Visit the Kill Switch Master List for more information on these and other current known issues: https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/kb/articles/299-kill-switch-master-list
We encourage you to be as honest as possible in letting us know how you feel about the game. The information and answers provided are anonymous, not shared with any third-party, and will not be used for purposes other than survey analysis.
Access the survey HERE!
When Will Nurse Get Nerfed?
Comments
-
No, no it isn't. Not even close. Nurse doesn't get exposed without perks. Come on, now.
1 -
I don't use a controller. As far as I know you could be using some third-party controller, so the bound keys are still set to keyboard. It is an even worse look, actually, if that wasn't a controller...
You have only shown one clip of your gameplay. You and the nurse weren't even playing the same game. You were running around, having a hard time moving your camera (still unexplained), and the nurse couldn't follow a straight line.
Are you really trying to suggest that nurse was anything but a beginner?
I'd like to see another of your clips. Is it at the same MMR as the previous video?
Post edited by EQWashu on0 -
Because they shouldn't be playing against them in the first place.
2 -
That would be a matchmaking issue, and shouldn’t be used as an excuse to demand Nurse nerfs.
4 -
If it's going to stay, it should be considered in balance.
3 -
There are a lot of killers that struggle when matchmaking places them against a well coordinated SWF.
If that’s going to stay, should it also be considered in balance?
3 -
If you really do feel the issue is matchmaking, then why does it seem like you are often complaining about Nurse specifically?
It feels like you are upset at solo q matchmaking, and that you want Nurse nerfed so you can still win even if the Nurse player is much better at the game than your solo q teammates.
3 -
so he is basically saying:
Good Nurse player vs bad Solo Q Team: unbalanced, rito pls fix
Good survivor SWF vs inexperienced player on a weak Killer: Totally fair
the logic of some surivor mains...
(and then he pulls up with "i dont care about this discussion logic while he STILL responds, lol)
Skill based matchmaking fails to do everything its supposed to do, it just makes matches annoyingly hard for both sides, remove it to a minimum. that way not all matches feel the same and you can get the chance to have a decent balance of matches at equal skill, matches where you can dominate and sometimes those very frustrating ones where you get completely dominated. that's just how it works.
1 -
I'm honestly not in the right mental space to continue to argue this point. I haven't done a good job illustrating my points and it's honestly embarrassing to me.
I'll leave it by summing up what I see. Nurse breaks every mechanic that every other Killer has to play around while having good mobility, insane chase potential and great map pressure. There is virtually zero meaningful counterplay to Nurse.
I'm not going to consider responding any further as I haven't done a good job to this point
5 -
Personally, I don’t believe basekit Nurse is an issue totally balanced, but I do believe that her add-ons are OP especially with a competent Nurse, like I can’t see how Three Blink, Omega Blink, or Instant Blink are fine. Especially with some of her perk synergies.
1 -
Add-ons, she has the most insane add-ons in the game, No basekit changes are needed I just don’t believe she needs such nutty add-ons.
0 -
Yeah, her basekit is fine, but her basekit already gives her strength beyond any other killers, she doesn’t need the strongest add-ons in the game.
1 -
I agree
1 -
Range and three blinks are fundamentally unhealthy because they remove or reduce her counterplay, I agree. They should both be fully reworked.
Recharge is strong but not overpowered because it doesn't change the mindgame itself, only makes it happen more frequently. And while not relevant for most players, is almost necessary at very high levels of play because of how brutal her basekit recharge time is at that level of play.
0 -
Its funny how many people so strongly differentiate between "Solo" and "Swf" when it's both the same character "Survivor". I think, in the past, the devs stated they didnt wanna balance swf differently.
That comms add another layer of balance issues is another can of worms.
Im gonna exxagerate a bit here: "The community wants to buff nurse (babynurse / solo) to the powerlevel of nurse ( good nurse with wallhack*)" to equalize the performance between the two."
*Disclaimer: WH obviously stronger than comms but many people suddenly started treating comms as accirate as auras in this year, while it was always memed on as inaccurate before.
Worth noting that the community somehow only wants survivors buffed to the powerlevel of outliers while killer top "needs to get the billy treatment" . WROOAR.
0 -
Just to make it clear, comms are not equal to live auras but offer much more in other aspect.
Namely live status updates between players not only for position but also
- gen progress
- recovery progress
- circumvention of perks like knockout
- exchange of hints on the killers perk and addin loadout
- resource management in Form of important pallet drops/break ("Shack/Main pallet x is down and they broke it just now")
And more that i can't name from the top of my head.
But all this is just potential and people that don't use it have no one else to blame but themselves.
Just like in league of legends were you can go in a match with a premade group and not use third party or even the provided voice comms but the game still puts you up against other premade teamsof similar size and they might use comms. That puts you at a disadvantage but it's purely your own fault.
In DBD that is not the case, killer can never opt for the comm advantage. And neither can the choose to play in a premade group. The only option they have is to play another killer character of different potential. And the worst of it is that bhvrs matchmaking algorithm isn't taking any of this into account.
2 -
(I did put a warning before and a disclaimer after that wallhack comparison.)
Obviously Aura and comms are totally different.
- Auras are instant and accurate and do not need survivor input (same for other UI additions)
- Comms can relay any info the user deems important enough to remember to relay. The precision depends on the user though. Did you see those sector callouts?
---------
I just feel like some people only acknowledge comms advantages for that soloswf gap, but not for the compensation for killers.
Imagine if survs got "current action and location ui, a"ping at yourself/point youre looking at"-tool, premade messages like "i need healing (seperate or in the pingtool), a radar/map with all pinged objeczs (comms can callout sectors), better visual presentation for progress on gens etc....
And now imagine the survivor meltdown when another 6.1 has to drop to compensate for that. The "D" tiers of those buffed killers would need to be B-A on current lists, to keep up with the survivor piwrrcreep.
0 -
I don't find that range addons remove the nurse's counterplay; currently, they still speed up her tp so yes, I can totally see what you mean 🤔
But after the maj, this acceleration will no longer exist, allowing players more time to get to a safe place, if they were in an area that was too clear 😊
In fact, if you think about these range addons (I'm assuming we're talking about them post-maj), they won't change anything from the moment the nurse is 0-20m from the player.
Therefore, facing a nurse who is 0-20m away from you with range addons will be the same as facing a nurse who is 0-20m away without range addons.
The difference will be if she is 21-30m away.
And so, as I said, yes, she will be able to cover a longer distance, but the survivors will still have time to see her coming, if they are aware of their surroundings, and keep an eye on them 😊
1 -
But exactly that has to happen to make this game even remotely manageable in terms of balance.
You can't balance around 3 or 4 groups.
Survivor need tools that substitute the advantage of comms, like the chat, built-in group voice option and ping system in league for example. The first isn't as immediate and the last not as precise as comms but are at least something to help.
And killer need all to be brought in line in terms of "strength"/viability/however you want to call it.
Until that has happened and the community has adapted to those changes, there will never be "peace".
How bhvr exactly achieves that is their responsibility but without it we will eternally sit in the us vs them situation. And while it gives me my entertainment in this forum, it will "ruin" people (as much a a mere video game can).
1 -
Yeah, maybe if map design was better she wouldn’t need recharge either but with maps like Mother’s Dwelling and Badham they can stay. I still get lost on how Nurse was able to get these add-ons.
0 -
When Awakened Awareness releases paired with Starstruck Nurse Mains can expect really short games. Either people are giving up on hook or not playing at all.
4 -
AA is bad though. Nurse fatigue is almost always 3.5s default. Pick up takes 3s. In 6.5s, a survivor can run 26m. You can be out of the range before the pick up even finishes, even if you start literally right beside the Nurse. The linger also means nothing, because it only lingers on people who were still in the 20m when the carrying ends.
1 -
I've seen and had Nurses get two or three downs from Starstruck when a Nurse 'doesn't' immediately know where people are. Picking up the survivor and getting starstruck effectively paralyzes all survivors in the TR. No flashlight saves, or for people working on the gen or just happen to be in the vicinity they are forced to run far away (which is usually why the nurse catches them after hooking a survivor-seeing scratchmarks). Now the survivor will either have to run to get Starstruck off them and risk leaving scratchmarks or try and hide in which case she will know where you are with AA. Also, a nurse does not have to commit to hooking. She can simply pick up a survivor, get starstruck and AA value, drop the survivor and then blink onto the survivor standing nearby. Unlike BBQ which you can anticipate, AA is not something you will be alerted to unless you have Distortion.
3 -
The moral of the story is the same as almost every other killer on the roster: split up. And as you said, Distortion and Object of Obsession can be used to hard counter the perk. Vigil can also be used to counter Starstruck.
2 -
You shouldn’t be near each other in the first place against most killers. Splitting up is good against almost every killer in this game. Even more so against hyper-snowball potential killers like Nurse, and even more so if they have Starstruck. Fatigue, then picking up, then dropping takes a ridiculous amount of time and literally isn’t even worth it in most situations unless someone is super close. Flashlight saves have always been a risk regardless of killer. AA isn’t going to prevent a save since it only happens after carrying actually starts anyways.
1 -
What other killer can punish grouping up as much as her though?
Oni has good snowball but has to earn it through M1 hits. Still has to play around pallets and windows
Plague has to first infect and then get her fountain. Even then a well placed stun will remove it.
Myers is M1 and has to hope the survivor messes up or is in a deadzone. Starts off insanely weak and has to charge throughout the game and can even run out
Nurse equips a perk and gets the best snowball because of it
3 -
You didn't even mention Bubba, who (potentially) can down up to all four survivors in one chainsaw sweep. Which, with chili add-ons, outlasts Sprint Burst. All of the killers you mentioned either have built-in exposed, or a power to keep survivors consistently injured, with a limited-time ranged attack. Myers can just pick up a survivor he's never even hooked and immediately kill him or her. Nurse can't do any of that.
Which perk are you referring to? Because everyone and their mother on these forums is complaining about some perk on Nurse - all of which have basic counterplay, as well as perk counter options. I've discussed just about every one previously.
Edit: typo.
2 -
Soon i hope
0 -
Good look breaking line of sight in shelter woods
0 -
I played her for about the first time in 6 months for the rift challenge, sure everyone had a great time
0 -
Well, I sure did in my survivor match against Nurse on RPD today! Two man out. Got hit once.
1 -
As someone who doesn't really play her is she always that janky on RPD? I was having a lot of issues trying to blink from one level to another in the main area so the Feng was able to buy some time just running up and down the stairs
0 -
If nurse hasnt been nerfed yet, she is not getting nerfed anytime soon.
I mean, the devs knew that a good nurse just stomps 90% of the playerbase and she literally bypasses any game mechanic to defend against her(pallets, windows, different floors). They even knew that nurse would be even more buffed after patch 6.1.0 and didnt care at all.
They are probably more inclined in nerfing Prove thyself and OTR.
0 -
Fun fact, mindgaming is a core mechanic innate to the game for every single killer.
1 -
At that point, It depends more on the nurse being bad than anything survs could possibly do
4 -
Objectively incorrect. Mindgames are from both ends, because it is both players reading the other and trying to bait or outpredict the other. Even the best Nurses in the world get 3-4 outed against the best survivors in the world in some games.
1 -
What i meant is that there is a limit time you can possibly mindgame with a nurse. A very short limit.
You can`t realisticaly mindgame a nurse for more than half a minute when you cant use pallets, windows, distance, etc. It relies more on the nurse being really bad at predicting surv than the survs being good at escaping/looping etc.
3 -
You can 100% use distance against Nurse, it's one of her main counterplay options
2 -
If chases should be 30-35sec and survs have to repair 5x 90sec gens, thats a guaranteed 4k, dont you think? And this is without considering slowdown perks.
Plus, i said 30 sec at best, you can be downed in less
0 -
How much distance can you put before you have her again on you? Even if you used overcome, that will gain you 10 sec at best
0 -
Doing well can go for ~1-1.5m against Nurse.
0 -
Nurse is broken and everybody knows it. Her biggest win is the statistic, thanks to noob-players who dont know how to play her
3 -
The point is that killers with snowball potential have limiters in place to stop them going too insane. Myers and plague have resources to use and ONI has to keep survivors constantly injured to stay powered up. Bubba has to charge a saw and lose distance to get a hit which gives plenty of time for survivors to move, Windows and pallets also stop the saw.
Nurse has no limiter to her slugging and snowball potential. If she sees you she can hit you basically (especially with range). The perks I was referring to were starstruck and to a lesser degree HG. Assuming agitation nurse has a 44m TR when picking up and moves at around 105% while carrying. She can cover most of the map with that and then use tracking perks like BBQ to seal the deal. Exposed is simply too much for a killer who can ignore obstacles and get hits anywhere on the map.
The perk is only an issue on nurse. Characters like slinger use it well but it’s not blatantly OP on them
1 -
Myers is awful. Plague is heavily reliant on RNG. Oni is screwed by predrop and running and is a useless M1 until he can get a hit which won’t happen for a long time on a lot of maps. Bubba’s power is absolutely awful on most tiles. Nurse always being able to continue to perform is why she is good design. The only cap is whether she or the survivors can play better, not some inane hard limit. If a player is able to play better than the other, they should always be able to succeed in trades. Hard limits trump skill expression.
0 -
Nurse ignoring bad map design doesn’t make her well designed. DBD isn’t just about skill vs skill. Pallets are resources that scan run out but offer defence for survivors yet nurse just says no to that . DBD has never been a mechanically intensive game and nurse is no exception to that
Nurse’s skill expression isn’t higher than other killers. Huntress and blight have much more skill expression precisely because they play off map design. You don’t play tiles as nurse while huntress and blight play each tile in a unique way. Another example is pinhead since you not only have to hit a chain projectile you have to play around the environment to use it at the right time.
Nurse’s skill ceiling falls rather flat compared to these killers and people have been overblowing it for years
1 -
I feel that the most important aspect of comms in a SWF is task allocation: "I'll save Fred, you keep slamming that gen!" which avoids the situation all too often seen in solo Q when multiple people move in for the save then one has to back off & go back to gen/other activity.
0 -
That is not a solution and not always feesible on smaller maps. With solo queue you don't even know where your teammate is at until they go down or they can just run in your direction while in chase. You also can't get out of the TR in time to prevent starstruck. And very few people run distortion (I happen to be one of them). You shouldn't have to run one specific perk to counter a very powerful perk combo on certain killers like prenerf Undying, tinkerer, ruin Blight people are going to afk or quit.
0 -
Most people know to split up against killers but a games progress that becomes harder to do, less gens, crossing paths for saves or running into teammates during chase. You're not going to get off a gen just because someone goes down and the TR extends to where you are. I think its going to be a problem and you don't. We'll just have to wait and see.
0 -
Run Empathy and/or Empathetic Connection then. You and/or your teammate will get that information. And Starstruck doesn’t even activate until they pick the survivor up or it finishes its cooldown as they’re already carrying. You can be running away or hiding as soon as your teammate is downed, if you know the killer has it or you suspect they have it.
All of the survivor perks I mentioned give massive value outside of the off chance you face a Nurse or any of these perks. Survivors definitely got the better end of the bargain with Distortion and Vigil. You can run one or two of them, or none at all, and still counter Starstruck just by playing smart. And none of these killer perks come anywhere near the power level of old Ruin, Undying, or Tinkerer - especially when they were used together. Nurse has to get a down for any of the Starstruck build to even possibly give value (the other part of the equation is requiring foolish or greedy survivors to be nearby); those other three perks gave value simply by being equipped.
1
