following an optimal loop pattern is lazy. I really don't like chess because you can memorize the counter to any potential move setup. DBD is exactly the same when you are chased by most of the M1 cast. Follow the optimal loop path until you can't anymore then throw the pallet. There is no innovation. It's route memorization. Bamboozle says no to that. You have to think of something different or I win.

"I believe Bamboozle is a lazy perk because it removes skill from the equation."

So you probably think chasing people with Nurse is lazy too right? Under normal conditions running a memorized loop pattern removes any perceived skill you think you have. It's literally monkey see - monkey do. Copy and Paste someone else's understanding of the game and run the most efficient loop on every tile. When I bring Bamboozle I erase everything you know about that tile and change it into a new tile that favors me.

"Mind games with the opposing side are dynamic, and to me that's the most fun part of DBD"

I'm not going ti humor this argument as it reinforce the idea : chases are fun when I am in control and not fun when I have zero control.

"All of this comes back to my original point: when I go against a top tier killer who mindgames me well and gets downs on me by anticipating and outsmarting me, I feel satisfied because I know that at that moment, he was the better player. When I go down because someone bamboozled a window, I just feel like someone used a perk to avoid having to put the time in to learn to outsmart people, they just let the perk do it."

It's boring to play Nurse and Blight because you move really fast, you have the advantage at almost every tile, you have crazy strong addons and it is your game to lose. For every other killer in the game it's the survivor's game to lose. They will win if they don't mess up. Because of this I don't play those killers.

The reality is that you can't outsmart people who have "questionable vision" with a mind game. I can't explain that better or the mods will delete this post for advertising non allowed behavior. There are also quite a few people who play DBD with subtle cheats. You literally can't catch them at loops without bloodlust. They absolutely hate Bamboozle because they have no idea what to do when you block their favorite window.

Also while you feel there are no mind games with Bamboozle - I can assure you there are plenty. When I play survivor I don't mind Bamboozle. I know exactly how I would play that window when I play killer and in what feels like 90% of cases I can make huge distance if I know they feel they need to block a window. I also listen for the "bloop" sound whenever a killer vaults a window. Most people could avoid a free hit from the "surprise" factor if they just learned to pay more attention - like you are forced to do as killer.

Bamboozle isn't a tool that rewards a killer for being lazy. It forces a survivor to not be lazy. You have to think of a new escape pattern and that requires on the fly adaptation. It also bumps up "bad killers" to be a real threat. People love to play against weak killers because they can loop them "forever" with very little effort. Don't be that kind of lazy.

"Bamboozle forces people to not be able to follow an "optimal loop pattern". Following an optimal loop pattern is lazy."

Did you not read any other part of my response saying that reading and reacting to the other player is what makes it fun? I agree running the "optimal path" is lazy, because

A: that's reducing the entire game down to a flowchart, rather than playing dynamically and predicting the other player's actions, like I said I prefer doing.

and B: running the optimal path IS EXACTLY WHAT YOU SAID BAMBOOZLE ALLOWS YOU TO DO. If no matter what the survivor has done earlier in the game, the way you play a tile is the exact same because of a perk you're running, then that perk facilitates laziness.

So you probably think chasing people with Nurse is lazy too right?

No, because playing nurse requires you at least learn her blink distance and predict survivor pathing, akin to learning how to run tiles correctly. The equivalent would be if there was an addon that automatically turned you in the direction of the survivor when you release the blink, because then you wouldn't have to predict or learn at all.

"The reality is that you can't outsmart people who have "questionable vision" with a mind game. I can't explain that better or the mods will delete this post for advertising non allowed behavior. There are also quite a few people who play DBD with subtle cheats. You literally can't catch them at loops without bloodlust. They absolutely hate Bamboozle because they have no idea what to do when you block their favorite window."

This explanation reads like someone who blames every single time they lose a chase on stretched rez, subtle cheats or SWF. If you're going against so many that you have to run Bamboozle to counter them constantly, you're probably not going against any.

""Mind games with the opposing side are dynamic, and to me that's the most fun part of DBD"

I'm not going ti humor this argument as it reinforce the idea : chases are fun when I am in control and not fun when I have zero control."

I don't think you know what the word dynamic means.

We agree on one thing: A survivor running every tile in the same prescribed way is boring and lazy. Comp dropping every safe pallet and moving on to the next one sucks to go against and is boring. But I think killers doing the same thing is equally as boring. Bamboozling a window is just comp dropping every pallet but for the killer: you remove all chance for interesting play and turn the game into resource management. Chases should be dynamic (that means changing constantly), with reads and predictions and reactions. That's the way I play. Sometimes it backfires and I go down faster, but that's the risk reward. But by running bamboozle, you're forcing me to simply play the only way I can with the window blocked, which is just to loop and drop the pallet at the optimal time. Ironically, you're forcing the thing you hate most by running the perk.

"We agree on one thing: A survivor running every tile in the same prescribed way is boring and lazy. Comp dropping every safe pallet and moving on to the next one sucks to go against and is boring."

I definitely agree with you here.

"Bamboozling a window is just comp dropping every pallet but for the killer: you remove all chance for interesting play and turn the game into resource management"

Most of the maps have too many safe pallets. I don't even mean the really abusive ones like "The Game". Once upon a time maps were littered with something like 50% safe pallets and 50% unsafe pallets. The problem with wanting DBD to be a "mind game" centered adventure is that most pallets can't be mind gamed anymore.

Bamboozle forces you to waste resources or take a hit. I don't care if you drop the pallet - I can instantly break it. If I am in a chase with someone and they drop 3-4 pallets I might just chase them a while so they ruin the map for others. This is rare but MMR sometimes gives you people with very low hours who are not smurfing with new accounts.

DBD is most fair to killer when it becomes a resource management issue. If you make them drop their medkits or waste them through other perks that helps. Making people waste pallets is a big help too.

"But by running bamboozle, you're forcing me to simply play the only way I can with the window blocked, which is just to loop and drop the pallet at the optimal time. Ironically, you're forcing the thing you hate most by running the perk."

This is the part I disagree with. The reason I run Bamboozle is to force chases to be faster and force pallets to be used more quickly. I want both of those things.

Most survivors have zero skill without a pallet; conversely there is almost no skill involved in looping an M1 killer around a safe loop with the pallet intact. I would agree if you call these chases boring. It's dumb game design that you need to bring bamboozle to prevent survivors from running around the same loop over and over - or you can play Nurse. A lot of people in recent months have just opted out to play Nurse as it doesn't cost a perk slot.

One of the oldest tricks in the DBD book was stealth. Sadly it has almost completely been eliminated from the game. We lost the fog to make console players happy and that sucks. Stealth without fog isn't really that viable. Nor it is easy when the killer can see your aura over and over and over again. Stealth play was the original mind game. Shelter woods was the "challenge" map back in the time of release because it had no infinite window loops (after they patched the second window to be closed or if you played trapper in the first month).