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-50% collision is not slight nerf, that's huge!
PTB Wesker had too big Survivor collision when using his power, I get it, but nerfing it by half and calling it "slightly" is bad too. It's like from one extreme to another (too good --> too bad).
He should have +25% back (so total -25% loss from PTB) or something. He needs bigger collision please.
Comments
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The whole "He was grabbing survivors who weren't in front of him" thing, I don't buy it. I think sadly Wesker is gonna be a killer like Nurse who has wildly inconsistent attack hitboxes.
I think how the devs handled fixing his bumping into everything was to nerf his grab's hitbox, but I don't think they have to do it that way. I'm no game designer, lucky us, but I would try to find a way where the bumping into objects hitbox was small and the grab detection hitbox was still big. This idea could also be applied to Victor, Demogorgon, Huntress... oh it would solve SO much.
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He either bumps into stuff he shouldn't or it's harder to hit survivors, it's a double edged sword
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Funny how they had the exact opposite ratio you suggest in the original version on the ptb
(Collision detection for Virulent Bound was 45cm)
(Survivor detection for Virulent Bound was 40cm)
I agree with you, it should be the inverse order of the one they did originally: bigger survivor collider, smaller collision collider.
Just let the collision detection stay at 20cm and increase the Survivor detection to 30cm.
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I'm more annoyed by his bugs. He's not as bad as release Twins, but he's pretty close
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That looked very nice, yes
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It's actually 2 different hit boxes, the collision and the grabbing survivors hitboxes are totally different.
The collision hitbox was reduced as Wesker bumped into so many things on the PTB - I'm not seeing that happening on the current Live version.
With regards to grabbing the survivors, it was generous on the PTB and we could see that he was able to grab survivors that he really shouldn't have. This was also something that was adjusted, whether it's now gone the opposite way is hard to say - that's what feedback is for. But I want to be sure we're getting the correct feedback and not having the two different hitboxes mixed up.
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From my experience playing Wesker for about 8 hours yesterday the new grab hitbox is a bit too unforgiving. There were many times where I seemed to just phase through the survivors. As it is now you have to aim so that from your perspective you bound in front of the survivor or it will miss. You can even miss point blank bounds where you're looking straight at the survivor.
The collision hitbox for the terrain seems pretty good. Though I did get stuck on small rocks now and then on some maps where I wouldn't have thought I'd get stuck. There was a few of those spots around the small two story main building on MacMillan (Coal tower I think it is) near the loops outside for example.
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They already have this. Just look at Trickster or Slinger. They can nail shots through holes.
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It is not hard to say, at all. There are plenty of clips around youtube demonstrating the problem. My own experience also confirms it. Here are a couple of clips going around for example:
Wesker went from being the most fun I've had in any game in years on the PTB to being one of the most frustrating experiences in just as long on live. His survivor hitbox was too large on the PTB at 40cm, however the nerf to 20cm is excessive. It should be 30-35cm to allow for some feedback when playing Wesker. His power is ridiculously punishing to miss, so making it this unreliable to hit only causes frustration.
Survivors have extremely easy and effective counterplay to Wesker - any tree or object of any kind neuters him and forces the killer to play as an m1 killer. Even just running in circles around a small rock will make him powerless, which means he's essentially an m1 killer with some mediocre map traversal against good survivors. For example, the Kate in Hens's clip could simply have hugged that tree to break line of sight and Hens would have been completely powerless, as unlike Blight, there is no mid-bound adjustment. It is because of this that survivors SHOULD be punished for being in the open against Wesker. It happens very rarely against competent survivors, and having it so that grabbing the survivor who made this huge error is so unreliable removes what little of his power he has left, since most of the time he will just slide round the survivor.
The current hitbox means that going for long range bound plays is no longer viable, because survivors can just randomly move around to make hitting the bound a total guess for the killer. This is a huge shame, because going for these long range bound plays was where all of Wesker's fun and excitement came from on the PTB. People love it.
I quit playing the game yesterday out of frustration for the first time since 2020, and this was all down to my immense disappointment with how much weaker Wesker now is. He sometimes just lets go of survivors when you're clearly slamming them into a wall, and they run to safety. I don't mean throw, I quite literally mean he just lets go. One example of this was slamming into a wall with a chest against it. The most common place this happens is at corners. It has happened every single game, often multiple times in a row.
As it currently stands, Wesker will likely do well at low mmr, but be unable to kill anyone at high mmr. In order to help fix this, his hitbox should be increased, and both his bound charge and recharge times should be reduced. It would also be worth considering increasing the speed of his second bound. His first bound's speed is okay, as it should be slower. This would create a fun kind of preparation and then blitz kind of gameplay. I still think his counterplay fundamentally neuters him enough that the issue will remain, but it will definitely be lessened. I also think he should have some addons that affect the speed or charge times of his power - many of the current addons are useless. If Blight can have several addons that skyrocket him from S tier to Nurse tier, then why can't Wesker's be useful too? First aid sprays are also too plentiful. Maximum infection almost never happens, and survivors can spray straight away without worry because there are so many more sprays on the map. No games go on long enough for survivors to have to worry about when they use a spray. The Complete Global Saturation scoring event may as well not exist.
Of course, you've likely already heard that he also gets no brutality points - when he lands a bound hit, he gets 3 scoring events, all of which are deviousness. He has no way to get brutality outside of m1. This makes his bloodpoint gain poor.
To be honest, I love the concept behind Wesker, and your team did a great job making him slide around objects now and hit people over vaults. However, the issues I mention here are totally killing his fun. Some less informed people are confusing his object and survivor hitboxes, but don't get it twisted - his object hitbox is much MUCH better. His survivor hitbox is the issue.
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His hitbox on PTB was broken, like you said, he grabs survs that shouldn't be grabbed, like survs in the other side of the pallet, but now his power hitbox is like hit a needle.
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i think his grab hitbox could be slightly increased again
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I'm with the others, i think the Survivor collision detection was made too small.
Yes, in PTB it was so generous that i was also hitting survivors that i shouldn't (like, they were even far outside my screen), but i think you guys went a bit too far shrinking it, now i just phase into survivors without grabbing them.
I get that Wesker power isn't supposed to be braindead and using it with skill, but aiming at survivors right now is just almost impossible.
The collision hitbox tho i think its perfect (it still sometimes cancel my power when i bound into some tiny object) but it's so good right now.
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"It is not hard to say, at all. There are plenty of clips around youtube demonstrating the problem. My own experience also confirms it. Here are a couple of clips going around for example:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFI5zUNgUO0
Wesker went from being the most fun I've had in any game in years on the PTB to being one of the most frustrating experiences..."
All this look like the Hillbilly's chainsaw hitbox for me...
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HIllbilly has an add-on to reduce his chainsaw collision. So try it to compare to the Wesker's collision, I'm convinced it's the same thing...
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Agreed with slightly increasing his hitbox. But please. Slightly does not mean "make a new nurse". Using power in general vicinity of survivor does not mean 100% grab all the time.
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The problem is not just that the grab hitbox is smaller. The issue is also that survivor hitbox is not the same as survivor 3D model. The survivors lean forward when they run, but the hitbox remains a straight column at their back... So the 3D model is very deceptive... If you aim for the 3D model of the survivor, you will miss, especially if they do a spin. People who play Huntress or Deathslinger will know.
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How is that hard to say that the survivor detection hitbox is way too small when there are so many clips showing it was nerfed too much? His power became almost useless to catch people at the moment and why? Because it's very very easy to dodge it in fact it's almost impossible to hit someone if they move to left and right a bit and thats horrible
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Seems they cant do that potato code
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The collision hitbox is great now, the big problem is the survivor hitbox, it is definitely too small especially with latency. Increase it to a midpoint so its not too big like before but also offers a bit of leeway to make his power far more accessible.
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@Mandy after playing Wesker and survivor for many games yesterday, watching steamers, and then reading all these forums before we talk about what kind some buffs Wesker needs(spray, add-ons, etc). THERE ARE JUST TOO MANY BUGS . Hitbox to grabbing the survivors 100% needs to increase for sure. So HOT FIX PATCHES WHEN?
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