make shattered hope base kit
im dyslexic
now i have a genuan argument survivors can cleanse a hex and thats is gone for the rest of the match even if you use hex pentamento you can only relight it once but survivors can spam as many boons as they like if you snuff it out they can just relight it over and over and over again. now either./both ways to fix this problem is make shattered hope base kit or only allow survivors to place a boon once like a token system i mean do you know how annoying it is to here a boon find it snuff it and 5 secs later its buck up again of and if your argument is why not just use shattered hope well its a waste of a perk slot
Comments
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Yeah, I don't like Shattered Hope either. You're bringing a perk that only exists to counter someone else's perk so, if they don't have that perk, you get no value.
If they want to keep Shattered Hope as a perk, it should do something else besides just kill boons so that you can get use out of it even if no one brings any.
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If you buff the other boon perks other then circle of healing to be better then I would probably agree to it
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circle of healing is broken in my opinion should re decused to 35% same as self care
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No that's awful
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Sad to say this, but with pentimento in the game they cannot make this basekit.
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It doesn't really need such a punitive nerf. Circle of Healing in a vacuum is mostly fine.
But it gets problematic when you start adding in Medkits, co-op healing speeds, and the fact that Boons can be reused constantly. And just reducing the speed isn't gonna fix those problems, but it will make the perk nearly worthless on it's own.
Honestly they need to just rework it completely and give it an entirely new effect. The idea is fine conceptually but it does NOT play nice with DbD's other means of Healing and it's baffling to me that they'd rather nerf Self-Care and 'rework' Botany Knowledge instead of just changing the actual problem perk.
Why not?
Maybe this my Killer Main bias showing, or just me being an idiot, but I feel like it'd only be a problem if the Survivors lit 5 boons and the Killer gets instant 5 stack Pentimento or if the Survivors keep lighting boons after finding out the Killer has Pentimento, and both of those edge cases are kind of on the Survivors for not being more careful with their Boon usage IMO.
Furthermore, the Survivors will always know where the Penti totem is if the Killer lights it immediately after stomping, AND it lets the Survivors potentially get an extra use from their Boon.
How would basekit Shattered Hope + Pentimento be an issue?
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CHANGE: Every gen that gets done your Shattered Hope gets charged and when its charged you can smash a dull totem, either depriving survivors of their own resources (Overzealous, Inner Healing etc) or powering your own Pentimento.
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Boon Coh is the reason why other Boon are so weak. Others need more range to have better use, but more range means even stronger buff to Coh.
Shattered hope should not be basekit, but the ability to destroy Boon. Shattered hope then can make Booner exposed for 1min instead.
If you have Boon and killer snuff, telling they may have Noed or Plaything.
If killer destroy Boon, telling they may have Penti, and not having Noed.
Otherwise, you have a choice not to Boon to stop making Penti works (and my SH suggestion)
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I think that perk should be added to some other useless or mediocre perk & maybe some people would run it in their builds. As it stands is pretty useless and I've never personally used it. You might get some value out of it in like 1/50 games when you get some meme SWF running like a boon setup, but other than that it's pretty pointless.
Most survivors relight the same totem over and over so it's actually a better time waste just to stamp it out & then come back later. It's also a good indicator of were survivors might run when injured if you know the location.
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I would be perfectly fine with increasing Circle of Healing's speed if it meant that it could be snuffed permanently. I would rather that than a slower heal speed and self care that can be set up infinitely.
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Making Shattered Hope basekit isn't a good idea. If you bring NOED or Plaything you're screwing yourself over destroying totems.
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Having had people who brought noed and shattered and then dced because noed didn't activate BECAUSE THEY THEMSELF GOT RID OF ALL THE TOTEMS... this would be hilarious.
That said, there are few maps on which you might miss the activation thunder, so the best you can do is get a feeling for where totems usually spawn and pay attention to where survs run to narrow down the area. And let's be honest:
Boons are not that much a threat that it would justify making SH basekit to begin with.
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Boons as a whole are not a threat. The only reason people suggest Shattered Hope be basekit are mostly debating about CoH being a big issue, as it works best when the killer is not around. Address CoH if it is such a big problem, but if you just up and decide to make SH basekit, all boons will need big buffs to compensate.
Any killer I have seen or interacted with will usually keep the boon up as bait, knowing survivors will come back to it, especially if it is the same totem being lit. Even if they decide to kick it, they do it as a last priority.
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Well, penti is such a potent hex with its bonuses because you generally have to lose a hex to gain it (or have a survivor in your game with inner healing or a totem challenge). Most survivors have the knowledge to cleanse it again because they monitor where the hex got cleansed earlier. This is the risk and reward with pentimento and why it has such punishing penalties like 40% gen slowdown.
If shattered hope became basekit, pentimento builds would be THE meta and no one would want to run boons anymore (especially since you can't boon a pentimento hex).
I can't help but feel that if they made shattered basekit, they would have to nerf pentimento and I would rather they didn't.
I've always been a fan of the diminishing returns idea. The more times you place a boon, the longer it takes to complete the action so the killer actually gets something out of snuffing them.
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If shattered hope became basekit, pentimento builds would be THE meta and no one would want to run boons anymore
I feel like these are mutually exclusive outcomes of a theoretical basekit Shattered Hope though. If Pentimento was used by everyone, you're right, people would just not use Boons.
But if people aren't using Boons very often Pentimento loses a lot of it's meta appeal, because you wouldn't get value reliably. So people wouldn't throw Pentimento on every build. Which would mean people would bring Boons and etc.
You'd essentially be at an even playing field where both sides *might* use this thing, or they might not.
I'd like to clarify here, that I'm not personally in favour of Shattered Hope being basekit. It'd just be a band-aid that doesn't fix the actual problem (because, if we're honest, when people say "Boons are annoying" they aren't complaining about Boon: Dark Theory, they're complaining about Boon: Circle of Healing). I just don't think it'd be a very problematic change either.
Personally I think BHVR just needs to totally rework Circle of Healing and take another look at how Boons interact with multilevel maps like RPD or Midwich. Then they'd be okay.
That said, your idea of decreasing the Blessing speed after every Boon use isn't something I'm opposed to either. I just think that Boon: Circle of Healing specifically is the issue, not necessarily Boons in and of themselves.
(especially since you can't boon a pentimento hex).
I wasn't aware of this interaction between Boons and Rekindled Totems, that's interesting to know.
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Nothing to do with the argument but just an expansion on the interaction of boon and rekindled totems.
You're able to bless them, just not to a desired effect. It'll take the same time as blessing a regular totem, except after all that time and effort the totem will just smash as if it were a regular cleanse and be unable to be booned or otherwise revived by any means.
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I think most people already said it, but all other boons are bad besides CoH and pentimento is a thing.
So yeah, if you don't want boons to be blessed again on the same totem, you would have to fix a bunch of other issues.
Honestly i wouldn't mind boons being destroyed, maybe that will stop dumb teammates from booning every single totem they see and just loosing because of that
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This again?
I will make it short. Shattered basekit for survivor spawning on hook that is as far as possible from killer after hook (similiar to pyramidhead).
Killing boons for killing camping. I will not settle for less
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I can't help but imagine that pentimento would be on every killers build especially when you take into account that many players also run boons to counter the very common plaything & penti combo. With a basekit shattered hope, there's just no downside to that combo anymore.
I'm not sure about if it's possible to boon a pentimento that came from a clensed hex or dull, but It's not possible to reboon a pentimento hex broken by shattered hope. (I've tried, the interaction to boon doesn't show up.)
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I understand your point but I'm afraid this would make other low-performing boon perks even less efficient. 😕
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there is only one boon i see all the time is circle of healing i rarely see shadow step, exponential or dark theory
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Maybe a good balance could be:
Whenever a killer snuffs a boon, it adds an extra x (10s?) to the next time that surv tries to reboon?
The extra time stacks (indefinitely?) and this should be balanced enough to be basekit.
Thoughts?
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I'd be fine with this, but only if they made snuffing take 5 seconds, can work all around the map, and make no noise
Otherwise, no thank you. If you hate boons that much simply don't snuff them unless they are actively hindering your playstyle (I personally hate shadowstep and go out of my way to snuff it, but if it's COH I don't care much and won't actively look for it unless I happen to see it when chasing a survivor). That or just deal with it. Booning takes much longer than a snuff anyway
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