We Are (Actually) Legion (Legion Overhaul)

@not_Queen

Since you are the one I know to contact the most (my apologies for taking you away from whatever you are doing), I would like your opinion.

or

@Peanits

I want to know if you can find any faults so I can shape up my idea. I've seen your responses to others, and I feel like you can give some good advice. (you also have my apologies for taking you away from whatever you may be doing.)

And everyone else, give me feed back. I want to become better at writing things like this.

@HatCreature said:
I like the idea of switching between members in-game, I don't think the others should have a TR because it could be too much for the Survivors since your TR could tehnically be all over the map and be too confusing so I think the TR should only be on the member you're playing and not the others on stand-by.

I also think it might be too much for each member to have different percentages in vaulting and running etc. There's 4 of them yeah but it could be too much for players to remember and identify exactly how fast and how big their TR is, espeically with add-ons.

I like your idea of all 4 having their ability be different in some way but I think it needs to be expanded on because of my previous comment. Frank not having FF is cool but he should have Killer's Instinct because he's the one who had it to begin with, he wouldn't be the way he is if he didn't. Julie should have FF and have like a moderate % for KI because she's like him but not completely. Maybe Joey should have both but his FF lasts longer because from his outfit he looks like a messenger? And Susie should not have KI because she really doesn't but her FF should be the fastest.
These are just different versions of yours and maybe these could work? Each member does something better than the other. Frank has normal speed so he doesn't get FF, Julie has FF so you could use her to chase, Joey is an allround Killer and Susie becomes the best at chasing but of course it's only one person.

And I don't know if it's your intention but it sounds like you can technically ''teleport'' by switching, so if you're Frank and you switch to Julie you end up wherever Julie is? I like that. Would these changes make Legion better? I don't know but it would make them much cooler and actually give them counterplay depending on which member is being used.

I shall adress your points, for this reason I will consider each paragraph a point. Thanks in advance for your feedback.

1) It is my fault for not makkng it clear. Yes it will be only you who has a terror radius. The others are basically just side characters until you switch to them.

2) Eh, true, but I see each as having their own way of going about it. I want to confuse the survivors, and by my way it also means the Killer needs to learn the Legion to know when to use a specific member for a specific job.

3) All the members have Killer Instinct. They all get it differently though. Though I can give Frank a higher chance of getting it though. Because balance is what I want, and him being able to always see survivors is something that will make my rework null and void. Julie follows Frank so I figured she wouldn't use FF like him. I might consider giving it to her though. Joey and Susie both have Feral Frenzy and both can apply Deep Wounds and gain Killer Instinct as if the rework hasn't happened.
3.2) I will see about that.

4) I would imagine the change could be whateber the devs might want it to be. My idea would be that after like two seconds, whomever you decide to tag out with is teleported to the last place you were standing, sending who ever you were to the position the person you switched with was. Or it could be cinematic and you run to a member and switch perspective, so that the person you switched to runs where you last were prior to switching.

Again thank you for the feedback. This is why I wanted it as I can think up of different ways to improve or explain better what I haven't in my op.

@ToxicFengM1n said:
You have a legion pic and your making a legion rework, so your opinion matters in my book

Lel. Thanks fam. I just... I know I claimed I don't care about Legion's fate, but I want a step in the right direction. If my rework can even give a small push, I'll be happy.

@HatCreature said:

@Shad03 said:

@HatCreature said:
I like the idea of switching between members in-game, I don't think the others should have a TR because it could be too much for the Survivors since your TR could tehnically be all over the map and be too confusing so I think the TR should only be on the member you're playing and not the others on stand-by.

I also think it might be too much for each member to have different percentages in vaulting and running etc. There's 4 of them yeah but it could be too much for players to remember and identify exactly how fast and how big their TR is, espeically with add-ons.

I like your idea of all 4 having their ability be different in some way but I think it needs to be expanded on because of my previous comment. Frank not having FF is cool but he should have Killer's Instinct because he's the one who had it to begin with, he wouldn't be the way he is if he didn't. Julie should have FF and have like a moderate % for KI because she's like him but not completely. Maybe Joey should have both but his FF lasts longer because from his outfit he looks like a messenger? And Susie should not have KI because she really doesn't but her FF should be the fastest.
These are just different versions of yours and maybe these could work? Each member does something better than the other. Frank has normal speed so he doesn't get FF, Julie has FF so you could use her to chase, Joey is an allround Killer and Susie becomes the best at chasing but of course it's only one person.

And I don't know if it's your intention but it sounds like you can technically ''teleport'' by switching, so if you're Frank and you switch to Julie you end up wherever Julie is? I like that. Would these changes make Legion better? I don't know but it would make them much cooler and actually give them counterplay depending on which member is being used.

I shall adress your points, for this reason I will consider each paragraph a point. Thanks in advance for your feedback.

1) It is my fault for not makkng it clear. Yes it will be only you who has a terror radius. The others are basically just side characters until you switch to them.

2) Eh, true, but I see each as having their own way of going about it. I want to confuse the survivors, and by my way it also means the Killer needs to learn the Legion to know when to use a specific member for a specific job.

3) All the members have Killer Instinct. They all get it differently though. Though I can give Frank a higher chance of getting it though. Because balance is what I want, and him being able to always see survivors is something that will make my rework null and void. Julie follows Frank so I figured she wouldn't use FF like him. I might consider giving it to her though. Joey and Susie both have Feral Frenzy and both can apply Deep Wounds and gain Killer Instinct as if the rework hasn't happened.
3.2) I will see about that.

4) I would imagine the change could be whateber the devs might want it to be. My idea would be that after like two seconds, whomever you decide to tag out with is teleported to the last place you were standing, sending who ever you were to the position the person you switched with was. Or it could be cinematic and you run to a member and switch perspective, so that the person you switched to runs where you last were prior to switching.

Again thank you for the feedback. This is why I wanted it as I can think up of different ways to improve or explain better what I haven't in my op.

Your idea is really cool, when I first read it I actually thought you were going with the fake Survivor route but then you turned it into where all 4 members were playable which I think is the best part of your idea. It is incredibly misleading and weird to call them Legion and only play as 1 of them, especially when you need to buy the other 2.

Your idea actually got me thinking about another way to incoporat all 4 of them. The Devs could create an incredibly basic AI routine wherethe other 3 are walking around the map, either you can switch between all 4 OR you can only play as the one you choose and the other 3 just walk around and give notifications when someone is in range, kind of like Spies From The Shadows.

Something like that. I just want them to all be in the match as they're all a group. Even so, I just hope the change will be good.

@Arroz said:

@Shad03 said:
Howdy there, mostly killer main here coming to talk to you about a potential fun fix for Legion. Since he is confirmed that he will be getting a rework soon™, I figured I should throw my mask in the ring and suggest something for a potential change.

I've posted the meat of this idea into another one of my discussions, but this is to expand on the idea. I want actual feedback here people. We don't get better without it.

[I am well aware there is a little to no chance that my idea will be used, but I want to at least show what I can think of]

The Legion was advertised as a group of teens and Frank had been shown that, even if once, was able to fool survivors and hide his heartbeat. The trailer was misleading and the only thing dealing with The Legion's multi group function is the cosmetics. I want to change this.

I wish to keep the Legion's uniqueness and add it to his strength. For this, each Legion member will be present in the trial, with you controlling either of the four members (your power is affected by the body cosmetics you choose).

My idea would be that if you have the Joey cosmetic, you start off the trial as Joey, and can then switch between the other Legion members during the trial, who would be sitting in random locations within 64 meters or more from your current position. The Legion members will not attack survivors, but will have various uses which can be affected by add ons.

When I say sit, I mean they'll be able to be seen in idle animations, Susie could be sitting next to a locker while Joey will be leaning against a wall for example. Upon seeing a survivor they can do a few things based on what can be considered fair. I would like that they make a loud noise event, then run out of sight. Legion Members can be seen via different auras. Or just a red/yellow aura for the killer.

Each Legion member can be sorta unique in their own way, having different stats like different terror radius and movement. I will place my idea below on how unique they can be. Bear in mind to compare, I will use 100% as a baseline for something like vault speed.

Frank: He is the mastermind of the group, he knows how to get the job done quickly and efficiently. He vaults pallets at 75% speed. His terror radius is the standard 32 meters, and his movement speed is 115%. He cannot enter Feral Frenzy, though he has a 50% chance of activating killer instincts for 15 seconds upon hitting a survivor.

Julie: She follows Frank in whatever his endeavors are. She is slightly more agile, able to vault pallets at 85% speed. Her terror radius is at 24 meters and she moves at 113% movement speed. She cannot enter Feral Frenzy, however her attacks have a 55% chance of giving her killer instincts for 10 seconds.

Susie: She will follow Frank since she has no other choice. She is very agile due to her hidden bloodlust, her pallet vault speed is at 100%. Her terror radius is set at 8 meters, and she moves at 100% movement speed. She can enter Feral Frenzy which applies Deep Wounds and grants her the Killer Instinct. Hitting a survivor already afflicted with Deep Wounds stuns her.

Joey: He finds Frank as a friend and will trust him. He is not as agile as the others and vaults pallets at 50% speed. His terror radius is the standard 32 meters and his movement speed is 113%. He can enter Feral Franzy and can apply the Deep Wound effect. Hitting a survivor already afflicted with Deep Wounds will stun him. He of course gets the Killer Instinct when hitting a survivor with Feral Frenzy.

You can no longer break pallets and vaulting will be considered a blood point gain event that gives just as much as normally breaking a pallet. You only get blood points once per pallet you vault. Pallet vaulting of course is faster then breaking the pallet.

Of course I am aware of how complicated this can all be which is why it's only a idea. If I knew how to code then I would definitely beg to apply to BHVR so I could help

I am also aware that add ons need to change, and if you want I can give a few ideas about that. As for how you switch between Legion members, I guess you can use the activation button when facing a member, and to make it easier the selectable member would be marked in white. The transition could either be the burn effect placed when changing characters in the lobby, or a dynamic scene of the Legion running to that the other's place.

TL;DR:

I want the Legion to be one of the more Unique killers by allowing power to reflect lore and cosmetics. Each Legion member would have their own stats and you don't even have to switch between each Legion if you want. The option would be there however.

You can no longer break pallets. Each Legion member has different vaulting speeds that are still faster than normally breaking a pallet, but someone like Joey can still be sorta looped.

I like the idea of switch while the match, but it's just the same everyone is gonna buy susie and equip frank's mixtape, and btw susie cost auric cells, so it would be a pay 2 win, but it's not a bad idea!, oh and I think of joey is just usseles, can you change joey? give him some love!

Susie and Joey would be avaliable to switch to even if you didn't buy them. You just wouldn't be able to start as them. None would be pay to win as each have their own weakness.

Strength in numbers, stronger as one.

Also the addons will be changed, so Franks will not do the same thing. I might change Joey's effects, but I'll have to see.

Cosmetics are cosmetics. They have the benefit of starting as her and Joey. They also have the benefit of customizing Susie and Joey.

@AnIntellectualClone said:
I do like the idea of implementing the other 3 wannabes into the gameplay.

We are Legion.

@Arroz
I have given Joey thy love.

@Mr_Black said:

You need to accept criticism... If anything, Legion will get a tad nerf... Legion does not need fast base speed as his feral frenzy gets him to run at more than 4.6m/s... No need to increase their walking speed... And what you suggested was insane as that'd make Legion pretty OP... And his one counter play is gen rushing... This idea would make it impossible to counter him...
By your profile pic, I assume you are a Legion main and highly biassed towards him... Legion is the ultimate chaser... He needs no buff...

First and foremost I am a player of Dead by Daylight, then I am a Trapper main. I accept criticism but what you suggest is the same thing that neuters a great killer like Freddy. You're problem is you don't see the small details in the big picture.

I am aiming to make a killer I like playing be more fair and more interesting then what we have now, because people like you do not know what is fun or enjoyable. I am biased I will admit, but not as biased to not know what isn't fun.

The Legion would certainly would have more counters then the Nurse (whom is easy to counter, just figure out how that specific Nurse plays). The Legion wouldn't be "pretty OP", they would suffer the same thing as any other killer. Each Legion member would have their strength and weakness.

Muse on that before submitting a response, I enjoy feedback but what you suggested wasn't feedback. It was a poisoned dish of food (I'm hungry, so don't mind that).

@Mr_Black said:

@Mc_Harty said:

@Mr_Black said:
Smaller terror radius... Buff

Legion has a 24 meter terror radius, so not a buff.

Slower walk speed... Nerf

Which is a horrible idea and the devs will likely not nerf base move speed.

Faster Feral Frenzy speed... Buff

Again, horrible idea. You want to make a skill-less power less skilled to use?

Since Legion uses Feral Frenzy more because of chases, this would counter the slower walk and make him buffed... The slower walk speed is just so the Legion has to use his Feral Frenzy more often...

The whole reason people dislike Legion is because of Feral Frenzy. Rework it.

Jesus Christ, I might just end up saying git gud or something... The simple solution is to buff him... But the way Shaa dude suggested would be way too complicated and would make people even more angry...

Another suggestion is to get rid of Feral Frenzy and replace it for some sort of tackle or something... It would be a short ranged lunge which, if misses, will cause a 4 second stun... If it hits, it will knock the survivor to the floor and he'll automatically pick them up... However, the struggling survivor will struggle 20% faster...

You've brought nothing but bad ideas and completely missed the point of this entire thing. Yes my idea is complicated I will admit but this is a SUGGESTION, I am not a dev nor anyone important. I merely want to give my own thoughts based on what people have given on this killer.

Tackling actually sounds somewhat decent but there will have to be a cooldown. 4 seconds ain't much in the grand scheme of things and would make the Legion even more brain dead then people claim he is.

@Mr_Black said:

@Shad03 said:

@Mr_Black said:

That will make Legion useless, everyone will just choose Joey or Susie...
Also, I'm a Doctor main...

Different strengths my dear acquaintance. Susie is slower then the other Legion members but has a smaller terror radius. She moves at 100% (HEY LOOK! I suggested she moves at the same speed of the survivors before you came). Joey can break pallets but not vault them, and he is slightly slower moving at 114% movement speed.

Again, your ignorance is that of a survivor main. I could never guess you even touched killer based on the trash of suggestions you give.

Again, killer main... I just disagree of one killer being multiple killers...

Again, would never have guessed. And that is how they were advertised, I wanted to build the Legion based on what the Devs have given us.

@ShrekIsHot said:
Hello Shad03, I already proposed this idea on my forum, but I think that they should all have Survivor Status and have their masks off until they enter Feral Frenzy, which would enter a transition into sticking their mask on? They keep the 110% if the survivor deal would work since the trailer portrayed them so, Frank is fast so it would make sense, but they have 0 TR, no lunge, and no indication of being a killer except for the blade and look, they would get a 32 terror radius and have the same appliance of Feral Frenzy with lunge, I have no problem with that but to heal from the mend, you'd need another survivor or Self Care, and the heal would take as long as Self Care would.

An interesting idea, however if implemented then I doubt it would have a good standing. Survivors would riot because of that mend you suggested. While I certainly would love to take the salt, as a player I don't think this would be a good idea. However I enjoy the idea you placed.

@LegitAdventurer said:
Although I wish that the Legions would change up a bit more? I really enjoy the concept that one Legion breaks pallets, another vaults them. I also totally understand that a killer with 4 completely different abilities would be too OP. So I really like this concept. The switching places around the map is awesome. You could even use the other legion as like...traps? Place them at your totems and switch back and forth between them at any given time. Such a cool concept. I dig this.

I had considered that, but then again I had it so if they encounter a survivor, they make a loud noise (like a generator exploding) and then run away out of sight.

To clarify, when you switch between Legion it could be that the Legion you want to switch to is teleported to where you currently are, or you sorta run to and switch p.o.v with the member you switch with.

I.E

If you were Frank and switch with Julie, Julie will either run to or teleport to where Frank is, while Frank is teleported or runs to where Julie is.